Game Thread: Timberwolves vs Nets - 11/5/14 7:30pm

[Keith Van Horn]

Guys, let's not over-analyze this one too much. We had too many TOs, JJ was in foul trouble early, and Brook was so off tonight. Brook will rebound, just give him some time. He should have a much better game against Dalembert on Friday.

he is in his 7th year. im done waiting for him to rebound... and rebounding was the least of his issues.

we should have easily overcome all the things you mentioned. minnesota at home should be a double digit win

haha I actually didn't mean literally he will rebound for us... I meant more score his scoring and efficiency will improve. I don't expect him to average more than 6 rebounds a game this year actually.

[MGrand15]

We've got a strong team imo. This loss was just a case of one player being unusually off (Lopez), and some sloppy play (too many fouls, too many TOs). All of those things can easily be improved upon.

if one player being really off and playing sloppy causes you to lose against a bad team while playing at home then things probably arent all as great as they appear. you should easily be able to overcome a bad game from one of your top players at home against the wolves.

we had issues on both ends last night, and in the last 4 minutes they made all the plays to win and we made all the plays to lose, kind of embarassing since the wolves led the league in losses decided by 4 points or less. they arent good in close games, or at least havent been.

2-2 and we have basically played 4 garbage teams. the celtics are the best team we played so far and they kind of waxed us. 2 big tests coming up:

knicks - they have owned us since coming to BK and have blown us out a bunch of times recently
Magic - they play hard, bully us, and embarassed us and have size to match lopez

wecoume out 2-0 and all is good. we come out 0-2 and we are looking alot like last years team to start the season

One player being really off, our best player in foul trouble and the entire team being sloppy is normally why good teams lose to bad teams. I'd be worried if one player was off and we played sloppy and we got blown out. That didn't happen. We were tied 91-91 with the ball and then we turned it over back to back times. That's a fluke. Not taking away from Minnesota, they deserved it but most of the time, we at least get a shot up.

Not sure why you love the Magic so much. Every team plays hard to start the year. They don't play exceptionally hard or have exceptional size.

Last years 4 game sample size doesn't mean much. It's about what happened after that. 2-12 over our next 14 games. TERRIBLE losses and point differentials too. Not sure if your predicting the same thing but I'd bet a lot of money that the same thing isn't going to happen.

[CalamityX12]

Anyone else think we'd be a much better team with his twin brother manning the center position instead of brook?

Not without a scoring PF IMO....

[Prokorov]

We've got a strong team imo. This loss was just a case of one player being unusually off (Lopez), and some sloppy play (too many fouls, too many TOs). All of those things can easily be improved upon.

if one player being really off and playing sloppy causes you to lose against a bad team while playing at home then things probably arent all as great as they appear. you should easily be able to overcome a bad game from one of your top players at home against the wolves.

we had issues on both ends last night, and in the last 4 minutes they made all the plays to win and we made all the plays to lose, kind of embarassing since the wolves led the league in losses decided by 4 points or less. they arent good in close games, or at least havent been.

2-2 and we have basically played 4 garbage teams. the celtics are the best team we played so far and they kind of waxed us. 2 big tests coming up:

knicks - they have owned us since coming to BK and have blown us out a bunch of times recently
Magic - they play hard, bully us, and embarassed us and have size to match lopez

wecoume out 2-0 and all is good. we come out 0-2 and we are looking alot like last years team to start the season

One player being really off, our best player in foul trouble and the entire team being sloppy is normally why good teams lose to bad teams. I'd be worried if one player was off and we played sloppy and we got blown out. That didn't happen. We were tied 91-91 with the ball and then we turned it over back to back times. That's a fluke. Not taking away from Minnesota, they deserved it but most of the time, we at least get a shot up.

Not sure why you love the Magic so much. Every team plays hard to start the year. They don't play exceptionally hard or have exceptional size.

Last years 4 game sample size doesn't mean much. It's about what happened after that. 2-12 over our next 14 games. TERRIBLE losses and point differentials too. Not sure if your predicting the same thing but I'd bet a lot of money that the same thing isn't going to happen.

im not high on the magic, i think they are terrible. but its more about the matchup, they play like a bunch of bulldogs. teams that are gritty and play hard always give us trouble because we struggle to match their intensity level. we can beat them, but its going to be rough. and vucevic has the size to match lopez.

im not saying we will start 2-12. my point was people are saying they are encouraged by the first 4 games and how its better start then last year but comparing it to the first 4 games last year we really havent been any better.

i dont really see how we should be super encouraged by anything we have seen other the maybe Dwills health and hollins coaching. still alot of flaws. i dont see it all doom and gloom, i think we still win 43ish games, but nothing beyond that and mainly due to stuff like losing to horrible teams at home.

you can say we didnt play well, but i mean, neither did they

[C-Dub47]

They scored 9 straight points to win the game...Disgusting.

yup, and they are a team that has been TERRIBLE in close games and games decided by 4 or less. they blew so many of those last year. to lose a tight one to them at home is just beyond disappointing

To be fair, that was last year, and that team was a completely different team and had a different coach. Last year, it was all about Love. This year, it's more of a team effort and Rubio is leading the team.

[JudBuchler]

This is the slowest team ever .

Deron..Slow
JJ...Slow,lethargic mostly kind of slow
Mirza,Bogs...slow
KG...slow as hell at this point in his career. was once very quick
Lopez...slowest player in the nba
Jack..slow
Anderson..slow

the fastest player on the team is probably mason plumlee

Minnesotas player are fast and athletic, bad matchup for brooklyn to say the least

[Prokorov]

This is the slowest team ever .

Deron..Slow
JJ...Slow,lethargic mostly kind of slow
Mirza,Bogs...slow
KG...slow as hell at this point in his career. was once very quick
Lopez...slowest player in the nba
Jack..slow
Anderson..slow

the fastest player on the team is probably mason plumlee

Minnesotas player are fast and athletic, bad matchup for brooklyn to say the least

slow isnt really an issue as long as you are also big and excel in the half court. which the nets do. joe johnson isnt slow, but he still beasts on people.

wolves arent a bad matchup at all and your speed and athleticism wasnt the reason you won and really gave us no trouble. we outscored you in fastbreak points and you didnt have many points at all on drives or lobs or second chances.



pek and martin did most of the damage... and that was on jumpers and post play.

[Trader_Joe]

If you are quick and can run, you beat the slow footed Nets defenders (everyone in our 10 man rotation other than Anderson and Plumlee) down the court and score an easy basket. It's the easiest shot there is. We cannot get into a running game because we aren't quick, nor do we create many opportunities to do so. Most our guys have questionable finishing ability unlike say a Wiggins, Young, Dieng, Brewer who can all jump high and dunk hard.... Especially relative to us

If I had to guess, that will Flip's plan while I don't think Hollins will want us to do that. Its game 2 of 3 this week and he's been logging the guys big minutes, along with a lot of running in practice.

Thus, because I'm assuming they will push it and it will be their game plan, I simply don't think we can allow them to execute it. They will also pound it into Pekovic and test Brook early on IMO. I'm not as worried about that since Brooks post D is good.

As i said... the wolves dont run. and when they do, its pretty ugly. they did nearly all their damage in the half court and at the FT line. just 11 fast break points and several turnovers on the break. we outscored them in fast break points 16-11.

brooks post D...

As I said this is a team that scared the crap out of me. Young, quick, athletic and their speed let to better shots in open court, half court and far superior defense to ours. We weren't going to blow out this team like you said, because they would be a playoff team in the East.

And yes Brook has looked awful on O and D ..shocking that he would in his first 57 minutes since last December. He's out of shape, lost weight, out of sync and looks slower than ever. Notice how Pek did most his damage in the 2nd half since Brook was fatigued. 2 FG in the first half for Pek towards his 5-12 night.


BTW where are you getting your numbers?
ESPN says they won the FB points 14-11.

[MrDollarBills]

I still can't get over how god awful offensively Lopez was to start that game

He needs to get his touches within the flow of offense. Either move the ball around, run the pick and roll, or give the ball to Joe and move the hell out of the way. Lopez should NOT be force fed we got off to a horrible start because he was garbage against Pek

[2Mas]

I don't understand why is the "Duncan is in a great situation" argument used against him. Duncan has pretty much done the most he could have with his situation. They've NEVER missed the playoffs, they've won the championship 5 times, and they're favorites to win it all again this season. Has Duncan underachieved by any means for people to use the argument "oh he's in a great situation"? Like just because Duncan has been in a great situation means that you take credit away from him, even though he has had incredible success? Even though he has been an integral part of that great success?

What does underachieving have to do with being in a great situation? He was been on good teams his entire career. Whether he underachieved depends on who your talking to. Not winning a championship despite being a top seed can be considered underachieving. I"m not saying it is, but it can be looked at that way.

TD's an all time great. Top 5 pf ever, there is no right or wrong answer. It just the "TD is better than KG because he has 4 more rings" argument in ridiculous.

The spurs worst record was 47-35 in the 90's before TD got there (besides the year they tanked). The previous 3 years before their winning % was .671, .756 & .720. They were a contending team before him. You throw an all time PF in that mix & yeah it's not surprising that they won a few chips.

I'm not even saying Garnett is better, i'm saying that if TD is in discussion for best PF ever, KG is too. Yeah TD has more longevity cause Duncan was part of the spurs that made them great. KG was the Wolves. Without him they're the worst team in the league. Spurs without TD suck, but they had other all stars.

He is arguable the biggest reasons for SAS's success. But they were successful before him & will be after him. That organization is top notch. Everyyear picking studs at the end of the draft. Hell MINNY didn't even have 1st round picks for years because their FO is so stupid. Man They can go down TD-1 KG-2 all time & I have no problem with it. Just when ppl disrespect KG for something that was way bigger than him is stupid.

[Prokorov]

As I said this is a team that scared the crap out of me. Young, quick, athletic and their speed let to better shots in open court, half court and far superior defense to ours. We weren't going to blow out this team like you said, because they would be a playoff team in the East.

no, they absolutely would not be a playoff team in the east. they would be an awful sub .500 team like they will in the west. beating us doesnt change that just liek orlando beating us by 30 last year didnt make orlando any good.

and their speed did nothing, we outscored them in transition 16-11. where they outplayed us was in the half court. We should have blown them out... or at least won by double digits. we had a ton of unforced turnovers, and tons of dumb lazy fouls.

And yes Brook has looked awful on O and D ..shocking that he would in his first 57 minutes since last December. He's out of shape, lost weight, out of sync and looks slower than ever. Notice how Pek did most his damage in the 2nd half since Brook was fatigued. 2 FG in the first half for Pek towards his 5-12 night.

this isnt something new for brook. he has been a soft pansy who plays terrible defense for a while. i dont care about his 5-12. he will eventually make those easy shots... thats rust. but the D and horrible bbiq, and slowness is nothing new and wont change

BTW where are you getting your numbers?
ESPN says they won the FB points 14-11.

yahoo sports

[Prokorov]

I still can't get over how god awful offensively Lopez was to start that game

He needs to get his touches within the flow of offense. Either move the ball around, run the pick and roll, or give the ball to Joe and move the hell out of the way. Lopez should NOT be force fed we got off to a horrible start because he was garbage against Pek

its still crazy to me how we dont run the offense through johnson in the post. good things always happen once we do. after what he did to toronto and how well he played even with lebron on him vs the heat you'd think we'd be going to him instead of lopez or letting KG that 20 foot jumpers early in the clock

[Trader_Joe]

As I said this is a team that scared the crap out of me. Young, quick, athletic and their speed let to better shots in open court, half court and far superior defense to ours. We weren't going to blow out this team like you said, because they would be a playoff team in the East.

no, they absolutely would not be a playoff team in the east. they would be an awful sub .500 team like they will in the west. beating us doesnt change that just liek orlando beating us by 30 last year didnt make orlando any good.

and their speed did nothing, we outscored them in transition 16-11. where they outplayed us was in the half court. We should have blown them out... or at least won by double digits. we had a ton of unforced turnovers, and tons of dumb lazy fouls.

And yes Brook has looked awful on O and D ..shocking that he would in his first 57 minutes since last December. He's out of shape, lost weight, out of sync and looks slower than ever. Notice how Pek did most his damage in the 2nd half since Brook was fatigued. 2 FG in the first half for Pek towards his 5-12 night.

this isnt something new for brook. he has been a soft pansy who plays terrible defense for a while. i dont care about his 5-12. he will eventually make those easy shots... thats rust. but the D and horrible bbiq, and slowness is nothing new and wont change

BTW where are you getting your numbers?
ESPN says they won the FB points 14-11.

yahoo sports

They were 17-13 against the East last year (40-42 overall) and they look like a better team this year (they better at every position other than PF and even then Young may fit this team better). They've been playing teams tough and again you were wrong that we were going to blow them out.
They narrowly lost at Memphis and Chicago (5 total points), while winning vs Detroit... And took it to us.
Meanwhile let's remember.. I was the one right basically trying to tell people we were going to lose or struggle against this team, while you were wrong.

We shouldn't have blown them out because their defense was too much for us and forced many of those turnovers and fouls. I also think they did beat us in transition points as ESPN said. They were much quicker on the break than us since we don't "run" on the fastbreak.

Meanwhile Brook has been a good post defender for a couple years. He held his own in the 1st, but was clearly exhausted in the 2nd when Pek abused him. His D was fine in PS and Adams couldn't do anything against him the other night. It's the pick and roll and guards that exploit him. Had he been in game shape and not down 15 pounds I don't think Pekovic would have had the good fourth quarter. Right now he is slower than ever despite his weight loss, which again points to a lack of conditioning.

[Prokorov]

They were 17-13 against the East last year (40-42 overall) and they look like a better team this year (they better at every position other than PF and even then Young may fit this team better). They've been playing teams tough and again you were wrong that we were going to blow them out.

That was last year... you know before they lost a top 10 player. but hey, no biggie, not like that matters or anything

We shouldn't have blown them out because their defense was too much for us and forced many of those turnovers and fouls. I also think they did beat us in transition points as ESPN said. They were much quicker on the break than us since we don't "run" on the fastbreak.

their defense wasnt good at all. we got wide open looks all night. and more then half our turnovers where unforced (silly offensive fouls on illegal screens, stepping out of bounds in the corner on 3pt attempts, passes out of bounds to no one, etc).

yahoo or espn... whoever is right both numbers would indicate they didnt hurt us on the fast break. whether they had 14 or 11 thats a really low number either way.

Meanwhile Brook has been a good post defender for a couple years. He held his own in the 1st, but was clearly exhausted in the 2nd when Pek abused him. His D was fine in PS and Adams couldn't do anything against him the other night. It's the pick and roll and guards that exploit him. Had he been in game shape and not down 15 pounds I don't think Pekovic would have had the good fourth quarter. Right now he is slower than ever despite his weight loss, which again points to a lack of conditioning.

Well you know my stance on preseason, so ill just agree to disagree on anything regarding that.

Post defense - again, how many back to the basket post up bigs are there? Steven Adams? is shutting him down some kind of achievement? the guy who averaged 3 points a game last year and 9 points a game this year? i like adams alot, but he isnt some offensive force.

last night isnt some isolated event. lopez has been the same slow, low iq, poor defensive rebounding, slow rotating, bad pnr, player who gards finish over and around consistently on his entire career

[Trader_Joe]

They were 17-13 against the East last year (40-42 overall) and they look like a better team this year (they better at every position other than PF and even then Young may fit this team better). They've been playing teams tough and again you were wrong that we were going to blow them out.

That was last year... you know before they lost a top 10 player. but hey, no biggie, not like that matters or anything

We shouldn't have blown them out because their defense was too much for us and forced many of those turnovers and fouls. I also think they did beat us in transition points as ESPN said. They were much quicker on the break than us since we don't "run" on the fastbreak.

their defense wasnt good at all. we got wide open looks all night. and more then half our turnovers where unforced (silly offensive fouls on illegal screens, stepping out of bounds in the corner on 3pt attempts, passes out of bounds to no one, etc).

yahoo or espn... whoever is right both numbers would indicate they didnt hurt us on the fast break. whether they had 14 or 11 thats a really low number either way.

Meanwhile Brook has been a good post defender for a couple years. He held his own in the 1st, but was clearly exhausted in the 2nd when Pek abused him. His D was fine in PS and Adams couldn't do anything against him the other night. It's the pick and roll and guards that exploit him. Had he been in game shape and not down 15 pounds I don't think Pekovic would have had the good fourth quarter. Right now he is slower than ever despite his weight loss, which again points to a lack of conditioning.

Well you know my stance on preseason, so ill just agree to disagree on anything regarding that.

Post defense - again, how many back to the basket post up bigs are there? Steven Adams? is shutting him down some kind of achievement? the guy who averaged 3 points a game last year and 9 points a game this year? i like adams alot, but he isnt some offensive force.

last night isnt some isolated event. lopez has been the same slow, low iq, poor defensive rebounding, slow rotating, bad pnr, player who gards finish over and around consistently on his entire career

Which is why I mentioned
a. They are better at every position this year
b. Young may actually be a better fit.

They've since added Young, Bennett, Mo Williams, and Andrew Wiggins to make up for Love's loss.
They are far from an awful team as their results this year shows, losing by 1 in Chicago and by 4 in Memphis.. both those teams are pretty good.

You clearly underestimated them. They will probably finish with a winning record against the East again and I stand by the fact they could make the playoffs in the East or at least fight for the 8th seed. Last night was basically like losing to Atlanta or NY or other Eastern fringe playoff teams.

And I mentioned Adams, since he tried repeated early on and was probably 0-4 when he tried to post him up. He had been beasting in PS and wanted to see if he could and he could not.

[Prokorov]

Which is why I mentioned
a. They are better at every position this year
b. Young may actually be a better fit.

Better at every position? they lost a top 10 player! are you REALLY going to insinuate that Young is better then love and/or is a better fit? that is just beyond riddicluous.

also how are they better at every position when they are returning 3 starters? at most they are better at 2 positions.

They've since added Young, Bennett, Mo Williams, and Andrew Wiggins to make up for Love's loss.
They are far from an awful team as their results this year shows, losing by 1 in Chicago and by 4 in Memphis.. both those teams are pretty good.

a loss is a loss. they all count the same, and they will pile up for them. they replaced Love with a bunch of role players. they are going to be worse. they wont sniff 40 wins.

You clearly underestimated them. They will probably finish with a winning record against the East again and I stand by the fact they could make the playoffs in the East or at least fight for the 8th seed. Last night was basically like losing to Atlanta or NY or other Eastern fringe playoff teams.

nah, they are an awful awful team. one of the 8 or 10 worst in the league. they dont do anything well. early on its not unsual for bad teams to get some wins. look at how philly and orlando started last season for example.

And I mentioned Adams, since he tried repeated early on and was probably 0-4 when he tried to post him up. He had been beasting in PS and wanted to see if he could and he could not.

a bad player trying to do something he is good at and failing shouldnt be something you praise the defense for. thats like watching josh smith chuck up a bunch of bricks from three and then giving props to your perimeter defense

again... preseason. worthless.

[Trader_Joe]

Which is why I mentioned
a. They are better at every position this year
b. Young may actually be a better fit.

Better at every position? they lost a top 10 player! are you REALLY going to insinuate that Young is better then love and/or is a better fit? that is just beyond riddicluous.

also how are they better at every position when they are returning 3 starters? at most they are better at 2 positions.

They've since added Young, Bennett, Mo Williams, and Andrew Wiggins to make up for Love's loss.
They are far from an awful team as their results this year shows, losing by 1 in Chicago and by 4 in Memphis.. both those teams are pretty good.

a loss is a loss. they all count the same, and they will pile up for them. they replaced Love with a bunch of role players. they are going to be worse. they wont sniff 40 wins.

You clearly underestimated them. They will probably finish with a winning record against the East again and I stand by the fact they could make the playoffs in the East or at least fight for the 8th seed. Last night was basically like losing to Atlanta or NY or other Eastern fringe playoff teams.

nah, they are an awful awful team. one of the 8 or 10 worst in the league. they dont do anything well. early on its not unsual for bad teams to get some wins. look at how philly and orlando started last season for example.

And I mentioned Adams, since he tried repeated early on and was probably 0-4 when he tried to post him up. He had been beasting in PS and wanted to see if he could and he could not.

a bad player trying to do something he is good at and failing shouldnt be something you praise the defense for. thats like watching josh smith chuck up a bunch of bricks from three and then giving props to your perimeter defense

again... preseason. worthless.

Did you not read my initial post as it was clear I forgot to say at PF?
("they better at every position other than PF and even then Young may fit this team better")

Rubio is better than last year because of experience and Mo Williams is better than Barrea/Shved
Martin is the same, but they have Mohammed playing well at SG not to mention Lavine, Brewer and Budinger.
Wiggins adds a major dimension at SF.
Pekovic is probably as good or better than last year plus they have Dieng in his 2nd year.

That is every position other than PF.. where Thad again may be a better fit, especially on D and because he can run.

Meanwhile, if you go to the GB lots of people have been singing this team's praises.. not just me.