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Our board instant analysis (when all reactions are settled)

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Re: Our board instant analysis (when all reactions are settled) 

Post#41 » by Slim Tubby » Thu Nov 19, 2020 3:52 pm

[/quote] I believe that the Knicks drafted Bolmaro and then we traded for him. He was projected first round by the strong majority and some think he is star material. If we made the trade just to jump whoever was drafting at 24 I see your problem with it.[/quote]

My understanding is Rosas wanted Bolmaro, moved up and acquired the pick and then proceeded to get fleeced by the fricken New York Knicks.

Look...to everyone upset that I have a very negative take to this draft, you can't take a turd and turn it into a diamond just because you want it to be one. I'm not an NBA talent scout or evaluator but I see what my eyes show me and I listen to what my ears hear. Rosas **** the bed with this draft and there's no way for me to sugarcoat what has been done. We ignored shooting, we ignored defense, we ignored character and more importantly, we ignored the hard things that needed to be done to improve this roster for the short and long term. Did Rosas consult David Kahn before the Draft?
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Re: Our board instant analysis (when all reactions are settled) 

Post#42 » by Chello1 » Thu Nov 19, 2020 3:53 pm

minimus wrote:
Chello1 wrote:All we did was add non shooters and to me people who were drafted way ahead of their slot.


Jaden McDaniels is considered the best shooter among PFs. Edwards has solid FT% and good shot mechanics, and Edwards is considered the best slasher among SG.


You are kidding yourself with those statements. Edwards shot like hot garbage against college kids last year and Mcdaniels is a dumpster fire who may work out if we can play psych and basketball coach as well as put 50 pounds on him. He will get bullied and pushed around. A bad pick. He has about a 10% chance at making it. Complete hit or most likely miss player. I hope I am wrong but to me this draft was a complete dumpster fire. Wiseman will be a complete stud. We drafted guys way above slot all the way through the draft. Rosas proved he cannot move in and out of spots to maximize return last night. Not impressed with him at all after two years of watching him work!!!!!!
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Re: Our board instant analysis (when all reactions are settled) 

Post#43 » by Baseline81 » Thu Nov 19, 2020 3:53 pm

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Re: Our board instant analysis (when all reactions are settled) 

Post#44 » by Chello1 » Thu Nov 19, 2020 3:55 pm

Slim Tubby wrote:
I believe that the Knicks drafted Bolmaro and then we traded for him. He was projected first round by the strong majority and some think he is star material. If we made the trade just to jump whoever was drafting at 24 I see your problem with it.[/quote]

My understanding is Rosas wanted Bolmaro, moved up and acquired the pick and then proceeded to get fleeced by the fricken New York Knicks.

Look...to everyone upset that I have a very negative take to this draft, you can't take a turd and turn it into a diamond just because you want it to be one. I'm not an NBA talent scout or evaluator but I see what my eyes show me and I listen to what my ears hear. Rosas **** the bed with this draft and there's no way for me to sugarcoat what has been done. We ignored shooting, we ignored defense, we ignored character and more importantly, we ignored the hard things that needed to be done to improve this roster for the short and long term. Did Rosas consult David Kahn before the Draft?[/quote]

Couldn't agree more with these takes! You are spot on.
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Re: Our board instant analysis (when all reactions are settled) 

Post#45 » by Klomp » Thu Nov 19, 2020 3:55 pm

Read on Twitter


Figure that 247Sports hire gave a pretty good review....
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Esohny wrote:Why are you asking Klomp? "He's" actually a bot that posts random blurbs from a database.
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Re: Our board instant analysis (when all reactions are settled) 

Post#46 » by NebWolvesFan » Thu Nov 19, 2020 3:55 pm

Baseline81 wrote:
Read on Twitter


Minnesota can match any offer for JMac without going into MLE. All they have to do is give him the qualifying offer which is another two-way deal.
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Re: Our board instant analysis (when all reactions are settled) 

Post#47 » by KGdaBom » Thu Nov 19, 2020 4:03 pm

Chello1 wrote:
Slim Tubby wrote:
I believe that the Knicks drafted Bolmaro and then we traded for him. He was projected first round by the strong majority and some think he is star material. If we made the trade just to jump whoever was drafting at 24 I see your problem with it.


My understanding is Rosas wanted Bolmaro, moved up and acquired the pick and then proceeded to get fleeced by the fricken New York Knicks.

Look...to everyone upset that I have a very negative take to this draft, you can't take a turd and turn it into a diamond just because you want it to be one. I'm not an NBA talent scout or evaluator but I see what my eyes show me and I listen to what my ears hear. Rosas **** the bed with this draft and there's no way for me to sugarcoat what has been done. We ignored shooting, we ignored defense, we ignored character and more importantly, we ignored the hard things that needed to be done to improve this roster for the short and long term. Did Rosas consult David Kahn before the Draft?[/quote]

Couldn't agree more with these takes! You are spot on.[/quote]
It's fine if you want to be all pissy about the draft. I wanted Wiseman too. However, I am almost certain that Bolmaro was drafted and then we traded for him. Not the other way around. Rosas is not an idiot and no way do we make that trade to jump one team. Many teams like Bolmaro a lot.
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Re: Our board instant analysis (when all reactions are settled) 

Post#48 » by Dewey » Thu Nov 19, 2020 4:12 pm

KGdaBom wrote:
Chello1 wrote:
Slim Tubby wrote:
I believe that the Knicks drafted Bolmaro and then we traded for him. He was projected first round by the strong majority and some think he is star material. If we made the trade just to jump whoever was drafting at 24 I see your problem with it.


My understanding is Rosas wanted Bolmaro, moved up and acquired the pick and then proceeded to get fleeced by the fricken New York Knicks.

Look...to everyone upset that I have a very negative take to this draft, you can't take a turd and turn it into a diamond just because you want it to be one. I'm not an NBA talent scout or evaluator but I see what my eyes show me and I listen to what my ears hear. Rosas **** the bed with this draft and there's no way for me to sugarcoat what has been done. We ignored shooting, we ignored defense, we ignored character and more importantly, we ignored the hard things that needed to be done to improve this roster for the short and long term. Did Rosas consult David Kahn before the Draft?


Couldn't agree more with these takes! You are spot on.[/quote]
It's fine if you want to be all pissy about the draft. I wanted Wiseman too. However, I am almost certain that Bolmaro was drafted and then we traded for him. Not the other way around. Rosas is not an idiot and no way do we make that trade to jump one team. Many teams like Bolmaro a lot.[/quote]

Seems Bolmaro was a much more valued prospect than most anticipated ... I was aware of his size/passing and thought ok, but unaware of his strong defense and ability to attack/finish at the basket. A potential fit that could phase in alongside DLo/Edwards as the Rube phases out ... who knows.
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Re: Our board instant analysis (when all reactions are settled) 

Post#49 » by Magoose » Thu Nov 19, 2020 4:16 pm

1) #1 Pick:
My dream scenario was to either trade for a borderline star or to trade down to 5-9 and grab a lightly protected 2021 FRP and one of Avdija, Okongwu, Haliburton. Not sure what kind of offers were on the table so not really sure how to rate it.

If none of these options was to materialize I was torn between Edwards and Wiseman. Both have their flaws and I have to admit the lack of consistency in terms of motor and commitment to the game on the defensive end of Edwards scares me. On the other hand: He seems very immature right now and with strong leadership and passion of a mentor it could work out in the end. There is defenitely All-Star Potential. Personally I feel like Rosas chose the easier path while Wiseman would have raised more eyebrows and questions about fit and desire from Wiseman to be here.

Grade: B-

2) #17 Pick:
Like others I wanted us to wait and pick either Bey, Achiuwa or Poku.
I like Ricky and feel like he could definitely help us playing winning basketball. Trade value overall was ok as well. On the other hand Johnson could have been used as a trade chip at the deadline and Rubios contract runs a year longer which might backfire. A "not sure" move to me.

Grade: C

3) #23 Pick:
These trades smelled a bit like the infamous Kahns multiple dimes for a dollar moves.
Bolmaro looks interesting although I would have liked us to focus more on the forward positions instead of trading down, then up again. Yes I know, he could probably play that position but that looks a bit like a reach at this point. Additionally his shooting motion looks a bit weird and he probably won't come over this season. Not 100% convinced but since there weren't really that many exciting alternatives after 20 I'm ok with it. Although I did not like giving up #33 to move up exactly two spots. Might be a Prigioni move.

Grade: C+

4) #28 Pick:
At #28 finally a pick I really liked. I low risk high reward pick. McDaniels might be out of the league in two years or he might surprise a lot of people but at least there is a lot of potential. Like Bolmaro this is clearly a pick for midterm success which is ok with me.

Grade: A

Overall I'd say it is a B-. The biggest problem I have with our performance so far is that I don't really have a clue about the strategy, intention and our short and midterm goals.
Looks like we want to reach playoffs next season but then I would have liked us to draft more immediate help especially for the forward positions. And since we do not have our own pick a far mature player and a 2021 FRP could have helped us making up for the loss of our FRP next year. At least Rubio might help us with reaching that goal rather sooner than later.

On the other hand we are drafting players for development in Europe and in the D-League. That's fine but it does not fit with the rest of our goals and actions.

Maybe some of the question marks will be gone after free agency and I really hope that we find some forwards and figure out what to do with Malik.

Until that I'll remain bit skeptical about our overall strategy and midterm plans.
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Re: Our board instant analysis (when all reactions are settled) 

Post#50 » by Slim Tubby » Thu Nov 19, 2020 4:21 pm

Magoose wrote:1) #1 Pick:
My dream scenario was to either trade for a borderline star or to trade down to 5-9 and grab a lightly protected 2021 FRP and one of Avdija, Okongwu, Haliburton. Not sure what kind of offers were on the table so not really sure how to rate it.

If none of these options was to materialize I was torn between Edwards and Wiseman. Both have their flaws and I have to admit the lack of consistency in terms of motor and commitment to the game on the defensive end of Edwards scares me. On the other hand: He seems very immature right now and with strong leadership and passion of a mentor it could work out in the end. There is defenitely All-Star Potential. Personally I feel like Rosas chose the easier path while Wiseman would have raised more eyebrows and questions about fit and desire from Wiseman to be here.

Grade: B-

2) #17 Pick:
Like others I wanted us to wait and pick either Bey, Achiuwa or Poku.
I like Ricky and feel like he could definitely help us playing winning basketball. Trade value overall was ok as well. On the other hand Johnson could have been used as a trade chip at the deadline and Rubios contract runs a year longer which might backfire. A "not sure" move to me.

Grade: C

3) #23 Pick:
These trades smelled a bit like the infamous Kahns multiple dimes for a dollar moves.
Bolmaro looks interesting although I would have liked us to focus more on the forward positions instead of trading down, then up again. Yes I know, he could probably play that position but that looks a bit like a reach at this point. Additionally his shooting motion looks a bit weird and he probably won't come over this season. Not 100% convinced but since there weren't really that many exciting alternatives after 20 I'm ok with it. Although I did not like giving up #33 to move up exactly two spots. Might be a Prigioni move.

Grade: C+

4) #28 Pick:
At #28 finally a pick I really liked. I low risk high reward pick. McDaniels might be out of the league in two years or he might surprise a lot of people but at least there is a lot of potential. Like Bolmaro this is clearly a pick for midterm success which is ok with me.

Grade: A

Overall I'd say it is a B-. The biggest problem I have with our performance so far is that I don't really have a clue about the strategy, intention and our short and midterm goals.
Looks like we want to reach playoffs next season but then I would have liked us to draft more immediate help especially for the forward positions. And since we do not have our own pick a far mature player and a 2021 FRP could have helped us making up for the loss of our FRP next year. At least Rubio might help us with reaching that goal rather sooner than later.

On the other hand we are drafting players for development in Europe and in the D-League. That's fine but it does not fit with the rest of our goals and actions.

Maybe some of the question marks will be gone after free agency and I really hope that we find some forwards and figure out what to do with Malik.

Until that I'll remain bit skeptical about our overall strategy and midterm plans.


This is an excellent, unemotional response....something I'm not capable of as a fan right now this close to the draft. Well done, Goose!
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Re: Our board instant analysis (when all reactions are settled) 

Post#51 » by flyindutchman » Thu Nov 19, 2020 4:31 pm

Klomp wrote:
Dewey wrote:Im ok with who we selected, but I'm very concerned with who we did not ... Big Forward. If KAT goes down, we are in trouble and prolly not competitive.

You can say that about most any team who might lose their franchise player to injury.


Ummm, hate to say it, but when were they competitive with him?
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Re: Our board instant analysis (when all reactions are settled) 

Post#52 » by Jedzz » Thu Nov 19, 2020 5:07 pm

NebWolvesFan wrote:
Baseline81 wrote:
Read on Twitter


Minnesota can match any offer for JMac without going into MLE. All they have to do is give him the qualifying offer which is another two-way deal.


What's the point really? There likely isn't even 10 minutes for him now. Going to keep him around for injuries again?

If they don't give him a real deal and a real part on the team they likely will have proven to any incoming players that join the gleague team that it doesn't matter how well you perform in the Gleague or in minutes they get on the main team, they just won't earn respect here. Can't sugercoat it. Yet, probably a different result for any taller players that ever show that kind of ability to actually produce. You would hope at least that anyway.
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Re: Our board instant analysis (when all reactions are settled) 

Post#53 » by Jedzz » Thu Nov 19, 2020 5:11 pm

flyindutchman wrote:
Klomp wrote:
Dewey wrote:Im ok with who we selected, but I'm very concerned with who we did not ... Big Forward. If KAT goes down, we are in trouble and prolly not competitive.

You can say that about most any team who might lose their franchise player to injury.


Ummm, hate to say it, but when were they competitive with him?


Right, because they've had a big gaping hole where a 6-6 to 6-8 Forward wing should be that could shoot and defend at NBA levels. Layman could suffice if he could remain healthy - doubtful. In fact the team won more when he played, and were more effective in limited the opposition scoring by the numbers. Just can't trust him to stay healthy or come back quickly from small issues. Then you have the team likely playing him at 4 just so they can play minutes for Culver/Okogie. They had opportunies in the draft to solve all this.
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Re: Our board instant analysis (when all reactions are settled) 

Post#54 » by TwolvesFanRome » Thu Nov 19, 2020 5:12 pm

My only regret is Achiuwa. It drives me crazy from videos.

However, if they felt to move up to take the Spanish, they obviously saw something in him....and I'm ok with Rosas and the Staff...
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Re: Our board instant analysis (when all reactions are settled) 

Post#55 » by gandlogo » Thu Nov 19, 2020 5:25 pm

TwolvesFanRome wrote:My only regret is Achiuwa. It drives me crazy from videos.

However, if they felt to move up to take the Spanish, they obviously saw something in him....and I'm ok with Rosas and the Staff...


I liked both Achiuwa and Tillman as prospects, but I also think that they both were basically small ball 5s in what the Wolves run. Would either be so much better than Naz that you would use an asset on them? In my eyes, no. Just one guy's opinion.
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Re: Our board instant analysis (when all reactions are settled) 

Post#56 » by Dosadi » Thu Nov 19, 2020 5:59 pm

Some random thoughts:
1 - I think it's reasonable to grade the draft - but I also think it's more reasonable to see it as one part of the roster construction process. As an example, if we use an expanded MLE to get the 6'8" - 6'10" mobile "4" or strong "3" that we all note we need - doesn't that suggest that trading out of the 33 pick was valuable?
2 - We left this draft with 2 opening night contributors - one that we know his range of talent, and one we do not. Adding 2 first night likely contributors is a win to me. How big a win? I'm not sure yet.
3 - We all see basketball through the lens of how we want/believe the game should be played. Rosas is doing the same. I am ok with the one guard, one post and 3 "wings" - but to me, if you play this way, the wings must have reaches of at least 6'6" to 6'10", be switchable and have with definable skills. I'm not seeing enough of those type of wings on the team at this time. And that frustrates me.
4 - I went on record with a preference for trading down if we could get PJ Washington, and then pursue the type of wings I noted above. Apparently that trade was either not offered, or Rosas really believes that AE can be a slasher/last 6 second shot creator that this offense needs. I will trust him, and wait to evaluate the roster construction process until after F/A is effectively complete.
5 - The two late round picks assist us with our roster spot overload, and I believe are viewed as our 2021 picks as Rosas expects the 2021 first to transfer next year. I like both of them (I was impressed with the couple highlight videos of Bolmaro). But both must continue to develop - and whether they do or do not will impact Rosas' length of tenure here.
6 - Rubio's impact on scoring guards in Utah and Arizona (small sample), was clearly positive. He is a "+" defender. Both characteristics can be expected to continue here. I don't think that can be said of any of the players available at 17 - even though there were players there that I thought were likely to be valuable in other ways. One other thing - by exchanging JJ's contract for Rubio, we gain a year where that contract can be traded, or be made part of a deal. I think that's valuable.
7 - Don't we have to sign and trade Malik now? Don't we have to re-sign Juancho now? To me, Juancho's leverage just increased a ton, if he can get another team to overpay him. Conversely, Malik's leverage decreased even further.

I'm enjoying the range of opinions and thoughts. Thanks to all for putting in the time to share them.
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Re: Our board instant analysis (when all reactions are settled) 

Post#57 » by Magoose » Thu Nov 19, 2020 6:02 pm

Slim Tubby wrote:This is an excellent, unemotional response....something I'm not capable of as a fan right now this close to the draft. Well done, Goose!


Haha, thanks. You always need to keep this image in mind, when feeling anger about draft day decisions.

Image

Personally, I stopped being emotional about draft day decisions when I initially ranted about trading what I thought was our multiple all-star shooting guard of the future for a certain overweight power forward from UCLA and change.
In hindsight though it might have prevented us from losing our 2021 FRP to the Warriors in the end :lol:
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Re: Our board instant analysis (when all reactions are settled) 

Post#58 » by Jedzz » Thu Nov 19, 2020 6:12 pm

Magoose wrote:
Slim Tubby wrote:This is an excellent, unemotional response....something I'm not capable of as a fan right now this close to the draft. Well done, Goose!


Haha, thanks. You always need to keep this image in mind, when feeling anger about draft day decisions.

Image

Personally, I stopped being emotional about draft day decisions when I initially ranted about trading what I thought was our multiple all-star shooting guard of the future for a certain overweight power forward from UCLA and change.
In hindsight though it might have prevented us from losing our 2021 FRP to the Warriors in the end :lol:


You are still emotional about that past event. Nothing has replaced it in your memory banks yet, in fact it just leaked out all over this post. There is no reason to be a robot about this stuff. Being a robot isn't going to guarantee the right moves are made. It would just allow people to keep making mistakes with no need to be concerned over them. Wups, just gave away Towns for nothing but a future 2021 pick. No biggy, I'm not emotional about it.
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Re: Our board instant analysis (when all reactions are settled) 

Post#59 » by karch34 » Thu Nov 19, 2020 6:16 pm

#1 would’ve preferred Bridges or Markannen in a trade down as helps fill D or shooting at F position. That said Edwards seems like he can be best player in draft and still feels most likely (to me) to be a star, I’m fine with pick since there wasn’t a trade.

17 and Johnson for Rubio, 25 and 28. Didn’t mind move down. Rubio helps with D and shot creation and also a great vet. Problem is we remove another vet to do it and our only significant trade piece financially goes to a PG, which isn’t a need….Assuming JJ was the actual contract moved. Was ok as thought next two picks were going to fill the need, but also disappointed as PG who could form a nice rotation with DLo and JMac were available late and our resources could be spent elsewhere. Do see the mentor to Edwards angle as being signficant.

25 and 33 for Balmoro. Liked Balmoro and no issue with stashing since we won’t have a pick next year, but thinking Bane/Woodard and Oturo were possible pieces we missed on makes it tough.

#28 I really liked the McDaniels pick. He’s very immature from what I’d heard leading up to the draft, but the talent is there. Good home run type pick.

Overall I’m around a B just because the trades didn’t seem to fit with biggest needs. I feel like we definitely aren’t looking to compete as much as we thought we would this year. That said I’m sure there are other moves that will change how all this looks or feels at this moment.
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Re: Our board instant analysis (when all reactions are settled) 

Post#60 » by Baseline81 » Thu Nov 19, 2020 7:36 pm

Also from today's article in The Ringer, this draft was about accumulating talent/assets.
“We need talent in the stage that we are in. Getting guys that are more ready to play in the NBA and get us marginal wins has a limited ceiling,” said Rosas. “I’d love to be in a situation where we are winning 50 games a year and are in the playoffs. We aren’t there yet. We have to take bets. We have to take developmental projects. We have to take the highest upside.”

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