[Krawczynski] Alex Rodriguez and Marc Lore in serious talks to become the next owners of the Minnesota Timberwolves

[BlacJacMac]

Even if the contract had incentives, they had no bearing on why it was illegal. We did not get busted for signing him to a contract with illegal incentives. You literally can’t sign a contract like that.

Why is that so hard for you to understand?

Incentives are not part of the story.

It started as Glen Taylor is a snake because he signed Joe Smith to an illegal deal.

His argument is he's not a snake because the contract had incentives in it.

Yea I don't get it ether

My argument was that secret contract wasn't a big enough deal to call him a snake. You have a low threshold to call someone a snake.

Because it had incentives!

But literally no mention of what was illegal about it.

[guest81]

Even if the contract had incentives, they had no bearing on why it was illegal. We did not get busted for signing him to a contract with illegal incentives. You literally can’t sign a contract like that.

Why is that so hard for you to understand?

Incentives are not part of the story.

It started as Glen Taylor is a snake because he signed Joe Smith to an illegal deal.

His argument is he's not a snake because the contract had incentives in it.

Yea I don't get it ether

My argument was that secret contract wasn't a big enough deal to call him a snake. You have a low threshold to call someone a snake.

It wasn't a big deal because it had incentives?

[BlacJacMac]

I'm not having any trouble understanding anything. I said we signed Joe to an illegal secret contract that included personal and team incentives. I never said the incentives made it illegal. You look at every post I made and show me where I ever said the incentives were illegal. You won't be able to.

Every sports contract has incentives in it! Your not even arguing anything, your just saying a thing

I don't think every contract has incentives. A lot of them do. That's why I'm saying him offering Joe this very large raise in pay that was based to some extent on unlikely to be met incentives wasn't IMO that big of a deal. You think it was a big deal.

Oh my god. None of that happened.

Nothing about the deal had anything to do with incentives.

It wasn’t a contract with crazy escalators for incentives. That contract would never get approved by the NBA.

It was 3 minimal one year contracts, each signed 1 year apart. Then after 3 years and we had his Bird Rights, we would sign him to an 80+ Million deal.

Incentives never entered the story.

What was illegal was before he signed the first contract, we put in writing that we’d give him the 80+ on the 4th contract he’d sign with us in the future.

[KGdaBom]

It started as Glen Taylor is a snake because he signed Joe Smith to an illegal deal.

His argument is he's not a snake because the contract had incentives in it.

Yea I don't get it ether

My argument was that secret contract wasn't a big enough deal to call him a snake. You have a low threshold to call someone a snake.

It wasn't a big deal because it had incentives?

I don't know how much of the raise in pay was based on unlikely to be met incentives. I just know some of it was. To me saying we will give you a big raise in pay for meeting incentives isn't a big deal. So can you acknowledge that what I said was true and we just disagree on how snakey the illegal contract is.

[thinktank]

OMG

[guest81]

My argument was that secret contract wasn't a big enough deal to call him a snake. You have a low threshold to call someone a snake.

It wasn't a big deal because it had incentives?

I don't know how much of the raise in pay was based on unlikely to be met incentives. I just know some of it was. To me saying we will give you a big raise in pay for meeting incentives isn't a big deal. So can you acknowledge that what I said was true and we just disagree on how snakey the illegal contract is.

Which of the 3 1 year contracts had these incentives in it? Are you saying there was an incentive that would give him a raise from the minimum to 82 million?

[KGdaBom]

Every sports contract has incentives in it! Your not even arguing anything, your just saying a thing

I don't think every contract has incentives. A lot of them do. That's why I'm saying him offering Joe this very large raise in pay that was based to some extent on unlikely to be met incentives wasn't IMO that big of a deal. You think it was a big deal.

Oh my god. None of that happened.

Nothing about the deal had anything to do with incentives.

It wasn’t a contract with crazy escalators for incentives. That contract would never get approved by the NBA.

It was 3 minimal one year contracts, each signed 1 year apart. Then after 3 years and we had his Bird Rights, we would sign him to an 80+ Million deal.

Incentives never entered the story.

What was illegal was before he signed the first contract, we put in writing that we’d give him the 80+ on the 4th contract he’d sign with us in the future.

We need to find the contract. I wouldn't bet my life it included unlikely to be met incentives, but other than that I'm almost certain. The contract was not illegal because of the incentives and I never said it was. I think Joe had to hit the incentives for the value to be what you claimed. I rest my case. Everything I said was true. I'm really resting my case until someone can produce the actual complete contract conditions. If that happens I will discuss it more to A: Admit I'm wrong if I am. or B: to gloat if it proves me right.

[BlacJacMac]

I used to think I had a need to be right…

[guest81]

I don't think every contract has incentives. A lot of them do. That's why I'm saying him offering Joe this very large raise in pay that was based to some extent on unlikely to be met incentives wasn't IMO that big of a deal. You think it was a big deal.

Oh my god. None of that happened.

Nothing about the deal had anything to do with incentives.

It wasn’t a contract with crazy escalators for incentives. That contract would never get approved by the NBA.

It was 3 minimal one year contracts, each signed 1 year apart. Then after 3 years and we had his Bird Rights, we would sign him to an 80+ Million deal.

Incentives never entered the story.

What was illegal was before he signed the first contract, we put in writing that we’d give him the 80+ on the 4th contract he’d sign with us in the future.

We need to find the contract. I wouldn't bet my life it included unlikely to be met incentives, but other than that I'm almost certain. The contract was not illegal because of the incentives and I never said it was. I think Joe had to hit the incentives for the value to be what you claimed. I rest my case. Everything I said was true. I'm really resting my case until someone can produce the actual complete contract conditions. If that happens I will discuss it more to A: Admit I'm wrong if I am. or B: to gloat if it proves me right.

You think that there was an incentive in a 1 year minimum deal that would pay him 82 million on a completely new contract.

[Klomp]

"We're a little town, a little town out here in the prairie," Taylor said. "And it isn't quite as important to the NBA as the other towns."

Glen Taylor in a nutshell. It's still his mentality over 20 years later!

[shrink]

“Simply foots the bill” .. for $11.5 million dollars?

You need both parties. Neither side shouldn’t take all the credit

Never did I say Lore and Rodriguez deserve all the credit. But even you must see they should be given more credit than Taylor. I would venture, based on what Taylor told them, it should be a considerable amount more.

Even me?

I don’t know how to decide who deserves more. Making some phone calls versus paying $11.5 mil is outside my frame of reference.

[guest81]

“Simply foots the bill” .. for $11.5 million dollars?

You need both parties. Neither side shouldn’t take all the credit

Never did I say Lore and Rodriguez deserve all the credit. But even you must see they should be given more credit than Taylor. I would venture, based on what Taylor told them, it should be a considerable amount more.

Even me?

I don’t know how to decide who deserves more. Making some phone calls versus paying $11.5 mil is outside my frame of reference.

Wonder why Glen didn't just make some phone calls in the past if it were that easy

[shrink]

Never did I say Lore and Rodriguez deserve all the credit. But even you must see they should be given more credit than Taylor. I would venture, based on what Taylor told them, it should be a considerable amount more.

Even me?

I don’t know how to decide who deserves more. Making some phone calls versus paying $11.5 mil is outside my frame of reference.

Wonder why Glen didn't just make some phone calls in the past if it were that easy

Because he incorrectly assumed Connelly wouldn’t come here, even for a giant payday.

Lore and ARod get credit for taking that swing.

Btw Baseline, I wasn’t accusing you of saying they deserved all the credit. I said I was frustrated with Lore and ARod for claiming all the credit. We would likely both agree that’s untrue, but we might differ on what each percentage is more valuable. But we also agree it takes them both.

[Nick K]

Joe Smith punishment was a record at that time and it still is.

No team has ever lost five draft picks, I don’t believe.

“ NBA commissioner David Stern punished the Wolves by taking away their next five first-round draft picks and fining them $3.5 million, a league record.”

SNAKE.

I thought the Joe Smith fiasco was fairly minor just because everyone else was doing it! I'm not saying it was right but it still kills me that we did that for a mediocre player at best! Smith never lived up to the hype. It was the ultimate in bad decision making. So Wolves like back then.

[Nick K]

Every sports contract has incentives in it! Your not even arguing anything, your just saying a thing

I don't think every contract has incentives. A lot of them do. That's why I'm saying him offering Joe this very large raise in pay that was based to some extent on unlikely to be met incentives wasn't IMO that big of a deal. You think it was a big deal.

Oh my god. None of that happened.

Nothing about the deal had anything to do with incentives.

It wasn’t a contract with crazy escalators for incentives. That contract would never get approved by the NBA.

It was 3 minimal one year contracts, each signed 1 year apart. Then after 3 years and we had his Bird Rights, we would sign him to an 80+ Million deal.

Incentives never entered the story.

What was illegal was before he signed the first contract, we put in writing that we’d give him the 80+ on the 4th contract he’d sign with us in the future.

Yep. That's the way I remember it.

[guest81]

Even me?

I don’t know how to decide who deserves more. Making some phone calls versus paying $11.5 mil is outside my frame of reference.

Wonder why Glen didn't just make some phone calls in the past if it were that easy

Because he incorrectly assumed Connelly wouldn’t come here, even for a giant payday.

Lore and ARod get credit for taking that swing.

Btw Baseline, I wasn’t accusing you of saying they deserved all the credit. I said I was frustrated with Lore and ARod for claiming all the credit. We would likely both agree that’s untrue, but we might differ on what each percentage is more valuable. But we also agree it takes them both.

If Lore and arod had bought the team straight up in the first place, Connelly still comes here. If they never entered the picture, there was zero chance he would of come here.

[guest81]

Joe Smith punishment was a record at that time and it still is.

No team has ever lost five draft picks, I don’t believe.

“ NBA commissioner David Stern punished the Wolves by taking away their next five first-round draft picks and fining them $3.5 million, a league record.”

SNAKE.

I thought the Joe Smith fiasco was fairly minor just because everyone else was doing it! I'm not saying it was right but it still kills me that we did that for a mediocre player at best! Smith never lived up to the hype. It was the ultimate in bad decision making. So Wolves like back then.

I mean what other deal was a blatant as the joe Smith deal?

[shrink]

Joe Smith punishment was a record at that time and it still is.

No team has ever lost five draft picks, I don’t believe.

“ NBA commissioner David Stern punished the Wolves by taking away their next five first-round draft picks and fining them $3.5 million, a league record.”

SNAKE.

I thought the Joe Smith fiasco was fairly minor just because everyone else was doing it! I'm not saying it was right but it still kills me that we did that for a mediocre player at best! Smith never lived up to the hype. It was the ultimate in bad decision making. So Wolves like back then.

I mean what other deal was a blatant as the joe Smith deal?

Blatant? I mentioned we just saw CHI sign a free agent one minute into free agency. I think MIA did this with Kyle Lowry as well. It’s not as serious (everyone tampers too), but it’s hard to be more blatant than announce your free agent publicly at 12:01!

[VanWest82]

I'm a little confused. Is all this Joe Smith talk because we think Taylor would've done to Joe Smith (had they not been caught) what he just did to ARod and Lore?

[shrink]

I'm a little confused. Is all this Joe Smith talk because we think Taylor would've done to Joe Smith (had they not been caught) what he just did to ARod and Lore?

No, many people here just like to complain about Taylor’s many missteps.

The Joe Smith thing won’t have any bearing whatsoever on how the arbiter or board decides the ownership case.