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Wolves jump into the LA/HOU/NO fray ...
Posted: Sat Dec 10, 2011 9:39 am
by Blue Wolf
EDITED:
http://basketball.realgm.com/tradechecker/saved_trade/5942719Houston
Out: Martin, Scola, Dragic, New York 1st
In: Gasol, Pekovic, Memphis 1st
Los Angeles
Out: Gasol, Odom
In: Paul, Ariza
New Orleans
Out: Paul, Ariza
In: Scola, Dragic, Johnson, Randolph, Utah 1st, New York 1st
Minnesota
Out: Pekovic, Johnson, Randolph, Utah 1st, Memphis 1st
In: Martin, Odom
Why ...
Rick Adelman needs a few vets to help him get things turned around here, the NBA wants New Orleans to get some younger players and/or picks for Chris Paul. This is essentially the same deal LA/HOU/NO already agreed to do - Minny just swaps some of its youth/picks for older guys a rebuilding the Hornets don't need long-term. Could NO do better than Johnson/Randolph + 2 mid-1sts by moving Martin and Odom later in the season? Maybe, probably, I don't know ... if they wait, however, Martin and Odom might help the team win a few games they'll wish they hadn't come lottery time ... they might also get injured. The only other real twist is Houston taking Pekovic (who McHale drafted and who Morey tried to trade for) for swapping its 2012 NY 1st for the Memphis 2013 1st it sent Minny last year.
We may have to amnesty Webster (out indefinitely due to back problems) or Darko first.
Re: Wolves jump into the LA/HOU/NO fray ...
Posted: Sat Dec 10, 2011 9:45 am
by shangrila
That's a lot to give up for Martin and Odom, especially considering Odom only adds to the logjam at the 3/4 with Beas, Williams and Love all still around. Maybe if you take out the Memphis 1st I'd do it, but otherwise I pass.
Re: Wolves jump into the LA/HOU/NO fray ...
Posted: Sat Dec 10, 2011 9:55 am
by Blue Wolf
It might be a lot, but it also might be nothing much at all. Personally, I'm not convinced Johnson or Randolph will ever be anything more than role players. Pekovic? He's got some very nice low post skills but I don't see how he fits here long term. I hesitated on adding the Memphis 1st but given their recent success, I don't know that it's all that valuable of an asset.
As for Odom, we're moving two guys who would need front court minutes for one guy, plus I think Odom's experience and pedigree could do a lot to help our young guys mature.
Re: Wolves jump into the LA/HOU/NO fray ...
Posted: Sat Dec 10, 2011 10:12 am
by wolves_fan_82au
nba wont allow the trade imo its too good for lakers again,there saving millions in this deal
and i would love to see odom at the wolves but not for jonson,martin i dont really like either
Re: Wolves jump into the LA/HOU/NO fray ...
Posted: Sat Dec 10, 2011 11:08 am
by shangrila
But where do Odom's minutes come from? Unless you're playing Love full time at centre there's just not enough for Odom, Williams and Beasley.
Re: Wolves jump into the LA/HOU/NO fray ...
Posted: Sat Dec 10, 2011 11:35 am
by Blue Wolf
How about this ...
C - Love (18), Odom (15), Tolliver (15)
PF - Love (18), Williams (20), Odom/Tolliver (10)
SF - Beasley (36), Williams (12)
SG - Martin (36), Lee/Ellington/Ridnour (12)
PG - Rubio (32), Ridnour (16)
Darko plays the 5 as match-ups dictate.
And there's your 8-man rotation w/ Lee, Ellington and Darko playing spot minutes
Re: Wolves jump into the LA/HOU/NO fray ...
Posted: Sat Dec 10, 2011 11:39 am
by wolves_fan_82au
shangrila wrote:But where do Odom's minutes come from? Unless you're playing Love full time at centre there's just not enough for Odom, Williams and Beasley.
yeh beasley would have to go in the deal imo,could go with Rubio/Hamilton/Odom/Love/Randolph with Johnson/Williams of the bench,Pretty decent team
Re: Wolves jump into the LA/HOU/NO fray ...
Posted: Sat Dec 10, 2011 11:46 am
by wolves_fan_82au
[quote="Blue Wolf"]How about this ...
C - Love (18), Odom (15), Tolliver (15)
PF - Love (18), Williams (20), Odom/Tolliver (10)
SF - Beasley (36), Williams (12)
SG - Martin (36), Lee/Ellington/Ridnour (12)
PG - Rubio (32), Ridnour (16)
Darko plays the 5 as match-ups dictate.
And there's your 8-man rotation w/ Lee, Ellington and Darko playing spot minutes[/q
terible at center :S
Re: Wolves jump into the LA/HOU/NO fray ...
Posted: Sat Dec 10, 2011 11:47 am
by Blue Wolf
wolves_fan_82au wrote:nba wont allow the trade imo its too good for lakers again,there saving millions in this deal
and i would love to see odom at the wolves but not for jonson,martin i dont really like either
You might be right about the deal at least "seeming" too good for the Lakers. We know Douche Gilbert feels that way and presumably some of the other owners too. With that in mind, I've adjusted the trade to send Ariza to the Lakers too, which removes a lot of the salary savings on their end.
IMO, Martin would be a great 2 guard for Rubio to work with as he adjusts to the league.
Re: Wolves jump into the LA/HOU/NO fray ...
Posted: Sat Dec 10, 2011 11:52 am
by Blue Wolf
wolves_fan_82au wrote:terible at center :S
I don't know about that ... Love, Tolliver and Odom all have high basketball IQs, most centers in the league nowadays don't. Adelman likes smart decisions and good passing from his bigs, and he did just fine with 6'6 Chuck Hayes playing the 5 for the Rockets. I think this could work.
Re: Wolves jump into the LA/HOU/NO fray ...
Posted: Sat Dec 10, 2011 2:22 pm
by shrink
Odom isn't a fit, and would have to be moved later, but I like the idea of moving into this deal. All three teams want to do it, and so there is trade value that can be nabbed.
I have a tough time putting a value on Odom myself, but if NOH wants to save money (or more specifically, the other owners who own this team want to save money), it might make the deal look better if we used our insured deals here. If the Odom part was:
IN: Odom
OUT: Brad Miller + Martell Webster + "something" (a pick? Martin half of deal?)
...then there is a great chance that it looks prettier for the rest of the league. Miller will most likely be insured - Webster might be as well, and NOH could use him even if he wasn't. Both guys can be bought out cheaply for $1.4 mil next season. Salaries match up almost perfectly:
Miller + Webster: $10.0 mil (only $2 mil uninsured), next year $1.4 mil buy-out
Odom $8.9 mil, next year $8.4 .. $2.4 mil buy-out
Re: Wolves jump into the LA/HOU/NO fray ...
Posted: Sat Dec 10, 2011 3:43 pm
by Biff Cooper
I really like the idea of shipping out our 5th & 6th most valuable assets (Wes & AR) along with Pek and a couple of firsts to get Odom & Martin in return.
I haven't done an in-depth analysis of what it does to us yet - especially salary wise, but...
Odom is a fantastic two way veteran basketball player who was basically the USA's center throughout the last Olympics. He is 6-10 and versitile and is making less than $9M. Don't see how you guys don't see him as a fit in a deal where we are freeing up playing time by getting rid or Wes, AR, and Pek.
Re: Wolves jump into the LA/HOU/NO fray ...
Posted: Sat Dec 10, 2011 3:47 pm
by Esohny
Just had to comment on that minutes breakdown. There is no chance that Adelman would play Beasley that many minutes with Odom getting crumbs on the bench. It would certainly be reversed.
Re: Wolves jump into the LA/HOU/NO fray ...
Posted: Sat Dec 10, 2011 4:24 pm
by Wolves21
I would probably due that deal.Kevin Martin is and upgrade over Johson,even with him be payed to much,and I would take Odom over Randolph and Pek any day.
PG-Rubio/Ridnour
SG-Martin/Lee/Ellington
SF-Williams/Beasley/Webster
PF-Love/Odom/Tolliver
C-Darko/Miller
and we still have a roster spot over to go for a back up center.Nice deal.
Re: Wolves jump into the LA/HOU/NO fray ...
Posted: Sat Dec 10, 2011 4:58 pm
by wolves_fan_82au
Wolves21 wrote:I would probably due that deal.Kevin Martin is and upgrade over Johson,even with him be payed to much,and I would take Odom over Randolph and Pek any day.
PG-Rubio/Ridnour
SG-Martin/Lee/Ellington
SF-Williams/Beasley/Webster
PF-Love/Odom/Tolliver
C-Darko/Miller
and we still have a roster spot over to go for a back up center.Nice deal.
odom wont be 6th man,he would start i think,right now he is better than both williams and beasley
Re: Wolves jump into the LA/HOU/NO fray ...
Posted: Sat Dec 10, 2011 5:01 pm
by Krapinsky
shangrila wrote:That's a lot to give up for Martin and Odom, especially considering Odom only adds to the logjam at the 3/4 with Beas, Williams and Love all still around. Maybe if you take out the Memphis 1st I'd do it, but otherwise I pass.
Seems like you've got to be kidding. We give up Randolph, who hasn't proven anything, Wes who hasn't shown anything, some bad picks, and salary filler, for two near all-star caliber players.
Wolves are going to have to pony up more than that if you ask me.
Re: Wolves jump into the LA/HOU/NO fray ...
Posted: Sat Dec 10, 2011 5:08 pm
by Torcher
wolves_fan_82au wrote:odom wont be 6th man,he would start i think,right now he is better than both williams and beasley
Even though Odom is in fact a better player than both, I wouldn't start a veteran over two young, developing players; it might impede their progress as a player.
Re: Wolves jump into the LA/HOU/NO fray ...
Posted: Sat Dec 10, 2011 5:53 pm
by Esohny
Rick Adelman wrote: You go with the people who help you win. I don't know about development. Potential gets coaches fired.
Re: Wolves jump into the LA/HOU/NO fray ...
Posted: Sat Dec 10, 2011 6:02 pm
by Esohny
Does this trade gain points or lose points because of the fat Kardashian sister that would come with Odom?
Re: Wolves jump into the LA/HOU/NO fray ...
Posted: Sat Dec 10, 2011 6:09 pm
by Swish4
I really would hate if we traded our best athletes who are just starting development like Wes, AR, DWill or Rubio. I'd put those guys on my untouchable list along with Love. Their trade value is probably at its lowest right now overall. Let em develop and gain value and then make a judgement.