The Official Allen Crabbe Thread

[brook]

Is useless talk to trade Crabbe right now. You can trade him only for another bad contract. And that doesn't make any sense. We must hope Marks was right.

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[LKIRNets]

his postgame presser was a great listen. I hope YES posts it on YouTube.

[MrDollarBills]

his postgame presser was a great listen. I hope YES posts it on YouTube.

what did he say?

[Claud]

Before I pass final judgment I want to see Crabbe under the "Atkinson diet" for a minimum of 2 years.

Even though things generally haven't been going his way this season, I always appreciate the way he competes and plays hard.

I think he's still searching for his role on this team but he definitely is a person that can help us become a better team in the long run
if he can put his game together.

[steady]

Before I pass final judgment I want to see Crabbe under the "Atkinson diet" for a minimum of 2 years.

Even though things generally haven't been going his way this season, I always appreciate the way he competes and plays hard.

I think he's still searching for his role on this team but he definitely is a person that can help us become a better team in the long run
if he can put his game together.

I agree.

From yesterday:
"I think he's a smart defender, he's a long defender, he understands positioning, his rebounding numbers are up over his career, so I think he is an underrated defender, I've said that from the beginning,” said Atkinson, expressing confidence in Crabbe. “He's just a really good all-around player. That's why we love him."

If Atkinson loves him, I am going to trust that he can develop to be a better player, and hold off on judging him until he has had a little more chance to adjust to being here.

[Netaman]

I also agree. Last night's game against Orlando is really the blueprint. 15 points, very good defense against Fournier, 3/6 from three, solid rebounding and a few nice passes. I don't know what the timeline is, but I think he can realistically get to that level of performance and feel like we may as well remain optimistic as long as he's working hard and contributing to wins.

Wes Matthews (who also makes $18M per year) is a comp a lot of us were hoping for in terms of realistic growth and the fact that he has checked off the 'defense' box is a big development. Hopefully he can get hot shooting over the 2nd half of the year too.

[LKIRNets]

his postgame presser was a great listen. I hope YES posts it on YouTube.

what did he say?

After being asked what changed for him defensively.

"I'm low-key tired of hearing people trying to question my defense”

“Coming over here in this new role, there's a lot of expectations now."

“I don't want to be the liability, especially in film the next day if coach points out things that went wrong that night. Just knowing if my shot is not going, obviously I've been in mind of a slump lately, I could impact the game in other ways and I feel like that starts with defense."

They asked how it was different from his days of Portland.

"When you first get to the league they don't need you to score,”

“We already had enough guys on that roster. They just pulled me aside and told me 'how you are going to get recognized on this team is by the energy that you bring.' I feel like it started with that. I had a down year last year with it so, like I said, it's a new team, new chapter for my career, and I wanted to start off right over here."

“I'm just trying to get back to old habits”

“If one thing is not clicking, not one dimensional - I just want to show the arsenal – just expand the game."

Very mature responses, he says he's aware how he ain't playing to expectations, but notes he's working from defense to offense first. So he's using defense and other areas to get him going on offense. First and foremost he doesn't want to be a liability on the court defensively.

[MGrand15]

I get where he's coming from but it's not encouraging to hear a guy averaging 12 PPG talking about not wanting to be a liability on defense The bar should be a bit higher. He's not carrying the offense or anything.

[Prokorov]

I also agree. Last night's game against Orlando is really the blueprint. 15 points, very good defense against Fournier, 3/6 from three, solid rebounding and a few nice passes. I don't know what the timeline is, but I think he can realistically get to that level of performance and feel like we may as well remain optimistic as long as he's working hard and contributing to wins.

Wes Matthews (who also makes $18M per year) is a comp a lot of us were hoping for in terms of realistic growth and the fact that he has checked off the 'defense' box is a big development. Hopefully he can get hot shooting over the 2nd half of the year too.

Wes matthews is an incredibly overpaid role player. i dont think anyone was "hoping" for crabbe to become wes matthews. if thats all he can become, the trade/contract was a collosal failure... crabbe is already better then matthews even by just being a jumpshooter

[vincecarter4pres]

I also agree. Last night's game against Orlando is really the blueprint. 15 points, very good defense against Fournier, 3/6 from three, solid rebounding and a few nice passes. I don't know what the timeline is, but I think he can realistically get to that level of performance and feel like we may as well remain optimistic as long as he's working hard and contributing to wins.

Wes Matthews (who also makes $18M per year) is a comp a lot of us were hoping for in terms of realistic growth and the fact that he has checked off the 'defense' box is a big development. Hopefully he can get hot shooting over the 2nd half of the year too.

Wes matthews is an incredibly overpaid role player. i dont think anyone was "hoping" for crabbe to become wes matthews. if thats all he can become, the trade/contract was a collosal failure... crabbe is already better then matthews even by just being a jumpshooter

Obviously I think he meant prime Wes Matthews, who was an awesome 3&D player, one of the best in the league at that role, in part because of an additional expanded game.

But I was hoping for Wes, because I didn't like the contract to begin with and disliked or at best was on some, "oh well", when the trade went down, because I wouldn't have done that either without one of their 2 higher picks coming back.

At this point, prime Wes Matthews for the final 2 years of Crabbe's contract would be excellent.

[vincecarter4pres]

I get where he's coming from but it's not encouraging to hear a guy averaging 12 PPG talking about not wanting to be a liability on defense The bar should be a bit higher. He's not carrying the offense or anything.

At least you have to like that he sounds intelligent and legible. If Crabbe sounded like Outlol or KCP I'd be even more worried, those dudes sound like they have trouble understanding instructions on a Bluetooth speaker.

[vincecarter4pres]

I feel the plan for Crabbe this year is give him a ton of unnecessary and unrealistic freedom.
Let him make tons of mistakes. Let him be somewhat inefficient. Turn it over. Just get way out of his comfort zone.
But... but... he must play good defense, give effort and think about his mistakes and start understanding things that work as well. This way, once they reel him in next year and going forward, they're hoping he can be mainly 3 and D, but still have the ability to mix it up when necessary and do some basic but needed things with the ball.
A guy you can at least trust to dribble more then twice.

Just like a Wes Matthews in his prime. Or Kerry Kittles.

I think they're just hoping to avoid $19 million a season Anthony Morrow lol.

[Prokorov]

I feel the plan for Crabbe this year is give him a ton of unnecessary and unrealistic freedom.
Let him make tons of mistakes. Let him be somewhat inefficient. Turn it over. Just get way out of his comfort zone.
But... but... he must play good defense, give effort and think about his mistakes and start understanding things that work as well. This way, once they reel him in next year and going forward, they're hoping he can be mainly 3 and D, but still have the ability to mix it up when necessary and do some basic but needed things with the ball.
A guy you can at least trust to dribble more then twice.

Just like a Wes Matthews in his prime. Or Kerry Kittles.

I think they're just hoping to avoid $19 million a season Anthony Morrow lol.

Kittles? kittles was a super athlete who got end to end as fast/faster then anyone, had point gaurd like handles (even played point for us before the injuries/kidd/marbury additions) and dunked like it was going out of style.

[SpeedyG]

As I said before, people expecting immediate returns from Crabbe have their expectations skewed. Sure, we would have liked to seen better and more consistent shooting, but whether he was going to be worth his contract was really more dependent on two things: defense and play making.

We've seen him buy in and be a pretty good defensive player. He's even getting involved in rebounding.

That means the next step is being an improved ball handler and playmaker (either for him or for others). And that really won't show until a full off season or two. With him being injured coming into the year, it shouldn't be a surprise that he's largely the same player as he was in Portland from a skills perspective.

He's a solid 3&D player right now, but him evolving into a more complete player would allow him to eventually take over DMC at SF (assuming it's Levert/Din and Russ at Gs) next season.

[Prokorov]

As I said before, people expecting immediate returns from Crabbe have their expectations skewed. Sure, we would have liked to seen better and more consistent shooting, but whether he was going to be worth his contract was really more dependent on two things: defense and play making.

We've seen him buy in and be a pretty good defensive player. He's even getting involved in rebounding.

That means the next step is being an improved ball handler and playmaker (either for him or for others). And that really won't show until a full off season or two. With him being injured coming into the year, it shouldn't be a surprise that he's largely the same player as he was in Portland from a skills perspective.

He's a solid 3&D player right now, but him evolving into a more complete player would allow him to eventually take over DMC at SF (assuming it's Levert/Din and Russ at Gs) next season.

yea, he cant be a complete non threat the second he puts the ball on the floor. he also needs to be at least an average defender to be a "3 and D" guy... if not an above average-good defender. he isnt the trash defender he was the last 3 years, but he also is still a pretty clear negative statistically and subpar with the eye test. he uses his length well but beyond that he needs to be able to stay with his guy when he doesnt pull up and cut down on the fouls

[Netaman]

Wes Matthews is and always has been a hopeful comp for Crabbe for a number of reasons. He's a 3 & D second round pick who was signed to a big contract early in his career as an RFA and lived up to it. The RFA aspect alone puts him and Crabbe together in a very small subset. Further, he's never been viewed as an immovable contract, even now when he's past his prime and makes the same AAV that Crabbe does - $18M. I don't think it was a coincidence that Crabbe got 4/$75M just 1 summer after the Mavs gave Matthes 4/$70M on the open market. Matthews set the market for higher end 3 & D guys. Offensively Crabbe really only needed to make subtle improvements to reach Matthews peak. If the expectation was for Crabbe to be better than one of the better 3&D guys in the NBA over the last decade than that's the problem right there - unrealistic expectations.

Defense was by far the biggest question mark with that comp coming into this season, and if you don't think Crabbe has done a good job on the defensive end I don't know what to say. This is a bad defensive team, mostly because they have to play so undersized, and he's been one of the bright spots - contesting shots, getting his hands on balls, and especially grabbing rebounds when they are playing without any true big men.

[MrDollarBills]

honestly if crabbe made 7 mil less this wouldn't be an issue lol

[Netaman]

honestly if crabbe made 7 mil less this wouldn't be an issue lol

They did conveniently dump a $7M dead weight for the next 3 years as part of the deal to get Crabbe. So if you believe we got the pick from WAS more because of our willingness to take back Nicholson than acquire Bogdonovic, in return for taking on Crabbe Portland helped absorb a good chunk of the cost we paid to get Jarrett Allen.

[TheBrooklynKidd]

honestly if crabbe made 7 mil less this wouldn't be an issue lol

They did conveniently dump a $7M dead weight for the next 3 years as part of the deal to get Crabbe. So if you believe we got the pick from WAS more because of our willingness to take back Nicholson than acquire Bogdonovic, in return for taking on Crabbe Portland helped absorb a good chunk of the cost we paid to get Jarrett Allen.

This is spot on. They had no plans to keep Bogdanovic and didn’t even try. Exactly the way we should be thinking about Crabbe. He was the equivalent of a 36 mill/3 year FA signing. Only difference is that he can’t be traded as easily as someone actually on that deal.

Anyone who refuses to admit that those two are basically equivalent has an agenda.

[TheNetsFan]

honestly if crabbe made 7 mil less this wouldn't be an issue lol

They did conveniently dump a $7M dead weight for the next 3 years as part of the deal to get Crabbe. So if you believe we got the pick from WAS more because of our willingness to take back Nicholson than acquire Bogdonovic, in return for taking on Crabbe Portland helped absorb a good chunk of the cost we paid to get Jarrett Allen.

This is spot on. They had no plans to keep Bogdanovic and didn’t even try. Exactly the way we should be thinking about Crabbe. He was the equivalent of a 36 mill/3 year FA signing. Only difference is that he can’t be traded as easily as someone actually on that deal.

Anyone who refuses to admit that those two are basically equivalent has an agenda.

It's nice to think about it as only about $7mil of dead money still on the roster, but it still limits flexibility more than Nicholson & no Crabbe would have. $7mil can be squeezed into a larger deal. $7mil can be stretched & not be a cap killer. You have little choice but to ride out $19mil.