2023 NBA Draft watch

[TheNetsFan]

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I like it. Would still prefer to keep 2 picks if possible and move into the lotto with 1 of them packaged with a wing (dfs).

would be great to move up for a real lotto starter level talent, then still add a role player for bench like hawkins or jackson.

with cam j and bridges locked into the starting lineup hopefully for the next 4 years they should cash in dfs/oneale now. move up with 1, maybe get a protected 2024 pick for the other? clears some room to bring back yuta cheaper too.

Cason Wallace has been my trade up draft target for a while, but he likely goes no later than Toronto at #13. I don't think #21 & #22 will get us that high.

[Tha King]

^^^Keyonte I get. I am not sold on the other guards and would prefer not trading up for them. Look at the impact stats for JHS/Smith Jr. (BPM: 0.7)...I don't think there's ever been a really good player that had advanced stats similar (LaVine was the lowest I came across and he was 2.9). If they are available at 21 or 22 you can take a chance because Smith was considered elite and had injuries and JHS is a 6'6 CG but I wouldn't trade up for them. Wallace is interesting but I don't see him as a lead guard.

Whitehead, Sensabaugh, GG Jackson, Rupert, etc. are more interesting because if you hit with them their archetypes are so much more valuable.

[Netaman]

Read on Twitter

I like it. Would still prefer to keep 2 picks if possible and move into the lotto with 1 of them packaged with a wing (dfs).

would be great to move up for a real lotto starter level talent, then still add a role player for bench like hawkins or jackson.

with cam j and bridges locked into the starting lineup hopefully for the next 4 years they should cash in dfs/oneale now. move up with 1, maybe get a protected 2024 pick for the other? clears some room to bring back yuta cheaper too.

Cason Wallace has been my trade up draft target for a while, but he likely goes no later than Toronto at #13. I don't think #21 & #22 will get us that high.

I like wallace a lot. I watched him a decent amount and see the jrue comps. would be very happy to add him.

[vincecarter4pres]

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I like it. Would still prefer to keep 2 picks if possible and move into the lotto with 1 of them packaged with a wing (dfs).

would be great to move up for a real lotto starter level talent, then still add a role player for bench like hawkins or jackson.

with cam j and bridges locked into the starting lineup hopefully for the next 4 years they should cash in dfs/oneale now. move up with 1, maybe get a protected 2024 pick for the other? clears some room to bring back yuta cheaper too.

I still think we’re going to see something like DFS/21/22 for a pick in the 10-15 range.

DFS on his own isn’t worth a first round pick, unless we’re talking somewhere in the late 20’s, imho, unless really bad salary is coming attached to the match.

I know Royce isn’t a likely long term piece because of his age, and is almost certainly the more valuable of the two, but he’s the guy I’d hope we keep. He got bashed a little unfairly this season when he was clearly better than DFS, and was a good player before the KD injuries and the trades. He’s a guy who really needs to be in a more proper system and role though, when he’s asked to overextend himself and be aggressive on offense he becomes wildly inefficient.

Tbh, neither is a must have on a team like this and if you need to include him, or both, you make the move to secure a potential future + level starter.

The more I look at this roster, the more I think we’re a bottom ten record. Pick goes to Houston regardless, have to get your hands on some real deal future pieces.

[CalamityX12]

Read on Twitter

going into this with half hearted investment

but i wonder what possible guards in the late lotto to mid range are worth our two picks?

[Netaman]

I still think we’re going to see something like DFS/21/22 for a pick in the 10-15 range.

DFS on his own isn’t worth a first round pick, unless we’re talking somewhere in the late 20’s, imho, unless really bad salary is coming attached to the match.

I know Royce isn’t a likely long term piece because of his age, and is almost certainly the more valuable of the two, but he’s the guy I’d hope we keep. He got bashed a little unfairly this season when he was clearly better than DFS, and was a good player before the KD injuries and the trades. He’s a guy who really needs to be in a more proper system and role though, when he’s asked to overextend himself and be aggressive on offense he becomes wildly inefficient.

Tbh, neither is a must have on a team like this and if you need to include him, or both, you make the move to secure a potential future + level starter.

The more I look at this roster, the more I think we’re a bottom ten record. Pick goes to Houston regardless, have to get your hands on some real deal future pieces.

I think both picks and a wing to move 6 spots is a little rich. I think that's closer to a deal that gets you to #10 with Dallas, maybe with a Bertans or McGee coming back so they can offload some salary.

I don't disagree with your assessment of Royce, but I think he's a wasted role player on this version of the nets. If they can get a 2024 first for him i'd do it. Or if a team in the teens wants 1 of the firsts + royce for say pick 14-17, I think that makes sense. Since DFS has a bunch of years of control I think you could trade him for a lotto protected 2024 first. if dallas or phoenix had that to trade for example i think either of those teams runs to make that deal, so it's just finding the right team.

[vincecarter4pres]

I still think we’re going to see something like DFS/21/22 for a pick in the 10-15 range.

DFS on his own isn’t worth a first round pick, unless we’re talking somewhere in the late 20’s, imho, unless really bad salary is coming attached to the match.

I know Royce isn’t a likely long term piece because of his age, and is almost certainly the more valuable of the two, but he’s the guy I’d hope we keep. He got bashed a little unfairly this season when he was clearly better than DFS, and was a good player before the KD injuries and the trades. He’s a guy who really needs to be in a more proper system and role though, when he’s asked to overextend himself and be aggressive on offense he becomes wildly inefficient.

Tbh, neither is a must have on a team like this and if you need to include him, or both, you make the move to secure a potential future + level starter.

The more I look at this roster, the more I think we’re a bottom ten record. Pick goes to Houston regardless, have to get your hands on some real deal future pieces.

I think both picks and a wing to move 6 spots is a little rich. I think that's closer to a deal that gets you to #10 with Dallas, maybe with a Bertans or McGee coming back so they can offload some salary.

I don't disagree with your assessment of Royce, but I think he's a wasted role player on this version of the nets. If they can get a 2024 first for him i'd do it. Or if a team in the teens wants 1 of the firsts + royce for say pick 14-17, I think that makes sense. Since DFS has a bunch of years of control I think you could trade him for a lotto protected 2024 first. if dallas or phoenix had that to trade for example i think either of those teams runs to make that deal, so it's just finding the right team.

Yeah I agree with this.

But I think you have to get into the top 15 by hook or crook.

Anything that doesn’t involve future picks, Clax, or Bridges should be on the table, anything. As we’re currently discussing, for us, a young lottery team without a pick, they’re a waste and quite frankly ineffective.

The difference between say pick 11 and pick 18 is pretty staggering, historically.

[Netaman]

I still think we’re going to see something like DFS/21/22 for a pick in the 10-15 range.

DFS on his own isn’t worth a first round pick, unless we’re talking somewhere in the late 20’s, imho, unless really bad salary is coming attached to the match.

I know Royce isn’t a likely long term piece because of his age, and is almost certainly the more valuable of the two, but he’s the guy I’d hope we keep. He got bashed a little unfairly this season when he was clearly better than DFS, and was a good player before the KD injuries and the trades. He’s a guy who really needs to be in a more proper system and role though, when he’s asked to overextend himself and be aggressive on offense he becomes wildly inefficient.

Tbh, neither is a must have on a team like this and if you need to include him, or both, you make the move to secure a potential future + level starter.

The more I look at this roster, the more I think we’re a bottom ten record. Pick goes to Houston regardless, have to get your hands on some real deal future pieces.

I think both picks and a wing to move 6 spots is a little rich. I think that's closer to a deal that gets you to #10 with Dallas, maybe with a Bertans or McGee coming back so they can offload some salary.

I don't disagree with your assessment of Royce, but I think he's a wasted role player on this version of the nets. If they can get a 2024 first for him i'd do it. Or if a team in the teens wants 1 of the firsts + royce for say pick 14-17, I think that makes sense. Since DFS has a bunch of years of control I think you could trade him for a lotto protected 2024 first. if dallas or phoenix had that to trade for example i think either of those teams runs to make that deal, so it's just finding the right team.

Yeah I agree with this.

But I think you have to get into the top 15 by hook or crook.

Anything that doesn’t involve future picks, Clax, or Bridges should be on the table, anything. As we’re currently discussing, for us, a young lottery team without a pick, they’re a waste and quite frankly ineffective.

The difference between say pick 11 and pick 18 is pretty staggering, historically.

i'd agree with the need to move up if marks didn't have such a good track record right around #21/22. allen was a typical lotto guy who slipped, levert was a kind off the board pick, cam thomas was a lotto guy who fell, claxton was sort of the prototypical developmental big guy with tools.

don't get me wrong, i very much want to move up. but i do think there will be useful players available at #21/22 like andre jackson. and probably a few guys who fall that we are considering top 15 talents right now. vecenie has keyonte george #26 and nick smith #22 in his final big board. whitehead is #20.

end of day i go back to really trusting marks with the draft picks in this range. i do think it's highly likely they maneuver some kind of moves because i think royce/dfs are going to be somewhat in demand for teams who are already actively shopping their picks because they want to add vets to win now though. and i think the cam thomas experience probably pushes them away from the nick smith, keyonte george types and more towards the style of players who fit the style of play they want to develop which is less one dimensional.

[vincecarter4pres]

I think both picks and a wing to move 6 spots is a little rich. I think that's closer to a deal that gets you to #10 with Dallas, maybe with a Bertans or McGee coming back so they can offload some salary.

I don't disagree with your assessment of Royce, but I think he's a wasted role player on this version of the nets. If they can get a 2024 first for him i'd do it. Or if a team in the teens wants 1 of the firsts + royce for say pick 14-17, I think that makes sense. Since DFS has a bunch of years of control I think you could trade him for a lotto protected 2024 first. if dallas or phoenix had that to trade for example i think either of those teams runs to make that deal, so it's just finding the right team.

Yeah I agree with this.

But I think you have to get into the top 15 by hook or crook.

Anything that doesn’t involve future picks, Clax, or Bridges should be on the table, anything. As we’re currently discussing, for us, a young lottery team without a pick, they’re a waste and quite frankly ineffective.

The difference between say pick 11 and pick 18 is pretty staggering, historically.

i'd agree with the need to move up if marks didn't have such a good track record right around #21/22. allen was a typical lotto guy who slipped, levert was a kind off the board pick, cam thomas was a lotto guy who fell, claxton was sort of the prototypical developmental big guy with tools.

Yeah but it's rare to hit on so many late picks. And honestly, LeVert is good, but not all that good. Cam Thomas is currently a tunnel vision chucker who doesn't play defense, has major attitude concerns and found himself in the doghouse even after a bunch of ridiculous 40+ point forest fires.

Look at the history of late picks, it's such a lower percentage after pick 15 who even become legit perennial starters.

don't get me wrong, i very much want to move up. but i do think there will be useful players available at #21/22 like andre jackson. and probably a few guys who fall that we are considering top 15 talents right now. vecenie has keyonte george #26 and nick smith #22 in his final big board. whitehead is #20.

Again, total crap shoot when you get this late in the draft. What are we holding onto DFS and O'Neale for? To say we have them? We are a lotto team without our own picks. They are mediocre assets, but they can help us jump into the early to late teens.

I don't want a so-so starter, or a trade filler guy putting up empty numbers on our bad team. I want Marks to find a franchise building block who winds up here for most of his career, makes All Star games and is a fan favorite.

It's tremendously harder to find a Klay Thompson, a Paul George, D Mitchell, Dirk, McCollum, etc., without a late lotto pick.

end of day i go back to really trusting marks with the draft picks in this range. i do think it's highly likely they maneuver some kind of moves because i think royce/dfs are going to be somewhat in demand for teams who are already actively shopping their picks because they want to add vets to win now though. and i think the cam thomas experience probably pushes them away from the nick smith, keyonte george types and more towards the style of players who fit the style of play they want to develop which is less one dimensional.

Again, it's like saying this. Marks is a great race car driver. He keeps coming in the money in beat up old Mustangs and Civics. I think he does great with the crappy cars he has, so I don't want him to trade a bunch of extra socket and wrench sets with the crappy cars to get him an Porsche or a Corvette, because I like the fact he has so many good tools even if he doesn't use them, and it's fun watching him occasionally beat the expensive race teams with his lemon cars that over-perform.

And you can't site Cam T as a late pick hit by Marks in the beginning of your post, and then poo poo him in the end. It's one or the other.

[Netaman]

Yeah I agree with this.

But I think you have to get into the top 15 by hook or crook.

Anything that doesn’t involve future picks, Clax, or Bridges should be on the table, anything. As we’re currently discussing, for us, a young lottery team without a pick, they’re a waste and quite frankly ineffective.

The difference between say pick 11 and pick 18 is pretty staggering, historically.

i'd agree with the need to move up if marks didn't have such a good track record right around #21/22. allen was a typical lotto guy who slipped, levert was a kind off the board pick, cam thomas was a lotto guy who fell, claxton was sort of the prototypical developmental big guy with tools.

Yeah but it's rare to hit on so many late picks. And honestly, LeVert is good, but not all that good. Cam Thomas is currently a tunnel vision chucker who doesn't play defense, has major attitude concerns and found himself in the doghouse even after a bunch of ridiculous 40+ point forest fires.

Look at the history of late picks, it's such a lower percentage after pick 15 who even become legit perennial starters.

don't get me wrong, i very much want to move up. but i do think there will be useful players available at #21/22 like andre jackson. and probably a few guys who fall that we are considering top 15 talents right now. vecenie has keyonte george #26 and nick smith #22 in his final big board. whitehead is #20.

Again, total crap shoot when you get this late in the draft. What are we holding onto DFS and O'Neale for? To say we have them? We are a lotto team without our own picks. They are mediocre assets, but they can help us jump into the early to late teens.

I don't want a so-so starter, or a trade filler guy putting up empty numbers on our bad team. I want Marks to find a franchise building block who winds up here for most of his career, makes All Star games and is a fan favorite.

It's tremendously harder to find a Klay Thompson, a Paul George, D Mitchell, Dirk, McCollum, etc., without a late lotto pick.

end of day i go back to really trusting marks with the draft picks in this range. i do think it's highly likely they maneuver some kind of moves because i think royce/dfs are going to be somewhat in demand for teams who are already actively shopping their picks because they want to add vets to win now though. and i think the cam thomas experience probably pushes them away from the nick smith, keyonte george types and more towards the style of players who fit the style of play they want to develop which is less one dimensional.

Again, it's like saying this. Marks is a great race car driver. He keeps coming in the money in beat up old Mustangs and Civics. I think he does great with the crappy cars he has, so I don't want him to trade a bunch of extra socket and wrench sets with the crappy cars to get him an Porsche or a Corvette, because I like the fact he has so many good tools even if he doesn't use them, and it's fun watching him occasionally beat the expensive race teams with his lemon cars that over-perform.

And you can't site Cam T as a late pick hit by Marks in the beginning of your post, and then poo poo him in the end. It's one or the other.

you are misunderstanding my post. i can say with a pretty high level of confidence my plan A at the draft would involve trading both DFS/Royce with the main intent of moving up for a lotto pick. I've said that pretty verbatim in our back/forths. we just dont know what their values are to accomplish that.

as i said above i would much rather cash them in to move up (or add future picks) than to have to package both picks to drop to only getting 1 selection this year because of the value marks has shown he's able to get at 21/22. i agree with the limitations you mentioned re cam/levert but they were still good picks, very easily better picks than a lot of guys that went ahead of them.

for sean marks to give up 2 swings at #21/22 there has to be a sizable upgrade in quality of whoever he is moving up for and i dont know if that exists or not. to give up dfs/royce to move up is a generally lower bar in my mind since i agree, they are spare parts who dont move the needle on this roster. i do think they both likely hold late 1st value for playoff teams like the ones i mentioned (we just dont need another late 1st right now).

[Tha King]

I looked at recent drafts a while back and compared the 10th pick (because the Mavs picks might be available) to the 21/22 picks we do have. The 10th pick is far more valuable but cumulatively I think you can say 21/22 produced better players. Also, for what the team needs to be looking for (upside) I think taking two chances is better than one.

2022
10 - Johnny Davis

21 - Christian Braun
22 - Walker Kessler

2021
10 - Ziare Williams

21 - Keon Johnson
22 - Isaiah Jackson

2020
10 - Jalen Smith

21 - Tyrese Maxey
22 - Zeke Nnaji

2019
10 - Cam Reddish

21 - Brandon Clarke
22 - Grant Williams

2018
10 - Mikal Bridges

21 - Grayson Allen
22 - Chandler Hutchinson

2017
10- Zach Collins

21 - Terrance Ferguson
22 - Jarret Allen

2016
10 - Thon Maker

21 - DeAndre Bembry
22 - Malachi Richardson

2015
10 - Justise Winslow

21 - Justin Anderson
22 - Bobby Portis

2014
10 - Elfrid Payton

21 - Mitch McGary
22 - Jordan Adams

2013
10 - Cj McCollum

21 - Gorgui Dieng
22 - Mason Plumlee

[vincecarter4pres]

I looked at recent drafts a while back and compared the 10th pick (because the Mavs picks might be available) to the 21/22 picks we do have. The 10th pick is far more valuable but cumulatively I think you can say 21/22 produced better players. Also, for what the team needs to be looking for (upside) I think taking two chances is better than one.

2022
10 - Johnny Davis

21 - Christian Braun
22 - Walker Kessler

2021
10 - Ziare Williams

21 - Keon Johnson
22 - Isaiah Jackson

2020
10 - Jalen Smith

21 - Tyrese Maxey
22 - Zeke Nnaji

2019
10 - Cam Reddish

21 - Brandon Clarke
22 - Grant Williams

2018
10 - Mikal Bridges

21 - Grayson Allen
22 - Chandler Hutchinson

2017
10- Zach Collins

21 - Terrance Ferguson
22 - Jarret Allen

2016
10 - Thon Maker

21 - DeAndre Bembry
22 - Malachi Richardson

2015
10 - Justise Winslow

21 - Justin Anderson
22 - Bobby Portis

2014
10 - Elfrid Payton

21 - Mitch McGary
22 - Jordan Adams

2013
10 - Cj McCollum

21 - Gorgui Dieng
22 - Mason Plumlee

You go back 15 more years, you also have the likes of Paul Pierce, Brook Lopez, Jason Terry, Joe Johnson, Caron Butler, and Andrew Bynum in there.

You struggle to find a real starter outside of Rondo and Diaw with both the 21/22 in those same added 15 drafts.

The 10th pick specifically has produced a number of legit franchise players and perennial All Stars, the 21/22 has barely produced starters, even if the overall hit/miss is similar.

[Netaman]

I looked at recent drafts a while back and compared the 10th pick (because the Mavs picks might be available) to the 21/22 picks we do have. The 10th pick is far more valuable but cumulatively I think you can say 21/22 produced better players. Also, for what the team needs to be looking for (upside) I think taking two chances is better than one.

2022
10 - Johnny Davis

21 - Christian Braun
22 - Walker Kessler

2021
10 - Ziare Williams

21 - Keon Johnson
22 - Isaiah Jackson

2020
10 - Jalen Smith

21 - Tyrese Maxey
22 - Zeke Nnaji

2019
10 - Cam Reddish

21 - Brandon Clarke
22 - Grant Williams

2018
10 - Mikal Bridges

21 - Grayson Allen
22 - Chandler Hutchinson

2017
10- Zach Collins

21 - Terrance Ferguson
22 - Jarret Allen

2016
10 - Thon Maker

21 - DeAndre Bembry
22 - Malachi Richardson

2015
10 - Justise Winslow

21 - Justin Anderson
22 - Bobby Portis

2014
10 - Elfrid Payton

21 - Mitch McGary
22 - Jordan Adams

2013
10 - Cj McCollum

21 - Gorgui Dieng
22 - Mason Plumlee

You go back 15 more years, you also have the likes of Paul Pierce, Brook Lopez, Jason Terry, Joe Johnson, Caron Butler, and Andrew Bynum in there.

You struggle to find a real starter outside of Rondo and Diaw with both the 21/22 in those same added 15 drafts.

The 10th pick specifically has produced a number of legit franchise players and perennial All Stars, the 21/22 has barely produced starters, even if the overall hit/miss is similar.

im not sure how much value you gain by going back more than 10 drafts with how much more advanced information is now.

i think the general point holds up that even up at #10, it's a coin flip whether 2 shots at 21/22 work out better than the 1 shot at #10.

heck you can go back to the last few years and 50% of the top 9's are already regrettable. the draft is a crap shoot that produces 1 or 2 expected all stars and 1 or 2 unexpected.

i trust marks in either spot and if we think back to earlier in his tenure mikal bridges and donovan mitchell were 2 guys he supposedly loved and tried to move up for, so im fully confident if he moves up it will be for a solid player. im also confident he'll do fine with 21/22 if that's how it goes. but obviously wont be as exciting.

[Tha King]

You go back 15 more years, you also have the likes of Paul Pierce, Brook Lopez, Jason Terry, Joe Johnson, Caron Butler, and Andrew Bynum in there.

You struggle to find a real starter outside of Rondo and Diaw with both the 21/22 in those same added 15 drafts.

The 10th pick specifically has produced a number of legit franchise players and perennial All Stars, the 21/22 has barely produced starters, even if the overall hit/miss is similar.

Respect.

You're right, the 10th pick definitely has a higher chance of being a cornerstone type of player just not sure if this draft has that level of separation. Don't think Wallace, George, Hawkins, etc. have more upside than GG Jackson, Whitehead, Sensabuagh, etc. And with the latter, you could possibly get two.

[Netaman]

Here's a simple trade up idea:

DFS + #21
to
OKC #12

a veteran defensive player in the front court is sort of exactly what OKC needs, they have plenty of lotto picks already in the building trying to develop.

they have cap room so nets get another chunky trade exception and move up 9 spots. not a king's ransom for DFS but imo a pretty fair deal for both sides.

i feel like Dallas is going to have to aim for a bigger name player than DFS with their pick (probably as part of a package).

[Rastas]

Why not Scoot if he's available at #3 for Cam J and the picks.

Marks has plenty of options if it's a stud PG he is targeting.

[vincecarter4pres]

Why not Scoot if he's available at #3 for Cam J and the picks.

Marks has plenty of options if it's a stud PG he is targeting.

That's not getting you close to the 3rd pick.

[TheNetsFan]

Here's a simple trade up idea:

DFS + #21
to
OKC #12

a veteran defensive player in the front court is sort of exactly what OKC needs, they have plenty of lotto picks already in the building trying to develop.

they have cap room so nets get another chunky trade exception and move up 9 spots. not a king's ransom for DFS but imo a pretty fair deal for both sides.

i feel like Dallas is going to have to aim for a bigger name player than DFS with their pick (probably as part of a package).

That would be a great deal, but I don't know if that's enough for #12. Part of the reason I believe that package is enough for #10, is because Dallas would be sending Bertans' dead money, some of which extends into next year, and they're more of a win-now situation.

[Netaman]

Here's a simple trade up idea:

DFS + #21
to
OKC #12

a veteran defensive player in the front court is sort of exactly what OKC needs, they have plenty of lotto picks already in the building trying to develop.

they have cap room so nets get another chunky trade exception and move up 9 spots. not a king's ransom for DFS but imo a pretty fair deal for both sides.

i feel like Dallas is going to have to aim for a bigger name player than DFS with their pick (probably as part of a package).

That would be a great deal, but I don't know if that's enough for #12. Part of the reason I believe that package is enough for #10, is because Dallas would be sending Bertans' dead money, some of which extends into next year, and they're more of a win-now situation.

it's possible. I had thought dallas was the best fit from day one since they know exactly how valuable dfs is. i just think they may be getting desperate with kyrie possibly walking and may want to aim higher with their pick. beal maybe?

feels like the top 9 picks in play are going to be more for the siakam, zion, og level players on the market. so maybe dallas strikes out and relents on the 11 spot drop to bring back dfs. that would at least return them a big piece from the kyrie trade.

[CalamityX12]

Here's a simple trade up idea:

DFS + #21
to
OKC #12

a veteran defensive player in the front court is sort of exactly what OKC needs, they have plenty of lotto picks already in the building trying to develop.

they have cap room so nets get another chunky trade exception and move up 9 spots. not a king's ransom for DFS but imo a pretty fair deal for both sides.

i feel like Dallas is going to have to aim for a bigger name player than DFS with their pick (probably as part of a package).

of all those teams that don't need more lotto picks(after top 7) OKC would be that team.

They be a team ready or to at least start incorporating some high upside vets.

I like looking at OKC for possible trade partner