Who will get the most credit for team success?

Post #1 » by **Klomp** » Tue Jul 26, 2022 8:14 pm

These things always fascinate me. Towns got little credit the first time in playoffs. More this time, but probably not as much as he deserved. Look at credit Wiggins got in GSW while Durant often got slandered for his impact to that franchise.

What do you think will happen for the 2022-23 Timberwolves?

winforlose · Post #2 » by **winforlose** » Tue Jul 26, 2022 8:29 pm

Klomp wrote:These things always fascinate me. Towns got little credit the first time in playoffs. More this time, but probably not as much as he deserved. Look at credit Wiggins got in GSW while Durant often got slandered for his impact to that franchise.

What do you think will happen for the 2022-23 Timberwolves?

KAT got less credit because when Jimmy got hurt we collapsed. A bad series against the Rockets didn’t help either. Ant is the guy the league wants to root for. Finch is the guy the league should root for. Gobert is the guy who came in and hopefully helped us climb the mountain. Dlo and KAT will always struggle to get their due. It’s not that they are bad, but they haven’t consistently lead teams to the promised land.

P.S I am hoping we resemble the KG Celtics champions team, where the bench really steps up and the team wins the title. Nowell is the guy I suspect will make or break the postseason, but time will tell.

Post #3 » by **Klomp** » Tue Jul 26, 2022 9:22 pm

winforlose wrote:
Klomp wrote:These things always fascinate me. Towns got little credit the first time in playoffs. More this time, but probably not as much as he deserved. Look at credit Wiggins got in GSW while Durant often got slandered for his impact to that franchise.

What do you think will happen for the 2022-23 Timberwolves?

KAT got less credit because when Jimmy got hurt we collapsed. A bad series against the Rockets didn’t help either. Ant is the guy the league wants to root for. Finch is the guy the league should root for. Gobert is the guy who came in and hopefully helped us climb the mountain. Dlo and KAT will always struggle to get their due. It’s not that they are bad, but they haven’t consistently lead teams to the promised land.

P.S I am hoping we resemble the KG Celtics champions team, where the bench really steps up and the team wins the title. Nowell is the guy I suspect will make or break the postseason, but time will tell.

It's just interesting to me that Towns' career narrative seems to be defined by what happened in his first playoff series in his third season in the league. Michael Jordan lost the first three playoff series he played in. It happens to even the best players. But only Towns seems to have it held so strongly against him.

Last year, it seemed like Towns was fourth in line at best for who received credit during the season. I think that also has to do with previous star failings within the franchise. Ant, Finch and Beverley were all new to the franchise, so they must be the ones who impacted the franchise the most. At least that's how a lot of people seem to want to look at it.

winforlose · Post #4 » by **winforlose** » Tue Jul 26, 2022 9:31 pm

Klomp wrote:
winforlose wrote:
Klomp wrote:These things always fascinate me. Towns got little credit the first time in playoffs. More this time, but probably not as much as he deserved. Look at credit Wiggins got in GSW while Durant often got slandered for his impact to that franchise.

What do you think will happen for the 2022-23 Timberwolves?

KAT got less credit because when Jimmy got hurt we collapsed. A bad series against the Rockets didn’t help either. Ant is the guy the league wants to root for. Finch is the guy the league should root for. Gobert is the guy who came in and hopefully helped us climb the mountain. Dlo and KAT will always struggle to get their due. It’s not that they are bad, but they haven’t consistently lead teams to the promised land.

P.S I am hoping we resemble the KG Celtics champions team, where the bench really steps up and the team wins the title. Nowell is the guy I suspect will make or break the postseason, but time will tell.

It's just interesting to me that Towns' career narrative seems to be defined by what happened in his first playoff series in his third season in the league. Michael Jordan lost the first three playoff series he played in. It happens to even the best players. But only Towns seems to have it held so strongly against him.

Last year, it seemed like Towns was fourth in line at best for who received credit. I think that also has to do with previous star failings within the franchise. Ant, Finch and Beverley were all new to the franchise, so they must be the ones who impacted the franchise the most. At least that's how a lot of people seem to want to look at it.

Some guys are doomed in that way. Part of it is bigs don’t get the same treatment as wings. Part of it is 2 playoff appearances in 7 years. Part of it is our franchise track record overall (it’s the wolves so it must be bad.) The play in game did him no favors. But the people who watch him, the people who understand our franchise, we get it. The problem is this thread is about the outside world, and the outside world doesn’t take the complicated answer, only the easy one.

KGdaBom · Post #5 » by **KGdaBom** » Tue Jul 26, 2022 9:35 pm

Ant will get the most credit because it's cool to give the credit to Ant.

fattymcgee · Post #6 » by **fattymcgee** » Wed Jul 27, 2022 1:31 am

The players always get the most credit, but it will depend on how each them them perform this year. Outsiders are quick to give a bad narrative to KAT so it will probably go to Ant or Rudy.

Last year KAT #1 and DLo #2 carried the Wolves to the playoffs, but they both had a few bad games in the playoffs so outsiders don't give them credit. They are going to have to be more consistent in the postseason if we want to go anywhere.

jscott · Post #7 » by **jscott** » Wed Jul 27, 2022 2:22 am

I will.

Biff Cooper · Post #8 » by **Biff Cooper** » Wed Jul 27, 2022 8:59 pm

Lets just hope they are successful. It isn't a foregone conclusion. I really don't care who gets the credit as long as they are successful. Championship teams have all of their individual members only looking at what they can do within the team's system to make the team better. Individual stats are a by-product of team success.

WolfAddict · Post #9 » by **WolfAddict** » Wed Jul 27, 2022 11:44 pm

jscott wrote:I will.

I'd like to be the first to thank you for your contributions brother! :wink:

King Malta · Post #10 » by **King Malta** » Thu Jul 28, 2022 4:19 am

Obviously the actual play of some of the players will influence exactly who gets how much credit, but if this is a highly competitive team I expect Gobert will draw most the plaudits.

The wider NBA's community with KAT seems to be almost personal. He's a well spoken, good natured, sensitive guy and that together with the way he's been portrayed either directly or indirectly by the likes of Butler, Green and Embiid has drawn some especially pointed negativity in my opinion. I can't see an uptick in the performance of the team being attributed mostly to him by a a community that has such a strong, seemingly personal, dislike for him.

Gobert cops his knocks but most of that are about his style of play and skillset, and how he's perceived to be a negative play-off influence. If he's able to turn that around and be demonstrably more effective when surrounded by a more suitable roster then I can see people being willing to heap praise on him. Whether fairly or not, Rudy seems to be perceived as having that 'dog' in him, the edge that's expected of top level players.

Mind you, if Ant comes out and is a near MVP level talent then he's getting absolutely all the credit. He's charismatic, has a lot of a swagger and, let's face it, is an aggressive, high usage guard. Fans and the media love the swagger and whether fair or not, fans always seem to gravitate more to the shot happy, flashy guard/wing types than they do big guys in the modern era.

shrink · Post #11 » by **shrink** » Thu Jul 28, 2022 4:22 am

It’s an interesting question

I don’t think it will be KAT. He always seems to get the blame for the failures of the team, and never gets credit for its successes. Even in the Jimmy year, Jimmy got all the credit, although Towns had a much better year than Jimmy. There aren’t any players in the NBA right now that can single-handedly make you a contender, so it was always an impossibly high bar that people set for KAT.

I hope Ant gets as much opportunity as he can handle, and a switch more to the 2 will give him a physical match up advantage nearly every night. My concern is that if Finch runs a two-man game often with DLO and Gobert, it might cost Ant development opportunities. But everyone loves Ant, so he might still get the most credit as his game improves.

I think Gobert, the newcomer, will get some credit, but it will be tepid, and usually followed by, “… but we’ll see if he’s as good in the playoffs!” The story that people repeat about Gobert in the playoffs isn’t true - he never got played off the floor, and the team was always much better when he was on instead of off. People also like to say, “two bigs can’t win in the modern NBA,” ignoring the success of BOS (Williams and Horford), the championship of MIL (Giannis and Lopez), and CLE’s surprising turnaround playing three bigs. But people tend to stick with their stories, so this will limit the amount of mid-season credit Gobert gets,

shangrila · Post #12 » by **shangrila** » Thu Jul 28, 2022 4:24 am

If the defence jumps to top 3 I’m sure national media will point to Gobert.

In terms of the fans I don’t know. I think Ant might still be a year away from consistently being the best guy night in night out so if KAT keeps up his play I’d give it to him.