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Release JMac?

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Jedzz
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Release JMac? 

Post#1 » by Jedzz » Sat Apr 3, 2021 5:51 pm

Should he just be released to try and catch on elsewhere if he's even able to at this point? With Dlo coming back and point guards not even being useful in this offense per Finch's words, wouldn't it help the logjam to just release? He costs virtually nothing so it won't hurt the team.

I know plenty here think very little of him. Where I saw an Isaiah Thomas possible player without the ego trips and injuries. After seeing how they made use of the play JMac showed the prior season I can see this team won't ever make use of his skills. For example, someone like Isaiah Thomas had over 1600 minutes and over 35 starts as a rookie, 3700 minutes and maybe 100 starts in first two seasons and went on to play 11 seasons. JMac has only 1,100 minutes now in two seasons. He's really got no shot at more here and it looks like they are asking him to play a style that won't amount to much for him. He probably never gets the chance someone like Isaiah Thomas did but maybe he can find a team he fits better with.

Thomas fell off a cliff they say on defense and wasn't loading up points anymore so was expendable to Boston and he never really got a featured role again. Hearing now he just got another 10 day with pelicans. JMac could maybe catch on this way with other clubs. Is there really any point in dragging this out? Would it be more fair to the player to release, or is that just dooming his career to do so?
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Re: Release JMac? 

Post#2 » by ClarkeW » Sat Apr 3, 2021 6:57 pm

I like McLaughlin too, so everything I’m about to say is with a great deal of respect towards his abilities....

1) Every single team in the NBA had a chance to sign him last offseason, and not a single one even made an offer. Not even the minimum. We were the only one.

2) He’s a third string PG on the worst team in the league. He is not some hot prospect who is going to sign to a playoff contender and start seeing contributing minutes. If we release him it just means he’s going to be unemployed.

I actually think releasing him would be the worst thing for him. At least here there is a possibility of him seeing the court sometimes if D’Lo takes a while longer to come back or if something happens to Rubio. Otherwise he’s just a FA PG who was cut by the worst team in the league... in a league filled with great PGs. Not a good position to be in.

And again, I actually like Jordan McLaughlin! If we hadn’t made the Rubio trade and rolled into this season with him as our backup PG I would have been totally happy with that. I’d still love to have him on the team next year as a third PG on a good contract who I actually trust to come in and play well if needed. I know that’s not what you envision as his upside, but I don’t think it’s a slap in the face to the player either.
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Re: Release JMac? 

Post#3 » by winforlose » Sat Apr 3, 2021 7:13 pm

Jedzz wrote:Should he just be released to try and catch on elsewhere if he's even able to at this point? With Dlo coming back and point guards not even being useful in this offense per Finch's words, wouldn't it help the logjam to just release? He costs virtually nothing so it won't hurt the team.

I know plenty here think very little of him. Where I saw an Isaiah Thomas possible player without the ego trips and injuries. After seeing how they made use of the play JMac showed the prior season I can see this team won't ever make use of his skills. For example, someone like Isaiah Thomas had over 1600 minutes and over 35 starts as a rookie, 3700 minutes and maybe 100 starts in first two seasons and went on to play 11 seasons. JMac has only 1,100 minutes now in two seasons. He's really got no shot at more here and it looks like they are asking him to play a style that won't amount to much for him. He probably never gets the chance someone like Isaiah Thomas did but maybe he can find a team he fits better with.

Thomas fell off a cliff they say on defense and wasn't loading up points anymore so was expendable to Boston and he never really got a featured role again. Hearing now he just got another 10 day with pelicans. JMac could maybe catch on this way with other clubs. Is there really any point in dragging this out? Would it be more fair to the player to release, or is that just dooming his career to do so?


In a season where the wolves are short on PGs they are simply not releasing an 80,000 dollar contract. Just isn’t going to happen. As for fairness to JMAC he just got a start last night. Will probably again tonight (assuming Rubio is out.) Every team needs cheap contracts with guys who can give you something. JMAC has flaws, but he is also young, he has a ceiling we would like for him to break through. Look at Omari Spellman. We wanted him, he didn’t want us, no one else wanted him, he fell of a cliff. I know it isn’t as simple as that, but my point is teams aren’t handing anyone minutes, especially an I drafted PG who cannot even get regular rotation minutes on the worst team in the league.

Bottom line, JMAC will hopefully resign with us, find more of a role and break through his ceiling. If not, there is always semi pro.
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Re: Release JMac? 

Post#4 » by wolves_89 » Sat Apr 3, 2021 7:27 pm

There is no chance the Wolves release McLaughlin. He'll be a restricted free agent, so the Wolves have every reason to keep him and see how things play out. He was a RFA last off-season and didn't get any offers, so it seems unlikely he will get much in the way of offers this off-season after what is looking to be a worse season. He's a good third string PG and as long as his contract is cheap he isn't going anywhere.
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Re: Release JMac? 

Post#5 » by SO_MONEY » Sat Apr 3, 2021 7:40 pm

C'mon. No.
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Re: Release JMac? 

Post#6 » by Jedzz » Sat Apr 3, 2021 8:32 pm

ClarkeW wrote:I like McLaughlin too, so everything I’m about to say is with a great deal of respect towards his abilities....

1) Every single team in the NBA had a chance to sign him last offseason, and not a single one even made an offer. Not even the minimum. We were the only one.



I'd rather the thread not devolve into our ignorant claims, excuses or guesses for why he's buried here or what we think of his ceiling or floor. We've all been through this already regarding him. Let's just stay away from it since I and maybe a couple others aren't going to agree it is this simple. The reality is the team doesn't respect him as worth anything more in role or contracts.

I'm more interested in other things you said such as believing it might end his career if released and maybe also whether or not there is any reason to keep dragging this on with this team.
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Re: Release JMac? 

Post#7 » by Jedzz » Sat Apr 3, 2021 8:45 pm

wolves_89 wrote:There is no chance the Wolves release McLaughlin. He'll be a restricted free agent, so the Wolves have every reason to keep him and see how things play out. He was a RFA last off-season and didn't get any offers, so it seems unlikely he will get much in the way of offers this off-season after what is looking to be a worse season. He's a good third string PG and as long as his contract is cheap he isn't going anywhere.


But he's not a good third string PG here. Certainly not on a team that today doesn't use point guards as point guards now. You can see the impact of that on him having a worse season now. How is that a good thing for the team or player? Simply as evidence they are able to lock down control of players cheaply? What's that good for?

Maybe they can go pickup an undraffed carnival shooter that can at least stand around and hit any open shot you give him if nothing else. Nowell got 21 minutes last game, maybe he could have done more with the 33 JMac got where three quarters of those minutes he's just standing a post on the 3pt line where most won't feed someone like him even though he can shoot. In 33 minutes he took 3 threes. Where the team has shown more apt to let Nowell take bunches of shots in the past. Maybe they just don't see little mac all the way across court standing by himself.
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Re: Release JMac? 

Post#8 » by Jedzz » Sat Apr 3, 2021 9:04 pm

winforlose wrote:
In a season where the wolves are short on PGs they are simply not releasing an 80,000 dollar contract. Just isn’t going to happen. As for fairness to JMAC he just got a start last night. Will probably again tonight (assuming Rubio is out.) Every team needs cheap contracts with guys who can give you something. JMAC has flaws, but he is also young, he has a ceiling we would like for him to break through. Look at Omari Spellman. We wanted him, he didn’t want us, no one else wanted him, he fell of a cliff. I know it isn’t as simple as that, but my point is teams aren’t handing anyone minutes, especially an I drafted PG who cannot even get regular rotation minutes on the worst team in the league.

Bottom line, JMAC will hopefully resign with us, find more of a role and break through his ceiling. If not, there is always semi pro.


Have you not heard Finch say this offense doesn't need Point Guards to operate?
Has Edwards ever given you any indication that he needs a rest?
Nobody else could fill in as fake point guard when it's necessary?

You said bottom line hopefully he stays and "breaks through his ceiling". What ceiling is that? He broke through last year and nobody cares. There may be nothing he could do to change minds here and he's a worse fit now this season. What good is an 80k body if you don't need it?
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Re: Release JMac? 

Post#9 » by Jedzz » Sat Apr 3, 2021 9:22 pm

ClarkeW wrote:
I actually think releasing him would be the worst thing for him. At least here there is a possibility of him seeing the court sometimes if D’Lo takes a while longer to come back or if something happens to Rubio. Otherwise he’s just a FA PG who was cut by the worst team in the league... in a league filled with great PGs. Not a good position to be in.


Do you think other franchises believe the Timberwolves know what they are doing with the players they have? In one sense they might use that as a reason to never look at JMac. In another sense, they might see a way to use him much more.

80K isn't a lot for other teams to find out. From JMac's point of view, another team's 80k might at least be another chance to have his play respected in a way the Wolves seem not to.
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Re: Release JMac? 

Post#10 » by Jedzz » Sat Apr 3, 2021 9:26 pm

SO_MONEY wrote:C'mon. No.


Didn't you assure me once that he would have his twoway deal converted to at least a minimum by now?
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Re: Release JMac? 

Post#11 » by Note30 » Sat Apr 3, 2021 9:54 pm

Jedzz wrote:
ClarkeW wrote:
I actually think releasing him would be the worst thing for him. At least here there is a possibility of him seeing the court sometimes if D’Lo takes a while longer to come back or if something happens to Rubio. Otherwise he’s just a FA PG who was cut by the worst team in the league... in a league filled with great PGs. Not a good position to be in.


Do you think other franchises believe the Timberwolves know what they are doing with the players they have? In one sense they might use that as a reason to never look at JMac. In another sense, they might see a way to use him much more.

80K isn't a lot for other teams to find out. From JMac's point of view, another team's 80k might at least be another chance to have his play respected in a way the Wolves seem not to.



Like Clarke said the likelihood of it is so low.

Guards are a dime a dozen at JMac's level. There's plenty of film on JMac, unless they are blown away no sense in signing him.

I'm pretty sure he's not going to be waived, he seems like the perfect 15th man on the roster.
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Re: Release JMac? 

Post#12 » by Jedzz » Sat Apr 3, 2021 10:07 pm

Note30 wrote:I'm pretty sure he's not going to be waived, he seems like the perfect 15th man on the roster.


ok
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Re: Release JMac? 

Post#13 » by _AIJ_ » Sat Apr 3, 2021 11:06 pm

Jedzz wrote:
Note30 wrote:I'm pretty sure he's not going to be waived, he seems like the perfect 15th man on the roster.


ok

Why are you upset if someone doesnt value mclaughlin as high as you do?
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Re: Release JMac? 

Post#14 » by winforlose » Sat Apr 3, 2021 11:34 pm

Jedzz wrote:
winforlose wrote:
In a season where the wolves are short on PGs they are simply not releasing an 80,000 dollar contract. Just isn’t going to happen. As for fairness to JMAC he just got a start last night. Will probably again tonight (assuming Rubio is out.) Every team needs cheap contracts with guys who can give you something. JMAC has flaws, but he is also young, he has a ceiling we would like for him to break through. Look at Omari Spellman. We wanted him, he didn’t want us, no one else wanted him, he fell of a cliff. I know it isn’t as simple as that, but my point is teams aren’t handing anyone minutes, especially an I drafted PG who cannot even get regular rotation minutes on the worst team in the league.

Bottom line, JMAC will hopefully resign with us, find more of a role and break through his ceiling. If not, there is always semi pro.


Have you not heard Finch say this offense doesn't need Point Guards to operate?
Has Edwards ever given you any indication that he needs a rest?
Nobody else could fill in as fake point guard when it's necessary?

You said bottom line hopefully he stays and "breaks through his ceiling". What ceiling is that? He broke through last year and nobody cares. There may be nothing he could do to change minds here and he's a worse fit now this season. What good is an 80k body if you don't need it?


Last night when JMAC sat down in the third Ant proved he isn’t ready to run the offense. His handle was failing him, his BBIQ was failing him (jumping with no plan,) and his teammates were failing him (lack of off ball movement and spacing.) I firmly believe if we had Dlo or Rubio last night we win. JMAC is a solid third option. His 3 point shooting is good enough, his defense is a little below good enough but he makes up for it with crafty steals and general disruption. His ceiling is hard to quantify because it is everywhere at once. He needs to rebound his position better, score more, get more assists, play better defense, ect... that said, we are not talking about radical improvements, just incremental.

Back to your point about releasing him, there is no upside for either party. JMAC needs minutes and needs to impress other teams with those minutes for next season (assuming he leaves.) The wolves need people who can run the offense when Ant or Nowell are off the floor (neither does it well anyways.) We would need to sign someone new to replace him and that would take time and cost money as well.

Finally, it seems your valuation of him is inconsistent with the leagues. He was an RFA and no one made an offer. I doubt we would have turned down a second round pick for him but no one offered that either. With Covid and missing time his game will probably look worse before it looks better. I don’t see a winning team grabbing him and a losing team puts him back in the same boat. They would rather develop their up and comers than a third string PG who is undersized.
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Re: Release JMac? 

Post#15 » by Jedzz » Sun Apr 4, 2021 12:16 am

_AIJ_ wrote:
Jedzz wrote:
Note30 wrote:I'm pretty sure he's not going to be waived, he seems like the perfect 15th man on the roster.


ok

Why are you upset if someone doesnt value mclaughlin as high as you do?


We are discussing waiving him. Not sure where you see I care anymore what some of you think of him. This is about bothering to keep and play him.
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Re: Release JMac? 

Post#16 » by Note30 » Sun Apr 4, 2021 1:06 am

Jedzz wrote:
_AIJ_ wrote:
Jedzz wrote:
ok

Why are you upset if someone doesnt value mclaughlin as high as you do?


We are discussing waiving him. Not sure where you see I care anymore what some of you think of him. This is about bothering to keep and play him.


probably the passive-aggressive "ok" that tipped him off
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Re: Release JMac? 

Post#17 » by shrink » Sun Apr 4, 2021 1:25 am

SO_MONEY wrote:C'mon. No.

I agree with Jack Black here. MIN isn’t just releasing a useful backup PG on such a cheap salary.
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Re: Release JMac? 

Post#18 » by Jedzz » Sun Apr 4, 2021 1:28 am

Note30 wrote:
Jedzz wrote:
_AIJ_ wrote:Why are you upset if someone doesnt value mclaughlin as high as you do?


We are discussing waiving him. Not sure where you see I care anymore what some of you think of him. This is about bothering to keep and play him.


probably the passive-aggressive "ok" that tipped him off


Im never passive aggressive.

I just wanted to quote a portion to remove all the unneccesary commentary to focus on his point that he thinks he should be kept as he thought he should be #15 guy. If only he was the #15 guy with a #15 contract and not a fake #15 guy without a contract. I figured I would let someone else point that out...but we can't have a normal discussion due to all the ish in some of your heads.
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Re: Release JMac? 

Post#19 » by winforlose » Sun Apr 4, 2021 11:58 am

Jedzz wrote:
_AIJ_ wrote:
Jedzz wrote:
ok

Why are you upset if someone doesnt value mclaughlin as high as you do?


We are discussing waiving him. Not sure where you see I care anymore what some of you think of him. This is about bothering to keep and play him.


Worth noting he just got 41 minutes plus tonight. He started last night, and with Rubio out with back spasms and Dlo still out (and being on limited minutes when back,) JMAC will get tons of run. Add to that the Nowell ankle and we may need a 10 day just to fill the SG (unless we give culver more run.) JMAC is fine where he is.
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Re: Release JMac? 

Post#20 » by ClarkeW » Sun Apr 4, 2021 12:51 pm

Jedzz wrote:
ClarkeW wrote:
I actually think releasing him would be the worst thing for him. At least here there is a possibility of him seeing the court sometimes if D’Lo takes a while longer to come back or if something happens to Rubio. Otherwise he’s just a FA PG who was cut by the worst team in the league... in a league filled with great PGs. Not a good position to be in.


Do you think other franchises believe the Timberwolves know what they are doing with the players they have? In one sense they might use that as a reason to never look at JMac. In another sense, they might see a way to use him much more.

80K isn't a lot for other teams to find out. From JMac's point of view, another team's 80k might at least be another chance to have his play respected in a way the Wolves seem not to.


Does anybody believe the Wolves are a good front office? Interesting question. Maybe so, maybe not. I just think the chances of him catching on somewhere, let alone anywhere where he’d have a role larger than he has here, or basically zero. At least for the rest of this season.

I feel even more confident about this take now after her just played 40 mins last night. And it also proved his value to the team, in the sense that we can’t afford to cut him even if we were feeling generous and thought it would be better for the player.

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