2017 Nets Offseason Thread III

[Prokorov]

There no way to excuse how terrible his FG% has been his entire time in the league.

Raw FG% is not at all useful. if 100% of your shots where 3 pointers and you had a 38% FG% that wouldnt be bad... because 38% from three is very good. you absolutely have to factor in that half of his shots where from three.

If its just because of the bad 3s hes taking then why is he taking so many bad shots?

And why would he change all of a sudden?

i would change because on the nets KCP would be sharing ball handling duties with 3 or 4 other players. and because the nets are super reliant on analytics and would make it a point to have him take less shots of the dribble and more within the motion offense on catch and shoot.

detroit runs a terible, iso heavy offense. we run a ball sharing motion offense

[Prokorov]

We should just wait till next FA to sign Bradley to a big deal instead.

As others have said, Bradley is 6'2". At that height, he needs to play the 1 unless he's paired with an allstar guard like IT or a much taller guard.

Since Kenny wants multiple ballhandlers in a lineup, I don't see him playing alongside JLin or DAR in the starting lineup. The max I'd be willing to give him is a 5yr/$80mil since I don't want to allocate that much money to a bench player.

I do believe Bradley is probably worth that much, if not more, but due to the makeup of our team, I don't think we can afford to give him more than that if we want to be able to have money for our other starters.

Bradley would play 2 where he always has. We could let Lin walk, move Russell to 1, and play Bradley at 2. Russell would be a tall PG at 6'5". Bradley is worth more than KCP, he's actually a two-way player, who has improved each season. It wouldn't surprise me to see him have a great season in Detroit.

i love avery bradley. he is better then kcp now. but he is also 4 years older and KCP could easily become what bradley is.

id much prefer kcp. he fits our timeline alot better

[hood30]

The more I think about it, the less and less I want Marks to sign KCP to anything above $18 million a season and even that's too much. He's a decent young player, but the worst thing Marks could do is lock the team into some crazy 4/92 kind of deal for him. Ideally the market has completely dried up on him and his agent waves the white flag and takes something reasonable like 4/60.

Exactly...Hope Brooklyn aren't dumb enough to offer this guy huge money when no one is really knocking on his door with a huge contract....There's a reason Detroit are willing to let him go for free.

It's crazy that a guy like KCP could get so much money while putting up weak stats offensively..We're talking about a guy who shot 40%FG and 35% 3PTFG...13ppg on 33 minutes pe game...This is so average and you really want to give this guy 18M for this type of production?...

because teams dont care about raw percentages any more and look much deeper into the analytics. volume matters. his on ball vs. catch and shoot splits matter. his wing and corner percentages matter. when teams look at KCP and see he is elite catch and shoot from three they can say "if we play this guy off the ball he;d be much more efficient"

If you are right about KCP, he'd be long gone by now...He's still on the board for a very good reason......They see what I see...An average offensive player and a slightly above average defender..

Teams are a bit smarter this year when it come to spending their money...Average guys like KCP should not be getting huge deals...Let him sign a 1 year contract to prove himself, but please, don't lock yourself up into a 4 year/18M contract..KCP is simply not worth that type of contract.

This type of contract will be hard to move in the future if things doesn't work out and this guy does not even have a huge market for himself right now...No one wants to pay KCP huge money, so can you imagine what would happen if he does not greatly out-produce his last year statistics.

Rather save the money and SG minutes for LeVert, Whitehead and Lin...No need for a guy that doesn't move the needle much.
Your highest paid player will be dropping 11ppg on 28mpg in Brooklyn..Don't think he'd get 33mpg in Brooklyn.

[Ror1997]

No it wasn't. Everyone knew we were signing Otto Porter.

They even had the date we were meeting with him pinned down.

Haven't even heard of a meeting for KCP yet.

A lot of people made assumptions that we would sign Porter, but there weren't any actual reports of us extending with a contract. We only knew that we met with OPJ because some Lin fans literally did detective work to confirm Lin was in his agents lobby... There were never any official reports.

Read on Twitter

Read on Twitter

Read on Twitter

Look at the time. Jazz literally set up a meeting 2 hours before he agreed to our deal. Hindsight is to 20/20 but to say that it wasn't quiet on the OPJ/nets front prior to the deal isn't even close to being true.

Official reports arent the only way of hearing about things. There was buzz the entire week leading up to his contract that the Nets would sign OPJ.

Haven't heard anything on the KCP front.

If its not an "official report" then it is purely speculation. The exact same speculation KCP and the nets got after detroit renounced his rights.

KCP has been linked to the Nets in the exact same way OPJ was. The same way Carroll was. The same way the DLo trade was.

There was reported interest in the player/type of transaction and nothing else. No reported FA meetings. No reported negotiations. Nothing. Just speculation based on purely on fit/agenda. Show me one tweet from a trusted source that even said the nets opened contract negotiations with Porter.

You literally said the buzz was coming from unofficial reports. That means the buzz was coming from nowhere.

[Papi_swav]

Spurs signed Lauvergne, does this mean they won't be signing Dedmon? they still need to have money to re-sign Gasol so I think we can sneak in and get Dedmon on a bargain contract..

[Paradise]

[tweet]

Read on Twitter

He gives the Nets an over 50 percent chance to sign KCP.


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[JohnStockton]

I wonder if Marks is banking on being the 3rd team in a Knicks/Rockets trade for Carmelo Anthony. IMO, it makes more sense than KCP, though probably not as much as just signing JaMychal Green/filler, or possibly doing nothing at all.

A deal something like this:
http://www.espn.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=ycuytjv5

Except that BRK also gets a HOU 1st, HOU 2nd, and possibly Hartenstein or Zhou Qi (not included in the trade machine link, but they'd both work). Almost no chance HOU adds any of Gordon/Ariza. They need both for their playoff run.

Knicks want a straight salary dump, so the trade machine deal would be better for them if they received one year of Trevor Booker instead of 3 years of Nicholson, but if they get desperate to unload Melo, they might bite the bullet. All the other HOU contracts are unguaranteed, so those contracts vanish with immediate cuts. Basically, the Knicks would trade away Melo's 50M/2years for Nicholson's 18M/3years. That's a relatively decent salary-dump, and they don't have much options, as I doubt any other team would take Anderson except the Nets or Blazers (and it's much trickier for the Blazers to do it). With Booker, they'd get Melo's 50M/2 years off for 9M/1year. Obviously better for them, but I think the Knicks would bite on Nicholson's contract with how badly they seem to want to move Melo. If this happens, Hartenstein/Zhou end up with either the Knicks or Nets--I'm assuming the Knicks--as otherwise, they'd be eating Nicholson just for a Melo dump, and that's too depressing... They'd at least want some sort of legit asset added.

HOU obviously would get Melo, as they wish. They pay a 1st, 2nd, and one young prospect for their troubles. That's about the right amount for them to pay to get rid of Anderson. I don't think Morey would go as high as two 1sts, though that would be the dream.

Either way, Nets get their stretch 4, some draft picks, and Anderson's 20m/year for 3 years--which isn't as bad as it initially sounds if you factor in that you got rid of Nicholson's 6M/year over 3 years. It's basically a net surplus of adding Anderson for 14m/year for 3 years, and you get a few picks out of it. Nets end up with two low 1st RD Picks again in 2018, then they get their own pick once again in 2019.

[Hello Brooklyn]

A lot of people made assumptions that we would sign Porter, but there weren't any actual reports of us extending with a contract. We only knew that we met with OPJ because some Lin fans literally did detective work to confirm Lin was in his agents lobby... There were never any official reports.

Read on Twitter

Read on Twitter

Read on Twitter

Look at the time. Jazz literally set up a meeting 2 hours before he agreed to our deal. Hindsight is to 20/20 but to say that it wasn't quiet on the OPJ/nets front prior to the deal isn't even close to being true.

Official reports arent the only way of hearing about things. There was buzz the entire week leading up to his contract that the Nets would sign OPJ.

Haven't heard anything on the KCP front.

If its not an "official report" then it is purely speculation. The exact same speculation KCP and the nets got after detroit renounced his rights.

KCP has been linked to the Nets in the exact same way OPJ was. The same way Carroll was. The same way the DLo trade was.

There was reported interest in the player/type of transaction and nothing else. No reported FA meetings. No reported negotiations. Nothing. Just speculation based on purely on fit/agenda. Show me one tweet from a trusted source that even said the nets opened contract negotiations with Porter.

You literally said the buzz was coming from unofficial reports. That means the buzz was coming from nowhere.

What are you talking about?

You understand the difference between speculation and reporting right?

There is usually speculation on a contract or trade when it happens. It usually doesn't happen out of the blue.

The Otto Porter contract was being talked every day of the week before it actually happened.

I haven't heard anyone saying anything about KCP being offered anything except the Lakers contract since his rights were renounced.

[ChokeFasncists]

Spurs signed Lauvergne, does this mean they won't be signing Dedmon? they still need to have money to re-sign Gasol so I think we can sneak in and get Dedmon on a bargain contract..

Not sure we should get him cuz we've got Moz and Jar. Lauvergne might have been better actually......

[ChokeFasncists]

bucks fan coming in peace

bucks send: rashad vaughn, john henson
bucks receive: jeremy lin

happy to include something else. what needs to be included?

What's wrong with Henson?

we wont play him.
hes not good.
he doesnt hustle.

That's too bad, wanted him when Lopez was here. What a waste of talent, could have been a very good shot blocker. Did he hustle before getting the contract?

[ChokeFasncists]

On a reasonable contract, the only blemish KCP has is his lack of versatility on offense. Doesn't have the handles or court vision to play PG or consistently make decisions off the pick and roll, too small to guard opposing SFs, in a system where Atkinson prioritizes flexibility. Almost all of our other players can play or has played at least two different positions.

Since the 6'5 Courtney Lee and 6'4 Tony Allen are able to play SF, I think a tough guy like KCP (6'5) should be able to play there some.

[ChokeFasncists]

I wonder if Marks is banking on being the 3rd team in a Knicks/Rockets trade for Carmelo Anthony. IMO, it makes more sense than KCP, though probably not as much as just signing JaMychal Green/filler, or possibly doing nothing at all.

A deal something like this:
http://www.espn.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=ycuytjv5

Except that BRK also gets a HOU 1st, HOU 2nd, and possibly Hartenstein or Zhou Qi (not included in the trade machine link, but they'd both work). Almost no chance HOU adds any of Gordon/Ariza. They need both for their playoff run.

Knicks want a straight salary dump, so the trade machine deal would be better for them if they received one year of Trevor Booker instead of 3 years of Nicholson, but if they get desperate to unload Melo, they might bite the bullet. All the other HOU contracts are unguaranteed, so those contracts vanish with immediate cuts. Basically, the Knicks would trade away Melo's 50M/2years for Nicholson's 18M/3years. That's a relatively decent salary-dump, and they don't have much options, as I doubt any other team would take Anderson except the Nets or Blazers (and it's much trickier for the Blazers to do it). With Booker, they'd get Melo's 50M/2 years off for 9M/1year. Obviously better for them, but I think the Knicks would bite on Nicholson's contract with how badly they seem to want to move Melo. If this happens, Hartenstein/Zhou end up with either the Knicks or Nets--I'm assuming the Knicks--as otherwise, they'd be eating Nicholson just for a Melo dump, and that's too depressing... They'd at least want some sort of legit asset added.

HOU obviously would get Melo, as they wish. They pay a 1st, 2nd, and one young prospect for their troubles. That's about the right amount for them to pay to get rid of Anderson. I don't think Morey would go as high as two 1sts, though that would be the dream.

Either way, Nets get their stretch 4, some draft picks, and Anderson's 20m/year for 3 years--which isn't as bad as it initially sounds if you factor in that you got rid of Nicholson's 6M/year over 3 years. It's basically a net surplus of adding Anderson for 14m/year for 3 years, and you get a few picks out of it. Nets end up with two low 1st RD Picks again in 2018, then they get their own pick once again in 2019.

Nice trade. One problem tho, is that it seems like DMC would be able to play that stretch four role?

[ChokeFasncists]

[tweet]

Read on Twitter

He gives the Nets an over 50 percent chance to sign KCP.


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Caldwell-Pope’s agent Rich Paul is renowned for getting his clients top dollar, and the 6-foot-5 wing was believed to be seeking the maximum. But after he rejected the Pistons’ five-year, $80 million offer, they pulled it. He may have a hard time duplicating that.

Wow, less than 16 per? That means less than 4/64. That would be pretty good.

[Hello Brooklyn]

Lol KCP can't even replicate the 80 million 5 year deal from Detroit?

I knew he would get low balled. Hes definitely worth bringing here for that price. Can easily be moved.

[ChokeFasncists]

https://www.sbnation.com/nba/2017/7/10/15946708/kentavious-caldwell-pope-restricted-nba-free-agency

Caldwell-Pope thought himself worthy of a Porteresque offer sheet. Whether he’s right or wrong, through the first week of free agency no team with interest in chasing restricted free agents agreed. NBA norms would dictate that Caldwell-Pope continue searching for a rich offer as more cap space dried up. We’d get a threat from his agent about taking the qualifying offer in an attempt to pressure the Pistons into offering a deal. Either some stalking horse team would make an offer to force the issue (the ol’ Enes Kanter resolution), Caldwell-Pope and the Pistons would find middle ground, or he’d take the qualifying offer after giving up on the 2017 market (the Greg Monroe doctrine).

Stan Van Gundy, who runs the Pistons, doesn’t do norms. He decided that with Avery Bradley in tow, he had no interest in retaining Caldwell-Pope at the price he is likely to command and rescinded the qualifying offer (making KCP an unrestricted free agent) and renouncing the Pistons’ Bird rights (meaning KCP will not be re-signing with Detroit even as an unrestricted free agent).

Van Gundy’s rash move may have been foolish — we’ll see how Caldwell-Pope pans out, but renouncing valuable players you could still extract value from is usually a bad idea — but it had a huge impact on how the player’s summer will wrap up. There are two routes: A one-year balloon contract with a team preserving cap space for 2017 (hello, Lakers) or a more reasonable, closer-to-market-value multi-year deal (perhaps with the Hawks).

S&T out of the question

[Roddy B for 3]

How would Nets fans feel about Wesley Matthews (18.5M this season, player option at 19.5M next season) + Dwight Powell + 2 2nd rounders + Dallas' 2018 1st top 6 protected (indefinitely) for cap space?

[Hello Brooklyn]

How would Nets fans feel about Wesley Matthews (18.5M this season, player option at 19.5M next season) + Dwight Powell + 2 2nd rounders + Dallas' 2018 1st top 6 protected (indefinitely) for cap space?

We don't have enough cap space for that deal.

But otherwise I would do it.

[Roddy B for 3]

How would Nets fans feel about Wesley Matthews (18.5M this season, player option at 19.5M next season) + Dwight Powell + 2 2nd rounders + Dallas' 2018 1st top 6 protected (indefinitely) for cap space?

We don't have enough cap space for that deal.

But otherwise I would do it.

How much cap do you all have left?

[Vae Victus]

Top 6 protection eh? I'd accept it, cuz the chance at getting a #7-10 pick is too alluring. While i dont expect DAL to be awful i sure as heck dont expect them to be any decent. Dirk is a legend but he's all rickety, however at the same time i have mad respect for Carlisle so i dont see him having the team be utterly awful either.

Matthews add to the glut at wing and he's getting pretty washed up, so his 2nd year option is def getting activated, but i think he's got the size for SF right? Powell is a hyper athlete i think with 2 or 3 years left on his deal? Doesnt really fit the motion offense though, so he might be considered too much dead salary.

Eh, i'd roll the dice but i can understand if many others wont.

[Rockice_24]

Its getting crazy quiet on KCP.

Seems like teams are not interested except for the Lakers on a one year deal.

Was pretty dead on Otto Porter. Heard he set up a meeting with the Jazz and agreed to the Nets offer sheet 30 mins later. I don't think the quietness means much.

Actually the quietness is making me think we have a deal in place for him and since Marks runs a tight ship we wont hear about it until the Porter match is official. When the best FA left on the market isn't even making a peep in the news something is up.