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The D'Angelo Russell Thread

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The D'Angelo Russell Thread 

Post#1 » by Klomp » Thu Feb 27, 2020 10:46 am

Somehow all of the other new Wolves have their own thread but not arguably the best player added at the deadline? Time to change that! It's nice to finally have a true franchise PG.

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(apologies if missed thread, looked through top two pages a few times but it's 4:30 am)
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Re: The D'Angelo Russell Thread 

Post#2 » by Klomp » Thu Feb 27, 2020 11:02 am

So I was watching a Jordan McLaughlin highlight video from summer league (the things you do at 5 am), and part of a commentary by the analysts caught my attention as they were talking about D'Angelo. I went back and found that summer league game in my DVR so I could transcribe what was said in full.

You speak of the work Prigioni has done with PGs, I remember speaking with D’Angelo Russell earlier this year and he credits Prigioni with a lot of his success this year making the all-star team for the first time. Said Pablo taught him about playing with pace and a lot of the nuances in the pick and roll game. Prigioni said that D’Angelo Russell might not be the most dynamic or athletic PG, but he still feels like in spite of the improvements he’s already made that there’s still a lot more improvement to be done for D’Angelo. -Mark Jones, ESPN
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Re: The D'Angelo Russell Thread 

Post#3 » by minimus » Thu Feb 27, 2020 11:04 am

Klomp wrote:So I was watching a Jordan McLaughlin highlight video from summer league (the things you do at 5 am), and part of a commentary by the analysts caught my attention as they were talking about D'Angelo. I went back and found that summer league game in my DVR so I could transcribe what was said in full.

You speak of the work Prigioni has done with PGs, I remember speaking with D’Angelo Russell earlier this year and he credits Prigioni with a lot of his success this year making the all-star team for the first time. Said Pablo taught him about playing with pace and a lot of the nuances in the pick and roll game. Prigioni said that D’Angelo Russell might not be the most dynamic or athletic PG, but he still feels like in spite of the improvements he’s already made that there’s still a lot more improvement to be done for D’Angelo. -Mark Jones, ESPN


I appreciate the late-night effort!
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Re: The D'Angelo Russell Thread 

Post#4 » by Dewey » Thu Feb 27, 2020 12:39 pm

All I’ve asked of him for this season has been to “be a leader”... so far I’ve been happy from what I see since the trade

1.) seems so engage teammates & communicate
2.) takes/makes some tough shots when needed
3.) defense has been ok
4.) does not see himself as bigger than the game
5.) will and able to move off ball in situations

Little things have shown me he has more character than I previously thought. I’m not one to judge people that way, but again, leaders need to do these little things and I hope he continues to develop into a top PG ... we need a leader.
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Re: The D'Angelo Russell Thread 

Post#5 » by thinktank » Thu Feb 27, 2020 12:51 pm

Seems like he has ice in his veins.
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Re: The D'Angelo Russell Thread 

Post#6 » by wolfen » Thu Feb 27, 2020 2:50 pm

Nice, was just going to post a DLo comment somewhere this morning and boom a new thread with his name on it. I agree with the leadership comments so far, so nice to see a PG take control and huddle the troops. Here's what I liked from the game last night - 2 pg lineup. Maximum ball movement, speed, floor spreading. Defenses can't just key on DLo or the other PG (Jmac in this case of course) will take you down. Here's the thing - we know DLo struggles defensively. Frankly, I think he'd be better off guarding 2 guards as opposed to nba pg's. I don't think he'd do any worse defensively guarding 2 guards, in fact, I think it could be better. Not saying it should be the starting lineup (certainly not with Jmac), but I could see it workiing in long stretches of games, especially if we were to either draft or somehow acquire a legit SF who can defend and isn't a liability on the offensive end.

Because of that, I'm back in the camp of re-opening the possibility of PG with our top pick in the draft. I've been on the "get a backup PG in round 2" train of thought lately (Hagans, Dotson), but last night's game has me opening back up to possibly going after a PG with our top pick. That being said, if we don't, I think either Hagans or Dotson would still allow that to happen, but just on a smaller scale (Hagans' defense on PG's will be really good).

The PG that intrigues me the most in the draft is Killian Hayes. 6-5 with a 6-8 wingspan with a solid build, looks like he can add more size over time. Right now 192 pounds, which isn't shabby. He should be adequate to possibly a plus defender at the PG position (still so young), and has size enough to guard 2's as well. But holy crap the handles on this dude. Almost a bigger and more athletic DLo. What do ya'll think of the idea? We could still target a SF in the draft as well, even use the 2nd rounder to move up into the mid-late lotto to nab said target (Okoro?).

Short synopsis:
http://www.nbadraftroom.com/p/killian-hayes.html

Detailed Synopsis:
https://www.thestepien.com/2020/02/14/killian-hayes-scouting-report-collaboration/

Highlights:



Hayes with draft analyst Mike Schmitz. Seems to be a bright kid, good head on his shoulders...

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Re: The D'Angelo Russell Thread 

Post#7 » by Klomp » Thu Feb 27, 2020 3:18 pm

wolfen wrote:Because of that, I'm back in the camp of re-opening the possibility of PG with our top pick in the draft. I've been on the "get a backup PG in round 2" train of thought lately (Hagans, Dotson), but last night's game has me opening back up to possibly going after a PG with our top pick. That being said, if we don't, I think either Hagans or Dotson would still allow that to happen, but just on a smaller scale (Hagans' defense on PG's will be really good).

The PG that intrigues me the most in the draft is Killian Hayes. 6-5 with a 6-8 wingspan with a solid build, looks like he can add more size over time. Right now 192 pounds, which isn't shabby. He should be adequate to possibly a plus defender at the PG position (still so young), and has size enough to guard 2's as well. But holy crap the handles on this dude. Almost a bigger and more athletic DLo. What do ya'll think of the idea? We could still target a SF in the draft as well, even use the 2nd rounder to move up into the mid-late lotto to nab said target (Okoro?).

I think personally, I'd still rather it be a SG that can slide up to PG rather than the other way around. Keep in mind the draft is before FA, and frankly, I wouldn't want to potentially lose McLaughlin because of a decision like that. That may seem crazy to say, but it's how I feel right now.
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Re: The D'Angelo Russell Thread 

Post#8 » by Killboard » Thu Feb 27, 2020 3:37 pm

Image

Games like this against Miami is because I think he is worth it. He is not a great defensive player or is tremendously athletic. But he has a 6'10 wingpsan, knows how to use his hands and his very smart on defense. Wolves will have to cover for him in some ways on defense, but here and there teams will overlook him. And in the other side off the court, well, he's an stone cold killer.

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Re: The D'Angelo Russell Thread 

Post#9 » by wolfen » Thu Feb 27, 2020 3:40 pm

Klomp wrote:
wolfen wrote:Because of that, I'm back in the camp of re-opening the possibility of PG with our top pick in the draft. I've been on the "get a backup PG in round 2" train of thought lately (Hagans, Dotson), but last night's game has me opening back up to possibly going after a PG with our top pick. That being said, if we don't, I think either Hagans or Dotson would still allow that to happen, but just on a smaller scale (Hagans' defense on PG's will be really good).

The PG that intrigues me the most in the draft is Killian Hayes. 6-5 with a 6-8 wingspan with a solid build, looks like he can add more size over time. Right now 192 pounds, which isn't shabby. He should be adequate to possibly a plus defender at the PG position (still so young), and has size enough to guard 2's as well. But holy crap the handles on this dude. Almost a bigger and more athletic DLo. What do ya'll think of the idea? We could still target a SF in the draft as well, even use the 2nd rounder to move up into the mid-late lotto to nab said target (Okoro?).

I think personally, I'd still rather it be a SG that can slide up to PG rather than the other way around. Keep in mind the draft is before FA, and frankly, I wouldn't want to potentially lose McLaughlin because of a decision like that. That may seem crazy to say, but it's how I feel right now.


C'mon now, how many wins has McLaughlin REALLY been a part of this season? He's a decent backup but he should be a factor at all when it comes to deciding which player to draft. Frankly, the only 2 players on the roster that should be considered in that boat are KAT and DLo. Every other player, including Beasley, shouldn't be a determining factor in the draft process, at all. I don't think you pass on an Anthony Edwards if he's there just because you have Beasley.

Thinking about this a little deeper, Cole Anthony might be as good as, if not, better choice over Hayes. Having two lefties who are primary ball handlers could be awkward. And Anthony is a d@mn dog defender of PG's. And his attack game will be superior to Hayes as well. Having that attack mentality PG alongside D-Lo could be perfect since D-Lo isn't a great rim attacker.

But yes, I like McLaughlin, he's a great dude to root for, but I think we can aim a little higher don't you think?
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Re: The D'Angelo Russell Thread 

Post#10 » by Killboard » Thu Feb 27, 2020 3:43 pm

Klomp wrote:
wolfen wrote:Because of that, I'm back in the camp of re-opening the possibility of PG with our top pick in the draft. I've been on the "get a backup PG in round 2" train of thought lately (Hagans, Dotson), but last night's game has me opening back up to possibly going after a PG with our top pick. That being said, if we don't, I think either Hagans or Dotson would still allow that to happen, but just on a smaller scale (Hagans' defense on PG's will be really good).

The PG that intrigues me the most in the draft is Killian Hayes. 6-5 with a 6-8 wingspan with a solid build, looks like he can add more size over time. Right now 192 pounds, which isn't shabby. He should be adequate to possibly a plus defender at the PG position (still so young), and has size enough to guard 2's as well. But holy crap the handles on this dude. Almost a bigger and more athletic DLo. What do ya'll think of the idea? We could still target a SF in the draft as well, even use the 2nd rounder to move up into the mid-late lotto to nab said target (Okoro?).

I think personally, I'd still rather it be a SG that can slide up to PG rather than the other way around. Keep in mind the draft is before FA, and frankly, I wouldn't want to potentially lose McLaughlin because of a decision like that. That may seem crazy to say, but it's how I feel right now.


Agreed. We need size over shooting moving forward. I still thinking Culver can be that if he shakes off the rookie rust and keeps working on his shooting. He came up big to start the 4th last night against Miami.

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Re: The D'Angelo Russell Thread 

Post#11 » by shrink » Thu Feb 27, 2020 4:45 pm

I prefer the Culver video to the typical ones that only show highlights, and make every player look like a superstar.

Culver does dumb things, but rookies do dumb things. In a player’s first year, I want to see flashes of great play, and I think Culver provides that. He really needs to build on those things over the summer, but I think he has the potential to be a good player on this league, and that’s what I want to see from a rookie. Get those mistakes out of your system this year, Jarrett!

I think he could be a good become a good compliment to DLo, guarding the tougher match ups, and offensively being active and available on cuts.
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Re: The D'Angelo Russell Thread 

Post#12 » by K4P » Thu Feb 27, 2020 4:51 pm

wolfen wrote:Nice, was just going to post a DLo comment somewhere this morning and boom a new thread with his name on it. I agree with the leadership comments so far, so nice to see a PG take control and huddle the troops. Here's what I liked from the game last night - 2 pg lineup. Maximum ball movement, speed, floor spreading. Defenses can't just key on DLo or the other PG (Jmac in this case of course) will take you down. Here's the thing - we know DLo struggles defensively. Frankly, I think he'd be better off guarding 2 guards as opposed to nba pg's. I don't think he'd do any worse defensively guarding 2 guards, in fact, I think it could be better. Not saying it should be the starting lineup (certainly not with Jmac), but I could see it workiing in long stretches of games, especially if we were to either draft or somehow acquire a legit SF who can defend and isn't a liability on the offensive end.

Because of that, I'm back in the camp of re-opening the possibility of PG with our top pick in the draft. I've been on the "get a backup PG in round 2" train of thought lately (Hagans, Dotson), but last night's game has me opening back up to possibly going after a PG with our top pick. That being said, if we don't, I think either Hagans or Dotson would still allow that to happen, but just on a smaller scale (Hagans' defense on PG's will be really good).

The PG that intrigues me the most in the draft is Killian Hayes. 6-5 with a 6-8 wingspan with a solid build, looks like he can add more size over time. Right now 192 pounds, which isn't shabby. He should be adequate to possibly a plus defender at the PG position (still so young), and has size enough to guard 2's as well. But holy crap the handles on this dude. Almost a bigger and more athletic DLo. What do ya'll think of the idea? We could still target a SF in the draft as well, even use the 2nd rounder to move up into the mid-late lotto to nab said target (Okoro?).

Short synopsis:
http://www.nbadraftroom.com/p/killian-hayes.html

Detailed Synopsis:
https://www.thestepien.com/2020/02/14/killian-hayes-scouting-report-collaboration/

Highlights:



Hayes with draft analyst Mike Schmitz. Seems to be a bright kid, good head on his shoulders...


I think drafting a point guard with our pick would be a pretty bad move imo. The Wolves need to be super careful about how they compliment their stars defensively and playing small puts yourself at an inherent disadvantage guarding bigger teams and on the glass. We've seen those Napier-Teague 2 point guard lineups struggle mightily earlier this year.
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Re: The D'Angelo Russell Thread 

Post#13 » by Killboard » Thu Feb 27, 2020 5:55 pm

shrink wrote:I prefer the Culver video to the typical ones that only show highlights, and make every player look like a superstar.

Culver does dumb things, but rookies do dumb things. In a player’s first year, I want to see flashes of great play, and I think Culver provides that. He really needs to build on those things over the summer, but I think he has the potential to be a good player on this league, and that’s what I want to see from a rookie. Get those mistakes out of your system this year, Jarrett!

I think he could be a good become a good compliment to DLo, guarding the tougher match ups, and offensively being active and available on cuts.


He could also be a secondary initiator and let Dlo play off ball like he did with success in Golden State. Obviously his shooting will affect how defense guard him opening lanes for assist receptacles.
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Re: The D'Angelo Russell Thread 

Post#14 » by packforfreedom » Thu Feb 27, 2020 6:18 pm

I really like him. He's a excellent ball handler and passer. And the best thing is, he is like a vet out there, while KAT still seems like a kid. I am really exited about having both guys (and Beasley) for potentially years to come
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Re: The D'Angelo Russell Thread 

Post#15 » by Calinks » Thu Feb 27, 2020 7:31 pm

I wish he was a finisher. That said, he's smooth and I can see why he could be a lethal combo with KAT. He can shoot from anywhere, its a huge difference to any PG we had before. Sam Cassell is the only other guy who could shoot well and consistently but Russell's shooting is more prolific.
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Re: The D'Angelo Russell Thread 

Post#16 » by Klomp » Thu Feb 27, 2020 8:04 pm

packforfreedom wrote:I really like him. He's a excellent ball handler and passer. And the best thing is, he is like a vet out there, while KAT still seems like a kid. I am really exited about having both guys (and Beasley) for potentially years to come

It's kinda funny, I remember early on in the careers we talked about how Towns was the better front man for the organization over Wiggins because he's more of the camera-friendly guy, if you will while Wiggins would rather do his work in the shadows. But really, I think Russell is the type of guy you really want for a franchise. I think Russell learned from Kobe on how to be a leader. And working as a pro in both the Los Angeles and New York media markets, Minnesota will be a breeze.
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Re: The D'Angelo Russell Thread 

Post#17 » by wolfen » Thu Feb 27, 2020 8:21 pm

KAT4PREZ wrote:I think drafting a point guard with our pick would be a pretty bad move imo. The Wolves need to be super careful about how they compliment their stars defensively and playing small puts yourself at an inherent disadvantage guarding bigger teams and on the glass. We've seen those Napier-Teague 2 point guard lineups struggle mightily earlier this year.


It very well could be, I was thinking more outside of the box than inside of it. I would be totally fine just taking "the best big" or "best wing" with our top pick, but it wouldn't surprise me if Rosas did something out of the box with the top pick. I agree, we need some size, physicality, defense on the squad, 100%. BUT, there are factors that point to taking a strong PG like Cole Anthony with the top pick and then going after a wing or big in the late lotto, in free agency, or via a trade. Those factors are:

1. DLo has trouble with his foot speed to put up any defensive fight against at least half of the PG's in the NBA (pg's are the quickest players in the league).
2. DLo is solidly built with a 6-10 wingspan. That size would give him a fighting chance against 2 guards (not all of them) and since most 2 guards aren't as cat-quick as PG's, DLo would have a better chance of containing penetration.
3. Best defender guarding the PG - If the scenario played out with Cole Anthony being drafted, we'd have potentially one of our best defenders on the squad guarding the most important position in hoops - the PG.

Looking at live nba starting lineups - https://www.lineups.com/nba/lineups - it's no wonder that it's hard to defend today's PG's. I'll list a couple of non-PG's from various teams that DLo could start against and defend. Keep in mind again, that CA would be guarding the PG.

ATL - Kevin Huerter / DeAndre Hunter OR Trae Young
*DLo could easily hold his own vs. either of those two.
*Equal if not better to have DLo guarding the non PG? Yes.

BOS - Jaylen Brown or Kemba Walker
*DLo would have a hard time with EITHER of those high end guys, so why wouldn't you want a GOOD defender on the PG?
*Equal if not better to have DLo guarding the non PG? No.

BRK - Joe Harris or Caris LeVert
*He'd be OK guarding Harris, a little less-so with LaVert, but would struggle most with the PG, Dinwiddie.
*Equal if not better to have DLo guarding the non PG? Yes.

CHA - Rozier / Graham
*Who is the 2 guard between Rozier and Graham? Who knows. Put DLo on the weaker of the 2.
*Equal if not better to have DLo guarding the non PG? Yes.

CHI - Satoransky or LaVine vs. Dunn
*The most common starting lineup for the bulls this year has all 3 guys above in it. DLo can check Satoransky just fine while Anthony makes life miserable for Dunn. If they throw Coby White in as a starter and trot out Lavine or either Dunn / Satoransky, we're fine there too.
*Equal if not better to have DLo guarding the non PG? Yes.

CLE - Not even worth discussing, yes, we'd be fine.
*Equal if not better to have DLo guarding the non PG? Yes.

DAL - Seth Curry / Tim Hardaway Jr. vs. Luka.
*DLo would be waaaaaaay better off guarding Curry.
*Equal if not better to have DLo guarding the non PG? Yes.

DEN - Harris / Barton or Murray.
*DLo would do just as good, if not better, guarding Gary Freaking Harris...
*Equal if not better to have DLo guarding the non PG? Yes.

DET - Bruce Brown or D. Rose
*Easy one....
*Equal if not better to have DLo guarding the non PG? Yes.

GSW - When healthy (this year would be an easy yes, but) - Klay / Wigs or Curry
*Flat out, DLo would do a better job on our former wolf vs. trying to chase around Curry.
*Equal if not better to have DLo guarding the non PG? Yes.

HOU - Danuel House starts for the Rockets. DLo wouldn't get torched by House at all. Anthony guards Westbrook, Okogie guards Russ.
*Equal if not better to have DLo guarding the non PG? Yes.

I could go on and on with the entire league, and what you're going to find is that every team has 1 and sometimes 2 other players in the starting lineup that you can "hide" one of your weaker defending guards on. And not to mention, have your BEST defensive guard on the opposing PG.

Some more without going deeply into analysis, who could DLo guard instead of the PG and have a chance against defensively?

Avery Bradley (Lakers), Josh Jackson or Dillon Brooks (Griz), Duncan Robinson (Heat), Wes Matthews (Bucks), Jrue Holiday or Lonzo B (Pels), Harkless (Knicks), Terrance Ferguson or Lu Dort (Thunder), Evan Fournier (Magic), McCollum (TBlazers), Bryn Forbes (spurs)

Would work a lot less or not at all:
Indy (Brogdan, Oladipo)
Clips (Paul George, Pat Bev)
Philly (Simmons, Richardson when healthy)
Suns (Rubio, Booker)
Kings (Bogdanovic, Fox)
Raps (VanVleet, Lowry)
Jazz (Mitchell, Conley)
Wash (Ish Smith, Beal)

So against 2/3 of the league, you would be just fine starting DLo AND another tough PG like Anthony. AND you'd have unbelievable offensive firepower. There may some nights where you'd need to start just 1 pg and match up better defensively, but on most nights I think it would be sweet to see those 2 as starters. Especially if you target a defensive wing with the nets pick, or use the 2nd round pick plus the nets pick to move back into the lotto and target the EXACT defensive wing you're trying to nab (Okoro).

Well I've wasted an hour of work and hey, I love it! Fun talkin' hoops...
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Re: The D'Angelo Russell Thread 

Post#18 » by wolfen » Thu Feb 27, 2020 8:29 pm

Also - you guys saying you're impressed with Culver's ball handling and passing. You're kidding right? 1.8 assist to 1.6 TO's. Not only is he not a setup guy who breaks down defenses, he's not a good passer, and he turns the ball over. I mean stats don't lie. I was AT LEAST sure that JC would be a guy right out of the gate who would put pressure on defenses with his handles and average maybe 4-5 apg with maybe 1 TO but struggle with his shot. Hell, we were talking about giving him PG duties awhile back but to play PG you either have to be a damn good scorer or a damn good facilitator, and he doesn't do either. AND the shot is horrid.

Even when he was at his best this year, he never showed flashes when you'd say "holy sh@t now this guy has some big time potential". What you saw in that time was, that he was able to play for awhile as an average nba player. Never did we see him breaking down defenses, or going off for 30 points a few times, etc. I know he's a great kid and a hard worker and I hope he proves me wrong but right now I don't agree with the types of assessments I'm seeing here on JC.
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Re: The D'Angelo Russell Thread 

Post#19 » by Klomp » Thu Feb 27, 2020 8:46 pm

wolfen wrote:It very well could be, I was thinking more outside of the box than inside of it. I would be totally fine just taking "the best big" or "best wing" with our top pick, but it wouldn't surprise me if Rosas did something out of the box with the top pick. I agree, we need some size, physicality, defense on the squad, 100%. BUT, there are factors that point to taking a strong PG like Cole Anthony with the top pick and then going after a wing or big in the late lotto, in free agency, or via a trade. Those factors are:

1. DLo has trouble with his foot speed to put up any defensive fight against at least half of the PG's in the NBA (pg's are the quickest players in the league).
2. DLo is solidly built with a 6-10 wingspan. That size would give him a fighting chance against 2 guards (not all of them) and since most 2 guards aren't as cat-quick as PG's, DLo would have a better chance of containing penetration.
3. Best defender guarding the PG - If the scenario played out with Cole Anthony being drafted, we'd have potentially one of our best defenders on the squad guarding the most important position in hoops - the PG.

To me, that's why I've always said at least one of the three wings in the 1-3-1 will be a defensive one. Right now, that's Okogie or Culver that would take those matchups you've outlined. I don't think they need to draft a PG in the Top 5 for that role.

I guess though I'm not too far off your thinking because I think they could add a combo guard....but I don't think it'd be someone who forces Russell off-ball that often. Think more Maxey or Hampton over Anthony or Mannion for player types. They can take over PG duties when Russell is off the floor, but could play well off of Russell.
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Re: The D'Angelo Russell Thread 

Post#20 » by life_saver » Thu Feb 27, 2020 8:49 pm

Surprised we didn't have a thread for DLo yet

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