The Andrew Wiggins Thread #2: Electric Boogaloo

[TwolvesFanRome]

Wiggins traded...ok...i could accept this...but for who? And with who? What team could take Wiggins or show interest for him?

[AirP.]

Lastly, since this is the Wiggins thread, I think I would mention that like Dieng and Towns, we take for granted the health of Wiggins, and his ability to play big minutes. Right now, the hardest thing to find in a switch-happy NBA is a swingman with length. MIN is blessed to have two. I highly doubt that the Wolves are looking to trade Andrew Wiggins, because the return on his max deal would not be good, and very unlikely to bring back a player that could be a comparable swingman to Wiggins. The Trade Board is gruesome.

Yes, Wiggins is highly durable. My problem is the production for the team in those 36 minutes, 82 games a year isn't anywhere close to worth a max contract. I'd much rather have a proven average nba wing(15-18 mil) and use that extra cap space on another solid rotation player.

Is Wiggins done improving, no, he should continue to get somewhat better with more experience(although I'm not sure it's happened much in 4 years) but putting that much of the cap towards "potential" when you potentially have Butler and Towns playing at all-star levels could really hurt the chances of building a real contender. I still can't believe Taylor made Wiggins off limits to make it basically impossible to really go after Irving(with him saying he wanted to go to Minnesota) to team him up with Towns and Butler, that with a few smaller moves for the right roleplayers would have been a championship quality team for the next 5-7 years.

[Mattya]

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[steveshikadance]

Imo the future of this team should be Kat #1 Wigs #2, but as long as Butler is on the team it will be Butler #1 Kat #2, I love Jimmy and what he brings as an alpha but never see him letting go of the reins for Towns as the Wolves closer in the next 5 years if he stays, and we will continue to see Jimmy iso ball late game.
The first 2 years with Kat, Wigs has been option 1 because of Kat's youth and inconsistency but after the dominant flashes he's shown this yr everyone on the team Wigs included realises Kat is numerous uno and I believe Wigs would be fine to be Kats #2.

[wolfen]

Wiggins will not be traded until the Summer of 2019 at the earliest. The Wolves are all about moving Dieng this offseason.

Let me counter on Dieng being moved this summer. If Dieng is moved(and he's not a good value on his contract as a backup) you'd potentially have a rookie center backing up Towns. If Towns tweaks an ankle, gets in early foul trouble, has an injury the team will be downgraded dramatically and we have zero idea how good Patton can be. I really would hate to see Minnesota with Patton at center go against a team with say... D.Jordan, S.Adams, D.Howard, M.Gasol, H.Whiteside, D.Cousins, A.Davis, J.Embiid... and so on and so on. If Dieng is moved Minnesota has to find some type of decent backup till Patton is ready.

It's been reported that Thibs was open to moving Wiggins last summer(maybe in the Butler trade) while the owner wasn't open to that idea and to hedge his bet he put the max on Wiggins saying he needed to improve. I'm pretty sure this wasn't the type of season Glenn Taylor expected from Wiggins after signing the max. Wiggins' poison pill provision ends this summer making him much easier to move. As a franchise, Minnesota has to move forward hoping for Wiggins to become more until they have Butler locked up long term which could happen this summer, once Butler signs an extension I would think Wiggins would be available for the right trade. Although I'm not a fan of Wiggins, some GMs out there will probably be willing to take a chance that he someday gets it.

A plan could be to deal Gorgs, roll with Patton as the backup, but also sign cheap older vet for the "just in case roll".

[AirP.]

Wiggins will not be traded until the Summer of 2019 at the earliest. The Wolves are all about moving Dieng this offseason.

Let me counter on Dieng being moved this summer. If Dieng is moved(and he's not a good value on his contract as a backup) you'd potentially have a rookie center backing up Towns. If Towns tweaks an ankle, gets in early foul trouble, has an injury the team will be downgraded dramatically and we have zero idea how good Patton can be. I really would hate to see Minnesota with Patton at center go against a team with say... D.Jordan, S.Adams, D.Howard, M.Gasol, H.Whiteside, D.Cousins, A.Davis, J.Embiid... and so on and so on. If Dieng is moved Minnesota has to find some type of decent backup till Patton is ready.

It's been reported that Thibs was open to moving Wiggins last summer(maybe in the Butler trade) while the owner wasn't open to that idea and to hedge his bet he put the max on Wiggins saying he needed to improve. I'm pretty sure this wasn't the type of season Glenn Taylor expected from Wiggins after signing the max. Wiggins' poison pill provision ends this summer making him much easier to move. As a franchise, Minnesota has to move forward hoping for Wiggins to become more until they have Butler locked up long term which could happen this summer, once Butler signs an extension I would think Wiggins would be available for the right trade. Although I'm not a fan of Wiggins, some GMs out there will probably be willing to take a chance that he someday gets it.

A plan could be to deal Gorgs, roll with Patton as the backup, but also sign cheap older vet for the "just in case roll".

That's not really in Thib's DNA. Dieng could be moved this summer, but he'd absolutely have to get a replacement vet big somehow. The center position for team defense is just too important to reply on a rookie for 12-18 minutes a night.

[Klomp]

The center position for team defense is just too important to reply on a rookie for 12-18 minutes a night.

He relied on a rookie in 2010-11.

[shangrila]

The center position for team defense is just too important to reply on a rookie for 12-18 minutes a night.

He relied on a rookie in 2010-11.

There's no comparison there and you know it.

[AirP.]

The center position for team defense is just too important to reply on a rookie for 12-18 minutes a night.

He relied on a rookie in 2010-11.

I'm guessing you're talking about Asik who actually was close to a finished product his rookie year since he had been playing professional ball overseas and was 24 years old, his body was way more mature to handle the strength at the NBA level, Patton probably isn't there although skill wise he probably is.

I get both are/will be rookies but one was older and way more prepared for the NBA then the other.

[minimus]

Patton is not ready to hold his own in NBA. I'd be happy if Noah or Bogut could be our backup C and teach toughness to KAT and Patton.

[Killboard]

Patton is not ready to hold his own in NBA. I'd be happy if Noah or Bogut could be our backup C and teach toughness to KAT and Patton.

Isnt enough with Taj on the roster?

[Killboard]

Let me counter on Dieng being moved this summer. If Dieng is moved(and he's not a good value on his contract as a backup) you'd potentially have a rookie center backing up Towns. If Towns tweaks an ankle, gets in early foul trouble, has an injury the team will be downgraded dramatically and we have zero idea how good Patton can be. I really would hate to see Minnesota with Patton at center go against a team with say... D.Jordan, S.Adams, D.Howard, M.Gasol, H.Whiteside, D.Cousins, A.Davis, J.Embiid... and so on and so on. If Dieng is moved Minnesota has to find some type of decent backup till Patton is ready.

It's been reported that Thibs was open to moving Wiggins last summer(maybe in the Butler trade) while the owner wasn't open to that idea and to hedge his bet he put the max on Wiggins saying he needed to improve. I'm pretty sure this wasn't the type of season Glenn Taylor expected from Wiggins after signing the max. Wiggins' poison pill provision ends this summer making him much easier to move. As a franchise, Minnesota has to move forward hoping for Wiggins to become more until they have Butler locked up long term which could happen this summer, once Butler signs an extension I would think Wiggins would be available for the right trade. Although I'm not a fan of Wiggins, some GMs out there will probably be willing to take a chance that he someday gets it.

A plan could be to deal Gorgs, roll with Patton as the backup, but also sign cheap older vet for the "just in case roll".

That's not really in Thib's DNA. Dieng could be moved this summer, but he'd absolutely have to get a replacement vet big somehow. The center position for team defense is just too important to reply on a rookie for 12-18 minutes a night.

If Bjelly stays with the team, he could see minutes with the starters, allowing Taj to be the backup center if Patton has off games.

[AirP.]

A plan could be to deal Gorgs, roll with Patton as the backup, but also sign cheap older vet for the "just in case roll".

That's not really in Thib's DNA. Dieng could be moved this summer, but he'd absolutely have to get a replacement vet big somehow. The center position for team defense is just too important to reply on a rookie for 12-18 minutes a night.

If Bjelly stays with the team, he could see minutes with the starters, allowing Taj to be the backup center if Patton has off games.

Why would Bjelica start over Taj at PF, the starters need defense way more then they need more offense.

[shrink]

I listened to Wolfson's Scoop podcast this morning, and he is in full retreat mode.

He said he doesn't fault Derek James for tweeting out three words of his 3 hours on a local radio show, but he did not intend to create a "bleep-storm" when the tweet got picked up by Bleacher Report. He said he was asked a question, and wondered aloud whether Wiggins would question his role when it changes, like Kevin Love's changed in CLE. He said he had heard a couple insiders whisper this as well, and others have told him since that it's flat out untrue. He agrees that if Wiggins felt strongly, he would have gone to Thibs with direct concerns about his role, and that did not happen. He said Wiggins is been a good teammate and hard worker. Thibs actually questioned "the character" of the reporter that said something like this, and Wolfson spent a considerable time talking about his 20 years in the industry, and asked Thibs ("who they should build a statue!") to contact him directly.

[Killboard]

That's not really in Thib's DNA. Dieng could be moved this summer, but he'd absolutely have to get a replacement vet big somehow. The center position for team defense is just too important to reply on a rookie for 12-18 minutes a night.

If Bjelly stays with the team, he could see minutes with the starters, allowing Taj to be the backup center if Patton has off games.

Why would Bjelica start over Taj at PF, the starters need defense way more then they need more offense.

1st) Bjelly is no slouch on D
2nd) They also need spacing
3rd) Isnt necesairly start or finish the game, but play more with the first unit to allow Taj play with the second, if Patton isnt playing reliable ball.

At the end, if it is Bjelly vs Gorgui, the decisions should be pretty simple.

[AirP.]

If Bjelly stays with the team, he could see minutes with the starters, allowing Taj to be the backup center if Patton has off games.

Why would Bjelica start over Taj at PF, the starters need defense way more then they need more offense.

1st) Bjelly is no slouch on D
2nd) They also need spacing
3rd) Isnt necesairly start or finish the game, but play more with the first unit to allow Taj play with the second, if Patton isnt playing reliable ball.

At the end, if it is Bjelly vs Gorgui, the decisions should be pretty simple.

Bjelica isn't under contract(while the team is over the cap) and will be a restricted free agent, Dieng is under contract and might cost assets to move, yeah, the decision is pretty simple as of now.

Bjelica is no Taj Gibson on defense, spacing, they have a center who's able to provide spacing and once again, they need defense to win games, not more offense. If you want to go the offensive way just trade Butler and get a high volume 3pt shooter to take his place. I just don't understand why more offense is a bigger need then defense for the starters.

[AirP.]

I listened to Wolfson's Scoop podcast this morning, and he is in full retreat mode.

He said he doesn't fault Derek James for tweeting out three words of his 3 hours on a local radio show, but he did not intend to create a "bleep-storm" when the tweet got picked up by Bleacher Report. He said he was asked a question, and wondered aloud whether Wiggins would question his role when it changes, like Kevin Love's changed in CLE. He said he had heard a couple insiders whisper this as well, and others have told him since that it's flat out untrue. He agrees that if Wiggins felt strongly, he would have gone to Thibs with direct concerns about his role, and that did not happen. He said Wiggins is been a good teammate and hard worker. Thibs actually questioned "the character" of the reporter that said something like this, and Wolfson spent a considerable time talking about his 20 years in the industry, and asked Thibs ("who they should build a statue!") to contact him directly.

Just got done listening to the same thing(just commenting on the Wiggins stuff).

What Shrink says is pretty much on target but here's what I heard.

A reporter who had his credibility attacked, he listed basically everything he's done in his career to try to rebuild his credibility for the whoever is questioning it.

Wolfson said he had multiple sources who said that Wiggins had questioned his role this year, Wolfson also said he could have been lied to. He also had other NBA sources after the bleacher report tagged him tell him they've heard the same things about Wiggins questioning his role(they could be hearing through the grapevine the same info from the same people Wolfson heard from).

A person Wolfson really believes in said it wasn't true, BUT it sounded like not because he knows for sure but because of the reasoning that he said Wiggins would have gone to Thibs himself with the complaint but that hadn't happen and Wolfson can verify that Wiggins has not gone to Thibs about his role. This doesn't dispute that Wiggins has mentioned not agreeing to his role to teammates, which personally I completely understand him doing that, which I even mentioned before the season.

Wolfson mentioned that since this broke, Thibs and Wiggins have talked about the story.

Wolfson then again talked about all his connections/credibility, all his connections before Thibs was in town, back to 96 or 97 then once again said he's heard from other's the same info on Wiggins.

Wolfson then goes on to say Thibs calling a reporter out but everyone knows who he was talking about, Wolfson then starts praising Thibs and his accomplishments going into all the games he won as a coach, how respected he is in the coaching community, I think the words were "he is incredibly accomplished his is one hell of a coach, he's having success as the president of operations, he traded for a top 10 2 way player in Jimmy Butler, he is about to take the Wolves to the playoffs for the first time since the 03-04 season, they should build him a statue". Wolfson mentioned it really bugged him having his character called into question(which you can tell with him keeping putting out all his credentials).

Wolfson is backpedaling a little bit but to me he's trying to frame exactly what he's heard(rumors) instead of it being taking as just plain fact which at this point they are not.


My opinion(not from the podcast) , Wiggins had the keys to the franchise handed over to him, in the span of 1 year Towns just bypasses him as the better player and then the franchise adds another player better than him. He went from the franchise player to 3rd option. In all actuality he does have a legitimate gripe with bringing in Butler to take over his role, he doesn't have a legit gripe about Towns(if he's upset about being behind Towns). I think we can all agree that bringing in a 3&D guy instead of someone like Butler would have been better personally for Wiggins.

[Killboard]

Why would Bjelica start over Taj at PF, the starters need defense way more then they need more offense.

1st) Bjelly is no slouch on D
2nd) They also need spacing
3rd) Isnt necesairly start or finish the game, but play more with the first unit to allow Taj play with the second, if Patton isnt playing reliable ball.

At the end, if it is Bjelly vs Gorgui, the decisions should be pretty simple.

Bjelica isn't under contract(while the team is over the cap) and will be a restricted free agent, Dieng is under contract and might cost assets to move, yeah, the decision is pretty simple as of now.

Bjelica is no Taj Gibson on defense, spacing, they have a center who's able to provide spacing and once again, they need defense to win games, not more offense. If you want to go the offensive way just trade Butler and get a high volume 3pt shooter to take his place. I just don't understand why more offense is a bigger need then defense for the starters.

Towns can provide spacing, but only if he isnt posting up. If he is posting up, where should Taj Gibson be (and where Bjelly should be)?

I know Bjelly and G contract situation. The decision should be simple in who you want to keep basketball wise, for your roster and who is a commodity in the league. After you choose your priorities (which clearly would be Bjelly IMO) you must weigth how good the rookie pool is after the 22 pick (and if its worth it to trade it attached to Dieng), if Crawford is coming back next season (what stupid decision give him a 2nd year), and how much better Teague (another stupid mistake, even more with the player option) is than Tyus for this roster.

What I know is that Bjelly has good size, is a good rebounder, is good at driving and passing, good team defender and a great 3pt shooter. He will be a great value for his contrat and still having 2 or 3 seasons more in his prime.

[Klomp]

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[packforfreedom]

Wolfson might have jeopardized his connection to the organization with this move. No wonder that he's trying to limit the damage.