RealGM

Congratulations on a successful trade.

Due to Minnesota being over the cap, the 25% trade rule is invoked. Minnesota had to be no more than 125% plus $100,000 of the salary given out for the trade to be accepted, which did happen here. This trade satisfies the provisions of the Collective Bargaining Agreement.

Trade ID #4839172

Minnesota Trade Breakdown
Change in Team Outlook: +7.9 ppg, -6.0 rpg, and -3.0 apg.

Incoming Players
O.J. Mayo-20.6 ppg, 4.6 rpg, 2.3 apg in 39.2 minutes
Greg Buckner-0.9 ppg, 0.9 rpg, 0.4 apg in 6.5 minutes
Marko Jaric-1.8 ppg, 0.3 rpg, 1.3 apg in 7.2 minutes
Antoine Walker-8.0 ppg, 3.0 rpg, 0.0 apg in 20.7 minutes


Outgoing Players
Kevin Love-8.3 ppg, 6.0 rpg, 1.1 apg in 23.6 minutes
Jason Collins-1.4 ppg, 2.4 rpg, 1.0 apg in 14.5 minutes
Brian Cardinal-1.7 ppg, 1.0 rpg, 0.3 apg in 3.7 minutes
Mike Miller-12.0 ppg, 5.4 rpg, 4.6 apg in 35.1 minutes

Pipe dream

No way Memphis would be dumb enough to do that.

I wouldn't. The upgrade from Love to Mayo isn't worth losing our starting SG and C (Collins and Mike Miller), adding Jaric's third year, and returning Antoine Walker's negative influence on Al Jefferson.

Give Love a chance

the crap we rid ourselves of >>>> mayo. period. end of story.

I hate to be the negative one here, but I would do that trade. Sure we got rid of some bad contracts through the Mayo/Love trade but it wasn't as significant as a lot of people make it out to be. If I remember correctly, Jaric was the only player involved in the trade who had a contract that went past 2010, we did pick up a bad contract in Cardinal in exchange.

I think a person would have to be in denial to think that Mayo hasn't clearly separated himself from Kevin Love at this point, and its not about minutes either. Even the minutes that Love plays, he just looks outmatched much of the time. Going into the draft Mayo and Love were both considered two of the most pro ready prospects, but Love hasn't looked the part. I'm not saying that Love won't improve, because he will and he may be a fringe all star one day, but Mayo will improve as well. Miller has been another story, he's been underwhelming so far, and its clear that he does a lot of little things that help a team win, but I would still consider him a role player. So we really need to turn this extra cap space into a positive signing of a star player to come out on top.

As has been said before, Love doesn't make sense for this team, at least not as a starter. I would have preferred Brook Lopez, Eric Gordon, etc. over Love if those were my choices.

That being said, I think we need to recognize that a Jefferson/Love starting front court probably won't work, and we should look at good centers with legit size and defensive potential in the draft. A Jefferson/Thabeet/Love (off the bench) big man rotation is something worth looking into. I'd rather not try to force the Jefferson/Love front court though, its like trying to jam a square peg in a round hole.

the thing about mike miller though is hes a good trade piece to have at the deadline to get us something decent of a contending team

marko jaric and antione walker will pretty much get you nothing

Zeitgeister wrote:I hate to be the negative one here, but I would do that trade. Sure we got rid of some bad contracts through the Mayo/Love trade but it wasn't as significant as a lot of people make it out to be. If I remember correctly, Jaric was the only player involved in the trade who had a contract that went past 2010, we did pick up a bad contract in Cardinal in exchange.

I think a person would have to be in denial to think that Mayo hasn't clearly separated himself from Kevin Love at this point, and its not about minutes either. Even the minutes that Love plays, he just looks outmatched much of the time. Going into the draft Mayo and Love were both considered two of the most pro ready prospects, but Love hasn't looked the part. I'm not saying that Love won't improve, because he will and he may be a fringe all star one day, but Mayo will improve as well. Miller has been another story, he's been underwhelming so far, and its clear that he does a lot of little things that help a team win, but I would still consider him a role player. So we really need to turn this extra cap space into a positive signing of a star player to come out on top.

As has been said before, Love doesn't make sense for this team, at least not as a starter. I would have preferred Brook Lopez, Eric Gordon, etc. over Love if those were my choices.

That being said, I think we need to recognize that a Jefferson/Love starting front court probably won't work, and we should look at good centers with legit size and defensive potential in the draft. A Jefferson/Thabeet/Love (off the bench) big man rotation is something worth looking into. I'd rather not try to force the Jefferson/Love front court though, its like trying to jam a square peg in a round hole.

Just for fun(Not that it means anything), I wanted to see what pace adjusted stats Love would have if he were playing the same minutes as OJ. (Notice how I said pace adjusted, so i'm not implying that this is what he would average if he got OJ minutes)

In roughly 39 minutes per game, Love would be averaging 13.8 points and 10.1 rebounds.

I still want OJ though.

shrink wrote:I wouldn't. The upgrade from Love to Mayo isn't worth losing our starting SG and C (Collins and Mike Miller), adding Jaric's third year, and returning Antoine Walker's negative influence on Al Jefferson.

Give Love a chance

Who care's about the starting SG and C if you only win 20 games? I don't know how to quantify Antoine Walker's negative influence on Al Jefferson or if there even was one. All that being said, it's still too early to evaluate the trade properly. It still depends things like who we're able to get in free agency and if Mike Miller is contributing to a winning Timberwolves team 2 year from now or if he's traded for something useful.

walchy wrote:the crap we rid ourselves of >>>> mayo. period. end of story.

End of story? You've got to be kidding.

I don't think I do want to re-do it, Kevin Love is struggling, but he had some good games early, I feel like that's the true Kevin Love. He's lost his shot right now, but it'll come back.


And there's something weird about Mayo, he gets his numbers, I don't dispute that. But there's something about his game that bothers me when it comes to getting W's, both for USC and now for Memphis.

Maybe it's coincidences or maybe I'm trying to hard to not believe, but it still stands out to me.

the 2 games he played the fewest minutes and had his lowest shot attempts were the 2 biggest wins of the year for Memphis. Memphis is +5.5 with him off the floor. Rudy Gay can't find any sort of chemistry with him. He's -75 in net points when on the court.

Kevin Love is struggling horribly but he's still +2 in net points when on the court.

As a team the Wolves are +4.9 net pts per 100 possessions with a horribly struggling Kevin Love on the court. As a team the Grizzlies are -8.4 net pts per 100 possessions with Mayo on the court.

This is the data that I have, if it's flawed or I'm misinterpreting it, then tell me why.

We should of drafted Brook Lopez. Maybe. I don't know.

Interesting stuff Devilz. I'm convinced Love will be a good player in this league, he's just got a lot of learning to do.

can we quit this please its done.

If we re-did the trade, we not only lose Kevin Love (who just needs more time than mayo to get comfortable and thats not a crime), Mike Miller (who is a better all around player than mayo who is just a volume shooter) and Jason Collins, but we also would lose Foye as Mayo would render Foye to the bench as Mayo's back up as the two of them could not co-exist on the floor. It will also tell Foye that we don't believe in him anymore.

Yes, Mayo has been good. He puts up ton of shoot and the ball is in his hands most of the game. If Foye did the same thing and didn't worry about getting other people involved, he would be putting up the excact same numbers.

Give Love this season to get his feet wet and a summer to get in better shape and adjust, and I am confident that we will see a special player. Add an athletic big like Greg Monroe or Thabeet in draft and we will see a pretty dang good front court for the future.

Yeah, I'd take it back. I never would have done it. Mayo has all the tools to be a superstar. Kevin Love is better than he has showed this year, but he is no OJ Mayo.

And there's something weird about Mayo, he gets his numbers, I don't dispute that. But there's something about his game that bothers me when it comes to getting W's, both for USC and now for Memphis.

Maybe it's coincidences or maybe I'm trying to hard to not believe, but it still stands out to me.

the 2 games he played the fewest minutes and had his lowest shot attempts were the 2 biggest wins of the year for Memphis. Memphis is +5.5 with him off the floor. Rudy Gay can't find any sort of chemistry with him. He's -75 in net points when on the court.

Kevin Love is struggling horribly but he's still +2 in net points when on the court.

As a team the Wolves are +4.9 net pts per 100 possessions with a horribly struggling Kevin Love on the court. As a team the Grizzlies are -8.4 net pts per 100 possessions with Mayo on the court.

This is the data that I have, if it's flawed or I'm misinterpreting it, then tell me why.

I found some more data. Over the past three seasons, the Wolves are a -4.8 net pts as a team and -6.0 net pts in games that Wittman is the head coach. Coincidentally, they are also averaging exactly -6.0 net pts over the length of Kevin McHale's tenure as GM. Amazingly, they are also a precise -6.0 in games played under the ownership of Glen Taylor.

Wittman--> -6.0
McHale----> -6.0
Taylor ----> -6.0

As one can see, these numbers can be arranged as 666. Coincidence? I Think not.
That's what the Illuminati wants you to believe. This is the data that I have, if it's flawed
or I'm misinterpreting Angels and Demons, then tell me why.

Did we ever consider a Mayo + filler(cap relief) to New Jersey for Lopez, Richard Jefferson, and Sean Williams?

Obviously we wouldn't be in as good of a cap situation, but our rotation would be more set.

C - Lopez/Williams
PF - Jefferson/Madsen
SF - Jefferson/Gomes
SG - Brewer/McCants
PG - Foye/Telfair

Our defense would be a lot better, our weakness would be at backup PF, but a rotation of Lopez/Jefferson/Williams would work for me at the 4/5. Rebounding would be better. We wouldn't have this pipe dream of a FA coming here in '09 or '10 either, which would save fans stress.

We could even go big line-up of Lopez, Jefferson, Gomes, Jefferson, and Foye and just pound on teams, or go with Jefferson, Gomes, Jefferson, McCants, and Telfair and run on teams.

Our picks would allow us to fill out the rest of the roster and we'd have a chance at the play-offs this year.

Hindsight, I know. But while this thread exists...

john2jer wrote:Did we ever consider a Mayo + filler(cap relief) to New Jersey for Lopez, Richard Jefferson, and Sean Williams?

Obviously we wouldn't be in as good of a cap situation, but our rotation would be more set.

C - Lopez/Williams
PF - Jefferson/Madsen
SF - Jefferson/Gomes
SG - Brewer/McCants
PG - Foye/Telfair

Our defense would be a lot better, our weakness would be at backup PF, but a rotation of Lopez/Jefferson/Williams would work for me at the 4/5. Rebounding would be better. We wouldn't have this pipe dream of a FA coming here in '09 or '10 either, which would save fans stress.

We could even go big line-up of Lopez, Jefferson, Gomes, Jefferson, and Foye and just pound on teams, or go with Jefferson, Gomes, Jefferson, McCants, and Telfair and run on teams.

Our picks would allow us to fill out the rest of the roster and we'd have a chance at the play-offs this year.

Hindsight, I know. But while this thread exists...

why would NJ consider this? they have Harris and Carter as their starting backcourt and CDR as a prospect

They probably wouldn't have drafted CDR, if this was in the works. Remember, this would have been done at draft time this past year. Clearly Carter isn't part of their future, but I think Mayo is better than Bobby Simmons.

shrink wrote:I wouldn't. The upgrade from Love to Mayo isn't worth losing our starting SG and C (Collins and Mike Miller), adding Jaric's third year, and returning Antoine Walker's negative influence on Al Jefferson.

Give Love a chance

Please stop talking about Jason Collins like he matters. Thanks.