2017 Nets Offseason Thread III

Keith Van Horn · Post #841 » by **Keith Van Horn** » Thu Jul 13, 2017 6:15 pm

was Green renounced yet? Wouldn't be upset if we worked a S&T for green/RHJ

moonpie · Post #842 » by **moonpie** » Thu Jul 13, 2017 6:17 pm

Claud · Post #843 » by **Claud** » Thu Jul 13, 2017 6:26 pm

If no further moves made this is how I currently see the rotations...

Lin-Archie-Dinwiddie
DAR-IW-SK
CL-HARRIS-
DMC-RHJ-ACY
MOZ-BOOK-ALLEN-Nicholson

Note: Still need to move Nicholson, bring in a stretch big and maybe another true SF.

steady · Post #844 » by **steady** » Thu Jul 13, 2017 6:38 pm

I can see Knicks being interested in A Crabbe if Blazers wanted to offload that contract. Crabbe is 25.

"The Knicks' front office has been privately saying that the organization's marching orders are now focusing on players 25 years old and younger, league sources said."

Crazy?

DarkXaero · Post #845 » by **DarkXaero** » Thu Jul 13, 2017 6:40 pm

I don't Simmons on a short 1-2 year deal. He had a bad season after a very good first one but he's still good defensively, athletic, and he also played well in the playoffs this year (shot much better in playoffs than regular season).

Paradise · Post #846 » by **Paradise** » Thu Jul 13, 2017 7:02 pm

DarkXaero wrote:I don't Simmons on a short 1-2 year deal. He had a bad season after a very good first one but he's still good defensively, athletic, and he also played well in the playoffs this year (shot much better in playoffs than regular season).

Yeah, I'm kind of baffled by some of these posts. You'd want a guy who has the defensively skills and athleticism of a Simmons. He's pushing 28 but so is Ja. Green. So, I don't see the difference. This is the part of FA when you add guys who can help build the identity the team will need to sustain consistently. Simmons should've been a Net a long time ago and nobody expects to max him either so it's not even about the money right now.

Btw, all this talk about 'shooting' reminds me of last summer. How did that go? We signed a bunch of 37%-40% shooters like Scola, Harris, Vasquez and they didn't do anything much on that side of the ball and were awful defensively.

I'd rather bet on some athletic talent with some offensive deficiencies because finding and developing offense in this league isn't too hard and scoring was hardly our issue last season.

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Sleepyazn · Post #847 » by **Sleepyazn** » Thu Jul 13, 2017 7:26 pm

Paradise wrote:
DarkXaero wrote:I don't Simmons on a short 1-2 year deal. He had a bad season after a very good first one but he's still good defensively, athletic, and he also played well in the playoffs this year (shot much better in playoffs than regular season).

Yeah, I'm kind of baffled by some of these posts. You'd want a guy who has the defensively skills and athleticism of a Simmons. He's pushing 28 but so is Ja. Green. So, I don't see the difference. This is the part of FA when you add guys who can help build the identity the team will need to sustain consistently. Simmons should've been a Net a long time ago and nobody expects to max him either so it's not even about the money right now.

Btw, all this talk about 'shooting' reminds me of last summer. How did that go? We signed a bunch of 37%-40% shooters like Scola, Harris, Vasquez and they didn't do anything much on that side of the ball and were awful defensively.

I'd rather bet on some athletic talent with some offensive deficiencies because finding and developing offense in this league isn't too hard and scoring was hardly our issue last season.

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RT our roster is completely devoid of any real explosion around the rim, outside of Allen but he a rook so who knows.

Prokorov · Post #848 » by **Prokorov** » Thu Jul 13, 2017 7:34 pm

Karate Diop wrote:https://sports.yahoo.com/nba/players/5526/splits

I'd be wary of giving Simmons a very large deal given that he'll be 28 before the season begins and saw his stats fall across the board after his fairytale rookie year.

A Trevor Booker kind of deal seems fair, though I'm not sure he'll go for it given that that's what the Spurs appeared to be offering.

yeah... people knock KCP for his offense/shooting. simmons makes him look like larry bird. If he spurs are renouncing him its probably for a good reason. and that reason is because he was absolutely horrenouds despite being in a system that turns crap into gold on the regular.

i dont want Simmons, even on the cheap

Prokorov · Post #849 » by **Prokorov** » Thu Jul 13, 2017 7:36 pm

Ror1997 wrote:3/27 - 3/33 is what I'd offer. Not going over board for Simmons. He's valuable as a 2 way player not as a building block.

11 million for simmons is a massive overpay. no way he is worth like nearly double patrick patterson money. why eat up most of our cap for a guy closer to 30 who isnt very good and doesnt move the needle?

Prokorov · Post #850 » by **Prokorov** » Thu Jul 13, 2017 7:39 pm

Keith Van Horn wrote:was Green renounced yet? Wouldn't be upset if we worked a S&T for green/RHJ

I would be. why do we want to trade a 22 year old on a rookie deal for a 28 year older on a larger deal? Green isnt much better then RHJ right now, let alone if RHJ improves and RHJ is already the better defender

ghostpotato · Post #851 » by **ghostpotato** » Thu Jul 13, 2017 7:41 pm

How about these trades?

http://www.espn.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=y8hartme

http://www.espn.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=ybnuqzf4

The Nets get a Blazers first round pick, the Knicks get a Rockets first round pick, Bulls get a second round pick from the Bucks, Nets get a first round pick from the Thunder. There may additional 2nd round picks to even things out.

Prokorov · Post #852 » by **Prokorov** » Thu Jul 13, 2017 7:44 pm

Paradise wrote:Yeah, I'm kind of baffled by some of these posts. You'd want a guy who has the defensively skills and athleticism of a Simmons. He's pushing 28 but so is Ja. Green. So, I don't see the difference.

I dont want simmons or green

This is the part of FA when you add guys who can help build the identity the team will need to sustain consistently. Simmons should've been a Net a long time ago and nobody expects to max him either so it's not even about the money right now.

What does simmons help as an awful offensive player and above average defender? We have Demarre Carroll as a culture building player along with Lin and Mozgov. Simmons is a terrible fit and poor player

Btw, all this talk about 'shooting' reminds me of last summer. How did that go? We signed a bunch of 37%-40% shooters like Scola, Harris, Vasquez and they didn't do anything much on that side of the ball and were awful defensively.

Like Lin, all 3 battled injuries. when healthy they played well. Harris led the team in 3 point shooting last year (Acy didnt qualify).

I'd rather bet on some athletic talent with some offensive deficiencies because finding and developing offense in this league isn't too hard and scoring was hardly our issue last season.

Defense was a bigger problem then offense but our offense was still not great. especially range shooting. and we have athletes who defend like RHJ. Simmons isnt even that great of a defender. id rather look for an athlete from the dleague who is younger then hope a 28 year old can become decent on offense.

if we are going to go with an older athlete... green makes much more sense since he is decent on offense already

Prokorov · Post #853 » by **Prokorov** » Thu Jul 13, 2017 7:46 pm

ghostpotato wrote:How about these trades?

http://www.espn.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=y8hartme

http://www.espn.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=ybnuqzf4

The Rockets, Blazers, and Thunder would also give out first round picks. There may be 2nd round picks to even things out.

hate the crabbe trade

love the fergeson trade

PG13 · Post #854 » by **PG13** » Thu Jul 13, 2017 7:47 pm

Caveat: Everyone looks better playing for Pop.

Keith Van Horn · Post #855 » by **Keith Van Horn** » Thu Jul 13, 2017 7:48 pm

I guess I'd rather see a deal worked for crabbe where we can pull out a future first rounder than giving Simmons a deal. They can top 5-8 protect it, but I'd want it for 2 years from now, and maybe a second rounder too. However Nicholson needs to be sent out of here in return. Things are getting crazy with the amount of cap we're eating. Crabbe can easily fit into our rotation and get 25 minutes a night still and be a productive player.
Crabbe, 2019 protected first, 2020 second for Harris or Kilpatrick and Nicholson. I don't think that kills us in long run does it?

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Paradise · Post #856 » by **Paradise** » Thu Jul 13, 2017 7:51 pm

PG13 wrote:Caveat: Everyone looks better playing for Pop.

Yet, alot of us advocated for a Danny Green trade and Patty Mills signing. That doesn't make much sense if Pop makes everyone look better because by that logic, they will be scrubs everywhere else they go. Can't have it both ways.

Simmons looks good because he looked good before the Spurs signed him and Billy King dropped the ball. He's an athletic lengthy wing, slasher, cutter and defender. The Spurs played to his strengths. Signing here means he gets atleast the same amount of dunks and fast break points with our style of play and the fact we've got plenty of good passing guards.

DartboardT · Post #857 » by **DartboardT** » Thu Jul 13, 2017 8:03 pm

To be fair, it wasn't at all clear if Scola (36 at the time, playing in DMC's favorite iso offense, LOL) or Vasquez (look at his 2015-16 Bucks season stats) had much left in the tank, esp. for an uptempo offense. When your baseline is Dloading instead of say Foye, great guy that he is, it's easier to assess system fit.

Paradise wrote:
DarkXaero wrote:I don't Simmons on a short 1-2 year deal. He had a bad season after a very good first one but he's still good defensively, athletic, and he also played well in the playoffs this year (shot much better in playoffs than regular season).

Yeah, I'm kind of baffled by some of these posts. You'd want a guy who has the defensively skills and athleticism of a Simmons. He's pushing 28 but so is Ja. Green. So, I don't see the difference. This is the part of FA when you add guys who can help build the identity the team will need to sustain consistently. Simmons should've been a Net a long time ago and nobody expects to max him either so it's not even about the money right now.

Btw, all this talk about 'shooting' reminds me of last summer. How did that go? We signed a bunch of 37%-40% shooters like Scola, Harris, Vasquez and they didn't do anything much on that side of the ball and were awful defensively.

I'd rather bet on some athletic talent with some offensive deficiencies because finding and developing offense in this league isn't too hard and scoring was hardly our issue last season.

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MGrand15 · Post #858 » by **MGrand15** » Thu Jul 13, 2017 8:08 pm

Paradise wrote:
DarkXaero wrote:I don't Simmons on a short 1-2 year deal. He had a bad season after a very good first one but he's still good defensively, athletic, and he also played well in the playoffs this year (shot much better in playoffs than regular season).

Yeah, I'm kind of baffled by some of these posts. You'd want a guy who has the defensively skills and athleticism of a Simmons. He's pushing 28 but so is Ja. Green. So, I don't see the difference. This is the part of FA when you add guys who can help build the identity the team will need to sustain consistently. Simmons should've been a Net a long time ago and nobody expects to max him either so it's not even about the money right now.

Btw, all this talk about 'shooting' reminds me of last summer. How did that go? We signed a bunch of 37%-40% shooters like Scola, Harris, Vasquez and they didn't do anything much on that side of the ball and were awful defensively.

I'd rather bet on some athletic talent with some offensive deficiencies because finding and developing offense in this league isn't too hard and scoring was hardly our issue last season.

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Our scoring was pretty awful last year. We just played at a ridiculously high pace so it looked cute. I'm not saying we should pass up on defense first guys but offense isn't a cake walk. We just lost our best scorer too.

FlipFlopShot · Post #859 » by **FlipFlopShot** » Thu Jul 13, 2017 8:09 pm

Next year free agency looks restricted heavy unless they sign extensions. We may want to spend our cap now or keep as much of the flex as we can for poaching next off season. Or we can just focus on salary dumps because that seems to be the only good thing going for us.

Rockice_24 · Post #860 » by **Rockice_24** » Thu Jul 13, 2017 8:19 pm

We need to not sign anyone else. Maybe a 1-year deal for a stretch big but that's it. We need to stay flexible now and look for the next dump. Every day there is another team looking to dump a player so we need to be there to help them do so.

I wanted Green but the DMC deal was even better, no need for Green anymore.

Time to stand pat and let the young guys develop. I look forward to a crazy fun bench to watch with Goodwin, Dinwiddie , IW, Levert, Booker, Allen