A week after the trade

[SoSick]

How do you guys feel about it? At first i thought "Oh no not again Mchale" but after a few days i saw the benefits of this trade for minny. Here are some of my thoughts. .

1.Miller will be an asset for us (Either by staying here or through a trade)

2.Drafting Mayo would crowd our backcourt (we'll have Foye, McCants, Brewer and Mayo to develop)

3.Mayo and Foye are almost the same (PG/SG type player with star potential) and i still think Foye will prove doubters wrong with a healthy season

4.Love/Big Al frontcourt will be better defensively than Big Al/Gomes or Smith

BTW This is My 1st post

[B Calrissian]

I liked it then and I still like it now. Welcome to the board.

[deeney0]

Welcome to the board.

Trading for Love was better than drafting him at 3 outright. Miller should fit in well here. The trade dashes all hopes of making a splash in 2009 free agency, but opens up a possibility for an even bigger splash in 2010 IF they're frugal with the kind of contracts they doll out this year. If they keep Gomes, Telfair, and Smith for too long/too much, then one of the big appeals of this trade gets dashed.

Jefferson/Love is a short, slow defensive front court. The Wolves couldn't keep penetrating guards out of the lane last year, couldn't defend in transition, had crappy help defense. This trade doesn't address those problems much at all. Worse - the Wolves are locked into that front court for four years. Yes, Jefferson/Love is better than Jefferson/Gomes, but keeping Mayo and targeting a defensive big man next year (Thabeet, for example), would've addressed these issues a lot more.

I think a Mayo/Foye backcourt would've worked beautifully. I didn't see drafting Mayo as giving up on Foye at all, it was more a giving up on McCants thing - and he's still probably gone before the trade deadline.

After a week, I'm still not digging the trade. I wish Mayo was still here.

[prefuse73]

great first post. Welcome.

I agree with all your points and will add that Love and Big Al are going to be extremly tough to defend as well as being better defensively than AL/Gomes or Smith.

Not keeping Mayo also proved to Foye that the F.O. still believes in him. We need to see what this kid can do for a full year when healthy. I have a good feeling about it. It also leaves the door open for McCants to hopefully to the next step.

[Mcfale313]

I hate mchale as my name indicated......but not because of this trade...although i do think if we could get a backup pg such as Lowry or Crittenton the deal would be sweatter.

I think if we did keep Mayo, McCants would be traded for a big by now.

McHale, however, screwed up the wolves in several occasions in the past few years and this trade can't redeem himself fully from my mind.....

[DG4L]

I hated the trade on draft night and I still hate it now.

A Jefferson and Love front court on defense depresses me. I dread the thought of this franchise having to rebuild 3-4 years down the road again because of this mistake. They should have kept Mayo and built around him and Jefferson. That would have been a very nice, young inside-outside combo. Now, instead of pairing Jefferson up with a high potential, scoring guard that can play great defense, they're stuck with a PF that poorly compliments Big Al defensively (both are undersized, neither has great quickness). Say what you want about Mayo being small as well, but I'd rather be small in the back court than the front court.

I have nothing against Love but after watching the playoffs and seeing how far good defense took the Celtics and other great teams, it bugs me that the Wolves have totally disregarded that half of basketball with this trade. Trading the 3rd best prospect in the draft who also happens to be one of the top perimeter defenders in his class for Love (below average defender) and Miller (terrible defender) just frustrates the hell out of me.

[collin_k41]

Well, I thought I felt better about this trade before I read this thread. All these posts have so-called re-depressed me. I really don't think it'll be as bad as everybody before me say. My only worry is defense but I'm hoping that we can at least play average defense so our hopefully above average offense can make up for it. But really it's all speculation. I just want the season to start so we can start to get a first-hand view of how this all works out.

[prefuse73]

but keeping Mayo and targeting a defensive big man next year (Thabeet, for example), would've addressed these issues a lot more.

I have news for you, we can still target Thabeet next year and he would really fit nicely in a 3 man roation with love and jefferson.

This gives Foye a chance to be the "nice inside-outside" combo with Jefferson and we hold on to McCants and get Miller. Its a good trade period. Go be memphis fans if OJ does it for you....just like a few of you went to portland to follow roy.

Alot of you are jumping to huge conclusions about Big Al and Love's defensive capabilities. Love in particular is very smart and more athletic than initially thought...so give him a shot. He has great work ethic and he knows what he needs to do. Most importantly, he isn't going to force his way out like Mayo probably would have.

[deeney0]

Sure, Wolves can still target Thabeet next year, but they won't have Mayo's perimeter defense. OJ on the Wolves is what does it for me, so lay off the personal attacks. It is possible to have a civilized discussion about the trade even if people disagree about it, ya know.

I think Love and Jefferson might become adequate defensively eventually, but you just can't teach size and speed. They're both undersized, and they're both slow laterally. I don't think it's a stretch to at least voice concerns about this team's ability to keep opposing guards out of the paint, play transition defense, defend the pick and roll... this team might have to score 110 points a game to win. They might be capable of that in a few years, maybe, but buying into the trade so blindly reeks of homerism.

[GopherIt!]

duplicate entry

[GopherIt!]

A Jefferson and Love front court on defense depresses me. I dread the thought of this franchise rebuilding 3-4 years down the road again because of this mistake. They should have kept Mayo and built around him and Jefferson. That would have been a very nice, young inside-outside combo. Now instead of pairing Jefferson up with a high potential scoring guard that can play great defense, they're stuck with a PF that poorly compliments Big Al defensively. Say what you want about Mayo being small as well, but I'd rather be small in the backcourt than the front court.

I have nothing against Love but after watching the playoffs and seeing how far good defense took the Celtics and other great teams, it bugs me that the Wolves have totally disregarded that half of basketball with this trade. Trading the 3rd best prospect in the draft who also happens to be one of the top perimeter defenders in his class for Love (below average defender) and Miller (terrible defender) just frustrates the hell out of me.

I totally agree with you DG - and Deeney too. I was hoping we were going to build our squad similar to either Detroit or a lesser version of San Antonio with an emphasis on defensive play. I understand Cookie probably was out the door but even Ryan Gomes skillset seems redundant (and unneccessary) behind Love.

I'm also concerned that Big Al is going to be at greater risk of injury from banging against bigger centers (vs going against slightly smaller players at his natural PF position.) When we face guys like Yao, Bynum, Oden, Kaman & even grandpa Shaq, he is going to take a beating if/when he plays in the middle. Assuming he defends the PF slot, how is Love going to guard guys like Dirk, Gasol, Durant, TD & Boozer? From a defensive standpoint I don't think it is going to work out. Even if we can't find size, at least get a guy with the length to block shots and lateral quickness to provide good help defense.

Can we get Joakim Noah to smack talk and puff his way out of Chicago?

[Klomp]

I'm also concerned that Big Al is going to be at greater risk of injury from banging against bigger centers (vs going against slightly smaller players at his natural PF position.) When we face guys like Yao, Bynum, Oden, Kaman & even grandpa Shaq, he is going to take a beating if/when he plays in the middle. Assuming he defends the PF slot, how is Love going to guard guys like Dirk, Gasol, Durant, TD & Boozer? From a defensive standpoint I don't think it is going to work out. Even if we can't find size, at least get a guy with the length to block shots and lateral quickness to provide good help defense.

I don't understand this logic. If Al will struggle against Cs and you want him moved to PF, won't he struggle with the same guys you listed for Love?

[GopherIt!]

Yes, you are correct, we are probably no worse off defensively at the PF slot with Love instead of Al.. But here's the rub, with Love going against those guys and we now have Al at center to help him, except that help defense isn't likely ever going to be one of Al's strengths. Now if we had a defensive minded big man paired next to Al (or Love), he could help them against those guys in addition to not being a liability defensively at center. See what I'm sayin'?

[Vindicater]

I liked the trade on Draft night and i still like it now.

As someone who has not been a big fan of Mayo from the start I like that Mchale was able to get the guy he really wanted while alos adding an all-star talent in Mike Miller while also helping our fufture cap space.

Mchale finally made the RIGHT call

[karch34]

I hated the trade on draft night for all the reasons mentioned. I thought Al and Mayo would be a great tandem for years and you could build around accordingly.

I have warmed up to the trade a bit since I like Miller a lot, but still want him at SG with Gomes at SF. I also like getting rid of Jaric's contract. What would help me like this trade a lot more is a legitimate banger at C because I think you could play Al at C and Love at PF, but I wouldn't want it for major minutes. A real center makes the front court a strength, so we're not bad there now, but we're not good until another move is made. I can understand wanting to keep Gomes means he probably sees significant time at his best position (SF), so you need to find time for Brewer at SG as well as SF so dealing Mayo for a big probably made sense to the FO.

What I need to see to make the trade a potential success from a balance standpoint is Telfair and a big being signed in addtion to Gomes.

PG: Foye, Telfair
SG: Miller, McCants, Brewer
SF: Gomes, Brewer, Miller
PF: Love, Jefferson, Gomes
C: Jefferson, FA, Collins, Richard

That's really not a bad young lineup, but right now it needs some work.

[Vindicater]

So do we still take a punt on POB?

[deeney0]

There's POB talk in a couple other threads. What has been reported out of his workouts in Miami and Boston makes me think he's done in the NBA.

[sheefo13]

I think this trade simply means they are giving McCants one more year to develop into the player they wanted him to be. Love, while not being the best of defensive bigs, gives this team a great 2nd post and a good character guy. Love gives this team a Old school Sacromento Kings feel. This traded also indicated to me that they still need to develop Corey Brewer. Brewer will not be a star in this league, but I think they expect him to become a Tayshaun Prince type and not an oversized two.

The Miller part I feel was just a piece we picked up just to give some value to the roster.. An actual tradeable assest that this team could use. I am sure he will contribute but I find it hard to believe he is in our future plans.

One other thing I feel this trade did was put a lot of pressure on Foye. The wolves lose two guards in the trade in Mayo and Jaric. The Wolves don't lose as if they will keep Telfair. Meaning that regardless of which point guard is signed to come in, Foye will see a lot more time handling the ball, meaning he will have to learn how to actually play like a point guard, not a 2 that is bringing the ball up which he has done up to this point in his career.

[Mikchek]

lets be realistic here...big men are a lil bit harder to come by then small guys....we have been throwing around POB and he is only 2 more inches tall...hell shaq is only 7-1....

you also have to look at what if we don't get as good as mayo likes in the next few years....and the big markets come calling....do you think he will stay?...of course not?....so then we are SOL and get peanuts for him....I think Love with develop great and be a good player next to AL...plus with the addition of Miller we have a scoring punch...

what most of you dont understand who have been talking about trading McCants is that his value is low right now...really low so we wouldn't get much

[Klomp]

I find it funny that people are mad because we added an established veteran like Miller. All of you just expect us to keep the same 8 man core throughout the rebuilding process, maybe adding a rookie or two along the way every year. Guess what, ITS NOT GOING TO HAPPEN! Wake up from your video game world.

Very few teams, if any, can win with just extremely young players and no veterans. It just doesn't happen. If a young team is a good team, it needs established veterans around its young players.

Look at the Rays in baseball. For years, they tried to win with just young guys. It didn't happen. Once they got vets like Percival, Pena, etc, they started to figure it out and are now playing well.

Mike Miller is one of those veterans. He should be here to stay.