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theGreatRC wrote:"Minnesota will need to offer Orlando more than Derrick Williams"

Yeah, that's a little goofy.

If we sign Reddick, I'd want Ridnour out. JJ Barea is playing big time as of late, and is one of the few players we have on our roster that can create his own shot and draw fouls late on the game.

guille_4 wrote:If we sign Reddick, I'd want Ridnour out. JJ Barea is playing big time as of late, and is one of the few players we have on our roster that can create his own shot and draw fouls late on the game.

So then we have a JJ and JJ backcourt at some point? That squad is playing no defense and we don't have the wings to support AK at the 3. I know people love Redick around here, but I don't think he is the fit everyone thinks he is. I'd much rather see us try to find a body that can also play the three. I'm not sure that player exists right now, but that doesn't mean we should make a play for an expiring 2-guard that may be overvalued by his current team AND tough to re-sign.

Williams should be added to something in an Afflalo trade, since he has some years on his deal - not for Redick.

shrink wrote:The trade board people disagree with me, but I'm very concerned about [Courtney Lee's] horrible start, and four-year deal. Does anyone have an explanation for how badly Lee is doing?

Lee is not the only player off to a slow start, and I think a large part of it is that Doc has not got all the roles/rotations down so players are playing tentatively.

Doc always seems to do worse when he has 'too many' quality players - experiments with line-ups, minutes etc.

Just taking Lee's case as an example: he began as a starter, went to the bench, started again during Rondo's 2 game suspension, went back the bench, recently started three games and is now back on the bench again. Talk about a rollercoaster ride. lol

It seems that Lee has improved his play significantly lately, and I believe his stats for December are pretty solid.

My own impression is that Lee will be the odd man out once Avery Bradley returns, but Ainge may want to include his salary in a larger deal. Celtics' biggest need is another big man - or two - so trading Lee for an even smaller player is probably a nonstarter.

Magic fan here. I would be surprised if JJ fetched more than DW (although im a greedy bastard that would love to pry Shved away from you guys).

What do you guys think of Afflalo? Compared to JJ he is a superior scorer, better defender, better at taking defenders off the dribble, but is worse at facilitating (JJ is top 3 sg in APG).

Afflalo is also locked up on a reasonable 4 yr deal.

Zmill wrote:Magic fan here. I would be surprised if JJ fetched more than DW (although im a greedy bastard that would love to pry Shved away from you guys).

What do you guys think of Afflalo? Compared to JJ he is a superior scorer, better defender, better at taking defenders off the dribble, but is worse at facilitating (JJ is top 3 sg in APG).

Afflalo is also locked up on a reasonable 4 yr deal.

I'd prefer Afflalo greatly.

One problem with Redick is that he's an expiring deal. MIN has several assets they need to use their space under the lux to keep next year (Pekovic, Buddinger, 1st), and after Redick's recent interview where he says he loves ORL, I could see the Magic making an offer that the Wolves wouldn't match.

OrlandO wrote:I doubt he'd leave Orlando for craphole Minny.

While Redick would be a great fit for Adelman, the risk that we'd only have him for 55 games this year and have to send him back to ORL is too great forthe wolves to part with Williams as a rental.

thanks for posting. It's nice to see a more reasonable ORL poster after reading so many posters that wanted Williams, Shved and sometimes picks.

http://forums.realgm.com/boards/viewtopic.php?f=25&t=1221618#p34068691

shrink wrote:

Zmill wrote:Magic fan here. I would be surprised if JJ fetched more than DW (although im a greedy bastard that would love to pry Shved away from you guys).

What do you guys think of Afflalo? Compared to JJ he is a superior scorer, better defender, better at taking defenders off the dribble, but is worse at facilitating (JJ is top 3 sg in APG).

Afflalo is also locked up on a reasonable 4 yr deal.

I'd prefer Afflalo greatly.

One problem with Redick is that he's an expiring deal. MIN has several assets they need to use their space under the lux to keep next year (Pekovic, Buddinger, 1st), and after Redick's recent interview where he says he loves ORL, I could see the Magic making an offer that the Wolves wouldn't match.

OrlandO wrote:I doubt he'd leave Orlando for craphole Minny.

While Redick would be a great fit for Adelman, the risk that we'd only have him for 55 games this year and have to send him back to ORL is too great forthe wolves to part with Williams as a rental.

thanks for posting. It's nice to see a more reasonable ORL poster after reading so many posters that wanted Williams, Shved and sometimes picks.

http://forums.realgm.com/boards/viewtopic.php?f=25&t=1221618#p34068691

I agree with what you're saying man. Obviously I am familiar with the salary cap, the CBA, and the value in expiring contracts. However I do not understand why there would be value in a GOOD player on an expiring contract. I mean... if you are trading for JJ it is because of his value as a basketball player (implying that whatever team trades for him will want to resign him next year) which is kind of contradictory to the purpose of why you would want an expiring contract in the first place.

JJ Redick has become somewhat of an icon for magic fans. He started off very slowly and has developed very well since. He is a voice of reason in the locker room/media and is a leader on the team. Not to mention he is a good starter/great sixth man in this league. So his value is a bit inflated on our forum.
With all that being said though I think JJ has more value than D-Will RIGHT NOW; but not enough to guarantee picks or anything. I think DW can still carve out a niche in this league, as a sixth man gunner atleast.

If Afflalo was involved; would their be any potential package that would make you willing to part ways with Shved? Sorry... Gotta Ask! This dude is a BALLER!

Zmill wrote: I agree with what you're saying man. Obviously I am familiar with the salary cap, the CBA, and the value in expiring contracts. However I do not understand why there would be value in a GOOD player on an expiring contract. I mean... if you are trading for JJ it is because of his value as a basketball player (implying that whatever team trades for him will want to resign him next year) which is kind of contradictory to the purpose of why you would want an expiring contract in the first place.

I think people get confused because they try to over-complicate it. This year, is a player worth his contract, or could you do better with a free agent in cap space? If he is, then he has positive trade value, if he does not, he has negative trade value. Next year, it's the same. Which has more value - the player, or someone you could buy in free agency? People are mistaken that an expiring has extra trade value because it's an expiring. It's only value is as a mechanism for a team to sell the thing that truly has value - a team's willingness to spend money in the future.

Is JJ Redick worth $6.2 this year? I'd say yes - positive trade value this year.
Will JJ Redick be worth his contract next year? He'll be paid market value .. that's a push.
JJ = Net positive trade value.

Zmill wrote: If Afflalo was involved; would their be any potential package that would make you willing to part ways with Shved? Sorry... Gotta Ask! This dude is a BALLER!

I think MIN would add something to get Afflalo, who's worth a little more than his contract. I think Shved right now has more value than either JJ or Afflalo, particularly to Kahn. Kahn is fairly criticized for his inability to assess young talent in the draft (stretch for Flynn, Wes Johnson, critics of Derrick Williams), however I don't have a problem with the last two - you often have to pick the guy that's there, and it's up to the player to make himself an NBA pro. However, Kahn can now wave off critics who mock his assessment by pointing to Shved, who he found and didn't even use a pick for.

No way we add Shved for Afflalo. Yes Afflalo may be better, but we are lacking shooting guards and Alexey is pretty much our only healthy one.

The situation is pretty simple. We need Shved on our team, losing him in Afflalo trade would mean we basically did nothing. We need one more SG on the team because we lost Lee, Roy and Howard and we have one spare PF and one spare PG, so we want to give DWill + Ridnour/Barea for that SG, nothing else.

The only way Orlando could get Shved is if they gave both Redick and Afflalo in return, and that is impossible.

FinnTheHuman wrote:The situation is pretty simple. We need Shved on our team, losing him in Afflalo trade would mean we basically did nothing. We need one more SG on the team because we lost Lee, Roy and Howard and we have one spare PF and one spare PG, so we want to give DWill + Ridnour/Barea for that SG, nothing else.

The only way Orlando could get Shved is if they gave both Redick and Afflalo in return, and that is impossible.

Magic are hardly in need of of a forward either (particularly one who plays better as a PF). Probably why the rumor stated that the Magic did not think D-Will was enough for JJ.

shrink wrote:Williams should be added to something in an Afflalo trade, since he has some years on his deal - not for Redick.

Most Magic fan's would rather you guys take Afflalo than Redick, he is a fan fav here. Might even be the most popular Magic player at the moment.

theGreatRC wrote:No way we add Shved for Afflalo. Yes Afflalo may be better, but we are lacking shooting guards and Alexey is pretty much our only healthy one.

Would a JJ & Afflalo deal for Shved and WIlliams work for you guys?

Shved is untouchable

It's clear Williams has no place here in Minnesota. Can't even get a good player for player deal with him anymore.

tranjSAIC wrote:

theGreatRC wrote:No way we add Shved for Afflalo. Yes Afflalo may be better, but we are lacking shooting guards and Alexey is pretty much our only healthy one.

Would a JJ & Afflalo deal for Shved and WIlliams work for you guys?

I don't think it's a totally unfair offer, but I don't think the team will move Shved.

Besides his clutch play and the way Adelman already trusts him, his $3.2 mil salary for three years makes it possible for the team to spend money on other areas of need.

Adenusi wrote:It's clear Williams has no place here in Minnesota. Can't even get a good player for player deal with him anymore.

This is rediculous wasting him for 10 minutes/gm ...

Redick for Minnestoa 2013 2nd round pick and 2014 1st round pick?

Skin wrote:Redick for Minnesota 2013 2nd round pick and 2014 1st round pick?

Our pick situation is confusing, but basically, if neither MIN nor MEM make the play-offs, we'll still owe PHX a pick next year. If we traded a future pick, there would have to be a clause in there that if the PHX obligation wasn't paid off, it would have to be two years after PHX. We could trade the rights to the 2013 pick (trading the 2012 doesn't matter) with those same conditions.

As for value, I would not trade an unprotected 1st for expiring JJ Redick. Best I would do is Top 12 protected. Last year, we gave a #16 for Buddinger for one year and his rights, and while JJ is better, Buddinger was sitting on a $885,120 contract that helped us meet some very stringent needs for cap space. Redick is sitting on $6.2, and we don't know how much we would need to match offers next year.