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Aaron Gordon to the Timberpups?

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Would you trade the #17 pick for Aaron Gordon?

Yes, trade makes sense for both teams
20
69%
No, just draft another rookie instead
9
31%
 
Total votes: 29

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Re: Aaron Gordon to the Timberpups? 

Post#141 » by KGdaBom » Fri Oct 2, 2020 4:26 am

Texas Chuck wrote:I'm right here guys. You don't have to talk about me. You can talk to me. We can get to the bottom of chuckbiasgate I promise. :D

Chuck look above this. I made a direct post to you along with talking about you with Think Tank and Ducklett.
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Re: Aaron Gordon to the Timberpups? 

Post#142 » by Texas Chuck » Fri Oct 2, 2020 4:29 am

KGdaBom wrote:The person who's the most strongly against a player is likely to be the person who is unfairly biased against the player. His opinion is likely a biased one.



KGdaBom wrote:Hey Chuck this is the first comment you have made that I have read :lol: . I never once said you were biased. Look at my posts. I said assuming the premise that you are a Gordon hater that it is likely you are biased. That's not the same thing. For me to really work on this it would require me looking up every comment you ever made regarding Gordon and I'm not willing to do that.



KGdaBom wrote:I never once said he was biased. Check every word I've said. If you can find a place I said he was biased I apologize.



Let's take these one by one. I'm not the most strongly against Gordon. I am however probably the most consistent poster in regards to thinking his value isn't particularly high due to reasons I'm still willing to provide if we can settle this pesky bias issue.

You didn't call me bias indeed. You simply, based on the words of a Magic fan no less, were willing to say that my opinion is likely biased. You can decide for yourself if that is a wise approach, but I'd suggest not. I don't expect you to read all my posts on the topic of course, but odd to just take a perhaps more likely biased source(a Magic fan) at his word.

I don't need an apology, mate. I'm actually quite amused by this whole thing. You've helped provide me with a fair bit of entertainment.
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Re: Aaron Gordon to the Timberpups? 

Post#143 » by Midw35t » Fri Oct 2, 2020 4:29 am

shrink wrote:
UnFadeable21 wrote:Aaron Gordon 6'9 235lbs

14ppg, 8 rebs, 3 ast

Aaron Gordon:
2020 3P 30.8%. Career 3P 31.9%
2020 BPM 0.0. Career BPM 0.0

I understand many fans believe Gordon is the answer to the Wolves questions. I don’t agree. The biggest mismatch Towns gives this team is pulling opposing bigs out of the paint. Last year, the Jazz had to take Gobert out from under the rim (where he is historically good at altering shots), and play him man-to-man! Without a credible three point threat, opponents get to keep a big down low to wait for Gordon or other Wolves to drive.

Secondly, it is a huge warning sign that Gordon hasn’t improved since his sophomore season, five years ago. I question his focus. He seems less interested improving for his team than rapping about how he should have got a higher score in a slam dunk contest.

Third, this locks up the salary of the Johnson contract.

If the price is just the #17 and Spellman, I don’t care. This is a price that much of the trade board thinks is fair. Orlando fans uniformly believe that this is undervaluing him. If the Magic front office turned this down, it wouldn’t surprise me. He is less likely to be traded as ORL continues on their path to inconsequential playoff defeats, especially know that Isaac is out for all of next year, and there isn’t any position duplication. Moreover, maybe Gordon would have a higher trade value if he had a few months to rehab it before the trade deadline.

I vote .. meh.

(Maybe a mod can move this to our trade board)


I agree with all of this.

#17, Johnson, back-end filler - I don't care.

Anything else, easy pass. He is not the ideal fit some like to portrait.

Personally, I'd prefer to stand pat with the rebuild unless we can net a real needle mover with 1 + 17.
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Re: Aaron Gordon to the Timberpups? 

Post#144 » by thinktank » Fri Oct 2, 2020 4:30 am

I already covered your “bias is possible” argument, KG.

thinktank wrote:
KGdaBom wrote:
thinktank wrote:
Ok. Now prove that happened in this specific case. (You can’t.)

You like to zoom out to 32,000 feet and have difficulty staying on a specific topic.

I had no intention of proving it or a belief it was the case. I don't believe I ever said anything indicating such a belief. Your reply seemed to me that since their may be no bias their was no bias. I just wanted to point out that their could be bias.

Any conclusion by anyone on realm could be due to unprovable bias so that point is moot.

Now KG will beat the dead horse and get his worthless last word in.

Or, KG can be productive and get back to talking b-ball. His choice.
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Re: Aaron Gordon to the Timberpups? 

Post#145 » by KGdaBom » Fri Oct 2, 2020 4:34 am

Texas Chuck wrote:
KGdaBom wrote:The person who's the most strongly against a player is likely to be the person who is unfairly biased against the player. His opinion is likely a biased one.



KGdaBom wrote:Hey Chuck this is the first comment you have made that I have read :lol: . I never once said you were biased. Look at my posts. I said assuming the premise that you are a Gordon hater that it is likely you are biased. That's not the same thing. For me to really work on this it would require me looking up every comment you ever made regarding Gordon and I'm not willing to do that.



KGdaBom wrote:I never once said he was biased. Check every word I've said. If you can find a place I said he was biased I apologize.



Let's take these one by one. I'm not the most strongly against Gordon. I am however probably the most consistent poster in regards to thinking his value isn't particularly high due to reasons I'm still willing to provide if we can settle this pesky bias issue.

You didn't call me bias indeed. You simply, based on the words of a Magic fan no less, were willing to say that my opinion is likely biased. You can decide for yourself if that is a wise approach, but I'd suggest not. I don't expect you to read all my posts on the topic of course, but odd to just take a perhaps more likely biased source(a Magic fan) at his word.

I don't need an apology, mate. I'm actually quite amused by this whole thing. You've helped provide me with a fair bit of entertainment.

Thank you for your reading comprehension. You wouldn't believe how many people don't have that level of reading comprehension. Since you were singled out as a Gordon hater I thought there was probably some truth to you being one. I could have made the effort to look up every post on Gordon you ever made, but didn't want to. :lol: I also acknowledge the Orlando fan likely having pro Gordon bias. So I would expect you both to be somewhat biased. The people on the extreme ends are most likely to be biased.
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Re: Aaron Gordon to the Timberpups? 

Post#146 » by KGdaBom » Fri Oct 2, 2020 4:36 am

thinktank wrote:I already covered your “bias is possible” argument, KG.

thinktank wrote:
KGdaBom wrote:I had no intention of proving it or a belief it was the case. I don't believe I ever said anything indicating such a belief. Your reply seemed to me that since their may be no bias their was no bias. I just wanted to point out that their could be bias.

Any conclusion by anyone on realm could be due to unprovable bias so that point is moot.

Now KG will beat the dead horse and get his worthless last word in.

Or, KG can be productive and get back to talking b-ball. His choice.

I recommend you follow Texas Chuck's example and reading comprehension.
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Re: Aaron Gordon to the Timberpups? 

Post#147 » by KGdaBom » Fri Oct 2, 2020 4:42 am

Midw35t wrote:
shrink wrote:
UnFadeable21 wrote:Aaron Gordon 6'9 235lbs

14ppg, 8 rebs, 3 ast

Aaron Gordon:
2020 3P 30.8%. Career 3P 31.9%
2020 BPM 0.0. Career BPM 0.0

I understand many fans believe Gordon is the answer to the Wolves questions. I don’t agree. The biggest mismatch Towns gives this team is pulling opposing bigs out of the paint. Last year, the Jazz had to take Gobert out from under the rim (where he is historically good at altering shots), and play him man-to-man! Without a credible three point threat, opponents get to keep a big down low to wait for Gordon or other Wolves to drive.

Secondly, it is a huge warning sign that Gordon hasn’t improved since his sophomore season, five years ago. I question his focus. He seems less interested improving for his team than rapping about how he should have got a higher score in a slam dunk contest.

Third, this locks up the salary of the Johnson contract.

If the price is just the #17 and Spellman, I don’t care. This is a price that much of the trade board thinks is fair. Orlando fans uniformly believe that this is undervaluing him. If the Magic front office turned this down, it wouldn’t surprise me. He is less likely to be traded as ORL continues on their path to inconsequential playoff defeats, especially know that Isaac is out for all of next year, and there isn’t any position duplication. Moreover, maybe Gordon would have a higher trade value if he had a few months to rehab it before the trade deadline.

I vote .. meh.

(Maybe a mod can move this to our trade board)


I agree with all of this.

#17, Johnson, back-end filler - I don't care.

Anything else, easy pass. He is not the ideal fit some like to portrait.

Personally, I'd prefer to stand pat with the rebuild unless we can net a real needle mover with 1 + 17.

Gordon IMO is very likely to be a better player than whoever we may draft at #17. Of course he has the much bigger contract than who we would draft at #17. We send JJ out to resolve that issue. I don't have a strong stance on the issue. I would lean toward trading #17 and JJ for him rather than just drafting somebody at #17. However, if we can get my man Larry Nance Jr. that would be my preference.
Did you mean portrait? The word is actually portray. :D
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Re: Aaron Gordon to the Timberpups? 

Post#148 » by thinktank » Fri Oct 2, 2020 4:44 am

KGdaBom wrote:
thinktank wrote:I already covered your “bias is possible” argument, KG.

thinktank wrote:Any conclusion by anyone on realm could be due to unprovable bias so that point is moot.

Now KG will beat the dead horse and get his worthless last word in.

Or, KG can be productive and get back to talking b-ball. His choice.

I recommend you follow Texas Chuck's example and reading comprehension.


I recommend you talk about basketball.

I wouldn’t do that Gordon deal, for the same reasons Chuck wouldn’t.

I agree with Chuck.
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Re: Aaron Gordon to the Timberpups? 

Post#149 » by KGdaBom » Fri Oct 2, 2020 4:51 am

thinktank wrote:
KGdaBom wrote:
thinktank wrote:I already covered your “bias is possible” argument, KG.


Now KG will beat the dead horse and get his worthless last word in.

Or, KG can be productive and get back to talking b-ball. His choice.

I recommend you follow Texas Chuck's example and reading comprehension.


I recommend you talk about basketball.

I wouldn’t do that Gordon deal, for the same reasons Chuck wouldn’t.

I agree with Chuck.

I'm talking basketball. I had an issue with you claiming there was no bias when there was no possible way you could know there was no bias.
My basketball stance on the Gordon issue is he would probably be better for us than JJ and 17 at about the same cost. If we can figure out a better way to utilize 17 and JJ I would be extremely open to it.
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Re: Aaron Gordon to the Timberpups? 

Post#150 » by Ducklett » Fri Oct 2, 2020 5:05 am

KGdaBom wrote:
Ducklett wrote:
thinktank wrote:
:lol:

I’ll argue all night when I confident I’m right.

It is your OPINION that his OPINION is biased.

You’re dabbling in very dubious logic.

Let’s go back to the heart of the topic, which you can never do.

Gordon’s WS/48 last year was BELOW AVERAGE at .089. That’s the same as his career average of .090.

His TS% is .532, which is below average for a PF.

His PER last year was 15.1, right next to his career average of 15.3. PERFECTLY AVERAGE.

Being handcuffed to average Gordon at ~16M for 2 years is not a good deal, ESPECIALLY if you have to give up #17.

If anyone is showing bias it is YOU!



Chuck is making a perfectly unbiased and logical evaluation of both Gordon and the proposed deal.



You can criticize his evaluation of Gordon and the deal using data and opinions, but accusing him of bias is WAY OFF BASE, and frankly, an unprovable and below the belt argumentative tactic.


Like I said: We will keep AG, yall keep 17. Not sure why so many of you guys want to trade for him if you think he is trash.

Good luck boys.

A lot of people think he is pretty good. I'm inbetween, but see him as likely better than the #17 pick. The problem is he comes with a much larger contract than the #17 pick. You can make a great case for him with Statistics. You can make a great case against him with statistics. That's why stats can be a real bad way to evaluate.


I have said several times myself that I think he is worth somewhere from 12-14. I have also said I wouldn't trade him for less than 10 in this draft because of Isaac's injury and how god awful this draft is. This is my opinion that I have formed based on trade rumors and what, supposedly, the Magic turned down for AG at the deadline.
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Re: Aaron Gordon to the Timberpups? 

Post#151 » by Midw35t » Fri Oct 2, 2020 5:09 am

KGdaBom wrote:
Midw35t wrote:
shrink wrote:Aaron Gordon:
2020 3P 30.8%. Career 3P 31.9%
2020 BPM 0.0. Career BPM 0.0

I understand many fans believe Gordon is the answer to the Wolves questions. I don’t agree. The biggest mismatch Towns gives this team is pulling opposing bigs out of the paint. Last year, the Jazz had to take Gobert out from under the rim (where he is historically good at altering shots), and play him man-to-man! Without a credible three point threat, opponents get to keep a big down low to wait for Gordon or other Wolves to drive.

Secondly, it is a huge warning sign that Gordon hasn’t improved since his sophomore season, five years ago. I question his focus. He seems less interested improving for his team than rapping about how he should have got a higher score in a slam dunk contest.

Third, this locks up the salary of the Johnson contract.

If the price is just the #17 and Spellman, I don’t care. This is a price that much of the trade board thinks is fair. Orlando fans uniformly believe that this is undervaluing him. If the Magic front office turned this down, it wouldn’t surprise me. He is less likely to be traded as ORL continues on their path to inconsequential playoff defeats, especially know that Isaac is out for all of next year, and there isn’t any position duplication. Moreover, maybe Gordon would have a higher trade value if he had a few months to rehab it before the trade deadline.

I vote .. meh.

(Maybe a mod can move this to our trade board)


I agree with all of this.

#17, Johnson, back-end filler - I don't care.

Anything else, easy pass. He is not the ideal fit some like to portrait.

Personally, I'd prefer to stand pat with the rebuild unless we can net a real needle mover with 1 + 17.

Gordon IMO is very likely to be a better player than whoever we may draft at #17. Of course he has the much bigger contract than who we would draft at #17. We send JJ out to resolve that issue. I don't have a strong stance on the issue. I would lean toward trading #17 and JJ for him rather than just drafting somebody at #17. However, if we can get my man Larry Nance Jr. that would be my preference.
Did you mean portrait? The word is actually portray. :D


I'll give you that. Autocorrect. I like art.

I don't think we disagree on much. AG would be a great get for #17 + whatever filler. A proven player who fits the current age group. Get it done. We are not likely to get a playrt of his caliber at that pick, nor a FA at that price.

I absolutely wouldn't entertain any deal including the #1 pick though. Anything more than 17 and filler, pass.
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Re: Aaron Gordon to the Timberpups? 

Post#152 » by Texas Chuck » Fri Oct 2, 2020 3:03 pm

Ducklett wrote:
I have said several times myself that I think he is worth somewhere from 12-14. I have also said I wouldn't trade him for less than 10 in this draft because of Isaac's injury and how god awful this draft is. This is my opinion that I have formed based on trade rumors and what, supposedly, the Magic turned down for AG at the deadline.


This thread is the gift that keeps on giving. You came over to this other board and slandered me for anti-Gordon bias and our views on his value aren't really that far apart. :lol:

I think Johnson + 17 is a reasonable price. That's just not significantly different from 12-14 in any way.
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Re: Aaron Gordon to the Timberpups? 

Post#153 » by Ducklett » Fri Oct 2, 2020 9:41 pm

Texas Chuck wrote:
Ducklett wrote:
I have said several times myself that I think he is worth somewhere from 12-14. I have also said I wouldn't trade him for less than 10 in this draft because of Isaac's injury and how god awful this draft is. This is my opinion that I have formed based on trade rumors and what, supposedly, the Magic turned down for AG at the deadline.


This thread is the gift that keeps on giving. You came over to this other board and slandered me for anti-Gordon bias and our views on his value aren't really that far apart. :lol:

I think Johnson + 17 is a reasonable price. That's just not significantly different from 12-14 in any way.


12-14 in a normal draft. This isn't normal in value of the players in the draft, covid, and Isaac being out a year.

If Johnson is enough to get from 17 to 12-14, find a team that will take him for the 12-14 and add them as a third team.
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Re: Aaron Gordon to the Timberpups? 

Post#154 » by shrink » Sat Oct 3, 2020 11:22 am

Texas Chuck wrote: I'm not the most strongly against Gordon. I am however probably the most consistent poster in regards to thinking his value isn't particularly high due to reasons I'm still willing to provide if we can settle this pesky bias issue.

Not on this board, buddy! I hold that title, and I’m sure many people here are sick of me pointing to his lack of three point shooting, his lack of improvement, and perhaps a lack of focus on basketball.

(In other words, I agree with you)
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Re: Aaron Gordon to the Timberpups? 

Post#155 » by minimus » Sat Oct 3, 2020 11:28 am

shrink wrote:
Texas Chuck wrote: I'm not the most strongly against Gordon. I am however probably the most consistent poster in regards to thinking his value isn't particularly high due to reasons I'm still willing to provide if we can settle this pesky bias issue.

Not on this board, buddy! I hold that title, and I’m sure many people here are sick of me pointing to his lack of three point shooting, his lack of improvement, and perhaps a lack of focus on basketball.

(In other words, I agree with you)


I second it, you hold that title. (In other words, I disagree with you) :lol: :lol: :lol:
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Re: Aaron Gordon to the Timberpups? 

Post#156 » by Jedzz » Wed Oct 7, 2020 6:11 pm

I still hate what he's shown in total so far.
But I have been sold on his fit for this team by posters here.
Yet I still have very little belief that he cares much about winning or producing at his best every game. The player could do so much more than he has shown to date. it's kind of sad, seems like coasting through his career really. I don't even know if he knows it. Maybe nobody has ever really pushed him. Maybe if he was traded away for a bench player the slap in the face would wake him up.

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