Trade Talk (Part Five)

[Wolveswin]

Now, it’s really about development for our younger players. I know it’s tough as Wolves fans to endure the losses, but fast-forward to the 2021-22 season with a healthy Towns (physically and emotionally) and players like Naz, Edwards, Vanderbilt, Nowell and McDaniels having received valuable minutes this year and things should be much brighter.

I’m all for the young guys getting the chance to develop. A bottom playoff spot and a quick first round sweep does not excite me at all. I’d rather shoot for a top 5 playoff spot in 21-22 with a chance to advance, which is reasonable with our young guys getting valuable opportunities to play this season and the off-season to develop. I also trust Rosas to make moves that will add veteran help. The losses are tough, but I like what I’m seeing from a few of our young guys.

I disagree that playing to lose and doing nothing more then drop minutes on young players and sit all vet plans is going to teach them how to be a team capable of top 5 playoff spot in 21-22. Not a chance besides dumb luck.

They can play the roster for wins now, which includes playing the young players the right way where they wisely fit individually. The ones ready for more play more, those not ready for it play less, but still play. This team, after all, doesn't have 5 bonafied proven starters. Which also means they don't have 5 locked in bench players either. There is room to play plenty of these players during the season. I'm not advocating sitting young players for just any vets favor at all. There are some Vets that need to take second or DNP roles at this point. But the point is to put your absolute best foot forward and go for wins and teach this team how to be winners. They have to learn that first long before they are leaping all the way up to top 5 team in 2021. Best get started doing things right/better, right now if that's you goal for timing.

You play it as if trying to win with this group. That tells you what you may still be missing. Make your trades and try to adjust that to get further.

I never said to play to the young players over winning, but our young players are playing better than our vets in this case. I still expect the young players to earn their minutes. My point was that if the young guys are getting minutes, it benefits us in the long run

Macwolf I will give you some free advice. It might help you get to a better place quicker on this board and save you some precious time. Use the ignore feature on Jedzz. It is awesome use of feature designed for immature posters just like him. Makes threads so much more rewarding and worth while. Cheers.

[old school 34]

Would KAT sign off on DLo for Lavine? And if so, how much more would we need to include (Culver enough)?

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Lol Culver + Russell doesn’t get Wolves LaVine’s used jockstrap. That isn’t even a positive value offer and LaVine is positive value. Bulls hang up phone laughing.

I 100% agree...but how much more would it take...I guess was more the point/question?

And the only reason, I even considered something along those lines...is maybe if the KAT/DLo thing can't work...is there enough KAT/Lavine history that it's more palatable for us to move on from KAT's guy?

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[old school 34]

So thinking when KAT comes back...they have maybe 15 to 20 games to show something significant. Or scapegoat right or wrong needs to happen...so top 3 scapegoat options:

Trade Rubio or DLo or fire Saunders....fair or not way the business works.

Rosas obviously makes the call, but he makes that call most likely hearing KAT out. Everyone has said...no way KAT would be good with DLo trade...but if he's told pick one Saunders or DLo....does he for sure pick DLo...not so sure? Picking Saunders & trading DLo at least gives him better chance of getting help (a real pf)...firing Saunders just gives him new HC...& not certain that he feels that helps him as much? Obviously many on the board may disagree with that thought process, but KAT could significantly dictate how that's handled if it comes to that?

Another thought to consider....not that I have any interest in tanking...but if we continue to trend with where we're at...& we'd get to keep pick (top 3)...real good chance that pick is either pg's (Suggs or Cunningham)...so we'd be moving on from DLo at that point, no?

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How about just maybe waitng to see those 20 games with Towns play out before imagining 20 ways to blow this thing up before hand? Or thinking about 20 ways to make this thing work with who the team has and pressuring the nitwit running the games to use one of them to improve things. Just spitballing here.

I agree...no matter how frustrating the wait has been...you have to give it a shot to play out. And I can't imagine a wolves fan that doesn't want it to be pure magic & all workout.

But Rosas has to have a backup plan ready & unfortunately, they have lost some leash as to how long it takes to gel...just because of all the unfortunate circumstances.

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[post0115]

Seems like a good one to me:

We give up Culver and Layman for PJ Tucker

Wolves get: PJ Tucker
NOLA: gets J. Culver and Exum (exp.)
Hou gets: Bledsoe and Layman

NOLA gets an expiring and a young guy for Bledsoe. Rockets continue to rebuild the 09-10 Kentucky Wildcats. Wolves get a big, versatile, veteran stretch 4 while freeing up a couple mill so they aren't as tight against lux tax.

[Dewey]

So thinking when KAT comes back...they have maybe 15 to 20 games to show something significant. Or scapegoat right or wrong needs to happen...so top 3 scapegoat options:

Trade Rubio or DLo or fire Saunders....fair or not way the business works.

Rosas obviously makes the call, but he makes that call most likely hearing KAT out. Everyone has said...no way KAT would be good with DLo trade...but if he's told pick one Saunders or DLo....does he for sure pick DLo...not so sure? Picking Saunders & trading DLo at least gives him better chance of getting help (a real pf)...firing Saunders just gives him new HC...& not certain that he feels that helps him as much? Obviously many on the board may disagree with that thought process, but KAT could significantly dictate how that's handled if it comes to that?

Another thought to consider....not that I have any interest in tanking...but if we continue to trend with where we're at...& we'd get to keep pick (top 3)...real good chance that pick is either pg's (Suggs or Cunningham)...so we'd be moving on from DLo at that point, no?

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How about just maybe waitng to see those 20 games with Towns play out before imagining 20 ways to blow this thing up before hand? Or thinking about 20 ways to make this thing work with who the team has and pressuring the nitwit running the games to use one of them to improve things. Just spitballing here.

I agree...no matter how frustrating the wait has been...you have to give it a shot to play out. And I can't imagine a wolves fan that doesn't want it to be pure magic & all workout.

But Rosas has to have a backup plan ready & unfortunately, they have lost some leash as to how long it takes to gel...just because of all the unfortunate circumstances.

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Agree as well ...

Aside from that - my issue is that after all this frustration, I don’t Know if I trust Towns. I wanna believe he is extremely motivated to get back and help the team, but I also have a concern he is mentally checked out. Back and forth. He is not exactly an alpha dog to start with, and rather than “lead” the Wolves out of the basement, I can see him opting for a new start elsewhere. Can go either way and I don’t like it. Been no signs of his desire to get back

[Norseman79]

I like the idea of shipping one of our guards/forwards for a shot blocking 7' younger guy. As small as Layman to Hornets for Nick Richards, or aiming bigger and shooting for a Mitchell Robinson, either way it is an undeniable need. (Jedzz, I know we could sign Patton and I would be fine with that too.)

Would Knicks do Robinson, Knox, Smith Jr for DLo and a 2nd?

[IceManBK1]

I think Orlando will finally move Gordon this trade deadline. Sucks he's out for a month though. But orl will keep losing the entire month. They'll be more motivated to tank rest of season. But seems like we're secretly tanking also. If we trade for Gordon and land another top 3 pick in the draft we can draft or trade the pick for a SF then we'll be a complete team.

[slicedbread2]

I like the idea of shipping one of our guards/forwards for a shot blocking 7' younger guy. As small as Layman to Hornets for Nick Richards, or aiming bigger and shooting for a Mitchell Robinson, either way it is an undeniable need. (Jedzz, I know we could sign Patton and I would be fine with that too.)

Would Knicks do Robinson, Knox, Smith Jr for DLo and a 2nd?

I think the Knicks would pass.

They are really high on Robinson as a defensive anchor and he's an RFA after this year who'll be up for a new contract. Plus they wouldn't want to kneecap their cap sheet with a proven bricklayer in DLo knowing he'd take away shots from Barrett and Quickley who have really given Knicks fans major optimism for a brighter future.

I don't know what the T-Wolves can realistically do as this team has way too many guards and wings and the wings they got can't shoot(Culver, Okogie) or suck at defense and can shoot. Rubio deserves better and IMO if they can should flip him for 2nds(don't expect a 1st). They could do a 3 way deal with Chicago and the Clippers:

LAC: Tomas Satoransky
CHI: Rubio, Kabengele, Ed Davis
MIN: Lou Williams, Chandler Hutchinson, Thaddeus Young, 3-4 2nds(1 CHI, 3 from LAC(1 via DET, POR and their own)

Clippers upgrade their depth and become more dangerous.

Chicago gets an upgrade at the point who could help out their young guys immensely in Lavine and Markkanen not to mention it gets Coby White to be the first guard off the bench and take on a flyer in Kabengele.

Minnesota gets much needed draft assets for the future not to mention they get Young who can be a stopgap PF for the year until next year. His last year is only guaranteed for 6M and his matching salary can be used to upgrade the PF or be used as cap relief to eat a bad salary from another team willing to exchange assets to get out of a bad deal. Lou Will can be flipped to another team looking to also get out of a bad deal. Hutch can be used as a reclamation project.

Yes it's not the best trade, but it's a joke seeing Rubio wasting away on the bench b/c Russell won't play off the ball. Minnesota needs to address the roster imbalance and this deal could be a stopgap solution until a better one comes along.

[Neeva]

Seems like a good one to me:

We give up Culver and Layman for PJ Tucker

Wolves get: PJ Tucker
NOLA: gets J. Culver and Exum (exp.)
Hou gets: Bledsoe and Layman

NOLA gets an expiring and a young guy for Bledsoe. Rockets continue to rebuild the 09-10 Kentucky Wildcats. Wolves get a big, versatile, veteran stretch 4 while freeing up a couple mill so they aren't as tight against lux tax.

Good god have you seen Tucker at all this season? He stinks at 35(36 in 3 months) he is basically done!

[wolves_89]

Rosas needs to find a way to turn some combination of Rubio, Okogie, Culver, Layman, Hernangomez, and Davis into a starting PF. My dream scenario would be Nance.

[zimpy27]

To keep: DLo, Beasley, Layman, McDaniels, KAT - JMac, Nowell, Edwards, Vanderbilt, Reid

To trade or buyout: Rubio, Culver, Okogie, Juancho, Davis

[Dual]

To keep: DLo, Beasley, Layman, McDaniels, KAT - JMac, Nowell, Edwards, Vanderbilt, Reid

To trade or buyout: Rubio, Culver, Okogie, Juancho, Davis

I didn't think about it, a buyout for Ricky would be awesome, but it won't happen.

[Wolveswin]

Seems like a good one to me:

We give up Culver and Layman for PJ Tucker

Wolves get: PJ Tucker koi
NOLA: gets J. Culver and Exum (exp.)
Hou gets: Bledsoe and Layman

NOLA gets an expiring and a young guy for Bledsoe. Rockets continue to rebuild the 09-10 Kentucky Wildcats. Wolves get a big, versatile, veteran stretch 4 while freeing up a couple mill so they aren't as tight against lux tax.

Yuck. Just yuck.

Rosas give up on his first draft pick for a soon 36yo player? Not even a true — but undersized — PF no less?!?

[Dewey]

Seems like a good one to me:

We give up Culver and Layman for PJ Tucker

Wolves get: PJ Tucker koi
NOLA: gets J. Culver and Exum (exp.)
Hou gets: Bledsoe and Layman

NOLA gets an expiring and a young guy for Bledsoe. Rockets continue to rebuild the 09-10 Kentucky Wildcats. Wolves get a big, versatile, veteran stretch 4 while freeing up a couple mill so they aren't as tight against lux tax.

Yuck. Just yuck.

Rosas give up on his first draft pick for a soon 36yo player? Not even a true — but undersized — PF no less?!?

My impression as well...

[Wolveswin]

Seems like a good one to me:

We give up Culver and Layman for PJ Tucker

Wolves get: PJ Tucker koi
NOLA: gets J. Culver and Exum (exp.)
Hou gets: Bledsoe and Layman

NOLA gets an expiring and a young guy for Bledsoe. Rockets continue to rebuild the 09-10 Kentucky Wildcats. Wolves get a big, versatile, veteran stretch 4 while freeing up a couple mill so they aren't as tight against lux tax.

Yuck. Just yuck.

Rosas give up on his first draft pick for a soon 36yo player? Not even a true — but undersized — PF no less?!?

My impression as well...

I am not overly comfortable giving up on Vanderbilt for Tucker. But Culver? Please.

[Wolveswin]

I think Orlando will finally move Gordon this trade deadline. Sucks he's out for a month though. But orl will keep losing the entire month. They'll be more motivated to tank rest of season. But seems like we're secretly tanking also. If we trade for Gordon and land another top 3 pick in the draft we can draft or trade the pick for a SF then we'll be a complete team.

Rubio to Bulls.

Thad + ____ to Magic.

Gordon to Wolves.

Wolves will need to give a 2nd and a youth. Is it Okogie, Culver, Vanderbilt, McDaniels, Nowell?

Also remember if Wolves are bottom 3 team, only 40% chance they keep pick from Warriors. If outside bottom 3 chances decline significantly they keep their 2021 1st.

[NebWolvesFan]

I would love a Rubio, Culver, Hernangomez, Davis, 2022 second, 2025 second for Porter/Young deal. Clear out some bad salaries

[shrink]

Out of curiousity, how much is Reid worth to you guys? Curious if you would consider moving him to address other needs (SF/PF) on the roster.

Good eye, but Naz is one of those, “more valuable to Rosas than other GM’s” types of guys.

Rosas has very little to point to as a successful GM, so he will probably want to keep Naz around. He found Naz undrafted, locked him up to the lowest possible deal for four years, and he has developed into a decent KAT-lite back up.

I doubt Rosas can afford to trade him.

[shrink]

For the record, the neutral Trade Board just voted Russell the sixth worst contract in the NBA. I am not a fan of his, but even I think that’s too severe, and tried to change some hearts and minds. Wiggins was 7th.

https://forums.realgm.com/boards/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=2048571

If Russell’s friendship with Towns isn’t enough, I think a valuation like this effectively ends the idea that Rosas would trade DLo.

[Dewey]

Out of curiousity, how much is Reid worth to you guys? Curious if you would consider moving him to address other needs (SF/PF) on the roster.

Good eye, but Naz is one of those, “more valuable to Rosas than other GM’s” types of guys.

Rosas has very little to point to as a successful GM, so he will probably want to keep Naz around. He found Naz undrafted, locked him up to the lowest possible deal for four years, and he has developed into a decent KAT-lite back up.

I doubt Rosas can afford to trade him.

Naz is Rosas trophy in his 2nd year? Ummm ... maybe Beas and McD ... Ant not terrible considering it was a fall back plan. Let’s be clear I’m not thrilled with Rosas or Saunders performances’, but I’m far less thrilled with KAT’s absence, our team shooting, and team defense - tho some Positive signs with McD/JV/ANT. Reid is an utterly horrible defender via the eye test ... never seen a C spin in circles like he does. All reaction and virtually no IQ to anticipate anything.