2024 Draft - Who you got?

[Klomp]

It's incredibly hard to see how Bronny James would make any sense for the Wolves. Looking at the guys who are likely to be available at 27 and 37, I'd rate James near the bottom in terms of players who can contribute in the short term. If the team is looking for upside, there are likely to be at least a half dozen young guys still on the board who would be ahead of James (Tyler Smith, Bobi Klintman, Carlton Carrington, Kyshawn George, Pacome Dadiet, Juan Nunez, AJ Johnson, Cam Christie, and Justin Edwards are all significantly better developmental prospects).

I get it, but I don't necessarily agree. Part of "upside" is how likely a prospect is to reach that upside. His upside might not be as high as some, but I feel very confident that he can reach the upside he has. Many of the guys you listed might have a higher upside in theory, but I don't know that reaching that upside is very likely for most of them.

Ndudi Ebi had more upside than anyone we had available to us in 2004. Josh Howard's upside was much lower, but was an upside that was more attainable.

I guess we have very different ideas on what Bronny James could be. To me the best case scenario for James is becoming a fringe rotation player with a very high chance of never even reaching that level. Personally, I think most of the guys I listed have a floor that is similar to Bronny, but with ceilings that are way higher.

Here's my Bronny scouting report:

No, he will probably never be a star and he might not ever be a starter, but he is someone who has a high basketball IQ, seems to be self-aware of who he is as a basketball player, and he is a connector. I also think that a good chunk of his USC tape and statistics could be thrown away by the mere fact of what he went through last offseason and working his way back from a significant health scare. He commits himself to the defensive end, and sees himself making an impact on that end by the way he compares himself to guys like Jrue Holiday, Derrick White and Davion Mitchell.

Yes, that's largely the only tape we've got and that forces a scouting staff to rely on their convictions of what a guy can be and how he can translate into the league, but I think that's exactly why we have someone like former 247Sports analyst Josh Gershon in the draft room, for example. He banged the table for a scrawny kid out of Washington who largely underwhelmed and had a temper to boot in his lone year of college, but Gershon was convinced that there was an NBA player inside of him. I also go back to a guy who averaged just 9.4 ppg in college on an okay UCLA team, but Flip Saunders was convicted that he was a guy with a high upside even though the tape didn't show it.

Now think about what we need, especially at guard: Defense, connector, and high IQ.

My NBA comparison: Patrick Beverley

[Klomp]

Comparing sizes of a few guard prospects either discussed here, mocked to us elsewhere, or mocked higher in the draft than our current picks:

(height barefoot / wingspan / weight)
Jamal Shead 6-0.25 / 6-3.00 / 200.8
KJ Simpson 6-0.25 / 6-4.50 / 187.0
Rob Dillingham 6-1.00 / 6-3.00 / 164.2
Tyler Kolek 6-1.25 / 6-2.75 / 196.6
Bronny James 6-1.50 / 6-7.25 / 210.4
Reed Sheppard 6-1.75 / 6-3.25 / 181.6
Jared McCain 6-2.00 / 6-3.50 / 203.2
Devin Carter 6-2.25 / 6-8.75 / 193.0
Isaiah Collier 6-2.50 / 6-4.75 / 204.6

[Klomp]

If we select two NBA ready players that can immediately fit: Baylor Scheierman as a movement shooter wing, KJ Simpson as Conley type of backup PG. Re-sign Anderson, Morris, Garza

Gobert/Reid/Garza
Towns/Anderson/Miller
McDaniels/Scheierman/Minott
Edwards/NAW/Moore + Clarke
Conley/Morris/Simpson

Scheierman as Sam Hauser, Simpson as Payton Pritchard.

Honestly, I think it's more likely that the development level needed for whoever we draft might be a good signal for if the front office believes it can retain Anderson and/or Morris. Their belief in Minott, Miller and/or Clark also factors into this equation.

If they don't think they can bring one or either back, I think they'd look at older prospects who are ready to potentially contribute.
If they are planning to bring them back to be contributors, watch for them to go more for the year-away prospects in the mold of how Minott and Miller were as prospects.

[thinktank]

Comparing sizes of a few guard prospects either discussed here, mocked to us elsewhere, or mocked higher in the draft than our current picks:

(height barefoot / wingspan / weight)
Jamal Shead 6-0.25 / 6-3.00 / 200.8
KJ Simpson 6-0.25 / 6-4.50 / 187.0
Rob Dillingham 6-1.00 / 6-3.00 / 164.2
Tyler Kolek 6-1.25 / 6-2.75 / 196.6
Bronny James 6-1.50 / 6-7.25 / 210.4
Reed Sheppard 6-1.75 / 6-3.25 / 181.6
Jared McCain 6-2.00 / 6-3.50 / 203.2
Devin Carter 6-2.25 / 6-8.75 / 193.0
Isaiah Collier 6-2.50 / 6-4.75 / 204.6

I think people assume he can’t physically compete but he absolutely can. I think he can but even I didn’t realize how long his wingspan is. He’s got both the stuff you can’t teach and the stuff you can.

[Klomp]

Comparing sizes of a few guard prospects either discussed here, mocked to us elsewhere, or mocked higher in the draft than our current picks:

(height barefoot / wingspan / weight)
Jamal Shead 6-0.25 / 6-3.00 / 200.8
KJ Simpson 6-0.25 / 6-4.50 / 187.0
Rob Dillingham 6-1.00 / 6-3.00 / 164.2
Tyler Kolek 6-1.25 / 6-2.75 / 196.6
Bronny James 6-1.50 / 6-7.25 / 210.4
Reed Sheppard 6-1.75 / 6-3.25 / 181.6
Jared McCain 6-2.00 / 6-3.50 / 203.2
Devin Carter 6-2.25 / 6-8.75 / 193.0
Isaiah Collier 6-2.50 / 6-4.75 / 204.6

I think people assume he can’t physically compete but he absolutely can. I think he can but even I didn’t realize how long his wingspan is. He’s got both the stuff you can’t teach and the stuff you can.

Here's another interesting size comparison, looking back 16 years ago at the 2008 draft

(height barefoot / wingspan / weight)
Bronny James 6-1.50 / 6-7.25 / 210.4
Derrick Rose 6-1.50 / 6-8.00 / 196.0
Russell Westbrook 6-2.25 / 6-7.75 / 192.0

[Klomp]

Comparing sizes of a few guard prospects either discussed here, mocked to us elsewhere, or mocked higher in the draft than our current picks:

(height barefoot / wingspan / weight)
Jamal Shead 6-0.25 / 6-3.00 / 200.8
KJ Simpson 6-0.25 / 6-4.50 / 187.0
Rob Dillingham 6-1.00 / 6-3.00 / 164.2
Tyler Kolek 6-1.25 / 6-2.75 / 196.6
Bronny James 6-1.50 / 6-7.25 / 210.4
Reed Sheppard 6-1.75 / 6-3.25 / 181.6
Jared McCain 6-2.00 / 6-3.50 / 203.2
Devin Carter 6-2.25 / 6-8.75 / 193.0
Isaiah Collier 6-2.50 / 6-4.75 / 204.6

I think people assume he can’t physically compete but he absolutely can. I think he can but even I didn’t realize how long his wingspan is. He’s got both the stuff you can’t teach and the stuff you can.

Here's another interesting size comparison, looking back 16 years ago at the 2008 draft

(height barefoot / wingspan / weight)
Bronny James 6-1.50 / 6-7.25 / 210.4
Derrick Rose 6-1.50 / 6-8.00 / 196.0
Russell Westbrook 6-2.25 / 6-7.75 / 192.0

And finally, from 2017:
Bronny James 6-1.50 / 6-7.25 / 210.4
Donovan Mitchell 6-1.25 / 6-10.00 / 211.4

[jpatrick]

James was terrible at USC. Terrible. 5ppg. I’m not looking but I think about 36% from the field, 26% from 3, and mid 60s from the line. In the combine 5-on-5 he wasn’t very good either. He has fine size for a PG. But he has no PG skills. He is undersized for SG but could make it work if it wasn’t for the fact he can’t shoot.

Jaden by contrast, although underperforming expectations at UW, was worlds better than Bronny. 13ppg, almost 41% from the field, 33% from 3, and I think mid 70s from the line. I think more than anything what made him fall was he displayed terrible body language in college, which we now know is more anger at himself than being a bad teammate. Further, unlike Bronny, he had incredible size/length for a wing.

Can Bronny make it in the NBA? Sure. Will it have to be in a Patrick Beverley type role? Yeah, I think so. And with his current resume, that would be a guy that goes undrafted or maybe very late second and then drastically improves his shooting and other skills to stick. It’s not a guy that gets picked late first/early second, where we are picking.

[thinktank]

Comparing sizes of a few guard prospects either discussed here, mocked to us elsewhere, or mocked higher in the draft than our current picks:

(height barefoot / wingspan / weight)
Jamal Shead 6-0.25 / 6-3.00 / 200.8
KJ Simpson 6-0.25 / 6-4.50 / 187.0
Rob Dillingham 6-1.00 / 6-3.00 / 164.2
Tyler Kolek 6-1.25 / 6-2.75 / 196.6
Bronny James 6-1.50 / 6-7.25 / 210.4
Reed Sheppard 6-1.75 / 6-3.25 / 181.6
Jared McCain 6-2.00 / 6-3.50 / 203.2
Devin Carter 6-2.25 / 6-8.75 / 193.0
Isaiah Collier 6-2.50 / 6-4.75 / 204.6

I think people assume he can’t physically compete but he absolutely can. I think he can but even I didn’t realize how long his wingspan is. He’s got both the stuff you can’t teach and the stuff you can.

Here's another interesting size comparison, looking back 16 years ago at the 2008 draft

(height barefoot / wingspan / weight)
Bronny James 6-1.50 / 6-7.25 / 210.4
Derrick Rose 6-1.50 / 6-8.00 / 196.0
Russell Westbrook 6-2.25 / 6-7.75 / 192.0

I hate to expose myself but the Rose comparison is one I can’t ignore. Not in capacity, per se, but in nature.

[thinktank]

I think people assume he can’t physically compete but he absolutely can. I think he can but even I didn’t realize how long his wingspan is. He’s got both the stuff you can’t teach and the stuff you can.

Here's another interesting size comparison, looking back 16 years ago at the 2008 draft

(height barefoot / wingspan / weight)
Bronny James 6-1.50 / 6-7.25 / 210.4
Derrick Rose 6-1.50 / 6-8.00 / 196.0
Russell Westbrook 6-2.25 / 6-7.75 / 192.0

And finally, from 2017:
Bronny James 6-1.50 / 6-7.25 / 210.4
Donovan Mitchell 6-1.25 / 6-10.00 / 211.4

Good Lord, Mitchell is a bat.

[Worm Guts]

There's a path for Bronny to become a rotation NBA player as sort of a 3-D PG, but I wouldn't spend a draft pick on him unless it means his dad is coming here.

[thinktank]

Bronny can be traded. Newsflash.

[BlacJacMac]

Bronny can be traded. Newsflash.

For more than the cost of drafting him?

[thinktank]

Bronny can be traded. Newsflash.

For more than the cost of drafting him?

That question doesn’t make much sense because each team makes trades to benefit their own team objectives.

If we like a guy on the Lakers and we want to shed a small amount of salary, Bronny could enable us to do that.

Is that more than the cost of drafting him?

You tell me. Bronny could turn out to be the best piece in such a deal. We can’t see the future with 100% certainty.

[BlacJacMac]

Bronny can be traded. Newsflash.

For more than the cost of drafting him?

That question doesn’t make much sense because each team makes trades to benefit their own team objectives.

If we like a guy on the Lakers and we want to shed a small amount of salary, Bronny could enable us to do that.

Is that more than the cost of drafting him?

You tell me. Bronny could turn out to be the best piece in such a deal. We can’t see the future with 100% certainty.

I'm just saying there aren't any cheap contracts on the Lakers that interest me, and there are at least a dozen guys I'd take a swing at in the draft before Bronny. Do drafting him doesn't make any sense to me.

[shangrila]

Bronny can be traded. Newsflash.

So can anyone. That's not the point.

I posted the quote from Bronny's agent that we were interested in bringing him in for a workout. You don't bring people in for a workout if you want to draft and immediately trade them. The response from a lot of people here of "oh we're drafting Bronny? What are we trading him to the Lakers for then?" is pure copium.

[thinktank]

Bronny can be traded. Newsflash.

So can anyone. That's not the point.

I posted the quote from Bronny's agent that we were interested in bringing him in for a workout. You don't bring people in for a workout if you want to draft and immediately trade them. The response from a lot of people here of "oh we're drafting Bronny? What are we trading him to the Lakers for then?" is pure copium.

In your opinion.

If you’re going to draft a player to trade them, you need to bring them in for a workout to sell it that you intend to keep him so that you can maximize the return. The game within the game. If you draft a player to trade them and teams know you have no intention of keeping him, then that deflates his value. You can’t show your hand.

[Klomp]

I'm intrigued by Harrison Ingram out of UNC. He feels like he's in the mold of guys like PJ Washington, Trey Lyles, Dante Cunningham. Not flashy, but they come in, do their job, and offer positional versatility at forward. He could fit right in on our big lineups, standing 6-5.25" and 233.6 lbs with a 7-0.25" wingspan. Big hands too. Good perimeter skills. He was a guard/forward in HS, who said he patterned his game after guys like Luka and LeBron. Has the smarts, he played at Stanford his first two years.

Watch on YouTube

[thinktank]

I like Ingram too. Some guys have a knack for operating in small spaces and still getting their shot up, grabbing loose balls, etc. He seems like he can do that. Maybe some Tucker / Morris brothers to him. We could really use that, especially if he can play defense.

[Klomp]

I like Ingram too. Some guys have a knack for operating in small spaces and still getting their shot up, grabbing loose balls, etc. He seems like he can do that. Maybe some Tucker / Morris brothers to him. We could really use that, especially if he can play defense.

Yes, Morris twins is another applicable comparison.

[shangrila]

Bronny can be traded. Newsflash.

So can anyone. That's not the point.

I posted the quote from Bronny's agent that we were interested in bringing him in for a workout. You don't bring people in for a workout if you want to draft and immediately trade them. The response from a lot of people here of "oh we're drafting Bronny? What are we trading him to the Lakers for then?" is pure copium.

In your opinion.

If you’re going to draft a player to trade them, you need to bring them in for a workout to sell it that you intend to keep him so that you can maximize the return. The game within the game. If you draft a player to trade them and teams know you have no intention of keeping him, then that deflates his value. You can’t show your hand.

...right. So you think, after hearing that we're 1 of 5 teams with interest in working him out, that it's more likely we're not actually interested in him as a prospect but that instead this is some kind of 4D chess manoeuvre to eek more value from a player widely mocked as a late 2nd rounder?