we get screwed because Memphis was too slow

[big3_8_19_21]

http://basketball.realgm.com/src_wireta ... de_sooner/

so...if Memphis had agreed to the trade 10 minutes earlier...we would have kept Chalmers...wow, that blows. Chalmers is certainly better than anyone we'll get with the 2 2nd rounders this year.

[TheFranchise21]

Edited, title was a little graphic.

[4ho5ive]

I thought this had something to do with D-Miles

[cpfsf]

I thought this had something to do with D-Miles

ditto, I even read that story an hour before posting this too

[shrink]

I guess I'm not so impressed by Chalmers.

Sure, he's turned out to be a good pick in the second round, but would he have this much "wow" factor if he was taken ten picks earlier. He has maybe the easiest job in the NBA -- PG next to Dwayne Wade. Wade is the play-maker, Wade is the scorer, and Wade even brings the ball up the court sometimes. Wade draws tons of defensive attention too. Chalmers didn't have a much competition at all for his starting role either.

I'm not saying he's a bad player -- not at all. He's legit, and that's an accomplishment with a second rounder, even in a loaded draft like 2008. However, I don't think that two years from now, many other than our biggest general complainers will care about Mario Chalmers.

And btw, its no guarantee Chalmers will be better than either second rounder, let alone both combined. In the last couple years, we've turned picks from MIA into Craig Smith and Pekovic. I tend to think of second rounders as crapshoots anyway, so who knows. Odds are in your favor, but two bites at the apple aren't bad.

[casey]

Sure Kev, if you say so.

[Devilzsidewalk]

what I don't understand is why trade w/ Miami? we own their 1st, we want them to do as poorly as possible. They were ready to go into the season w/ Chris Quinn and Banks and we throw them a life preserver

[big3_8_19_21]

shrink, you've said yourself that 90% of 2nd rounders turn out to be nothing, but Mario Chalmers was a projected 1st round pick. You can't expect to get someone better than that in the 2nd round. I mean trading him for 2 2nd round picks probably doesn't have a huge impact on our future, but in 3 years Chalmers will probably be the only one of those 3 picks still in the league.

[C.lupus]

McHale laid an egg.

I'm moving on.

[skorff26]

shrink, you've said yourself that 90% of 2nd rounders turn out to be nothing, but Mario Chalmers was a projected 1st round pick. You can't expect to get someone better than that in the 2nd round. I mean trading him for 2 2nd round picks probably doesn't have a huge impact on our future, but in 3 years Chalmers will probably be the only one of those 3 picks still in the league.

I think one of the main reasons we traded the pick was for the 2 million in cash that we got as well, and the additional 2nds probably weren't that much of an incentive for us.
We also can't blame McHale for trading chalmers (we can for trading mayo but that's for another time) since in reality he would have had no place on this team had we not traded mayo.

[big3_8_19_21]

which is why I included "because Memphis was too slow" in the title

[shrink]

You guys still feel we missed out on something great after tonight's game?

Read the MIA thread -- they are hating the guy, and some people even want him traded.

I think he's looked better than he is because he is playing next to Dwayne Wade, and carries a third of the responsibilities of other PG's.

[Flash is the Future]

He's hit the rookie wall now, but he's been great for us this season. His offense is coming along (10ppg on decent percentages), but his main value is as a great defensive PG, which is very necessary next to Dwyane Wade because he likes to roam. Miami needs their PGs to do 3 things: play good man defense, shoot 3s, and take care of the ball. Chalmers does all 3 of those well. Anything else is just a bonus. So I agree with shrink in that I don't think he'd be as good next to a different SG and I don't know that you guys missed out on him as much as we gained from him. Chalmers won't be traded though. 800k for a starting caliber PG in 2010 when there are very few PGs available? Almost irreplaceable.

[revprodeji]

Regardless of the view on Chalmers it was a poor trade. We do not need "more" picks. What we had was a pick in a very deep draft to take a player that would have likely been 20-25 range in this draft. Chalmers, Jordan, CDR, etc.

[shrink]

Can anyone remind me of our roster size if we had not done the MEM trade and signed a 2nd rounder? Is it possible we'd have cut our 2nd rounder due to roster limits?

I'm wondering if there was a chance we'd have ended up just cutting the guy. It's totally a guess, but it looks to me like Glen Taylor has said, "I bought out Juwon and bought out Hudson .. I'm done buying people out."

EDIT: I figured it out myself:

Foye, Telfair, Jaric
Mayo, McCants
Brewer, Carney, Buckner
Gomes, Craig Smith, Walker
Al Jefferson, Madsen, Booth

* I'm assuming they thought they could get Telfair, Gomes, and Smith to the cheaper contracts at the time, and they wanted to keep the experience they had already gained playing with the other Wolves. McHale seems to mention this in his statement, regarding his plans at the time to bring back Telfair. To be fair though, he could have passed on any of the three cheap contracts if he signed the 2nd.

That's 14, so #15 would come down to the 2nd, keeping Chris Richard, or signing a Free Agent. Center looks incredibly bare to me. I suppose the Wolves could have used the slot and the 2nd to draft a center, but I don't know how much one would be able to help. CDR and guys like that wouldn't have solved the problem.

[Devilzsidewalk]

regardless of the Mayo trade, it was a clear mis-evaluation of Chalmers' ability; if they knew Chalmers was good, then they wouldn't want to bring Telfair back as a lesser PG, but at 3x the salary. It doesn't make any sense. So when they say "well, if we kept Mayo we'd have to cut Chalmers because we wanted to bring Telfair back".... etc, that doesn't add up because Chalmers is a better and cheaper PG, they just didn't know that - and that's the real problem.

During the draft, they didn't have Telfair yet, they could've drafted Chalmers and let Telfair walk, so they obviously thought Telfair>Chalmers, and thats what sucks so much, another swing and a miss in talent evaluation. I remember how intently I was watching the end of the 1st round that day and the 2nd and 3rd picks of the second round and how happy I was to see that Chalmers/CDR/and Jordan were all still available. We ended up w/ Chalmers and I was relatively pleased. Then...DAGGERZ!!! That trade was a low blow.

They'll probably do it again this year, Sam Young or T Williams or somebody that could help us will be available, but the pick will be sold off for firewood to heat the Target Center.

[revprodeji]

I like Telfair better than Chalmers.

They are only a year apart.
Chalmers is a good defensive player, and gets plenty of steals, but does nothing on offense. Wade does it all.
Bassy is a superior ballhandler. He is improving and has had games that we won because of him. His "pg" skills are miles away from Chalmers.

Chalmers is a rookie, but he was seasoned in college. Bassy was a HS guard and is taking time. He currently plays 10min a game less than Chalmers and has better PG stats. At worse it is a coin-flip, but I think Bassy is a better pg.

[Jonathan Watters]

You folks are downright mind-boggling.

I mean, who needs another good young player when we can trade him to a team that desperately need a player at that position and whose pick we own next year?

Our future is set with such soon to be All-NBA'ers like Randy Foye, Rodney Carney and Kevin Love, so no need to stockpile, right?

(...at least not in the incredible 2008 draft, when we can stockpile in the horrible 2009 draft and then just cut all the players who will be even less capable of competing with Sebastian Telfair and Mark Madsen for a place in the team's future...)

What a bunch of nay-saying haters we are!

[Jonathan Watters]

I like Telfair better than Chalmers.

They are only a year apart.
Chalmers is a good defensive player, and gets plenty of steals, but does nothing on offense. Wade does it all.
Bassy is a superior ballhandler. He is improving and has had games that we won because of him. His "pg" skills are miles away from Chalmers.

Chalmers is a rookie, but he was seasoned in college. Bassy was a HS guard and is taking time. He currently plays 10min a game less than Chalmers and has better PG stats. At worse it is a coin-flip, but I think Bassy is a better pg.

Funny how the only aspect of the players' games you directly compare is the ONE thing Telfair does better than Chalmers. Things like shooting and defense are just little footnotes in the grand game of basketball, apparently.

Even more ironic that IN THE VERY SAME POST, you go on to imply that Telfair has more upside because he came straight out of HS. Nevermind that he hasn't made a major improvement to his game since he was 12, and probably had his hallowed "PG" skills long before then. Never mind that it is CHALMERS that is learning the new position, having been the THIRD ballhandler for much of his time with the Jayhawks.

My goodness...

[john2jer]

I'm not willing to jump up and down about the greatness of Chalmers, I think he greatly benefits from playing next to Wade, but I think potential-wise he's going to have a better career than Telfair. Seabass is what he is. He's not going to change. As the NBA comes easier to Chalmers and he learns his role better, he's going to become very solid. He won't be an all-star, but more of a Derrick Fischer level of point guard, and there's nothing wrong with that. In fact he plays very similar to Fischer.