RealGM

Lets start a new thread.

http://sports.yahoo.com/nba/news?slug=y ... rade072610

The Cleveland Cavaliers have reached agreement on a trade that sends Delonte West and Sebastian Telfair to the Minnesota Timberwolves for Ramon Sessions and Ryan Hollins, league sources told Yahoo! Sports.

The Timberwolves are expected to waive West, who has only $500,000 of his $4.7 million salary guaranteed next season. The Cavs also will get a second-round pick in the trade.

Telfair, who previously played for the Timberwolves, could eventually be moved again. The Timberwolves signed Sessions to a four-year, $16 million contract a year ago, and the Cavs can use him at shooting guard. The Cavs lost center Zydrunas Ilgauskas in free agency and aren’t expected to re-sign Shaquille O’Neal, so Hollins can help their frontline.

From the Gen board:

yossixbean11 wrote:Press release from Kahn:

"Delonte was a very young and immature kid who banged LeBron's mom a lot."

"He has developed a really good support system around him this past season in Cleveland. He's hired people to help him grow up."

LOL

West is another Gomes contract. Those things are really valuable right? RIGHT?

Krapinsky wrote:West is another Gomes contract. Those things are really valuable right? RIGHT?

West's is more valuable than Gomes'. West is guaranteed 500k this season, thats it. Gomes is guaranteed 1M this season, 1M the next season, and 750k the season after that.

If the wolves cut DWest, do they have any potenial trades or the horizon ??

Minn. team salary to start the season seems awfully low.

Thanks for any info !!

Pax

Any of you "EVERY deal Kahn does is brilliant" homers want to tell me what a great deal this is, because I sure don't see it.

Is it better for us to hold onto him and include him in a future trade (deadline) or to release him right away so we pay 500k?

I don't think it's going to save the franchise but I don't see what's so bad about it. Telfair makes more sense as a 3rd guard then either of Ridnour or Sessions and it saves the team money now (through West's buyout) and in the future (by getting out of both Hollins and Sessions long term contracts).

J_Era_3 wrote:Is it better for us to hold onto him and include him in a future trade (deadline) or to release him right away so we pay 500k?

His deal is guaranteed completely on August 3rd IIRC, so I think they'd have to get rid of him right away in either scenario.

J_Era_3 wrote:Is it better for us to hold onto him and include him in a future trade (deadline) or to release him right away so we pay 500k?

Two side. Obviously its better to not eat the $500,000 for nothing, but he has to be traded singly, and his price needs to be a salary-matching fit for the team that would get him. If we waived him, we'd turn him into cap space which we could add to our current stash, and then we have more flexibility for salary-matching the other team.

Either way, he won't be on our team by August 3.

This is not a great deal, Shrink--merely a good one, and for cap purposes only. Essentially, what Kahn has done is swap the five years of contractual obligations for Sessions and Hollins--$17.59 million total--for the one year of contractual obligations for Telfair and West--$3.2 million total. Total savings for Minnesota: $14.39 million. Plus it frees two roster spaces, which equals flexibility.

Kahn is cutting bait on Sessions and Hollins--two worthy FA experiments that failed. I have no problem with that.

No one should pretend that this trade makes Minnesota any better on the floor. But it doesn't make it demonstrably worse, either. It's all about bucks.

For this deal to be OK, you have to decide:

1. Is Sessions not worth his contract (+$500,000 more!)?

2. Is Hollins < Telfair < awful (we want to buy him out - pay money for no production), and

3. Is one of our future 2nd's < 0

The questionable website claims that the Wolves are receiving the 2nd rounder. Hmm.

http://www.hoopsworld.com/Story.asp?story_id=16926

It's a meh deal. Has no effect on the long run. Merely a deal to trim the roster and make our players happier. Sessions wasn't going to help us win more games even without Ridnour. I'm not going to cry over a 2nd round pick that I don't think was necessary.

shrink wrote:1. Is Sessions not worth his contract (+$500,000 more!)?

On this team? No. He's a well paid backup who doesn't fit the system.

2. Is Hollins < Telfair < awful (we want to buy him out - pay money for no production),

We want to buy Telfair out? Where's this coming from?

3. Is one of our future 2nd's < 0

It's a freaking 2nd round pick that they won't get until 2013. WHO THE HELL CARES?

Kurosawa wrote:Kahn is cutting bait on Sessions and Hollins--two worthy FA experiments that failed. I have no problem with that.

Why are you saying they were FA experiments that failed? Hollins, definitely. Sessions was paid pretty fairly, we signed him to be a value signing, and he seemed to outplay Flynn much of the time.

I maintain that Sessions has positive value, in light of when and for how much we signed him, and also, the recent free agency signings. Even if his value to us is neutral -- $0M -- we are taking on Telfair (2.7M) and West (.5M) and giving up a pick (let's say, 3M). Thus, it is around 6.2M in order to get rid of Hollins ASAP.

If Telfair, West, Sessions, and Hollins were all simply contracts, with no value, then sure, your argument makes sense. But Telfair is likely to be a stopgap PG or simply waived, and West is very likely to be waived. Sessions and the 2nd have value above their contracts, and I believe that value to be more positive than Hollins is negative.

$3M for a 2nd round pick?

Oh.. Do those not go for $3M?

EDIT: For my part, I think it will be a fairly good pick, which are often valued around late firsts.

shangrila wrote:

shrink wrote:1. Is Sessions not worth his contract (+$500,000 more!)?

On this team? No. He's a well paid backup who doesn't fit the system.

This was Kahn's problem with the Webster deal .. he doesn't look at an assets value to the other team. Boo hoo - Gomes costs POR $2.75 mil .. but the trade saves POR $11 mil, and they get a pick.

You're right, Sessions wasn't particularly valuable to us, but he would have been valuable to CLE, but also valuable to several other teams. Kahn didn't get market value, imho. Or, as his homers would say, "Well, if the trade bought back a bad return, obviously the asset must not be worth much, because never-fail Kahn only got squat!"

Now, this is a small trade, and it won't kill us, but its wasteful. Im a big fan of the value of cap space, so I guess I'll jump on the homer's other lifeline, "Well, don't blame him .. maybe he'll make a good deal down the line with this stuff!"

On a scale of 1-to-10, the board biggest fan of cap space gives Kahn a 4.

I don't expect Delonte or Telfair to be on our team come opening day. That being said, getting rid of Hollins is nice, and though I kind of liked Sessions(minus his horrendous FT shooting) he was expendable so this is a good roster trimming move. I'll give it a B on that basis. If we want to talk about talent(irrelevant) then we probably got hosed. Good deal.