GT: Heat @ Nets, 1/23/21, 8pm EST

[Stone]

I think Harden is being asked to play this way. My take is it’s easier to ramp up your offense as the year progresses than try to back off a more dominant role right from the gate. Coach is trying to build chemistry and see where everyone fits. That means he has to be a distributor first and foremost. We all know what he is capable of offensively when left on his own.

Good point. This could be a way of us not showing all of our cards at once. Sort of like the Muhammad Ali "Rope a dope".

We need to remember there is no other team out there this season that has had more starting line up changes than us. We need time to adjust

That said, have never seen this board so disappointed after in a win. I get it, but we need to remember this is not the final product. I'm confidant that Marks will bring in a few more nice pieces.....but even if it does not work out, I would still be glad that we have a GM with enough balls to make the trade. We still have options.

On to the next one

[Hello Brooklyn]

I think Harden is being asked to play this way. My take is it’s easier to ramp up your offense as the year progresses than try to back off a more dominant role right from the gate. Coach is trying to build chemistry and see where everyone fits. That means he has to be a distributor first and foremost. We all know what he is capable of offensively when left on his own.

There is no way Harden is being asked to pass when its him and freaking TLC and Reggie Perry on the court.

He has to be aggressive at some point.

[NetsJets]

I like that Harden tries to get Perry involved.

[drchaos]

It might be healthy for this team if Kyrie doubled down on the defensive side of the ball.

He is every bit as capable of scoring as the other guys but that is not where we are weak.

Kyrie can be very dangerous on the defensive side of the ball if he puts his mind to it.

[Lamak]

Harden playing amazing and showing he can sacrfice shows a lot about him. Kyrie wants to be the 2nd option on this team, I hope he doesnt freeze out teammates in the games that matters. durant best player in the world

[Shark]

I think Harden is being asked to play this way. My take is it’s easier to ramp up your offense as the year progresses than try to back off a more dominant role right from the gate. Coach is trying to build chemistry and see where everyone fits. That means he has to be a distributor first and foremost. We all know what he is capable of offensively when left on his own.

Honestly I don't have any issues with Harden being a facilitator, but how are we going to build any chemistry when we aren't really running any plays when he's out there with the bench? Any time he's out there with the bench most of our sets consist of him being at the top of the key with everyone else watching him or if they do move it's just for a couple of simple dribble hand offs that go nowhere.

There needs to be more movement in those situations. Have Harden make penetrating drives to draw the defense onto him so he can kick it out. Run the PnR with him and Perry. Have TLC and Brown cut and slash so Harden can hit them in motion. The bench has the tools to work well with Harden as a facilitator, but nothing is being done to take advantage of it.

[Hello Brooklyn]

It might be healthy for this team if Kyrie doubled down on the defensive side of the ball.

He is every bit as capable of scoring as the other guys but that is not where we are weak.

Kyrie can be very dangerous on the defensive side of the ball if he puts his mind to it.

Harden simply isn't looking to score on offense though.

We desperately needed all those points from Kyrie to win that game.

Harden can be more of a facilitator but he needs to be super aggressive during the bench minutes. And still be a potent threat when Kyrie/KD are on the floor.

Right now hes not even trying to score.

[Prokorov]

What is Harden giving us that Caris couldn’t have given us based on what we’ve seen so far? He’s supposed to be an upgrade over LeVert, start playing like it.

scoring, shooting, passing, rebunding, and defense.

all those things harden has done better then levert, even with harden having some down games and not clicking yet.

Caris wasnt scoring 30 in his sleep vs the bucks the way harden did

[Prokorov]

Your defensive woes shouldn't be surprising tbh. D'antoni and Nash are trying to recreate the ssol era and we know defense was an afterthought.

defense is not a concern. tunrovers and rebounding are. when we limit teams to 1 shot and dont give them easy point on fast breaks we are solid on that end.

also this offense is nothing like SSOL. we dont even attempt to attack until we have drained the clock 8 or 9 seconds with 4 dribble hand offs. this is methodical movement to get the match up, then letting a star make a play

[Prokorov]

Our inability to contain opposing big men is a serious problem. And I don't know how it's going to get better. We pick up bigs off the garbage heap, fine...they're on the garbage heap for a reason. They're not that good. Most teams could always use a good defensive big that can crash the defensive glass...if a big man is available, it's probably because they don't do those things well.

IDK, I'm really starting to think we're not as good as we thought we were after this trade, mainly because Harden hasn't been nearly as good as advertised and as of right now, we gave up more value than we're getting back. I don't think it's likely we're going to have him, Kyrie, and Durant all play well in the same game, because I don't think they fit well with each other. Harden is pretty useless off ball, and Kyrie has been great, but he loves having the ball too.

Bam had a ton of points but he hardly hurt us in a way that mattered. i mean off the dribble mid range pull ups vs iso 1 on 1 is really a bail out for us even if he is hitting them. honestly that allowed us to go on several big runs because when he did miss it was threes and layups for us and qukc 6-0 and 8-0 runs. they were 100% more dangerous with the dragic pick and roll

our real issue isnt bigs, its the 1-5 pick and roll, which nash refuses to switch or blitz

[Prokorov]

Our inability to contain opposing big men is a serious problem. And I don't know how it's going to get better. We pick up bigs off the garbage heap, fine...they're on the garbage heap for a reason. They're not that good. Most teams could always use a good defensive big that can crash the defensive glass...if a big man is available, it's probably because they don't do those things well.

IDK, I'm really starting to think we're not as good as we thought we were after this trade, mainly because Harden hasn't been nearly as good as advertised and as of right now, we gave up more value than we're getting back. I don't think it's likely we're going to have him, Kyrie, and Durant all play well in the same game, because I don't think they fit well with each other. Harden is pretty useless off ball, and Kyrie has been great, but he loves having the ball too.

Harden since the trade:
24 PPG 8 RPG 12 APG - 61 TS%

Let's not overreact about Harden. This is how he's playing while he's off, slightly out of shape and still developing chemistry with the team.

I mean, we'll see, but he's overall been underwhelming ever since Kyrie came back. I'm not blaming Kyrie because he's been outstanding...I think Harden has been super passive and their fit is just poor right now.

Ultimately, we may have traded our best defensive player for a minimal offensive improvement when it's all said and done. Is that worth it? We ARE getting wrecked by opposing bigs as it stands. And Harden the last 3 games hasn't given us anything Levert couldn't have.

Mainly, Harden needs to step up and play the way he's capable of for us to get to the next level...but our problems in the paint still stand. I mean, the people asking "what are they gonna do when they face Embiid, or Jokic, or Davis, or Vucevic, or Bam, or Giannis, especially in a playoff series?" have a point...what ARE we gonna do? We've already faced Vucevic, Giannis, and Bam since the trade, and they dominated our front lines. And they're 2nd tier offensive bigs...they're not Embiid, Jokic, or Davis.

"underwhelming since Kyrie has come back"

thats 3 games. which included a harden triple double and 20/10 game. We all want James to be more aggressive when one or both of Kyrie/KD is off the floor but he hasnt been as bad as some are making out and as someone said its better this extreme to start out then the other. just his presence helps everyone. Kyri/KD are dropping 30+ on 65+ TS with harden. each.

[Prokorov]

Harden is fine. I would be worried if he were taking 25 shots and suckin but he's obviously just trying to fit in

The only thing stopping Harden from taking 25 shots is himself. He has the ability to get a quality look at a stepback 3, floater, or layup on every possession. Once he gets acclimated and no longer feels like he's imposing on KD and Kyrie he will be fine. Playing with two other elite scorers is clearly an adjustment for him.

some of it is opposing teams. the Cavs zoned the crap out of us as did miami until Joe harris started dropping threes. tough for harden to penetrate when teams go zone but he is making the right plays when they do.

he has clicked with jordan now. cut the turnovers a bit firther and its lights out

Nash needs to play deandre more and more 1-5 pick and rolls out HIGH. like near mid court

[Prokorov]

Why can't we double Adebayo??? I don't understand this idiotic coaching. They have nothing else on offense!

I feel this, but in Nash's defense, our rotations and anticipation have been piss poor all season. I don't truly blame him for not employing aggressive doubling; man defense and junk zone is about as much as we can grasp right now. Lowman, a pass away, we don't have good collective awareness of these basic concepts. I don't know what we're going to do when we face a true superstar, we just can't seem to handle advanced defensive principles.

It was either defend Bam on contested mid range jumpers or allow Robinson and Dragic wide open threes. This was the correct strategy

Yeah. at no point was i worried that Bam was going to beat us with step back mid range jumpers. even when it got down to 2. because he was never going to out do kyrie on mid range pull ups back and forth

[Prokorov]

What is Harden giving us that Caris couldn’t have given us based on what we’ve seen so far? He’s supposed to be an upgrade over LeVert, start playing like it.

A passive, trying to fit-in and not in good shape Harden is still be able to average 23.6 pts, 12 ast and 8 reb with .611 TS% for the Nets.

He is an upgrade over LeVert already.

In these last 3 games he’s not been that good what are you watching? His first 2 games is what we brought him in to be.

Hadrens "not good" = levert at his apex

[Prokorov]

I think Harden is being asked to play this way. My take is it’s easier to ramp up your offense as the year progresses than try to back off a more dominant role right from the gate. Coach is trying to build chemistry and see where everyone fits. That means he has to be a distributor first and foremost. We all know what he is capable of offensively when left on his own.

I don't mind him being a distributor but he's now shying away from shots that he would normally not hesitate on taking.

There is a balance to be had here. We need him to keep defenses honest.

i dont mind if he never shoots when kyrie/KD are on the floor. but when its him + the bench he needs to impose his will.

[Hello Brooklyn]

A passive, trying to fit-in and not in good shape Harden is still be able to average 23.6 pts, 12 ast and 8 reb with .611 TS% for the Nets.

He is an upgrade over LeVert already.

In these last 3 games he’s not been that good what are you watching? His first 2 games is what we brought him in to be.

Hadrens "not good" = levert at his apex

True but not without Prince and Allen, who were critical to our defense.

[Prokorov]

My thoughts....

-Kyrie refused to let us lose this game. he put his cape on and brought it home. this was the perfect example of how clutch shots arent jsut in the last monute. jumper after jumper from 5 minutes in, and solid D to boot.

-Head scratching Nash didnt bring deandre back in. he had played really well. it should have been brown/deandre with the big 3 to close this out. i get having small ball with harris in general. but when we have leads in the 4th bring in deandre/brown and let the big three grind out the scoring. we dont need the death lineup when we have a 8-12 point lead

-Reggie Perry needs to never play again this season. no hate on hm, he was a late second rounder. but he shouldnt be playing minutes for a title contending team.

-Harris getting wide open looks like he is rondo. thats the byproduct of the big 3. they are great scorers but also floor spacers

-KD drops 30 in his sleep on off-nights. i didnt even think he played well and gives us 31 on 17 shots. absurd

-i thought our D played well. they came back inthe fortuh, but some suspect calls/no-calls, bam got like abillion shooters-touch type rolls, and they hit like 50 shots at the buzzer.

-turnovers sitll an issue. would hope this team can get 10 game stretch together to help build that

-Deandre played well. i think he is a 20-25 mpg player, but he can give you 20 outstandin minutes

we scored almost 400 points in 3 games vs top defense.

sick

[DarkXaero]

Harden is fine. I would be worried if he were taking 25 shots and suckin but he's obviously just trying to fit in

The only thing stopping Harden from taking 25 shots is himself. He has the ability to get a quality look at a stepback 3, floater, or layup on every possession. Once he gets acclimated and no longer feels like he's imposing on KD and Kyrie he will be fine. Playing with two other elite scorers is clearly an adjustment for him.

some of it is opposing teams. the Cavs zoned the crap out of us as did miami until Joe harris started dropping threes. tough for harden to penetrate when teams go zone but he is making the right plays when they do.

he has clicked with jordan now. cut the turnovers a bit firther and its lights out

Nash needs to play deandre more and more 1-5 pick and rolls out HIGH. like near mid court

Well the good thing was that we adjusted well to the zone against Miami, so that was good to see. We also saw Jeff Green roaming around the FT line a lot to break up zone.

[drchaos]

It might be healthy for this team if Kyrie doubled down on the defensive side of the ball.

He is every bit as capable of scoring as the other guys but that is not where we are weak.

Kyrie can be very dangerous on the defensive side of the ball if he puts his mind to it.

Harden simply isn't looking to score on offense though.

We desperately needed all those points from Kyrie to win that game.

Harden can be more of a facilitator but he needs to be super aggressive during the bench minutes. And still be a potent threat when Kyrie/KD are on the floor.

Right now hes not even trying to score.

If Harden comes in from day one and hogs the ball for 40-50 points every game chances are we never see Kyrie in a Nets uniform again.

As the team gels Harden should take more shots but with so few core players everyone should feel like they are included.

Harden helping everyone else look good is a really great way to introduce him to the team.

Right now KD, Joe Harris, and even Jeff Green are hitting their threes like a well oiled machine.

Kyrie could focus on defense and still pitch in 12-24 points per game.

[StepBackCrack]

So Harden going full Chris Bosh type of role this season?

Was thinking he will still want to be his superstar self. He looked himself fully in the first 2 games with Durant vs Magic and Bucks. But since then, he has been weirdly passive. And the Kyrie excuse isn't valid in the last game because Kyrie played smart all game and actually moved the ball well and still got great stats. On the other hand, I saw Harden overpassing to inferior bench players all game and it was beyond frustrating to be frank. My point is, there is no good reason Harden is playing this passively even with Kyrie out there.

Nets traded a lot of their future and sacrificed their defense for an all-time great player so having him reduce his aggressiveness/role this much is such a waste. I don't quite see Nets winning a title if Harden wants to be just a good unselfish role player. He needs to be at least close to superstar level if not superstar level. There is no good reason to be this passive imo (since Nash is staggering their minutes and started instructing his players to move the ball more).

That said, Nets' defensive issues are certainly bigger than this issue but still this annoys me a lot.