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Rank the Free Agent Signings

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Rank the Free Agent Signings 

Post#1 » by Krapinsky » Sun Nov 22, 2020 1:06 am

Since a lot of people don't seem to like the Beasley signing, I am curious how you would rank the signing among some of the other comparable free agent signings out there.

Gordon Hayward (age 30) - $120M / 4 ($30M avg)
Fred VanVleet (age 26) - $85M/4 ($21.25M avg)
Danilo Gallinari (age 32) - $61.5M / 3 ($20.5M avg)
Jerami Grant (age 26) - $60M / 3 ($20M avg)
Joe Harris (age 29) - $75M / 4 ($18.75M avg)
Goran Dragic (age 34) - $37.4M / 2 (18.7M avg)
Davis Bertans (age 28) - $80M / 5 ($16M avg)
Marcus Morris (age 31) - $64M / 4 ($16M avg)
Malik Beasley (age 23) - $60M / 4 ($15M avg) [4th year said to be team option]
Jordan Clarkson (age 28) - $52M / 4 ($13M avg)
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Re: Rank the Free Agent Signings 

Post#2 » by theGreatRC » Sun Nov 22, 2020 1:18 am

Krapinsky wrote:Since a lot of people don't seem to like the Beasley signing, I am curious how you would rank the signing among some of the other comparable free agent signings out there.

Gordon Hayward (age 30) - $120M / 4 ($30M avg)
Fred VanVleet (age 26) - $85M/4 ($21.25M avg)
Danilo Gallinari (age 32) - $61.5M / 3 ($20.5M avg)
Jerami Grant (age 26) - $60M / 3 ($20M avg)
Joe Harris (age 29) - $75M / 4 ($18.75M avg)
Goran Dragic (age 34) - $37.4M / 2 (18.7M avg)
Davis Bertans (age 28) - $80M / 5 ($16M avg)
Marcus Morris (age 31) - $64M / 4 ($16M avg)
Malik Beasley (age 23) - $60M / 4 ($15M avg) [4th year said to be team option]
Jordan Clarkson (age 28) - $52M / 4 ($13M avg)


3 factors make Beasley the best signing; age, production, contract

Gonna be 24 years old this season

Produced at a high level for US (Idc what he did for his career, he's still a young player improving, we're betting on him to be better every year)

15M per year compared to everyone else on that list ranks him at the top of the list.

My list:

Beasley

VanVleet
Clarkson
Dragic
Harris
Grant
Bertans
Morris
Gallo
Hayward
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Re: Rank the Free Agent Signings 

Post#3 » by Slim Tubby » Sun Nov 22, 2020 4:37 am

theGreatRC wrote:
Krapinsky wrote:Since a lot of people don't seem to like the Beasley signing, I am curious how you would rank the signing among some of the other comparable free agent signings out there.

Gordon Hayward (age 30) - $120M / 4 ($30M avg)
Fred VanVleet (age 26) - $85M/4 ($21.25M avg)
Danilo Gallinari (age 32) - $61.5M / 3 ($20.5M avg)
Jerami Grant (age 26) - $60M / 3 ($20M avg)
Joe Harris (age 29) - $75M / 4 ($18.75M avg)
Goran Dragic (age 34) - $37.4M / 2 (18.7M avg)
Davis Bertans (age 28) - $80M / 5 ($16M avg)
Marcus Morris (age 31) - $64M / 4 ($16M avg)
Malik Beasley (age 23) - $60M / 4 ($15M avg) [4th year said to be team option]
Jordan Clarkson (age 28) - $52M / 4 ($13M avg)


3 factors make Beasley the best signing; age, production, contract

Gonna be 24 years old this season

Produced at a high level for US (Idc what he did for his career, he's still a young player improving, we're betting on him to be better every year)

15M per year compared to everyone else on that list ranks him at the top of the list.

My list:

Beasley

VanVleet
Clarkson
Dragic
Harris
Grant
Bertans
Morris
Gallo
Hayward

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Re: Rank the Free Agent Signings 

Post#4 » by andyhop » Sun Nov 22, 2020 5:24 am

theGreatRC wrote:
Produced at a high level for US (Idc what he did for his career, he's still a young player improving, we're betting on him to be better every year)



I wish people would stop saying this because it isn't true , he is being signed because they believe he will either improve enough to become worth the deal or to be traded down the line and that's fine . no need to come up with BS to try and make yourself feel better about the signing
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Re: Rank the Free Agent Signings 

Post#5 » by Worm Guts » Sun Nov 22, 2020 5:29 am

andyhop wrote:
theGreatRC wrote:
Produced at a high level for US (Idc what he did for his career, he's still a young player improving, we're betting on him to be better every year)



I wish people would stop saying this because it isn't true , he is being signed because they believe he will either improve enough to become worth the deal or to be traded down the line and that's fine . no need to come up with BS to try and make yourself feel better about the signing


He averaged over 20 ppg on good efficiency, I think your reaction is pretty dismissive.
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Re: Rank the Free Agent Signings 

Post#6 » by andyhop » Sun Nov 22, 2020 5:33 am

Worm Guts wrote:
andyhop wrote:
theGreatRC wrote:
Produced at a high level for US (Idc what he did for his career, he's still a young player improving, we're betting on him to be better every year)



I wish people would stop saying this because it isn't true , he is being signed because they believe he will either improve enough to become worth the deal or to be traded down the line and that's fine . no need to come up with BS to try and make yourself feel better about the signing


He averaged over 20 ppg on good efficiency, I think your reaction is pretty dismissive.


So you don't believe that there are any other parts that make up the game of basketball?
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Re: Rank the Free Agent Signings 

Post#7 » by shrink » Sun Nov 22, 2020 5:39 am

andyhop wrote:
Worm Guts wrote:
andyhop wrote:
I wish people would stop saying this because it isn't true , he is being signed because they believe he will either improve enough to become worth the deal or to be traded down the line and that's fine . no need to come up with BS to try and make yourself feel better about the signing


He averaged over 20 ppg on good efficiency, I think your reaction is pretty dismissive.


So you don't believe that there are any other parts that make up the game of basketball?

Of course there isn’t. Don’t harsh their buzz, here at FanGM.com! He’s wearing a TImberwolves jersey!
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Re: Rank the Free Agent Signings 

Post#8 » by andyhop » Sun Nov 22, 2020 5:44 am

shrink wrote:
andyhop wrote:
Worm Guts wrote:
He averaged over 20 ppg on good efficiency, I think your reaction is pretty dismissive.


So you don't believe that there are any other parts that make up the game of basketball?

Of course there isn’t. Don’t harsh their buzz! He’s wearing a TImberwolves jersey!


I mean its not even as though i am positive he will be a waste of money or anything.

I think that Rojas could have got a better deal ( which may or may not be true) and that he is going to have to make big improvements in his game to be worth this deal given where he is now.

It is certainly possible that he will improve his game enough that he becomes worthy of his deal but the idea that he is there now is just stupid
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Re: Rank the Free Agent Signings 

Post#9 » by Worm Guts » Sun Nov 22, 2020 5:50 am

andyhop wrote:
Worm Guts wrote:
andyhop wrote:
I wish people would stop saying this because it isn't true , he is being signed because they believe he will either improve enough to become worth the deal or to be traded down the line and that's fine . no need to come up with BS to try and make yourself feel better about the signing


He averaged over 20 ppg on good efficiency, I think your reaction is pretty dismissive.


So you don't believe that there are any other parts that make up the game of basketball?


Of course there is, but scoring still counts as one of the ways to produce.
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Re: Rank the Free Agent Signings 

Post#10 » by andyhop » Sun Nov 22, 2020 5:53 am

Worm Guts wrote:
andyhop wrote:
Worm Guts wrote:
He averaged over 20 ppg on good efficiency, I think your reaction is pretty dismissive.


So you don't believe that there are any other parts that make up the game of basketball?


Of course there is, but scoring still counts as one of the ways to produce.


Sure but you don't play at a high level for a team by being a net negative on the court like Beasley was in his 14 games for the Wolves. If someone wants to spruik how well he shot then that's fine but that isn't playing at a high level
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Re: Rank the Free Agent Signings 

Post#11 » by Worm Guts » Sun Nov 22, 2020 5:57 am

andyhop wrote:
Worm Guts wrote:
andyhop wrote:
So you don't believe that there are any other parts that make up the game of basketball?


Of course there is, but scoring still counts as one of the ways to produce.


Sure but you don't play at a high level for a team by being a net negative on the court like Beasley was in his 14 games for the Wolves. If someone wants to spruik how well he shot then that's fine but that isn't playing at a high level


I’m not sure what metric you’re using, but his rpm was a positive.
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Re: Rank the Free Agent Signings 

Post#12 » by shrink » Sun Nov 22, 2020 5:58 am

delete
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Re: Rank the Free Agent Signings 

Post#13 » by andyhop » Sun Nov 22, 2020 6:02 am

Worm Guts wrote:
andyhop wrote:
Worm Guts wrote:
Of course there is, but scoring still counts as one of the ways to produce.


Sure but you don't play at a high level for a team by being a net negative on the court like Beasley was in his 14 games for the Wolves. If someone wants to spruik how well he shot then that's fine but that isn't playing at a high level


I’m not sure what metric you’re using, but his rpm was a positive.


Raptor.BPM,PIPM all negative and a negative BPM for the time he was with the Wolves as well as overall for the season.

The team was better without him on the court than with him on it.
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Re: Rank the Free Agent Signings 

Post#14 » by shrink » Sun Nov 22, 2020 6:21 am

Seriously though, I agree - it is unlikely, but not impossible, for Beasley to improve and be worth that contract. However, we should not be paying him like that’s the player he is.

I listed six reasons why Beasley has less leverage when you determine the contract he should have received. To illustrate, Joe Harris is another three point shooting player, who had leverage. The Nets couldn’t afford to lose him with their immediate championship goals, and couldn’t replace him if he left. Those are the teams that should be overpaying.

I looked briefly to find the specs on the other deals. Beasley’s team option improves his deal, and I think it is very likely others have this, specifically Goren Dragic. In his situation, MIA has a lot of unnecessary cap space this season, but their real target is Giannis next year. That’s a franchise maker. In their situation, overpaying Dragic for this year alone to keep him is worthwhile to outbid longer term offers, if Dragic’s second year is unguaranteed, and keeps MIA in 2021 cap space.

My point here is that each free agent contract needs to be evaluated based on the player, the team, and the short and longterm affects of that individual team. In our situation, I think we overpaid, especially with minutes being used on guards like Russell, Rubio, Edwards, and our last two 1sts also spent on guards, plus his continually bad defense over his career so far. He has not been a positive player yet - and focusing solely on his three point shooting isn’t a fair representation of who he really is. I have my fingers crossed that his production reaches his new contract level - in the meantime, it’s a negative trade asset.
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Re: Rank the Free Agent Signings 

Post#15 » by theGreatRC » Sun Nov 22, 2020 6:30 am

42% from 3 on 8 attempts is filthy..

5rpg from a SG is above average..

Compare it to a PF in Davis Bertans who got 80m for 4 years...he shot 42% as well on 8.7 attempts and grabbed less rebounds than Malik and scored 5ppg less...not saying Wiz got a good deal for him, but he still got a lot more than Beasley..

Same thing with Joe Harris:

42% from 3 on 6 attempts, 4rpg and about the same assists per game as Malik (2.1apg vs 1.9apg)

I like Malik's deal and it's not because he's wearing a Wolves jerseys, he's a good player and you're going to see it for the next 3+ years if he's here for the full contract.
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Re: Rank the Free Agent Signings 

Post#16 » by minimus » Sun Nov 22, 2020 8:25 am

Lets compare with two high volume shooters from small market teams:

Zach LaVine 78mil/4yrs, 19.5mil. Signed contract after serious injury. I love Zach's killer mentality, but he cant defend, does not care about defense, has questionable shot selection, clashes with coach about his role



Buddy Hield 106-94mil/yrs, 26.5-23.5mil. Cant defend, clashes with coach. Made his frustrations about contract situation and role visible.

Both players are better suited to play from the bench as designated 6th. Both expressed their frustrations about their roles in CHI, SAC, let alone move them to 6th man role. Both are paid way more than Beasley, at 20 ml you have to play them as starters.

See the difference between them and Beasley?

P.S. Hahaha, there is another perfect example of a shooter from small market. It is "invisible man" Tony Snell, or Tony "0-0-0-0-0". He got 44ml/4yrs.
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Re: Rank the Free Agent Signings 

Post#17 » by mercgold3 » Sun Nov 22, 2020 8:29 am

theGreatRC wrote:42% from 3 on 8 attempts is filthy..

5rpg from a SG is above average..

Compare it to a PF in Davis Bertans who got 80m for 4 years...he shot 42% as well on 8.7 attempts and grabbed less rebounds than Malik and scored 5ppg less...not saying Wiz got a good deal for him, but he still got a lot more than Beasley..

Same thing with Joe Harris:

42% from 3 on 6 attempts, 4rpg and about the same assists per game as Malik (2.1apg vs 1.9apg)

I like Malik's deal and it's not because he's wearing a Wolves jerseys, he's a good player and you're going to see it for the next 3+ years if he's here for the full contract.


Just a little correction.
Bertans got 80M for 5 years ;)
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Re: Rank the Free Agent Signings 

Post#18 » by theGreatRC » Sun Nov 22, 2020 9:44 am

mercgold3 wrote:
theGreatRC wrote:42% from 3 on 8 attempts is filthy..

5rpg from a SG is above average..

Compare it to a PF in Davis Bertans who got 80m for 4 years...he shot 42% as well on 8.7 attempts and grabbed less rebounds than Malik and scored 5ppg less...not saying Wiz got a good deal for him, but he still got a lot more than Beasley..

Same thing with Joe Harris:

42% from 3 on 6 attempts, 4rpg and about the same assists per game as Malik (2.1apg vs 1.9apg)

I like Malik's deal and it's not because he's wearing a Wolves jerseys, he's a good player and you're going to see it for the next 3+ years if he's here for the full contract.


Just a little correction.
Bertans got 80M for 5 years ;)


Thanks for correcting me, that makes it a lot better actually lol...but he's still 28 and one dimensional..i'd probably rank him before/after Joe Harris now..I feel like they're on the same level
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Re: Rank the Free Agent Signings 

Post#19 » by shangrila » Sun Nov 22, 2020 10:08 am

shrink wrote:
andyhop wrote:
Worm Guts wrote:
He averaged over 20 ppg on good efficiency, I think your reaction is pretty dismissive.


So you don't believe that there are any other parts that make up the game of basketball?

Of course there isn’t. Don’t harsh their buzz, here at FanGM.com! He’s wearing a TImberwolves jersey!

You're better than this, come on.
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Re: Rank the Free Agent Signings 

Post#20 » by Dewey » Sun Nov 22, 2020 10:50 am

Seems we are lurking to get involved in bigger Harden/Wall type deals... hopefully we can swap spit to balance out roster some.
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