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Looking more and more like the NBA season is coming back. How will this affect the Wolves?

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Re: Looking more and more like the NBA season is coming back. How will this affect the Wolves? 

Post#21 » by Jedzz » Fri May 22, 2020 2:32 pm

ClarkeW wrote:
Jedzz wrote:
Calinks wrote:That's why we are discussing it. We don't know how they will approach a return. Also don't know what will happen with the next season. I am sure the players will want some kind of off-season and the league obviously needs something. Will it be accelerated? Don't know.

At some point they have to get back on schedule. They could approach it in a lot of ways. Maybe next season gets shortened to like 60 games as if it was a lock out, that way they can have a longer off-season Who knows.


I just see no reason for delaying the next season or shortening it if they are going to be playing again now. Why have two ruined seasons in a row? Just deal with the fact that this season got tanked by something out of their control, and end it with a quick playoffs. I don't see much reasoning in any kind of month long camp since teams haven't changed. The only way that makes sense is if they don't play now and yet they hold a draft and then try to wrap up the season after it. Then changes would have occured and camps might make sense. But honestly if they are going to wait until July to play they should just end the season, deal with it, hold a month long playoffs in July. Then have August - October 15 off. 2.5 monnths. Two weeks of preseason camp and start the next season as always.


I think one of the primary motivating factors for owners wanting to push the beginning of next season to December is the increased possibility of having fans in the arenas. The longer they wait to start the season, the more likely that fans are able to attend a larger percentage of the games. That means an increase in revenue for the owners. December is the latest it could be pushed back while still wrapping up the playoffs prior to the NFL season kickoff in September.

There had already been some sort of recent push to start the league in December before all of this, I believe coming from the owner of the Atlanta Hawks. That was to decrease overlap with the NFL schedule. The majority of the owners were not on board at the time, but COVID-19 has opened up an opportunity for them to test it out now which I think they will take. If it doesn’t work out, they can find a way to get back to the October - June schedule when things are back to normal.

Personally I’m a bit excited by the potential change. A Christmas Day (or Christmas Week) opening day sounds great to me.


yes I remember reading some talk about pushing the season start back previously. If they do it, I don't seem them ever returning to the normal schedule easily. Because they would be wrapping up the new season schedule at the very time they were starting camps previously. It would be forever or they would be screwing with the season schedule for years after. Also, if it's to avoid football scheduling then starting Christmas day would be foolish as NFL already owns it. Many of those late football games really matter to playoffs, and then playoffs start. Where as opening week of the NBA simply matters to no one other than to those itching to get back to basketball. The games are meaningless the first few weeks. The Wolves even disregarded their first fast start in ages this season and dumped the season early to progress with rookie development and sales of players.

3 and 5 game series playoffs would be a way to solve it now. If they want to wait a month in the fall they can still do that. But an immediate, shortened playoffs would be amazing right now and then you could still hold draft maybe a week later, have a normal offseason while everyone tries to wait out this covid this summer.
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Re: Looking more and more like the NBA season is coming back. How will this affect the Wolves? 

Post#22 » by Jedzz » Fri May 22, 2020 2:55 pm

Klomp wrote:
Jedzz wrote:I don't see much reasoning in any kind of month long camp since teams haven't changed.

Same reason why teams hold training camps in the first place.....because you need that time to get back up and running physically after an extended layoff. If you were a marathon runner and took a year off without practicing, you'd be foolish to just go right into another marathon without preparation. Maybe it doesn't have to last a month, but there has to be some sort of buffer.

Oh give me a break. First off, how is a marathon runner taking a year off without practicing the same as less than 2.5 months? Why can't you just have a straight forward discussion without injecting rubbish.

Training camps normally have more reasons than just getting in shape. Offseasons bring player additions/changes, sometimes sweeping coaching/management and sometimes entire game theory changes. At minimum, new and existing players need to learn how to play with each other even if the schemes stay intact. The NBA camps aren't even close to physical preparation camps.

I also don't expect pro athletes to have been doing nothing but sitting around playing video games and chowing cheetos this whole time. Do you? Their homes have training equipment, pools, some probably even have courts, guaranteed most had a basket to practice on. You'd be foolish to assume otherwise.

There is no valid reasons to state that these teams need any kind of camp. There is nothing new to learn. No new players to inject, test or gel with, no new schemes. Therefore there is no need for normal offseason items. A week of practice might even be more than necessary to resume playing.

Unique player situations like KAT sitting out most of the season and maybe now being healthy to play shouldn't have any bearing on the rest of the league that was playing.
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Re: Looking more and more like the NBA season is coming back. How will this affect the Wolves? 

Post#23 » by Klomp » Fri May 22, 2020 3:14 pm

Jedzz wrote:Oh give me a break. First off, how is a marathon runner taking a year off without practicing the same as less than 2.5 months? Why can't you just have a straight forward discussion without injecting rubbish.

Training camps normally have more reasons than just getting in shape. Offseasons bring player additions/changes, sometimes sweeping coaching/management and sometimes entire game theory changes. At minimum, new and existing players need to learn how to play with each other even if the schemes stay intact. The NBA camps aren't even close to physical preparation camps.

I also don't expect pro athletes to have been doing nothing but sitting around playing video games and chowing cheetos this whole time. Do you? Their homes have training equipment, pools, some probably even have courts, guaranteed most had a basket to practice on. You'd be foolish to assume otherwise.

There is no valid reasons to state that these teams need any kind of camp. There is nothing new to learn. No new players to inject, test or gel with, no new schemes. Therefore there is no need for normal offseason items. A week of practice might even be more than necessary to resume playing.

Unique player situations like KAT sitting out most of the season and maybe now being healthy to play shouldn't have any bearing on the rest of the league that was playing.

The time difference in the comparison was made because there is a difference in recovery from a basketball game versus a marathon. You probably wouldn't run marathons on back-to-back days, but you could play a basketball game on consecutive days. So 2.5 months is a long time for a game like basketball that can see games played consecutively.

And I wouldn't just assume everyone has mansions with gyms full of equipment. Not everyone makes as much as the superstars. A lot of NBA players live in downtown condos. In normal circumstances those places have gyms, but I'm guessing most of them have closed doors during the quarantine as NBA practice facilities have. They may have a hoop, but probably not a full or even half court to do a full practice regimen or run through the playbook.
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Re: Looking more and more like the NBA season is coming back. How will this affect the Wolves? 

Post#24 » by Jedzz » Fri May 22, 2020 3:21 pm

Klomp wrote:
Jedzz wrote:I don't see much reasoning in any kind of month long camp since teams haven't changed.
Klomp wrote:Same reason why teams hold training camps in the first place.....because you need that time to get back up and running physically after an extended layoff. If you were a marathon runner and took a year off without practicing, you'd be foolish to just go right into another marathon without preparation.

Jedzz wrote:Oh give me a break. First off, how is a marathon runner taking a year off without practicing the same as less than 2.5 months? Why can't you just have a straight forward discussion without injecting rubbish.

Training camps normally have more reasons than just getting in shape. Offseasons bring player additions/changes, sometimes sweeping coaching/management and sometimes entire game theory changes. At minimum, new and existing players need to learn how to play with each other even if the schemes stay intact. The NBA camps aren't even close to physical preparation camps.

I also don't expect pro athletes to have been doing nothing but sitting around playing video games and chowing cheetos this whole time. Do you? Their homes have training equipment, pools, some probably even have courts, guaranteed most had a basket to practice on. You'd be foolish to assume otherwise.

There is no valid reasons to state that these teams need any kind of camp. There is nothing new to learn. No new players to inject, test or gel with, no new schemes. Therefore there is no need for normal offseason items. A week of practice might even be more than necessary to resume playing.

Unique player situations like KAT sitting out most of the season and maybe now being healthy to play shouldn't have any bearing on the rest of the league that was playing.

The time difference in the comparison was made because there is a difference in recovery from a basketball game versus a marathon. You probably wouldn't run marathons on back-to-back days, but you could play a basketball game on consecutive days. So 2.5 months is a long time for a game like basketball that can see games played consecutively.
Now your are doubling down. Really, don't.

If you don't want to admit I'm right that there are no player changes, coaching changes, scheme changes, roster changes that offseasons usually have that would demand some kind of preperatory camp to bring it all together, then fine, don't admit I'm right. But stop trying to sell rubbish about marathons and year long breaks, or any kind of dreamt up reality that these players were just ignored and left to their own devices during this 2.35 months while still being employed and they did nothing but war on video games and cheetos and now will need weeks of drills to shed all the weight they gained. If anyone did slack off a little they can spin up with lower minutes while those that are fine carry more load.
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Re: Looking more and more like the NBA season is coming back. How will this affect the Wolves? 

Post#25 » by ClarkeW » Fri May 22, 2020 6:33 pm

Jedzz wrote:
Klomp wrote:
Jedzz wrote:I don't see much reasoning in any kind of month long camp since teams haven't changed.
Klomp wrote:Same reason why teams hold training camps in the first place.....because you need that time to get back up and running physically after an extended layoff. If you were a marathon runner and took a year off without practicing, you'd be foolish to just go right into another marathon without preparation.

Jedzz wrote:Oh give me a break. First off, how is a marathon runner taking a year off without practicing the same as less than 2.5 months? Why can't you just have a straight forward discussion without injecting rubbish.

Training camps normally have more reasons than just getting in shape. Offseasons bring player additions/changes, sometimes sweeping coaching/management and sometimes entire game theory changes. At minimum, new and existing players need to learn how to play with each other even if the schemes stay intact. The NBA camps aren't even close to physical preparation camps.

I also don't expect pro athletes to have been doing nothing but sitting around playing video games and chowing cheetos this whole time. Do you? Their homes have training equipment, pools, some probably even have courts, guaranteed most had a basket to practice on. You'd be foolish to assume otherwise.

There is no valid reasons to state that these teams need any kind of camp. There is nothing new to learn. No new players to inject, test or gel with, no new schemes. Therefore there is no need for normal offseason items. A week of practice might even be more than necessary to resume playing.

Unique player situations like KAT sitting out most of the season and maybe now being healthy to play shouldn't have any bearing on the rest of the league that was playing.

The time difference in the comparison was made because there is a difference in recovery from a basketball game versus a marathon. You probably wouldn't run marathons on back-to-back days, but you could play a basketball game on consecutive days. So 2.5 months is a long time for a game like basketball that can see games played consecutively.
Now your are doubling down. Really, don't.

If you don't want to admit I'm right that there are no player changes, coaching changes, scheme changes, roster changes that offseasons usually have that would demand some kind of preperatory camp to bring it all together, then fine, don't admit I'm right. But stop trying to sell rubbish about marathons and year long breaks, or any kind of dreamt up reality that these players were just ignored and left to their own devices during this 2.35 months while still being employed and they did nothing but war on video games and cheetos and now will need weeks of drills to shed all the weight they gained. If anyone did slack off a little they can spin up with lower minutes while those that are fine carry more load.


I believe it is the players/coaches themselves that are requesting a minimum of 2-4 weeks of prep before resuming. To me, that tells me that it is necessary.

Not only is it about getting in shape (no team wants to drop out of playoff contention because they got off to a slow start because they weren’t in game shape yet) but I believe some of it probably also has to do with logistics. It’s going to take a long time to get the logistics to finish this season figured out. If they can’t get started on that until July, why wouldn’t you let teams take the opportunity to train in advance assuming that it’s safe to do so?

Also, this is unrelated to the quoted discussion but I believe I saw someone earlier in the thread questioning why even have any regular season games to begin with. That likely has to do with fulfilling contracts to the regional sports channels who hold NBA rights. My understanding is that those contracts demand a minimum of 70-72 games to be played. It also serves as an opportunity for playoff teams to get into game shape before things kick into high gear.
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Re: Looking more and more like the NBA season is coming back. How will this affect the Wolves? 

Post#26 » by Calinks » Fri May 22, 2020 6:37 pm

Jedzz, I get that you disagree but there are clearly reasons why the NBA is wanting to put together training camp. If it was as necessary as you believe they would probably skip it all together. You said you don't see a reason for camp, someone told you why there would be a reason. You may not agree with the answer but that is the reason. No need to drag out a big argument over it.

Just heard Woj talk about some of the NBA's plans, he rattled off several possibilities and one was a play in tournament for the final two seeds. Now personally I think that is hugely unfair to teams like Dallas who have been ballin and are way ahead. That said, if they did do something like that, the wolves could actually have a shot to get in.

I hope they do something that is as fair as possible to all teams. Would be a disaster IMO if some fluky tournament screwed Dallas or Memphis out of the playoffs after they played so hard all season. Somewhere else I did hear that they expand the playoffs to allow a couple more teams in. Not sure how that would work either.
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Re: Looking more and more like the NBA season is coming back. How will this affect the Wolves? 

Post#27 » by karch34 » Fri May 22, 2020 9:33 pm

Everything I'm hearing is the players and teams want a few weeks to get into basketball shape and get the rust off. Not saying they're not in shape in general, but some have courts and gyms, some have apartments and facilities have been off limits, those in cold weather might have had less options, etc.
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Re: Looking more and more like the NBA season is coming back. How will this affect the Wolves? 

Post#28 » by Klomp » Sat May 23, 2020 9:48 pm

The opening of Mayo Clinic Square does not mean players will be scrimmaging and getting up and down. For the moment, only individual workouts are allowed. Players must have their temperature checked on arrival to the facility, only one player and one coach will be allowed on the court at a time and have to remain 12 feet apart, workouts will be limited to 45 minutes and players will be required to wear masks except when on the court.

Other staffers will wear masks and gloves at all times, the locker room and weight rooms will remain closed and the equipment will be thoroughly cleaned between each player visit.

“Our first priority is their safety and their welfare,” Sikka said. “Not just the players’ safety and welfare, but our staff. So making sure that everybody is aligned and comfortable with a protocol has been something that we’ve really, really tried to emphasize good communication throughout this whole ordeal.”


https://theathletic.com/1826578/2020/05/21/timberwolves-return-to-play-voluntary-workouts-towns-rosas-sikka/
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Re: Looking more and more like the NBA season is coming back. How will this affect the Wolves? 

Post#29 » by Jedzz » Sat May 23, 2020 10:47 pm

Calinks wrote:Jedzz, I get that you disagree but there are clearly reasons why the NBA is wanting to put together training camp. If it was as necessary as you believe they would probably skip it all together. You said you don't see a reason for camp, someone told you why there would be a reason. You may not agree with the answer but that is the reason. No need to drag out a big argument over it.


Someone told me the reason? He gave an insane unrealistic example of a marathon runner taking a year off and then running a marathon with no practice during that year. Yeah, no.

If you don't have better reasoning, then maybe stay out of it. You don't believe me, fine. But every once in a while I might just be right. There may actually be no good reasoning to try so badly to resume season games before a playoff tourney besides money, contractual agreements, and maybe selfish desires for entertainment. ClarkeW expounded on that point and contracts may be all there is to explain pushing it forward. That explains the reason to maybe. It doesn't explain rumored timelines of things.

The rest of the excuses for rumored timelines being given so far don't appear to hold water to me, especially when it could reap havoc on future seasons. No reason to make things up in order to explain business reasoning. "it's a business" is a ubiquitous answer to wash the good and bad away.

So if money and desire rules all and they are going to do this regardless, then do it in a wise way has been my point. Don't waste the time they normally waste on things when time isn't an issue.
* They don't have to have 7 game series to decide round winners.
* They dont' have to have so many days off in between games.
* They don't have to swap back and forth on home courts and waste travel time if all games are in one random court.
* These Pro Athletes don't need a month long camp to spin up and play games. They are pros and their teams and they themselves are working to keep them in condition.

Klomp wanted to focus on one thing I said, the last in the list above, and yet he doesn't have a sensible reason to argue with. I'm completely annoyed by Klomp's seemingly life goal to argue against anything I post. But if he would just be sensible in all the excuses he throws out then I wouldn't mind. I'm sorry you don't like me calling him out on his outrageous excuses, but maybe you should ask him to backoff his tactics instead.

If you don't have anything that really explains the time wasting sensibly, then just let my complaint opinion stand and leave it alone. I know my post isn't going to change anything. Neither is posting bogus excuses for moronic planning. Placating us isn't needed.

For examples of reality for players during this time and how teams are keeping them engaged, see this link.
The Nuggets get their workouts to players on a platform called Teambuildr, a site where remote workouts can be programmed and progress can be tracked. The site says a half-dozen NBA teams are using its technology, with Oklahoma City, Houston, Charlotte, Minnesota and Detroit being the others... Other teams are figuring out their own methods.
...The NBA has allowed teams to send equipment to players’ homes for workout purposes during the shutdown, and it appears most if not all have taken advantage.


In that article, one person of the many interviewed is quoted saying the time off may go long enough to warrant another training camp. I've heard this said before by random people and we have people here obviously saying so. All I've said is my opinion that these people saying so are plum wrong and there is no sensible argument that would explain the need for a full fledged training camp. There simply hasn't been the typical offseason changes that would require one. Don't waste the time if your choice is to resume this season.
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Re: Looking more and more like the NBA season is coming back. How will this affect the Wolves? 

Post#30 » by Jedzz » Sat May 23, 2020 11:20 pm

I do want to see the Rockets in the playoffs this year with Covington and no real center at all. Wanted to see how that turns out.
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Re: Looking more and more like the NBA season is coming back. How will this affect the Wolves? 

Post#31 » by Calinks » Sun May 24, 2020 1:32 am

Jedzz, the basic reasoning is that player would need time training with their teams in an NBA setting to get back to NBA game shape. Not just physically but mentally as well. The game is played at such a high pace, that missing any significant time can throw a player off in multiple ways.

That's why generally when a player comes back form a big injury they have days of practice first and then they often don't look like their old selves for many games, its hard to get back to that peak level. Some player can do it better than others but in general, it helps to have a camp period. If you don't believe that, that is fine but it's apparent that the people making these decisions do believe it so it is likely to happen.

That's all anyone who is talking camp is really saying.
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Re: Looking more and more like the NBA season is coming back. How will this affect the Wolves? 

Post#32 » by KGdaBom » Sun May 24, 2020 2:52 pm

Jedzz wrote:
Klomp wrote:
Jedzz wrote:I don't see much reasoning in any kind of month long camp since teams haven't changed.

Same reason why teams hold training camps in the first place.....because you need that time to get back up and running physically after an extended layoff. If you were a marathon runner and took a year off without practicing, you'd be foolish to just go right into another marathon without preparation. Maybe it doesn't have to last a month, but there has to be some sort of buffer.

Oh give me a break. First off, how is a marathon runner taking a year off without practicing the same as less than 2.5 months? Why can't you just have a straight forward discussion without injecting rubbish.

Training camps normally have more reasons than just getting in shape. Offseasons bring player additions/changes, sometimes sweeping coaching/management and sometimes entire game theory changes. At minimum, new and existing players need to learn how to play with each other even if the schemes stay intact. The NBA camps aren't even close to physical preparation camps.

I also don't expect pro athletes to have been doing nothing but sitting around playing video games and chowing cheetos this whole time. Do you? Their homes have training equipment, pools, some probably even have courts, guaranteed most had a basket to practice on. You'd be foolish to assume otherwise.

There is no valid reasons to state that these teams need any kind of camp. There is nothing new to learn. No new players to inject, test or gel with, no new schemes. Therefore there is no need for normal offseason items. A week of practice might even be more than necessary to resume playing.

Unique player situations like KAT sitting out most of the season and maybe now being healthy to play shouldn't have any bearing on the rest of the league that was playing.

More of Jedzz attacking Klomp.
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Re: Looking more and more like the NBA season is coming back. How will this affect the Wolves? 

Post#33 » by Jedzz » Mon May 25, 2020 12:46 am

Calinks wrote:Jedzz, the basic reasoning is that player would need time training with their teams in an NBA setting to get back to NBA game shape. Not just physically but mentally as well. The game is played at such a high pace, that missing any significant time can throw a player off in multiple ways.

That's why generally when a player comes back form a big injury they have days of practice first and then they often don't look like their old selves for many games, its hard to get back to that peak level. Some player can do it better than others but in general, it helps to have a camp period. If you don't believe that, that is fine but it's apparent that the people making these decisions do believe it so it is likely to happen.

That's all anyone who is talking camp is really saying.


Same team, same coaches, same players, same schemes, already had a training camp, already had 65 games.

Aparently then they had absolutely nothing but couch riding for 2.35 months and now need "drills" or something to get back into shape. No teams sent players workout equipment and sent out schedules for workouts, or held live team wide remote workouts. No, none of that occured at all. It was just a bag of chips or cheetos and a couch for them. Can't possibly expect them to go play a basketball game after a week of practice. Right? Sounds like they want to get 5-10 more games in to reach 70 for the season. Those absolutely useless games aren't good enough warm up time for teams going to the playoffs, right? Oh hell naw. They need a full fledged training camp to remind them what was occuring in the previous 65 games.
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Re: Looking more and more like the NBA season is coming back. How will this affect the Wolves? 

Post#34 » by WolfAddict » Mon May 25, 2020 1:30 am

Ahhh so good to see the regular fire back again :) Have at it boys!
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Re: Looking more and more like the NBA season is coming back. How will this affect the Wolves? 

Post#35 » by Domejandro » Mon May 25, 2020 12:59 pm

For what it is worth, my limited sports medicine experience would make me somewhat agree with having a training camp of some sorts. Going from limited non-contact workouts to games would potentially increase injury risk.

That aside, I will be incredibly interested in seeing how the NBA decides the Playoff seeding. If the play-in tournament was inclusive enough, that Minnesota Timberwolves could hypothetically grease their way into the Playoffs, which would be thoroughly entertaining, given how miserable this season has been, thus far.

My guess is that they reschedule things around and end up playing the majority of the rest of the season, but fun hypotheticals are fun.
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Re: Looking more and more like the NBA season is coming back. How will this affect the Wolves? 

Post#36 » by Klomp » Mon May 25, 2020 9:56 pm

What if they left it up to each team in the race whether or not they want to keep fighting for a playoff spot. Some would gladly, while some maybe would rather not. Put the teams 8-x fighting for a spot into a play-in tournament.

If there's a need to get to the 70-game minimum, treat the rest of it for those not in the play-in as if it were summer league. Essentially round robin exhibitions, if they want to sit stars that's fine.
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Re: Looking more and more like the NBA season is coming back. How will this affect the Wolves? 

Post#37 » by ClarkeW » Wed May 27, 2020 12:27 am

https://www.theringer.com/nba/2020/5/26/21270365/nba-restart-world-cup

This seems like a great plan if you ask me. Actually add some entertainment to what would essentially count as the first round and then have a competitive 8 team playoff. Perfect.
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Re: Looking more and more like the NBA season is coming back. How will this affect the Wolves? 

Post#38 » by Neeva » Wed May 27, 2020 12:59 am

So season is over for the wolves, can we have the draft lottery soon? I hope this is the year they move up. Wonder what this means for the nets pick though? If nets end up with record in bottom 14 wolves lose the pick.
But get it next year instead if the Nets make the playoffs (which they should with Durant) Next year seems to be a stronger draft but the pick might be in the twenties.
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Re: Looking more and more like the NBA season is coming back. How will this affect the Wolves? 

Post#39 » by Calinks » Wed May 27, 2020 4:28 am

I wanted to see the wolves play some more but I am cool with our season being over. We blew it again, could have potentially done some damage in a group setting. That said if we could get our off-season started ASAP that would probably bode well for us. I'm really curious to see what kind of team we got when healthy and on the same page. Think we could be a playoff team.

If this solidifies our draft position I'm cool although its going to be a loooooooooong off-season with no wolves ball for like 9+ months.
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Re: Looking more and more like the NBA season is coming back. How will this affect the Wolves? 

Post#40 » by KGdaBom » Wed May 27, 2020 2:03 pm

AmicoHoops is reporting on Twitter Tuesday that an NBA GM told them the league was targeting Wednesday, July 22 as a target date to restart the league.
There are still a lot of meetings and conference calls that will take place and we still don't know much about the NBA's plan to return (finish the regular season, start with the playoffs, etc.), but July 22 sounds like a good target for the league to have for resuming play. There's an excellent chance the action will take place in Orlando and it's looking more and more like we'll see the completion of the season in some form or fashion this year.

SOURCE: AmicoHoops on Twitter
May 26, 2020, 6:46 PM ET

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