Trade Talk (Part Four)

[KGdaBom]

If positional archetypes don't matter, why not just draft Okongwu as our PG of the future?

Archetype is just a stupid fancy word for does he meet a need for our team. I would rather say that than talk about Archetype. I remember a few years ago and we didn't need archetypes to discuss the draft.

I don't know how others are using it, but when I'm using the word it's to say that there is a specific type of player the team is looking for to play that position.

The easiest place to see this is at the center position, where Towns is the offensive archetype as an offensively-skilled big man with good perimeter shooting and passing ability along with solid athleticism. This is why Naz Reid was specifically targeted by the team and not someone like Tacko Fall who wouldn't really fit any of those categories.

Building a roster with positional archetypes allows a team to create and implement one system that can be run no matter who is on the court. They didn't have to completely change the system when Towns went down because there were already players on the roster who could fill the role even if not to the same level.

That sounds like is he a good player and does he fit the need to me.

[IceManBK1]

https://youtu.be/l46pqSeeA34 Seems like Edward could be raw coming into the League too. His defense is lacking, can't catch and shoot...plays a selfish style. doesn't seem to trust his teammates.

[KGdaBom]

Nobody would be replacing Russell.....

https://youtu.be/pSuM0iIOAag Lamelo+Dlo backcourt on defense would be disastrous. I'm not even defending dlo on defense. seem like lamelo's defense is worse lol.

That video is from his sophomore year in high school. I'm guessing a lot of pros had bad defense at that age.

Not even saying he's a good defender, but that's a poor video to use as evidence in your argument.

I'm definitely not a Ball fan, but he should get better as time goes on. However, he better be amazing at everything else because he has one of the most broken shots I have ever seen.

[shrink]

Juancho and Nowell won’t get you from pick 10 to 5. Nowell might be worth a second, and a sign-and-trade isn’t very valuable to a team with the MLE. They could keep the #5, and overpay by $1 mil or so.

[Klomp]

Archetype is just a stupid fancy word for does he meet a need for our team. I would rather say that than talk about Archetype. I remember a few years ago and we didn't need archetypes to discuss the draft.

I don't know how others are using it, but when I'm using the word it's to say that there is a specific type of player the team is looking for to play that position.

The easiest place to see this is at the center position, where Towns is the offensive archetype as an offensively-skilled big man with good perimeter shooting and passing ability along with solid athleticism. This is why Naz Reid was specifically targeted by the team and not someone like Tacko Fall who wouldn't really fit any of those categories.

Building a roster with positional archetypes allows a team to create and implement one system that can be run no matter who is on the court. They didn't have to completely change the system when Towns went down because there were already players on the roster who could fill the role even if not to the same level.

That sounds like is he a good player and does he fit the need to me.

is he a good player and does he fit the need = 11 words, 34 letters
archetype = 1 word, 9 letters

[KGdaBom]

I don't know how others are using it, but when I'm using the word it's to say that there is a specific type of player the team is looking for to play that position.

The easiest place to see this is at the center position, where Towns is the offensive archetype as an offensively-skilled big man with good perimeter shooting and passing ability along with solid athleticism. This is why Naz Reid was specifically targeted by the team and not someone like Tacko Fall who wouldn't really fit any of those categories.

Building a roster with positional archetypes allows a team to create and implement one system that can be run no matter who is on the court. They didn't have to completely change the system when Towns went down because there were already players on the roster who could fill the role even if not to the same level.

That sounds like is he a good player and does he fit the need to me.

is he a good player and does he fit the need = 11 words, 34 letters
archetype = 1 word, 9 letters

True, but I'd rather speak plain English. Archetype just sounds too snooty to me.

[KGdaBom]

Klomp: Hey KG do you think Okongwu is the right Archetype?
Me: What?
Klomp: Is he a good player and does he meet our needs.
Me: Yes he is and yes he does.
Klomp:


I hope people enjoy this and nobody was offended. I think it's pretty funny and self deprecating humor.

[KGdaBom]

Can somebody tell me why the emoticons are available when I reply to a post or edit a post, but not when I create a post?

[KGdaBom]

Juancho and Nowell won’t get you from pick 10 to 5. Nowell might be worth a second, and a sign-and-trade isn’t very valuable to a team with the MLE. They could keep the #5, and overpay by $1 mil or so.

Isn't Juancho as good as Saric who got us from 11 to 6?
But Saric was already signed to a steal of a deal contract so it's different.

[minimus]

Juancho and Nowell won’t get you from pick 10 to 5. Nowell might be worth a second, and a sign-and-trade isn’t very valuable to a team with the MLE. They could keep the #5, and overpay by $1 mil or so.

What about #10, #33, Nowell and Juancho for #5?

[KGdaBom]

Juancho and Nowell won’t get you from pick 10 to 5. Nowell might be worth a second, and a sign-and-trade isn’t very valuable to a team with the MLE. They could keep the #5, and overpay by $1 mil or so.

What about #10, #33, Nowell and Juancho for #5?

Are we getting 10 in some proposed deal with Phoenix?

[gandlogo]

Reddish is bigger than Culver and a natural SF. He started last season poorly, but really came on strong down the stretch. My interest in him would be pretty high. Plus I love OO7. And Gordon for nothing but 17 and a salary swap. Sign me up.

Reddish is a SG, not a natural SF. He may be taller than Culver, but he’s not as physical. I tracked him as a Duke recruit in the AAU circuit. Watched him a ton at Duke. He’s a very talented kid. Great shooting stroke that was inconsistent in college, but finally started to see results late in the NBA season. He’s better suited at SG. In the MN 1-3-1 system, he’s just another wing like Beasley and Juancho. But if you need him to put a body on somebody, Culver or Okogie are better options at SF - despite their weaknesses on offense.

Wow so Reddish sucks at SF. Consider me no longer interested in acquiring him.

Yup. That’s exactly what said. Lord.

[Klomp]

Klomp: Hey KG do you think Okongwu is the right Archetype?
Me: What?
Klomp: Is he a good player and does he meet our needs.
Me: Yes he is and no he doesn't.
Klomp:


I hope people enjoy this and nobody was offended. I think it's pretty funny and self deprecating humor.

Fixed for accuracy.

[KGdaBom]

Klomp: Hey KG do you think Okongwu is the right Archetype?
Me: What?
Klomp: Is he a good player and does he meet our needs.
Me: Yes he is and yes he does
Klomp:


I hope people enjoy this and nobody was offended. I think it's pretty funny and self deprecating humor.

Fixed for accuracy.

I'm offended and yes he does. Our desperate need for rebounding, defense, shot blocking from the PF position. I don't think we have anybody who legitimately does all that. Vanderbilt might have potential.

[shrink]

Juancho and Nowell won’t get you from pick 10 to 5. Nowell might be worth a second, and a sign-and-trade isn’t very valuable to a team with the MLE. They could keep the #5, and overpay by $1 mil or so.

Isn't Juancho as good as Saric who got us from 11 to 6?
But Saric was already signed to a steal of a deal contract so it's different.

Right. With Saric, PHX got one discount season at rookie scale, a season they got to evaluate him and decide whether he fit, and how big a multi-year contract they wanted to offer.

The other problem with the trade value for non-max sign and trades, besides having to pay top price market value, is that trading for a sign-and-trade player hard caps a team. If you can get a 2nd for facilitating a deal, that’s normal value.

[IceManBK1]

Nerlens Noel is a UFA this yr...No outside game. But he can just patrol the paint, block shots and reb. We can run some PnR with Dlo and him. Throw some lobs to him.

[shrink]

Rosas and Saunders refused to play two bigs for the entire season last year, regardless of the match up. They continued to say that they wanted other teams to adjust to them. A one-big, five out system maximizes Towns versatility and creates match up nightmares for opposing coaches.

I would mention after the lottery that Rosas said he was keeping all options open, hinting that is Wiseman was the best prospect, he would draft him. Personally, I think he would have to look like a sure fire superstar for Rosas to ask Towns to change positions, and more likely this is just to keep up trade leverage for teams that love him with the threat that if they don’t up trade offers, we may just keep him ourselves.

Still, I think it is a long shot that Rosas would target any center, especially before we see how a 5-out looks with DeAngelo and KAT playing a number of games together.

[Klomp]

Rosas and Saunders refused to play two bigs for the entire season last year, regardless of the match up. They continued to say that they wanted other teams to adjust to them. A one-big, five out system maximizes Towns versatility and creates match up nightmares for opposing coaches.

I would mention after the lottery that Rosas said he was keeping all options open, hinting that is Wiseman was the best prospect, he would draft him. Personally, I think he would have to look like a sure fire superstar for Rosas to ask Towns to change positions, and more likely this is just to keep up trade leverage for teams that love him with the threat that if they don’t up trade offers, we may just keep him ourselves.

Still, I think it is a long shot that Rosas would target any center, especially before we see how a 5-out looks with DeAngelo and KAT playing a number of games together.

If they draft him, I think they do so with the belief he fits the five-out system. If they don't think he fits, they don't draft him. Easy as that.

[twolves31]

The realgm radio podcast yesterday has a good 30 minutes or so of speculative things Minnesota could do with the top pick, its on the main page of realgm at the moment. Some of their ideas included Porter from Denver, Lavine and Markkenan, Jru Holiday with a wink wink agreement on an extension for him, Myles Turner, Levert. They suggested more but I was only half listening in the background while cleaning.

[theGreatRC]

The realgm radio podcast yesterday has a good 30 minutes or so of speculative things Minnesota could do with the top pick, its on the main page of realgm at the moment. Some of their ideas included Porter from Denver, Lavine and Markkenan, Jru Holiday with a wink wink agreement on an extension for him, Myles Turner, Levert. They suggested more but I was only half listening in the background while cleaning.

We would have the worst defense in the league again with Lavine and Lauri, but we'd also be Houston-esque with the amount of players that shoot and hit 3s, especially if we had Beasley as a microwave off the bench.

Jrue is 30 and i'm assuming a wink wink extension would be 4 years, he'd be 34 by the time his contract is up. Most people think the decline of an NBA player happens after 30, unless you're a genetic freak that takes care of yourself like Bron or Vince Carter or your game doesn't rely on athleticism like Dirk and Duncan.

No on Myles Turner, No on Levert..

Only 3 guys i'd want are Booker, Beal and Simmons in that order, but Beal's contract is so short and fat that it hurts to look at.

Hopefully Rosas is doing his homework daily and makes the right choice, the organization can't afford another mistake with this decision of the #1 pick.