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***This whole scenario is contingent upon us winning the lottery and selecting Wall.***

OK, here's a deal I cooked up this morning. I wanted to debut it on the Trades and Transactions board, but first, I'd like to hear Nets fans' feedback. Are we overpaying? Is this a worthwhile pursuit? Here's the deal:

Trade ID# 5505418

Indiana Trade Breakdown
Incoming Players: Devin Harris, Yi Jianlian
Outgoing Players: Danny Granger, AJ Price
IND shores up the PG position.
Harris, Rush, Dunleavy, Murphy, Hibbert
Ford, Jones, (Aminu), Jianlian, Foster


Minnesota Trade Breakdown
Incoming Players: Danny Granger, Chris Douglas-Roberts
Outgoing Players: Kevin Love
MIN unclogs the PF position and gets an elite swingman rotation.
Flynn, (Turner), Granger, Jefferson, [Milicic]
Sessions, Roberts, Brewer, Pecherov, Holins


New Jersey Trade Breakdown
Incoming Players: AJ Price, Kevin Love
Outgoing Players: Devin Harris, Yi Jianlian, Chris Douglas-Roberts
NJN opens up enough capspace to sign two major FAs, while improving the PF position.
(Wall), [Johnson], [James], Love, Lopez
Price, Lee, Williams, (Babbitt), (Varnado)

No way Indy does this IMO.
Love Love, so this is an easy yes for us, plus it opens up cap space, absolutely!
Minny probably does this as well, can't really see them turning this down.
Again, not a snow cone chance in hell Indy does this as far as I'm concerned.

How much cap room does this actually give us?

I agree with the previous post that Indy laughs at this deal, but I'm obviously intrigued by it.

My only question is who would we add? Why would we acquire Kevin Love when we'd probably plan on using the cap room for a max deal on a PF? Don't get me wrong I would love Kevin Love on our team and am open for trading for him. I just don't know what we'd do with that Cap room. Personally, I don't think we'd go after 2 max deals. We'd go after Lebron or Wade then split the rest of the room over 3 solid bench/spot start players to give us depth. If we miss out on them, we put all our chips into the basket in 2011 for Melo.

As others have said, this deal is wretched for Indy and honestly its hardly a slam dunk for Minnesota.

This deal would effectively give us $9mil more in capspace. IF you ascribe to the belief that Kris Humphries will opt out of the final year of his contract ( ), then we would have $34mil in capspace after all roster and 1st-round pick salary holds, enough for TWO max FAs. Even if he doesn't opt out, though, that still leaves us with enough for one max FA offer, and and another near-max with a starting salary in the $14mil neighborhood. If Joe Johnson won't take a $3mil paycut for this gargantuan winning machine of a lineup, then we don't need him.

Now, I'm interested to hear how we might remedy this "IND declines" issue. Yi has to hold more trade value than Price, and I thought that that'd be enough to offset the difference between Devin and Danny; maybe I'm wrong. We could offer Courtney Lee, the former Indianapolis HS basketball star. But they already have a SG prospect they're grooming (Brandon Rush), as well as a reliable backup (Dahntay Jones). And I think he'd work great off the bench with T-Will and AJ Price; I'd hate to lose him if the Pacers don't value them as we do. We could send the DAL 1st, or even the GSW '11 1st. I'll have to see what Pacers and Wolves fans think...

ecuhus1981 wrote:Now, I'm interested to hear how we might remedy this "IND declines" issue.

By taking us or them completely out of this deal?

Indy is not going to move Granger for many players in the league. For better or worse he is the face of their franchise right now and the lone bright spot. I think they would have to be able to dump one of their bad contracts and bring back a player with big time potential on a rookie deal.
Maybe if they got a close to All Star level starter and a nice rookie/rookie deal type of guy for him, or two high level rookie deal guys?
Something like Devin Harris/T Will/Dallas pick and some slight salary relief, maybe.
Maybe Kevin Love and Flynn? That might be too much for Minny to give up though.
I'm trying to think of some others.
Maybe something with the Clippers for Eric Gordon and the 8th pick for Granger, Rush and salary relief? They bring back a hometown guy with a ton of potential and a mid lotto pick and clear out a bunch of long term salary. Clips might scoff at that though, not sure.

No Thanks!

I really doubt IND does this. The whole point of getting harris would be to help Granger. Why would they trade Granger.

I would still trade Harris to IND for their lottery pick, TJ ford and another one of their young guys.

I think a trade to PHI is more realistic. They arent going to move AI or Brand unless the people with cap space cant land any good FA. So a trade of Harris for 2010 pick and expiring makes more sense.

Yo what up SIC?! Long time no see.

vincecarter4pres wrote:Yo what up SIC?! Long time no see.

I am always around, VC4Pres.

Cant wait to the draft. I am officially a turner fan.

I am also for going after David Lee if he is willing to take $8mill.

whoa, there. You had Danny Granger for the Nets and should have stopped right there.

S.I.C. GM wrote:Cant wait to the draft. I am officially a turner fan.

And another one converted.

This trade should be a lot simpler then you made it. If The pacers are giving up Granger and Price and getting Harris and YI, then Granger should be going to the Nets. Get an elite scorer at the SF position. Playmaker at PG, low post guy at C, shooter at SG, playmaker off the bench and add a rebounding PF and its a championship contender.

But i think Indy laughs at a Harris for Granger swap.

The idea i had to make it worth while for them is to do that unthinkable. Trade Lopez.

Harris and Lopez for Granger and Hibbert.
Go after Boozer HARD.

PG-Wall (playmaker)
SG-Lee (shooter)
SF-Granger (elite scorer)
PF-Boozer (low post/rebounder)
C-Hibbert (defender)
Twitt - playmaker off the bench, main 6th man. Should leave money to get a solid shooter off the bench too.

Though I've been impressed with Hibbert (I thought he was gonna be terrible in the NBA), I wouldn't do that deal in a million years.

With that said, I feel 3 most realistic destinations for Devin is Sacramento, Washington and Indiana. All 3 of those teams could use a better PG than they got. In Sacramento's case, I feel Tyreke needs to be playing off the ball at the 2-guard. I'm starting to believe that we'll need a 3rd team though. Send Devin to Sacto, Wash or Indy and package Yi/CDR or Yi/Dallas's pick to the 3rd team, getting better 1st round pick and a rookie contract PF or SF in return. Of course, this hinders on us taking Wall. If we get #2 and take Turner, there is no point to trade Harris.

Preludepunk27 wrote:Though I've been impressed with Hibbert (I thought he was gonna be terrible in the NBA), I wouldn't do that deal in a million years.

With that said, I feel 3 most realistic destinations for Devin is Sacramento, Washington and Indiana. All 3 of those teams could use a better PG than they got. In Sacramento's case, I feel Tyreke needs to be playing off the ball at the 2-guard. I'm starting to believe that we'll need a 3rd team though. Send Devin to Sacto, Wash or Indy and package Yi/CDR or Yi/Dallas's pick to the 3rd team, getting better 1st round pick and a rookie contract PF or SF in return. Of course, this hinders on us taking Wall. If we get #2 and take Turner, there is no point to trade Harris.

You make that deal for Granger. Hibbert is someone that can start and is still developing and getting better, he wont be a 20/10 but who needs one anyway. Granger is a legit scoring power house, great shooting SF all-star. I think he's worth it.

You base your Sactown deal on the idea that Evans should play off the ball. I completely disagree with that. I think Devin and Evans could not coexist at all and dont understand why you think Evans is not a PG. The Wizards still have Arenas and he is pretty untradable, so it doesn't make such sense for them to be interested in Devin either.

Pacers are definitely the top choice. But they aren't giving Granger just for Devin and i dont want something like Murphy for him, Devin is worth more then that.

Just a "My Big Fat Rob Babcock and Isiah Thomas Wedding" LOL at trading Lopez to get a 27 year old(28 at the end of next season) Danny Granger.
There are so few situations I would trade Lopez in and this is just not one of them.

True centers that can score and defend don't grow on trees every day. There is a guy or two that ends up like Granger by the time they're 28 every year in the draft. Guys like Brook show up in the draft every few years. If someone knocks his leadership ability one more time I'm gonna get out my 9 iron and start swinging. The guy is 21 years old and is already one of the best centers in the game. Granger didn't show he could be leader/face of a franchise until he was 25.

I'm just saying, you trade Brook only when you absolutely have to. For Danny Granger, as good as he is, that isn't a trade I feel Brook needs to be included in. Indiana is going about rebuilding all wrong. They can't get legit free agents to sign with them so they HAVE to build through draft. With our assets, trust me we could get Granger without giving up Brook or Twill. Would it be fair for fans no, but we could most certainly give them what their management would want. Harrs/expirings/Yi/CDR/multiple first round picks.

Preludepunk27 wrote:There is a guy or two that ends up like Granger by the time they're 28 every year in the draft.

I'm just saying, you trade Brook only when you absolutely have to. For Danny Granger, as good as he is, that isn't a trade I feel Brook needs to be included in. Indiana is going about rebuilding all wrong. They can't get legit free agents to sign with them so they HAVE to build through draft. With our assets, trust me we could get Granger without giving up Brook or Twill. Would it be fair for fans no, but we could most certainly give them what their management would want. Harrs/expirings/Yi/CDR/multiple first round picks.

Granger is one of maybe 6 or 7 legit perimeter scores in the league. The others being James, Melo, Durrant, Kobe, Wade and ? Hardly a guy or 2 every draft. Interestingly enough, all in the play-offs.

Why is it so important to have a center that scores and defends? And the defends part is very arguable when it comes to Brook. How many "dominant big men" are in the play-offs compared to dominant perimeter players? How many are out?

With the peaces we already have and the addition of Wall (this trade is based on assumption that we get the #1) a great scorer/shooter at the SF spot is a perfect fit on this team. A legit #1 option Granger, a playmaker Wall and a shooter Lee with another playmaker Twitt off the bench. There is no need for a 20/10 center, just one that can be a finisher off all the plays those guys will be making and a defender. Hibbert can handle that and the defense maybe even gets better. Add DLee or Boozer at PF.

I dont see the Pacers giving him up for anything less then Brook. You gotta give up something good to get something good. I like the build of the team much better with Granger and without Brook then the other way around.

demens wrote:Granger is one of maybe 6 or 7 legit perimeter scores in the league. The others being James, Melo, Durrant, Kobe, Wade and ? Hardly a guy or 2 every draft. Interestingly enough, all in the play-offs.

I think you forgot a few...
Brandon Roy
OJ Mayo
Joe Johnson
Paul Pierce
Stephen Jackson
Kevin Martin
Gilbert Arenas
Corey Maggette

Thanks for playing, come again.

vincecarter4pres wrote:

demens wrote:Granger is one of maybe 6 or 7 legit perimeter scores in the league. The others being James, Melo, Durrant, Kobe, Wade and ? Hardly a guy or 2 every draft. Interestingly enough, all in the play-offs.

I think you forgot a few...
Brandon Roy
OJ Mayo
Joe Johnson
Paul Pierce
Stephen Jackson
Kevin Martin
Gilbert Arenas
Corey Maggette

Thanks for playing, come again.

Brandon Roy and JJ are the only 2 that are close to that level and they dont score as many points as Granger does.

OJ Mayo? Elite perimeter scorer OJ Mayo? There is a difference between scoring 25 a game for 2 years and scoring 18.

Pierce? You mean finals MVP Paul Pierce? If he wasn't so old i would have included him, cause certainly he is not the type that grow on trees.

Gilbert is a chucker but ok.
SJax is a joke. Maggette is an even bigger joke, you might as well include RJ in that list. Kev Martin is not an elite scorer either.

demens wrote:

vincecarter4pres wrote:

demens wrote:Granger is one of maybe 6 or 7 legit perimeter scores in the league. The others being James, Melo, Durrant, Kobe, Wade and ? Hardly a guy or 2 every draft. Interestingly enough, all in the play-offs.

I think you forgot a few...
Brandon Roy
OJ Mayo
Joe Johnson
Paul Pierce
Stephen Jackson
Kevin Martin
Gilbert Arenas
Corey Maggette

Thanks for playing, come again.

Brandon Roy and JJ are the only 2 that are close to that level and they dont score as many points as Granger does.

OJ Mayo? Elite perimeter scorer OJ Mayo? There is a difference between scoring 25 a game for 2 years and scoring 18.

Pierce? You mean finals MVP Paul Pierce? If he wasn't so old i would have included him, cause certainly he is not the type that grow on trees.

Gilbert is a chucker but ok.
SJax is a joke. Maggette is an even bigger joke, you might as well include RJ in that list. Kev Martin is not an elite scorer either.

I want to let it be known, I'm not a big fan of a lot of the guys I listed, but I was just making a point that there are numerous "elite" level perimeter scorers.
Joe Johnson and Roy may not put up the same raw ppg #'s but they don't need to and are both the absolutely superior facilitators.
Kevin Martin's efficiency has been almost legendary at times.
Maggette is also quite efficient, as is Arenas even if he seems like/somewhat can be, a chucker.
OJ Mayo is part of a seriously stacked lineup and is only in his second season.
His TS and eFG%'s are comparable to Granger's now. He scores only 7ppg less on 4 fewer attempts per game. There is no doubt in my mind with more experience and more shots he would be similar.
If you want to just go by raw #'s S Jax is right there as well, although he isn't very efficient, I guess he was a reach though.
Paul Pierce maybe old, but he is still elite.

Granger is obviously more gifted and the better scorer then these guys and I would love him on this team, but the difference between him and most of these guys isn't as wide and clear cut as it seems on the surface.