2017 Nets Offseason Thread II

[antique0o0]

Nah, RHJ won't get 17 millions extension. No way.

he will get 15-20 million barring serious injury.

it might not be an extension, it might be an RFA offer sheet. but he is a lock to get that. people focus to much on shooting and forget the preimium the leauge puts on elite wing/forward defenders

How much is Iguodala better than RHJ?
How much did iguodala get for his new contract?
And don't forget that Iguodala is on a championship team, teams like that usually overpay their key role player.
How much do you think Green from the Spurs will get for his next contract?

[All Nets]

i like option C:

-dont sign porter.
-add picks/young players via taking on salary dumps
-trade RHJ if you
-Continue forward with the core o Lin/Dlo/Levert/RHJ/Allen

dont tank. tanking never works and would completely destroy the culture we built. probably leads to marks and or kenny being let go or going elsewhere in a few years.

Lin is expendable with D'lo and Levert here, his age doesn't match the teams window. I doubt he get's a big offer on the open market because almost every team has a point guard or is developing one.

Lin is this teams leader. he is critical for the mentoring and development of young guys. he is worth keeping. especially since he probably doesnt bring back the value worth it in a trade

Agree with you regarding the mentorship.

This upcoming season, Lin will be the team leader. He's the incumbent for team captain after Brook's departure (unlikely it goes to Skil or RHJ) and he'll have to live up to it. He cannot afford another injury riddled season and be thought of as this team's leader going forward (picks up player option or extension).

D'Lo and Levert will have some pressure to further develop their game, but I wouldn't expect them to be the voice of the team, at least not yet. Ideally both can grow into leaders on the court.

[antique0o0]

Nah, RHJ won't get 17 millions extension. No way.

he will get 15-20 million barring serious injury.

it might not be an extension, it might be an RFA offer sheet. but he is a lock to get that. people focus to much on shooting and forget the preimium the leauge puts on elite wing/forward defenders

And even if there are teams who are willing to pay defensive wings, they will probably want to pay players who have proven themselvels useful in playoff series, not defensive wings who have never appeared in one playoff game.

[Curns13]

I don't get the people who wanna bring in JaMychal Green at $13M. We already have a power forward who is better on this roster and he is 5 years younger and will cost $22M less over the next 2 years. Other than pure shooting, RHJ is equal to or better than Green in pretty much every statistical category.

Look at their PER 36 numbers for the whole of last season:
RHJ - 13.8ppg, 9.2rpg, 3.1apg, 1.7spg, 0.9bpg, PER 13.7
Green - 11.8ppg, 9.3rpg, 1.4apg, 0.8spg, 0.6bpg, PER 13.5

When you look at RHJ's PER 36 numbers post All Star game where he became the full time starting PF (yes small sample size) compared to Green's season long starter numbers things get even more interesting.

RHJ - 15.3ppg, 10.7rpg, 2.7apg, 1.8spg, 1.0bpg, PER 16.25
Green - 11.8ppg, 9.3rpg, 1.4apg, 0.8spg, 0.6bpg, PER 13.50

When they played on March 6:
RHJ - 12 points, 4 rebounds, 2 assists, 3 steals, 1 block in 23 minutes
Green - 9 points, 9 rebounds, 0 assists, 0 steals, 0 blocks in 26 minutes

I just don't get it. The only thing I can think of is people are still stuck in the "RHJ is too small to be a PF" which is absolutely bogus. He has identical measurements to Draymond Green and with a couple of summers in the gym can put on the required muscle. He has never has an off season preparing to be a PF and yet when he was moved there mid season he significantly outperformed the guy some of you wanna bring in and pay 6 times the amount over the next 2 years.

RHJ is a worse shooter than Green, but he is better in every other way. He still manages to score at a better rate than Green, is at worse an equal rebounder (perhaps even slightly better) and is significantly better at getting assists, steals and blocks. He is 5 years younger, gets paid nothing and this will be his first off season preparing as a PF. I just don't get it.

Agreed. RHJ is Shawn Marionesque in his game but just like the Matrix he will have to improve his J. Green would make sense if we move Booker to get younger but I don't think he's a better prospect than RHJ either.

I can definitely see Marion in RHJ (I've been making the comparison for a while actually). I'm even against really using RHJ in a S and T with Washington. Again, would you rather have CLV and RHJ at the 3 and 4 for the next 2 years costing $7M or Porter and Green (with CLV coming off the bench) for $64M over the next 2 years? Is there really any comparison?

[Crunky]

Lin is expendable with D'lo and Levert here, his age doesn't match the teams window. I doubt he get's a big offer on the open market because almost every team has a point guard or is developing one.

Lin is this teams leader. he is critical for the mentoring and development of young guys. he is worth keeping. especially since he probably doesnt bring back the value worth it in a trade

Agree with you regarding the mentorship.

This upcoming season, Lin will be the team leader. He's the incumbent for team captain after Brook's departure (unlikely it goes to Skil or RHJ) and he'll have to live up to it. He cannot afford another injury riddled season and be thought of as this team's leader going forward (picks up player option or extension).

D'Lo and Levert will have some pressure to further develop their game, but I wouldn't expect them to be the voice of the team, at least not yet. Ideally both can grow into leaders on the court.

If he get's hurt again next year he won't be worth keeping.

[Prokorov]

Nah, RHJ won't get 17 millions extension. No way.

he will get 15-20 million barring serious injury.

it might not be an extension, it might be an RFA offer sheet. but he is a lock to get that. people focus to much on shooting and forget the preimium the leauge puts on elite wing/forward defenders

How much is Iguodala better than RHJ?
How much did iguodala get for his new contract?
And don't forget that Iguodala is on a championship team, teams like that usually overpay their key role player.
How much do you think Green from the Spurs will get for his next contract?

Age is a MAJOR factor when it comes to contracts.

Iguodala is 34
RHJ is 23

If iguodala was 23-26 he would have gotten 25 million per year/max type deal.

Also, he took a discount to stay with the warriors. they had to give Curry 40 million and durant 27 million and are going to be way into the tax. he could have gotten more elsewhere.

Danny green is 30. he is probably looking at 4/44 or 3/33.

[Prokorov]

Nah, RHJ won't get 17 millions extension. No way.

he will get 15-20 million barring serious injury.

it might not be an extension, it might be an RFA offer sheet. but he is a lock to get that. people focus to much on shooting and forget the preimium the leauge puts on elite wing/forward defenders

And even if there are teams who are willing to pay defensive wings, they will probably want to pay players who have proven themselvels useful in playoff series, not defensive wings who have never appeared in one playoff game.

i dont think that factors in at all. defense translates more then any other skill from good team to bad team from regular season to playoffs. Also, the other elite defenders from playoff teams are locked up, older, or worse.

Draymond green, jimmy butler, paul george - unavailable or locked up.

Danny green, tony allen - older

Andre roberson - worse

other then injury there is simply nothing to prevent a 15-20M offer from RHJ.

[Prokorov]

I don't get the people who wanna bring in JaMychal Green at $13M. We already have a power forward who is better on this roster and he is 5 years younger and will cost $22M less over the next 2 years. Other than pure shooting, RHJ is equal to or better than Green in pretty much every statistical category.

Look at their PER 36 numbers for the whole of last season:
RHJ - 13.8ppg, 9.2rpg, 3.1apg, 1.7spg, 0.9bpg, PER 13.7
Green - 11.8ppg, 9.3rpg, 1.4apg, 0.8spg, 0.6bpg, PER 13.5

When you look at RHJ's PER 36 numbers post All Star game where he became the full time starting PF (yes small sample size) compared to Green's season long starter numbers things get even more interesting.

RHJ - 15.3ppg, 10.7rpg, 2.7apg, 1.8spg, 1.0bpg, PER 16.25
Green - 11.8ppg, 9.3rpg, 1.4apg, 0.8spg, 0.6bpg, PER 13.50

When they played on March 6:
RHJ - 12 points, 4 rebounds, 2 assists, 3 steals, 1 block in 23 minutes
Green - 9 points, 9 rebounds, 0 assists, 0 steals, 0 blocks in 26 minutes

I just don't get it. The only thing I can think of is people are still stuck in the "RHJ is too small to be a PF" which is absolutely bogus. He has identical measurements to Draymond Green and with a couple of summers in the gym can put on the required muscle. He has never has an off season preparing to be a PF and yet when he was moved there mid season he significantly outperformed the guy some of you wanna bring in and pay 6 times the amount over the next 2 years.

RHJ is a worse shooter than Green, but he is better in every other way. He still manages to score at a better rate than Green, is at worse an equal rebounder (perhaps even slightly better) and is significantly better at getting assists, steals and blocks. He is 5 years younger, gets paid nothing and this will be his first off season preparing as a PF. I just don't get it.

Agreed. RHJ is Shawn Marionesque in his game but just like the Matrix he will have to improve his J. Green would make sense if we move Booker to get younger but I don't think he's a better prospect than RHJ either.

I can definitely see Marion in RHJ (I've been making the comparison for a while actually). I'm even against really using RHJ in a S and T with Washington. Again, would you rather have CLV and RHJ at the 3 and 4 for the next 2 years costing $7M or Porter and Green (with CLV coming off the bench) for $64M over the next 2 years? Is there really any comparison?

Green doesnt factor in for me at all. i want no part of him.

if i have to choose between porter at 25M and RHJ at 17M im taking porter. id prefer not to have either... pass on porter and eventually move RHJ before he is due an extension

[antique0o0]

he will get 15-20 million barring serious injury.

it might not be an extension, it might be an RFA offer sheet. but he is a lock to get that. people focus to much on shooting and forget the preimium the leauge puts on elite wing/forward defenders

How much is Iguodala better than RHJ?
How much did iguodala get for his new contract?
And don't forget that Iguodala is on a championship team, teams like that usually overpay their key role player.
How much do you think Green from the Spurs will get for his next contract?

Age is a MAJOR factor when it comes to contracts.

Iguodala is 34
RHJ is 23

If iguodala was 23-26 he would have gotten 25 million per year/max type deal.

Also, he took a discount to stay with the warriors. they had to give Curry 40 million and durant 27 million and are going to be way into the tax. he could have gotten more elsewhere.

Danny green is 30. he is probably looking at 4/44 or 3/33.

I don't think RHJ could do what Iguodala could do now in three years.

IMO, teams, usually contenders, pay defensive wings for their role, not their age.

[Prokorov]

Put it this way....

Taj gibson, at 32 years old, who has been on a stead decline, who isnt nearly the defender RHJ is, and who doesnt shoot threes (career 11.4%) ...

just got 14 million per year

[Curns13]

Agreed. RHJ is Shawn Marionesque in his game but just like the Matrix he will have to improve his J. Green would make sense if we move Booker to get younger but I don't think he's a better prospect than RHJ either.

I can definitely see Marion in RHJ (I've been making the comparison for a while actually). I'm even against really using RHJ in a S and T with Washington. Again, would you rather have CLV and RHJ at the 3 and 4 for the next 2 years costing $7M or Porter and Green (with CLV coming off the bench) for $64M over the next 2 years? Is there really any comparison?

Green doesnt factor in for me at all. i want no part of him.

if i have to choose between porter at 25M and RHJ at 17M im taking porter. id prefer not to have either... pass on porter and eventually move RHJ before he is due an extension

I guess the difference is that we know what we will be getting for $25M with Porter. We don't know what RHJ will be in 2 years. He may be a bench contributor for $8M or he might turn himself into a mini Draymond for $25M. Most likely somewhere in between.

[Prokorov]

How much is Iguodala better than RHJ?
How much did iguodala get for his new contract?
And don't forget that Iguodala is on a championship team, teams like that usually overpay their key role player.
How much do you think Green from the Spurs will get for his next contract?

Age is a MAJOR factor when it comes to contracts.

Iguodala is 34
RHJ is 23

If iguodala was 23-26 he would have gotten 25 million per year/max type deal.

Also, he took a discount to stay with the warriors. they had to give Curry 40 million and durant 27 million and are going to be way into the tax. he could have gotten more elsewhere.

Danny green is 30. he is probably looking at 4/44 or 3/33.

I don't think RHJ could do what Iguodala could do now in three years.

IMO, teams, usually contenders, pay defensive wings for their role, not their age.

you can believe that if you want but its false. Age is second only to talent level when determing a contract and in some cases is the #1 factor.

Taj gibson got 14 million at 32 years old. RHJ is gonna get more then that for sure

[Prokorov]

I can definitely see Marion in RHJ (I've been making the comparison for a while actually). I'm even against really using RHJ in a S and T with Washington. Again, would you rather have CLV and RHJ at the 3 and 4 for the next 2 years costing $7M or Porter and Green (with CLV coming off the bench) for $64M over the next 2 years? Is there really any comparison?

Green doesnt factor in for me at all. i want no part of him.

if i have to choose between porter at 25M and RHJ at 17M im taking porter. id prefer not to have either... pass on porter and eventually move RHJ before he is due an extension

I guess the difference is that we know what we will be getting for $25M with Porter. We don't know what RHJ will be in 2 years. He may be a bench contributor for $8M or he might turn himself into a mini Draymond for $25M. Most likely somewhere in between.

I dont think there is anyway RHJ gets less then 15 million. even if he came off the bench for a year he would get that. it would only go up for 15 million if he improved or got a 3 point stroke above 30%

[vincecarter4pres]

I can definitely see Marion in RHJ (I've been making the comparison for a while actually). I'm even against really using RHJ in a S and T with Washington. Again, would you rather have CLV and RHJ at the 3 and 4 for the next 2 years costing $7M or Porter and Green (with CLV coming off the bench) for $64M over the next 2 years? Is there really any comparison?

Green doesnt factor in for me at all. i want no part of him.

if i have to choose between porter at 25M and RHJ at 17M im taking porter. id prefer not to have either... pass on porter and eventually move RHJ before he is due an extension

I guess the difference is that we know what we will be getting for $25M with Porter. We don't know what RHJ will be in 2 years. He may be a bench contributor for $8M or he might turn himself into a mini Draymond for $25M. Most likely somewhere in between.

I think the problem is, you don't know exactly what you're getting with Porter either and that's a lot of change for the mystery box.

[antique0o0]

he will get 15-20 million barring serious injury.

it might not be an extension, it might be an RFA offer sheet. but he is a lock to get that. people focus to much on shooting and forget the preimium the leauge puts on elite wing/forward defenders

And even if there are teams who are willing to pay defensive wings, they will probably want to pay players who have proven themselvels useful in playoff series, not defensive wings who have never appeared in one playoff game.

i dont think that factors in at all. defense translates more then any other skill from good team to bad team from regular season to playoffs. Also, the other elite defenders from playoff teams are locked up, older, or worse.

Draymond green, jimmy butler, paul george - unavailable or locked up.

Danny green, tony allen - older

Andre roberson - worse

other then injury there is simply nothing to prevent a 15-20M offer from RHJ.

Usually several defensive wings get drafted into the league every year.
In three years, we might find out Jaylen Brown from Celtics and Justise Winslow from the heat and many others grow into a better defender than RHJ.

[TheBrooklynKidd]

You mean only some people I hope?


It looks to me like Russell would most likely play SG and LeVert would most likely play SF

Russell: He's 6'5, he models his game on Manu and he's not particularly quick. The league is going smaller not bigger. He started at PG in LA but didn't do too well. They put Clarkson next to him and he got better. One knock on him is that he's not a good enough leader to play PG. OTOH, his shooter/scoring ability would be a plus at SG.

LVJ: He's 6'7 and plays like LBJ that's a bit smaller and less athletic. He can guard LBJ OK, he'll be able to guard any SF. He just needs to bulk up. Last season, they had ample opportunity to play him at SG towards the end of the season but he barely did. It's the same logic with RHJ, who exclusive plays at PF until he has it down.

Well most people lol. It's pretty neck and neck at the moment and I'm sure there's lots of people that would even say that Russell is better right now.

How would you know? I just don't get that they are so many bad bball minds here, at least the regulars right now (NS doesn't count). If you're talking about the individual offensive players, then you might have a point, but overall? That's pretty absurd, not even close.

Also no I see LeVert being a SG or a PG since both him and D'Angelo are capable of being primary ball handlers and are great passers. Also he played a decent amount of point at Michigan. It doesn't really matter which one is penciled in at point.

Just cuz a certain player played a certain position in college, doesn't he will play that in the NBA. Just cuz they are capable of being primary ball handlers and are great passers doesn't mean they will play PG.

And no he didn't have any opportunity to play SG last year. The Nets had a very unbalanced roster last season because of Their abundance of guards because of Lins inability to stay healthy. LeVert was literally the only reasonable option at SF for the Nets once they moved RHJ to power forward. The only other player who was even physically capable of playing SF was KJ who we basically aqcuired for free and is no longer even on the team. He wasn't even taller than LeVert, he was our tallest perimeter player last season which is the only reason he started at SF.

I don't know what you watched last season. JHar started at SF and did well. When Kenny wanted to start LVJ, he started Foye with him. JHar is more suitable to play SF cuz he's buff and not very fast.

It's funny cause the only bad ball minds are the Lin fans who suffer from the delusion that he's some sort of elite player that's unrivaled be others. They truly are neck and neck at this point and a small leap by Russell will make him without a doubt the better player. Many people think Russell is better you could tell by all the comments about how he was the best player on the team after the trade.

And you must have just been watching Lin the whole time or something because LeVert is very capable of being a primary ball handler and showed it last season.

Also your quote about Harris is just completely wrong. He started 11 games, struggled to get consistent minutes all year and he's a fringe NBA player who only played 5 games in 2015. He's also unathletic, 6'6 with short arms and has no place playing small forward. In fact you mentioning Joe Harris as a small forward further proves the very well known point that the Nets lacked an actual small forward on last years roster. That's why Sean marks said that that was the position that he wanted to address the most over the offseason.

[Prokorov]

Green doesnt factor in for me at all. i want no part of him.

if i have to choose between porter at 25M and RHJ at 17M im taking porter. id prefer not to have either... pass on porter and eventually move RHJ before he is due an extension

I guess the difference is that we know what we will be getting for $25M with Porter. We don't know what RHJ will be in 2 years. He may be a bench contributor for $8M or he might turn himself into a mini Draymond for $25M. Most likely somewhere in between.

I think the problem is, you don't know exactly what you're getting with Porter either and that's a lot of change for the mystery box.

Yeah....

is porter:

Marvin Williams?
Trevor Ariza?
Tayshaun Prince?
Harrison Barnes?
Paul George?

[Paradise]

And even if there are teams who are willing to pay defensive wings, they will probably want to pay players who have proven themselvels useful in playoff series, not defensive wings who have never appeared in one playoff game.

i dont think that factors in at all. defense translates more then any other skill from good team to bad team from regular season to playoffs. Also, the other elite defenders from playoff teams are locked up, older, or worse.

Draymond green, jimmy butler, paul george - unavailable or locked up.

Danny green, tony allen - older

Andre roberson - worse

other then injury there is simply nothing to prevent a 15-20M offer from RHJ.

Usually several defensive wings get drafted into the league every year.
In three years, we might find out Jaylen Brown from Celtics and Justise Winslow from the heat and many others grow into a better defender than RHJ.

Brown and Winslow had the benefit of coming into teams with a defensive minded big man anchoring the defense. RHJ is better than Winslow already.

We'll see how he fares alongside Mozgov and Allen. His first season playing next to defensive oriented bigs that can cover the PnR and block shots. RHJ fits on a team that plays active perimeter defense with a big that can be the second line of the defense.

Lopez has never been capable of that consistently. That affects everybody else as well.


Sent from my iPhone using RealGM mobile app

[Prokorov]

And even if there are teams who are willing to pay defensive wings, they will probably want to pay players who have proven themselvels useful in playoff series, not defensive wings who have never appeared in one playoff game.

i dont think that factors in at all. defense translates more then any other skill from good team to bad team from regular season to playoffs. Also, the other elite defenders from playoff teams are locked up, older, or worse.

Draymond green, jimmy butler, paul george - unavailable or locked up.

Danny green, tony allen - older

Andre roberson - worse

other then injury there is simply nothing to prevent a 15-20M offer from RHJ.

Usually several defensive wings get drafted into the league every year.
In three years, we might find out Jaylen Brown from Celtics and Justise Winslow from the heat and many others grow into a better defender than RHJ.

there are good defenders, and then there are elite defenders.

there are few elite defenders, especially guys good enough to defend SG, SF, and PF.

Tony Allen, Kawai, Draymond green. Kidd-gilchrist, george.

you see one of those guys every 5 years... maybe 10. and typically they are unattainable because in addition to being a great defender they are also great on offense (kawai, george).

i mean there are the sefolosha's, bradleys, corey brewers... those guys are really good... but they really just gaurd 1 or 2 spots and not at the level RHJ does.

[ChokeFasncists]

Lin is this teams leader. he is critical for the mentoring and development of young guys. he is worth keeping. especially since he probably doesnt bring back the value worth it in a trade

Agree with you regarding the mentorship.

This upcoming season, Lin will be the team leader. He's the incumbent for team captain after Brook's departure (unlikely it goes to Skil or RHJ) and he'll have to live up to it. He cannot afford another injury riddled season and be thought of as this team's leader going forward (picks up player option or extension).

D'Lo and Levert will have some pressure to further develop their game, but I wouldn't expect them to be the voice of the team, at least not yet. Ideally both can grow into leaders on the court.

If he get's hurt again next year he won't be worth keeping.

Oh no, that'd be another worst record without a pick! God no!!!