Should we try to sign Boogie?

[winforlose]

So Houston is letting Boogie go. I haven’t seen him this season and I know he has lost a lot of his game from the various injuries. The question I have is whether his shooting alongside either Naz or KAT is worth a minimum deal. It would also likely put Vando on the bench as MCD is the future and KAT and Naz are guaranteed minutes.

[SCTwins]

I'm guessing he goes to Brooklyn or L.A.

[theGreatRC]

I'd love for him to come here, but he probably goes to a contender..

Maybe if he wants to put up stats to get a contract, he'll sing with us?

[RiRuHoops]

LOL

[packforfreedom]

lol no, why?

[winforlose]

lol no, why?

For him it gives a chance to prove it on a bad team (low pressure with decent minutes,) instead of a contender who is likely to keep him on a short leash. For us, it gives us another big who can shoot. If he does well here with partial bird rights and he bonds with our guys maybe we try and sign him next season. Either way I doubt it happens because it isn’t part of small ball, but it would give us a small ball out.

Edit to include, our biggest needs are legit centers to allow KAT and Naz to move to PF and a backup PG to replace Rubio on a decent deal. Assume we trade Ricky for a pick and sign JMAC to a deal close to 3-4 million with team control options (probably a team option year or RFA final year,) now we still a 3rd string PG probably on two way. Now we got Dlo, JMAC, 3rd string. Our wings are set with Beasley, Ant, Nowell, Layman, and Culver/Okogie as 3rd string. MCD plays with either KAT or Naz and Boogie plays with the other. Or you could go even bigger and play MCD at the 3 alongside the other bigs.

[Rookie-Mistake]

We are the WORST team in the league. Absolutely no one wants to come here.. CLOSE THREAD.

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[Sugarless]

Sure, why not? He's exactly the type of veteran presence that would go well with this team.

Low BBIQ, no defense, inefficient and shoots way more often than he should. A match made in heaven.

[winforlose]

Sure, why not? He's exactly the type of veteran presence that would go well with this team.

Low BBIQ, no defense, inefficient and shoots way more often than he should. A match made in heaven.

But is he worse than Vando. The guy who cannot even do a layup and gets stripped every time he tries. I don’t love him either, but the underlying question is whether there are any legit centers who are both available and have any incentive to come here. At least with Boogie the incentive is minutes (to try and a get a real deal next season.) I am just grasping at anything that moves us away from small ball.

[Sugarless]

Sure, why not? He's exactly the type of veteran presence that would go well with this team.

Low BBIQ, no defense, inefficient and shoots way more often than he should. A match made in heaven.

But is he worse than Vando. The guy who cannot even do a layup and gets stripped every time he tries. I don’t love him either, but the underlying question is whether there are any legit centers who are both available and have any incentive to come here. At least with Boogie the incentive is minutes (to try and a get a real deal next season.) I am just grasping at anything that moves us away from small ball.

He's just not worth it. Not his game, not his character, which certainly wouldn't help the youngest team in the league.

There are more interesting options out there, both veteran (Dewayne Dedmon) and young (Skal Labissiere). Heck, if it's just about bringing a big body I'd first sign John Henson. He's not going to give you anything other than 10 minutes of rebounding, defense and terrible offense, but his character won't be an issue inside the locker room.

As for PFs that would send Vanderbilt to the end of the bench, there are guys like Ilyasova or Caboclo. And RHJ is still free. He still can't shoot but he's an energy guy like Vanderbilt, only smarter, with better defense and at least able to make some of his FTs.

[winforlose]

Sure, why not? He's exactly the type of veteran presence that would go well with this team.

Low BBIQ, no defense, inefficient and shoots way more often than he should. A match made in heaven.

But is he worse than Vando. The guy who cannot even do a layup and gets stripped every time he tries. I don’t love him either, but the underlying question is whether there are any legit centers who are both available and have any incentive to come here. At least with Boogie the incentive is minutes (to try and a get a real deal next season.) I am just grasping at anything that moves us away from small ball.

He's just not worth it. Not his game, not his character, which certainly wouldn't help the youngest team in the league.

There are more interesting options out there, both veteran (Dewayne Dedmon) and young (Skal Labissiere). Heck, if it's just about bringing a big body I'd first sign John Henson. He's not going to give you anything other than 10 minutes of rebounding, defense and terrible offense, but his character won't be an issue inside the locker room.

As for PFs that would send Vanderbilt to the end of the bench, there are guys like Ilyasova or Caboclo. And RHJ is still free. He still can't shoot but he's an energy guy like Vanderbilt, only smarter, with better defense and at least able to make some of his FTs.

From my perspective anyone we bring in needs to meet 3 criteria.

1. They must be large enough and have experience playing C. Naz and KAT are both better at PF and would do better at rebounding and staying out of foul trouble guarding PFs instead of Cs.

2. They must be capable of scoring inside of 5-7 feet. Vando is not capable of any consistent offensive production whatsoever. It would be better if they could also shoot at least 33% from 3, but for under 2.5 mil beggars cannot be choosers.

3. They should have at least 5 years in the NBA. Last thing we need is more young blood not ready for the NBA. The exception to this is a backup PG once we ditch Rubio. Young PGs grow with the team, but at C we want experienced rebounding, rim protection, and consistent ability to hit layups.

Boogie is a low risk experiment but again not my first choice. That is why the topic wasn’t we need to sign Boogie or we should sign Boogie. But rather should we try to sign him?

[packforfreedom]

1. They must be large enough and have experience playing C. Naz and KAT are both better at PF and would do better at rebounding and staying out of foul trouble guarding PFs instead of Cs.

I think this premise isn't correct. Both KAT and Naz are better at center than PF. Both are too slow laterally to guard quicker 4s on the perimeter or small ball 4s. While Naz high center of gravity makes it hard for him to stay in position in the post when big, heavy opponents are around him, KAT has really every physical tool to be at least an above average defender. People are saying for years that KAT would be a better PF but I just don't buy him. It wouldn't make him better defensively while taking away some of his strenghts on offense.

[winforlose]

1. They must be large enough and have experience playing C. Naz and KAT are both better at PF and would do better at rebounding and staying out of foul trouble guarding PFs instead of Cs.

I think this premise isn't correct. Both KAT and Naz are better at center than PF. Both are too slow laterally to guard quicker 4s on the perimeter or small ball 4s. While Naz high center of gravitiy makes it hard for him to stay in position in the post when big, heavy opponents are around him, KAT has really every physical tool to be at least an above average defender. People are saying for years that KAT would be a better PF but I just don't buy him. It wouldn't make him better defensively while taking away some of his strenghts on offense.

I hate Thibs and I think he is an out of touch dumbass, but he was right to have Taj guard centers and KAT PFs because it helped KAT stay out of foul trouble. Also, PFs need help guarding KAT and couldn’t get that help easily with a solid center in the low post with shooters around the perimeter (Dlo, Beasley, and hopefully Ant.)

As for Naz, his best asset is his inside game. His 3 point shooting is spotty and though it is good enough to space out the D, he is not KAT from the outside. Having PFs guard him will make him more effective on offense and rebounding. As for defense, we have a better chance with two bigs then one. Especially when our biggest weakness is put back layups or dunks against Naz.

[shrink]

KAT is not playing PF. His defensive issues are based on his decision-making, and that problem would be magnified if he was forced to defend opponents out to the perimeter. Also, he sees himself as a center. We are not going to risk alienating him by forcing him to play a different position just to bring in Boogie.

From what I’m reading, a couple reasons Cousins is being cut for nothing because he doesn’t have any athleticism left, and he is unable, or unwilling, to defend.

[shrink]

There are more interesting options out there, both veteran (Dewayne Dedmon) and young (Skal Labissiere). Heck, if it's just about bringing a big body I'd first sign John Henson. He's not going to give you anything other than 10 minutes of rebounding, defense and terrible offense, but his character won't be an issue inside the locker room.

As for PFs that would send Vanderbilt to the end of the bench, there are guys like Ilyasova or Caboclo. And RHJ is still free. He still can't shoot but he's an energy guy like Vanderbilt, only smarter, with better defense and at least able to make some of his FTs.

These are some excellent names. We aren’t going to find some savior in free agency, but there are some ideas here that might help in small samples.

I also wanted to mention that there is value in keeping the roster spot open. It doesn’t cost us money as we are close to the lux, and it doesn’t use up minutes for other prospects we’d like to develop. Also, an open spot would allow us to do a 1-for-2 trade as we approach the deadline, without having to cut anyone. Finally, we would need that slot if we converted Jordan McLaughlin’s two-way deal.

I imagine we will keep the slot open. The NBA allows teams to start signing 10-day contracts on Tuesday, and that slot will give us some flexibility there, if needed.

[winforlose]

KAT is not playing PF. His defensive issues are based on his decision-making, and that problem would be magnified if he was forced to defend opponents out to the perimeter. Also, he sees himself as a center. We are not going to risk alienating him by forcing him to play a different position just to bring in Boogie.

From what I’m reading, a couple reasons Cousins is being cut for nothing because he doesn’t have any athleticism left, and he is unable, or unwilling, to defend.

KAT already plays defense at the perimeter when guarding shooting centers. In the modern NBA a lot of centers spend time behind the 3 point line. Also, while I agree that KAT’s biggest issue is his decision making, his swiping at the ball and poor angles with his body get him in foul trouble. When guarding PFs there is less post defense and that actually helps keep him in the game. I don’t think he cares who he guards (which on defense is the only real point of formal positions,) as long as we win.

As for Boogie, his 3 point shooting and rebounding probably adds more to the team than Vando. But, to be fair I have not seen his game, only his stat line. Hence the question rather than the suggestion.

[Sugarless]

There are more interesting options out there, both veteran (Dewayne Dedmon) and young (Skal Labissiere). Heck, if it's just about bringing a big body I'd first sign John Henson. He's not going to give you anything other than 10 minutes of rebounding, defense and terrible offense, but his character won't be an issue inside the locker room.

As for PFs that would send Vanderbilt to the end of the bench, there are guys like Ilyasova or Caboclo. And RHJ is still free. He still can't shoot but he's an energy guy like Vanderbilt, only smarter, with better defense and at least able to make some of his FTs.

These are some excellent names. We aren’t going to find some savior in free agency, but there are some ideas here that might help in small samples.

I also wanted to mention that there is value in keeping the roster spot open. It doesn’t cost us money as we are close to the lux, and it doesn’t use up minutes for other prospects we’d like to develop. Also, an open spot would allow us to do a 1-for-2 trade as we approach the deadline, without having to cut anyone. Finally, we would need that slot if we converted Jordan McLaughlin’s two-way deal.

I imagine we will keep the slot open. The NBA allows teams to start signing 10-day contracts on Tuesday, and that slot will give us some flexibility there, if needed.

We're still 4-5 weeks away from the trade deadline, so maybe it'd make sense to bring someone over and use that spot, but it certainly would have to be sooner rather than later, and only if the FO and coaches are fully invested on winning. As things stand, I think it's clear they're not really desperate to win, and they probably don't feel like bringing in a PF or C would help this team be more competitive, so I agree that they'll likely leave the spot open to use in a trade or to give McLaughlin a well-deserved full contract, like you said. I wish they would have used it earlier, though. A veteran guy like Dedmon or Ilyasova could have helped stabilize the Wolves during some of their dreadful 4th quarters.

[Sugarless]

KAT is not playing PF. His defensive issues are based on his decision-making, and that problem would be magnified if he was forced to defend opponents out to the perimeter. Also, he sees himself as a center. We are not going to risk alienating him by forcing him to play a different position just to bring in Boogie.

From what I’m reading, a couple reasons Cousins is being cut for nothing because he doesn’t have any athleticism left, and he is unable, or unwilling, to defend.

KAT already plays defense at the perimeter when guarding shooting centers. In the modern NBA a lot of centers spend time behind the 3 point line. Also, while I agree that KAT’s biggest issue is his decision making, his swiping at the ball and poor angles with his body get him in foul trouble. When guarding PFs there is less post defense and that actually helps keep him in the game. I don’t think he cares who he guards (which on defense is the only real point of formal positions,) as long as we win.

As for Boogie, his 3 point shooting and rebounding probably adds more to the team than Vando. But, to be fair I have not seen his game, only his stat line. Hence the question rather than the suggestion.

Not fully related to the debate about KAT playing PF or C, but I have to say the way the Wolves use their centers defensively in pnr situations, constantly and instantly dropping back (even when their teammates can't recover and stay on the ballhandler) has been one of the most mind-boggling, ineffective decisions they've made all year. They've been offering guys wide-open shots since the season started, while they stay in no man's land.

[winforlose]

KAT is not playing PF. His defensive issues are based on his decision-making, and that problem would be magnified if he was forced to defend opponents out to the perimeter. Also, he sees himself as a center. We are not going to risk alienating him by forcing him to play a different position just to bring in Boogie.

From what I’m reading, a couple reasons Cousins is being cut for nothing because he doesn’t have any athleticism left, and he is unable, or unwilling, to defend.

KAT already plays defense at the perimeter when guarding shooting centers. In the modern NBA a lot of centers spend time behind the 3 point line. Also, while I agree that KAT’s biggest issue is his decision making, his swiping at the ball and poor angles with his body get him in foul trouble. When guarding PFs there is less post defense and that actually helps keep him in the game. I don’t think he cares who he guards (which on defense is the only real point of formal positions,) as long as we win.

As for Boogie, his 3 point shooting and rebounding probably adds more to the team than Vando. But, to be fair I have not seen his game, only his stat line. Hence the question rather than the suggestion.

Not fully related to the debate about KAT playing PF or C, but I have to say the way the Wolves use their centers defensively in pnr situations, constantly and instantly dropping back (even when their teammates can't recover and stay on the ballhandler) has been one of the most mind-boggling, ineffective decisions they've made all year. They've been offering guys wide-open shots since the season started, while they stay in no man's land.

One of the many signs we don’t have a proper head coach or defensive scheme. Switching scheme in general has been a disaster. Have you noticed that a lot of the time the close games are more about the good teams missing open 3s then our defense altering them. Our lack of size also gives up a lot of defensive rebounds which teams exploit to kick out for open 3s or get easy put backs. Fundamentally we play 5 one on ones instead of team defense.

[Krapinsky]

Many already covered this obvious fact, but Boogie wouldn't be interested in coming here. He'll go to a contender or familiar place.