The Official Lin Net Thread

[reelsgm]

This whole thing about starting is where I say it is overstated by some.

Let's make this perfectly clear again. An NBA player who does NOT wish to start:
1. Doesn' believe he's good enough (whatever reason: unconfident, unmotivated...)
2. Is on a perennial Championship contender (e.g. Iguodala, Ginobili)
3. Just biding his time for the promotion (e.g. Harden-OKC, Lin-CHA)
4. Some or all of the above

Lin said he "absolutely" wanted to stay in CHA, had unfinished business in CHA, was willing to take a pay cut to stay (google it if you don't believe) - but the instant the starting role became available at midnight on FA day he took it - Don't tell Lin "this whole thing about starting is overstated by some" - Lin made his feelings about starting crystal clear.

Post everything I wrote please since I backed up that point. I'm not talking to Lin or about him specifically. Just how big a 6th man can be on a team's lineup.

Nostalgia of Lin as 6th man is just that - historic/nostalgic - it's not coming back despite the ad nauseum drumbeat of combining "6th man" and "Lin" on the Official Lin thread from some who might wish it.

Lin envisions himself as a starter until he's over-the-hill to the point that he either hangs up his laces or chases a ring if he still doesn't have one.

[GoodDayLa]

Makes sense, but that's not the point I've been trying to make. I expect success and I see it coming for this team this season a mile away in the form of a playoff birth.

I'm pretty certain Lin is going to help this team make the playoffs. I've explained the logic in previous posts. If and when they make it, I'm hoping those who didn't see it coming or view it as a long shot look back and wonder what they missed and why others like myself were so certain.

After all this is a Nets based Jeremy Lin thread. Like the Op said, I speak for myself and nobody else.

If the Nets don't make the playoffs, in my opinion, Jeremy Lin is just a decent backup PG who isn't good enough to be starting on a good NBA team as Matt Moore of CBS Sports recently wrote last month. In fact, if the Nets don't make it, and Lin plays almost all the games, I'll be the first to admit I have terrible basketball analytical skills and that I completely missed the boat on Jeremy Lin and that he isn't that good or the PG savior I predicted him to be for this franchise.

This is total nonsense and it's a shame that we have to listen to your drivel for the rest of the season. Is there an ignore feature on this site?

Keep on trolling, you're not fooling anyone with your BS, if you were legit Lin fan you'd have made your account on RealGM awhile ago and just post sporadically here and there commenting on Lin's progress (just like myself, although i was a LAL/LAC fan 1st), or just stayed in the Lin fan safe zones, its pretty goddamn clear you made this new account to stealth troll. Yea sure, Lin is a backup PG if he cant singlehandedly take the Nets to the playoffs, that's a helluva bar to set for a player who's never been given that much responsibility for.

I dont understand how some people can hate on a player so much theyd go to such lengths.

I'm actually a very big believer of Jeremy Lin, much bigger than you. I've never posted on here before because it would have been pointless to rant for 3 years that if Lin were a starting PG in a friendly situation with a coach who will empower him that I believe the playoffs are a virtual lock for that team. But now that's the situation Lin finds himself him. It's no longer an unprovable hypothetical and that should be exciting for all.

Lin already proved he can get a 20 win projection to the playoffs by starting at PG in season 1 in Houston. But everyone and their mom gives James Harden 100% of that credit.

Now of course,in Brooklyn, there's a great center in Brook Lopez, a stud offensive player in Bojan and key guys like Booker and Scola and some other good bench parts. They are missing a few key ingredients but they'll make it work. It's not like Lin can do this himself but the parts are there around him. If he was on Philadelphia this season, I doubt I'd be as convinced the playoffs are likely. Nobody can do it alone. Not even James Harden in season 1 in Houston though the entire NBA media and fans give Harden 100% of the credit.

You keep supporting who you want and how you want. I won't keep saying they'll make the playoffs. I've established that already. I can wait till they are numerically eliminated or when they make it to revisit that subject. I've made the point and I've also addressed that I don't think Lin is as good as I thought if they dont make it.

[Roy Tarpley]

I've made the point and I've also addressed that I don't think Lin is as good as I thought if they dont make it.

John Wall, Jimmy Butler, Anthony Davis, Demarcus Cousins, Carmelo Anthony - all scrubs cuz their teams didn't make the playoffs.

[GoodDayLa]

Let's keep the expectation low bud. Success is much sweeter when you least expect it.

Makes sense, but that's not the point I've been trying to make. I expect success and I see it coming for this team this season a mile away in the form of a playoff birth.

I'm pretty certain Lin is going to help this team make the playoffs. I've explained the logic in previous posts. If and when they make it, I'm hoping those who didn't see it coming or view it as a long shot look back and wonder what they missed and why others like myself were so certain.

After all this is a Nets based Jeremy Lin thread. Like the Op said, I speak for myself and nobody else.

If the Nets don't make the playoffs, in my opinion, Jeremy Lin is just a decent backup PG who isn't good enough to be starting on a good NBA team as Matt Moore of CBS Sports recently wrote last month. In fact, if the Nets don't make it, and Lin plays almost all the games, I'll be the first to admit I have terrible basketball analytical skills and that I completely missed the boat on Jeremy Lin and that he isn't that good or the PG savior I predicted him to be for this franchise.

Care to explain why there's such a large difference in evaluation of Lin that is solely dependent upon whether the Nets make the playoffs?

If the Nets made the playoffs as currently constructed, it will almost certainly be because a few of the Nets broke out and ended up playing way better than expected. And considering his prominent position on the team, there's a high probability that Lin would be one of those players.

Now, there are some people who believe the Nets will win 15 games, The number who believe they will between 15 and 25 is the largest group, followed by the those who believe they will win anywhere from 25 to 35 games.

In order for the Nets to make the playoffs, they would almost definitely need to win 40 games, which is a ton considering that almost every pundit has them as a bottom 5 team in the league.

If Lin helped carry them to the playoffs, yes he's a great player.

But if the Nets win 25-35 games, he'd the average starting PG that many people think he is.
If the Nets win 15-25 games, then it's probably safe to question whether he can really be the main focal point as a starting PG.

What I don't understand is why Lin has to be considered a scrub if the Nets don't make the playoffs considering that the talent surrounding Lin is probably the worst collection of talent in the league.

So if Lin doesn't lift this bad team to the playoffs, he can't be considered merely average? Why would should we then consider him a scrub if the Nets perform as expected or even just above expectations yet still miss the playoffs?

I'm just pointing out the NBA media posts stuff like "Lin is a good backup PG, and is not talented enough to be an NBA starting PG." These articles come out regularly even now. There have been tons of articles about how Lin can only be a starting PG for a team that is not capable of making the playoffs and that he cannot start on a playoff caliber team.

I've figured out, as many Lin fans have as well, that stuff like this privately drives Lin. It drives most sports athletes so that's nothing new, but I think Jeremy Lin is on a mission this season to help the Nets franchise and it will indirectly help himself. He's not direct but he's already saying he expects this to be a good competitive team and its just that their margin for error is smaller than the rest. Luckily, Lin is one of the NBA's most efficient guards.

So if they can't make it, Lin's just a guy full of talk and I've been conned for several years. For me personally, I would have to admit like the rest of the paid NBA media that Lin is just a good backup PG and not capable of being a quality starting NBA PG on a competitive team.

I will back off the use of the term scrub as that's not accurate and more of an exaggerated method to make my point.

[GoodDayLa]

I've made the point and I've also addressed that I don't think Lin is as good as I thought if they dont make it.

John Wall, Jimmy Butler, Anthony Davis, Demarcus Cousins, Carmelo Anthony - all scrubs cuz their teams didn't make the playoffs.

Lin has Brook Lopez, Bojan, and vets like Scola Booker and some shooters in Harris and Hamilton. Plus all the roster are team first guys with a capable coaching staff. Lin has no excuses because this team is basically built for him and Brook.

John Wall and Melo are wildly overrated. They've had some talent and coaching staff issues but most of that is on them. They aren't as good as the NBA wants us to believe. Teams were built for them w/ decent talent around them and they've generally failed to deliver.


AD has nobody to play with. His guards have been forgettable. Jrue Holiday and Tyreke Evans reminds me of a worse version of Wall and Beal. E Gordon was good but injured all the time. Ryan Anderson was good but dealing with a dead girlfriend for 1.5 seasons. That franchise is dealing with injuries to everyone from AD to EG to TE every other day.

Demarcus - his teams has stunk and his owners have been clowns from Maloofs to Randive. Bad coaching, bad front office. He had little help and the guy they get for him is Rudy Gay? You want Demarcus to win with midget IT fighting it out with Jimmer at PG and then coach Keith Smart who cannot coach? Kings are like the worst NBA franchise, I feel for him.

Jimmy Butler has made the playoffs consistently since he became the man.

[reelsgm]

If the Nets don't make the playoffs, in my opinion, Jeremy Lin is just a decent backup PG who isn't good enough to be starting on a good NBA team ... In fact, if the Nets don't make it, and Lin plays almost all the games, I'll be the first to admit I have terrible basketball analytical skills and that I completely missed the boat on Jeremy Lin and that he isn't that good or the PG savior I predicted him to be for this franchise.

Not to overly emphasize on what others have already noted above where you mention that No Playoffs equates to "isn't good enough to be starting", "isn't that good" which in and of itself is a curiosity based on your professed support of Lin and indicates some extremes of analysis and fair-weather fandom to be honest...

However, I think it's easy to be a Monday morning QB and I personally dont want to be accused of claiming I saw the playoffs coming all the way after the fact.

... but it's even more glaring when you don't realize that what you intend to proclaim on Lin if he doesn't make the playoffs is the epitome of Monday morning QBing.

I'm on record as saying the Nets make the playoffs but unlike you there is no way that I would concede that Lin "is just a good backup PG and not capable of being a quality starting NBA PG" if we don't. If the Nets win 15 games then alright, but would you really admit Lin is a scrub if the Nets get 40 wins but miss the 8th spot by 1 game?

Your all-or-nothing thinking is extreme and lends to credibility.

[Tracymcgoaty]

If lin helps this team to 30 wins hes a top 10 PG in this league lol tell me one guy ONE except lebron that make this team go into the playoffs? who they got on this team? they got brook, then they got Lin on offense.

Killpatrick still left to be seen

Rondae has no offensive game maybe a little midrange action. good defense.

Bogdanovic - 3 point shooter

Scola- offense no defense 36 years old

Booker - hustle

Randy foye - yeah

rest are unproven players.

Overall this team is not nearly good enough to get to the playoffs. And Lin could use every bit of energy hustle heart will break every bone in his body trying to get this team to the playoffs but it aint happening. If it happens like i said ill run around town naked. for it to be even have a chance every one of these players need to ball out like their life depended on it. This aint 2k17 you cant put it on rookie mode and blast 3s from halfcourt swishing it with Lin and rondae.

[GoodDayLa]

Let's keep the expectation low bud. Success is much sweeter when you least expect it.

Makes sense, but that's not the point I've been trying to make. I expect success and I see it coming for this team this season a mile away in the form of a playoff birth.

I'm pretty certain Lin is going to help this team make the playoffs. I've explained the logic in previous posts. If and when they make it, I'm hoping those who didn't see it coming or view it as a long shot look back and wonder what they missed and why others like myself were so certain.

After all this is a Nets based Jeremy Lin thread. Like the Op said, I speak for myself and nobody else.

If the Nets don't make the playoffs, in my opinion, Jeremy Lin is just a decent backup PG who isn't good enough to be starting on a good NBA team as Matt Moore of CBS Sports recently wrote last month. In fact, if the Nets don't make it, and Lin plays almost all the games, I'll be the first to admit I have terrible basketball analytical skills and that I completely missed the boat on Jeremy Lin and that he isn't that good or the PG savior I predicted him to be for this franchise.

So under your logic I guess John Wall who couldn't get his team in the playoffs last year sucks and much of the rest of the NBA experts who see him as a top 5 NBA PG are all wrong, since Lin will be judged as nothing more than a decent backup if he can't get this very weak roster into the playoffs.

I think John Wall has gotten poor coaching from Randy Whitman and whomever his development team is. He still tends to play inefficiently and his outside shot is not strong enough.

Now that he's getting older and his body is breaking down, he'll struggle even more as his athleticism fades.

Just my opinion.

[Roy Tarpley]

Lin has Brook Lopez, Bojan, and vets like Scola Booker and some shooters in Harris and Hamilton. Plus all the roster are team first guys with a capable coaching staff. Lin has no excuses because this team is basically built for him and Brook.

You're overrating the Nets. Bojan is one of the worst defensive players in the NBA. Scola is a 36 year old traffic cone. Harris and Hamilton barely have any NBA experience.

The Nets need a couple things to make the playoffs -- (1) some time together to work on their system, which will take more than one year, and (2) a couple better players, whether through free agency, trade, or improvement (like Levert and RHJ).

[leeramundo]

Makes sense, but that's not the point I've been trying to make. I expect success and I see it coming for this team this season a mile away in the form of a playoff birth.

I'm pretty certain Lin is going to help this team make the playoffs. I've explained the logic in previous posts. If and when they make it, I'm hoping those who didn't see it coming or view it as a long shot look back and wonder what they missed and why others like myself were so certain.

After all this is a Nets based Jeremy Lin thread. Like the Op said, I speak for myself and nobody else.

If the Nets don't make the playoffs, in my opinion, Jeremy Lin is just a decent backup PG who isn't good enough to be starting on a good NBA team as Matt Moore of CBS Sports recently wrote last month. In fact, if the Nets don't make it, and Lin plays almost all the games, I'll be the first to admit I have terrible basketball analytical skills and that I completely missed the boat on Jeremy Lin and that he isn't that good or the PG savior I predicted him to be for this franchise.

So under your logic I guess John Wall who couldn't get his team in the playoffs last year sucks and much of the rest of the NBA experts who see him as a top 5 NBA PG are all wrong, since Lin will be judged as nothing more than a decent backup if he can't get this very weak roster into the playoffs.

I think John Wall has gotten poor coaching from Randy Whitman and whomever his development team is. He still tends to play inefficiently and his outside shot is not strong enough.

Now that he's getting older and his body is breaking down, he'll struggle even more as his athleticism fades.

Just my opinion.

Wall is 26.

[Vae Victus]

I tend to be optimistic on Lin and the Nets (i estimate their wins at 32). After watching the pre-season games an seeing the dearth of wing talent/experience, i've no doubt that Lin will play 36 mins a night, be allowed to call his own number whenever he wants, shoot the 3 at a ~38% clip (more experience with the new shot form and confidence he's allowed to pull whenever he wants), and also log a bunch of mins at SG. I foresee Lin posting 22/8/4/1.5/1 stats, cuz he's gonna be forced to do EVERYTHING for the team that his body can provide. I see him coughing up 3.5 TOs a game too as he'll be forcing alot of passes to try to get teammates going, but being the primary ball handler for most of his court time means he'll get alot of easy assists (catch and shoot, fast break deflections/steals).

Obvious stat inflation due to the fact that the team is lacking in scoring options after Lin, BroLo, and Bogs. He'll make a strong push for all-star due to the Lin fans in Asia but fall just short.

I see him jacking up 6 3s a game, getting around 8 FTAs a game as he'll be fully unleashed on his penetration game and being a primary option so around 18 FGAs a game on avg. I see him getting his FG% up to around 45% overall in tandem based on his vastly increased 3pt% and being a terror on penetration. His scoring will be very efficient considering how a large part of his game will be predicated on 3s and FTs. He'll be pulling alot of boards as i see Nets wings being forced to crash instead of leaking for fast breaks. He'll up his steal and block avgs simply due to playing more mins.

I see a career year out of Lin that only people who pay attention to him would know is coming from being fully unleashed. Lin and D'Angelo Russell will be competing neck and neck for Most Improved Player of the year

Am i being incredibly optimistic? SURE! Lets hope Lin proves me right!

Edit: In short i'm basically predicting Lin will turn into a Mini-Harden but with more D

[Kytan]

To the regular, moderate Lin posters that I recognize from my time lurking on the CHA forums (e.g. 13th Man, bws94, ChokeFasncists, Roy Tarpley, TinmanZBoy, etc.), I would suggest not bothering to reply to posters with really extreme opinions.

It seems that contents in posts of a handful of posters are written to provoke responses from the more moderate Lin fans (and the long-time Brooklyn fans as well) for their personal entertainment. Do not feed these posts.

Cheers!

[TinmanZBoy]

To the regular, moderate Lin posters that I recognize from my time lurking on the CHA forums (e.g. 13th Man, bws94, ChokeFasncists, Roy Tarpley, TinmanZBoy, etc.), I would suggest not bothering to reply to posters with really extreme opinions.

It seems that contents in posts of a handful of posters are written to provoke responses from the more moderate Lin fans (and the long-time Brooklyn fans as well) for their personal entertainment. Do not feed these posts.

Cheers!

Noted, thanks..

[reelsgm]

To the regular, moderate Lin posters that I recognize from my time lurking on the CHA forums (e.g. 13th Man, bws94, ChokeFasncists, Roy Tarpley, TinmanZBoy, etc.), I would suggest not bothering to reply to posters with really extreme opinions.

It seems that contents in posts of a handful of posters are written to provoke responses from the more moderate Lin fans (and the long-time Brooklyn fans as well) for their personal entertainment. Do not feed these posts.

Cheers!

Or perhaps some of those "moderates" don't care to lumped together and might prefer to use objectivity to decide for themselves what they feel about other opinions?

[MrDollarBills]

Don't feed the troll. this guy called melo and wall scrubs.

Making the playoffs is a team effort. if and when we don't make the playoffs that doesn't fall solely at the feet of Lin this team is horribly flawed

[GoodDayLa]

Lin has Brook Lopez, Bojan, and vets like Scola Booker and some shooters in Harris and Hamilton. Plus all the roster are team first guys with a capable coaching staff. Lin has no excuses because this team is basically built for him and Brook.

You're overrating the Nets. Bojan is one of the worst defensive players in the NBA. Scola is a 36 year old traffic cone. Harris and Hamilton barely have any NBA experience.

The Nets need a couple things to make the playoffs -- (1) some time together to work on their system, which will take more than one year, and (2) a couple better players, whether through free agency, trade, or improvement (like Levert and RHJ).

While I agree with everything you said, I still think this team will squeak into a low seed playoff birth this season.

[bws94]

Let's make this perfectly clear again. An NBA player who does NOT wish to start:
1. Doesn' believe he's good enough (whatever reason: unconfident, unmotivated...)
2. Is on a perennial Championship contender (e.g. Iguodala, Ginobili)
3. Just biding his time for the promotion (e.g. Harden-OKC, Lin-CHA)
4. Some or all of the above

Lin said he "absolutely" wanted to stay in CHA, had unfinished business in CHA, was willing to take a pay cut to stay (google it if you don't believe) - but the instant the starting role became available at midnight on FA day he took it - Don't tell Lin "this whole thing about starting is overstated by some" - Lin made his feelings about starting crystal clear.

Post everything I wrote please since I backed up that point. I'm not talking to Lin or about him specifically. Just how big a 6th man can be on a team's lineup.

Nostalgia of Lin as 6th man is just that - historic/nostalgic - it's not coming back despite the ad nauseum drumbeat of combining "6th man" and "Lin" on the Official Lin thread from some who might wish it.

Lin envisions himself as a starter until he's over-the-hill to the point that he either hangs up his laces or chases a ring if he still doesn't have one.

Give it a rest.

[Jimmyftw]

From Lin's shooting couch:

DS: I can see him averaging 18 points per game, with 7.6 assists, shooting 48 percent from the field, 40 percent from three-point range, and 84 percent from the free throw line.

[ChokeFasncists]

^
How about almost making the playoffs?

Do keep in mind that the East is stronger now.

That's a reasonable suggestion and perhaps the most likely outcome this season. However, I think it's easy to be a Monday morning QB and I personally dont want to be accused of claiming I saw the playoffs coming all the way after the fact. That's why sports are fun.

I'm not sure what you mean.

I guess what I was asking was, if the Nets barely miss the playoffs, would he be considered a scrub? Or what?

[antique0o0]

You probably have to read my post in context...
First I was calling out GooddayLA's post saying "McHale and Byron called Lin a scrub", i did not respond his post directly because I think he is trolling in this board.... so I pointed out McHale never said that, instead he praised Lin plenty...
Second,I did not say or imply anything like "McHale is HOF, he must be a good coach"... I was saying even players like McHale and Manu's calibers could come off bench as the sixth man for the balance of a team, why could not Lin for the Rockets?

McHale, a HOF, and Ginobili, a future HOF, both came off the bench and did great things, does not mean making Lin coming off the bench, behind Beverley and Price, is the right decision.
If your logic stands, one could say that Cavs should let Irving come off the bench. You know, they do need some one to lead the second unit this season, which is certainly not going to happen.

The decision of Lin coming off the bench was never only for balancing any teams. Actually hardly for balancing the team. It's bad coaching and tanking.

What McHale and Scott thought about Lin? They said it out loudly and clearly with their action.
Even Clifford accidently said it in words in an interview...
Actually, not many coaches and GMs in this league think Lin could start. They view him as a sixth man at best, which is a kind of scrub.

Totally disagree that a 6th man is a scrub or viewing Lin as such views him as a scrub. The guys playing in garbage time or 3rd stringers playing in blowouts can be considered scrubs. A 6th man sometimes is one of the biggest and best players on the team, getting close to starters minutes.

This whole thing about starting is where I say it is overstated by some. A lot of starters are complementary players to the two or three stars in the starting lineup. And sometimes a better player is used with the second unit to make sure that when the starters are out, the bench can at least not give up a big lead. If the bench is really good, sometimes the starters play more or less even, and the game is won with the benches. So a strong bench is a part of most really good teams. A guy like a Crawford, Igoudala, Kantor, Lin when he was a 6th men are not scrubs at all, but huge parts of the team they were on.

Lin was viewed as a sixth man after his hornets season only, not after Rockets or Lakers season.
Even in his Hornets season, he wasn't used as the sixth man at the beginning (that's when and why Lamb got his contract) or in the middle (that role was given to Al Jefferson) of that season.
In a recent interview, Lin said he thought he worth more than what people thought about him in the offseason following his Lakers season. Truth is Rockets and Lakers never thought high of him.