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What's happening in Twolves land...

Posted: Sat Jun 19, 2010 7:40 pm
by enetric
I think its important to keep an eye what's going on here. I think this is the team with the most flexibility to make trades. Not players for the big names in free agency. They have a high pick but doubtful its for the guy they covet. They have assets their fans think not going anywhere...but those assets are duplications...and their biggest prospect clearly doesnt want to be there.

While I give Minny all the respect in the world for standing their ground...I have this feeling they are going to end having to deal Rubio sooner or later anyway. Sucks...but I think they are in a bad spot. I doubt any Minny fans will pass by and agree with that...but we have seen it before. Yi for one example doing it to the Bucks. Kobe doing it us out of HS.

Anyway, some info on what is being said out there. As always look at all of it and read between the lines. Its not always what they say but how they say it and what is happening around town that can help you see the big picture.

http://www.canishoopus.com/2010/6/18/1525554/wolves-updates-6-18-part-2#storyjump

Wolves Updates 6/18 Part 2
by SG on Jun 18, 2010 8:48 PM PDT 73 comments, 73 new


Kahn says it's unlikely team will trade 4th pick, Hoopsworld "hearing" Big Al's name in possible draft day trade scenarios, Wolves want Rubio to feel like part of the team, more draft workouts and more


[url]From Charley Walters/Pioneer Press:[/url]

The NBA draft is Thursday, and there are have all sorts of rumors about the Minnesota Timberwolves trading their No. 4 overall pick.

"Highly, highly, highly, highly unlikely," Wolves president David Kahn said this morning.

As for the possibility of trading rights to Spanish guard Ricky Rubio, who was the Wolves' top draft pick (No. 5 overall) a year ago, Kahn reiterated, "I don't anticipate trading him. I feel very strongly that Ricky Rubio should start his career with us here in a Minnesota Timberwolves uniform, and I look forward to that day a year from now."



[url]From the Timberwolves:[/url]

The following potential 2010 NBA draft picks will be working out for the Timberwolves next Monday: Damion James, Paul George, Tyren Johnson, Landon Milbourne, Ryan Wittman and Mikhail Torrance.



[url]From Jonah Ballow's twitter account:[/url]

Just arrived at the 1st #NBA draft workout today. White, Stephenson, Crawford, & Anderson



[url]From Jonah Ballow/Timberwolves site:[/url]

The Friday morning workout session featured four shooting guards battling at the Wolves practice facility. Obviously, Minnesota would like to acquire a scoring threat at the shooting guard position in Thursday's NBA Draft. Each prospect offers a different skill set that should translate to the next level. During the session, the assistant coaches ran the players through a variety of drills to test their ability to shoot off screens, hit pull-up jumpers, and attack with only seconds left on the game clock. The four potential draft picks also went head-to-head in a physical final drill that highlighted their isolation skills.



[url]From Bill Ingram/Hoopsworld:[/url]

In talking to a number of league sources in the run-up to the draft, HOOPSWORLD keeps hearing one name, in particular, involving possible draft day trades. We've heard plenty of rumors involving Minnesota Timberwolves forward Al Jefferson, and it turns out that where there's smoke there is definitely fire. Quite a few teams have indicated that Al Jefferson is one of their primary targets this summer.



[url]From Jon Krawczynski/AP Sports:[/url]

While they wait for Rubio, Kahn and Rambis are trying to get a jump on the get-to-know-you process. They had dinner with Rubio and his family in May, giving the 19-year-old his first face-to-face meeting with the man who wants to coach him in the NBA.

"As opposed to the draft process a year ago, we didn't have an opportunity to meet him in that context," Kahn said. "Through either last summer, this year, and with Kurt coming over, I felt it was very important for us to stay connected, but not so connected that he or his team feel overwhelmed."

The Timberwolves want Rubio to feel a part of the team in order to make his eventual transition from exotic Spain to meat-and-potatoes Minnesota as smooth as possible. But they also don't want to infringe too heavily upon him, and his Spanish team Regal FC Barcelona, while he develops his game overseas.



[url]From Jonathan Givony/DraftExpress:[/url]

Minnesota -- which drafted another point guard, Jonny Flynn, one pick after selecting Rubio last year -- still has work to do to sell him on playing there, according to high-level sources in the Rubio camp.

But there's no guarantee that you'll see Rubio in any NBA uniform in 2011. In fact, in large part because of a potential lockout and money considerations, the more likely scenario for now is Rubio's arrival in 2012.

Rubio will not be inclined to terminate his contract with Barcelona next summer if there's no new collective bargaining agreement by then. Also, if Rubio waits until 2012 -- three years removed from his draft year -- he'll no longer be bound by the rules of the NBA rookie scale, which, under the current CBA, would pay him an average of about $3.6 million his first two years, a sum that will likely be below market value. Freed from the rookie scale, Rubio could negotiate like a free agent with the team that holds his rights, receiving anything from the mid-level exception ($5.85 million this season) to a maximum contract if a team has the requisite room under the salary cap.

Another factor to consider could be Rubio's contract with Nike, which expires in two years. The company has made no secret of its preference to see Rubio in a bigger NBA market than Minnesota, according to sources, and it will be interesting to see whether the dollars Nike throw into the equation sways things.

Re: What's happening in Twolves land...

Posted: Sat Jun 19, 2010 8:21 pm
by enetric
This guy did a great job of breaking down the draft and comparing the big men we are looking at. He openly admits he is partial to Cousins and didnt really spend time covering the red flags that are weighing Cousins down....but he did give logical reasons why these guys are really strong prospects and why he thinks the Twolves are NUTS if they take Wes Johnson over either...ir if they trade DOWN lower than #4. And that is relavent to what we have been talking about as well. its why I scoffed at the silly trade ideas that have us making deals for medicore established players to trade down for a pick that will be significantly lower than what we have now. Yeah...Demens...The Detroit pick at #7 IS a huge drop off in this draft.

Anyway....people will take out of it what they want. We will here...see? Take Cousins over Favors. or, hmmmm...Favors is still growing and he is already this good? Runs the floor like that? Wow...Lebron having a big like that to go with Brook...that's really enticing. I will simply say...that isnt the point of why I am posting what i felt was a very well written article.

More than anything, we have debated the two bigs to death...and I for one have gotten comfortable taking either guy management feels is the BPA. This article beings to light why we should take the BPA. Why trading up is the only way we should be thining here...and this is a guy speaking for a team that wont be in the hunt for top tier unrestricted free agents this summer. Has more roster needs than we do...and yet he gets it. When you win as few games as we did...you get the best player you can for the long run of your team. Whoever that guy is when you are on the clock..you do it and dont look back....


http://www.canishoopus.com/2010/6/17/1523949/getting-cute


Getting Cute
by Stop-n-Pop on Jun 17, 2010 9:52 PM PDT 74 comments, 74 new



OK folks, there was a workout yesterday. Derrick Favors came to town and he ran up and down at the Target Center and jumped very high. According to Tweets, emails, and a few phone calls, we can tell you that he may have been a tad out of shape, very impressive for an 18 year old, and he can run the court like a gazelle (even when out of shape?). None of that matters. What really matters is below the fold...



The Minnesota Timberwolves hold the 4th pick in a 4 player draft. They also have two point guards (Jonny Flynn and Ramon Sessions), two power forwards (Kevin Love and Al Jefferson), two additional first round picks, two second round picks, and two stashed Euros (Ricky Rubio and Nikola Pekovic) to move in any number of combinations to get additional serviceable starting-level players, additional picks, whatever.

The bottom line for the team is that if they are unable to use their assets to get the 1st, 2nd, or 3rd best player in this draft, they take the BPA and use their assets to adjust the roster accordingly. At this stage of the game, it should be Evan Turner, Derrick Favors, DeMarcus Cousins or bust. I cannot tell you how big of a gap there is between these 3 players (and John Wall) and Wes Johnson. It's the Grand Canyon of the 2010 NBA Draft. This isn't to say that Wes Johnson isn't a nice player (he should be a very nice 3rd or 4th option and a terror in transition); rather, it's to say that for the first time in a long time, the Wolves have not found themselves as the one-pick-too-late player in a sparsely populated draft. For once, they aren't on the Laettner outside looking in at the beautiful O'Neal/Mourning interior. They're on the inside. They get to pick one of the big boys no matter what happens.

Keeping this in mind, there is nothing a 15-win team should worry about in terms of fit, roster cohesiveness, or locker room dynamics that should prevent them from taking one of the best 4 players in a 4 player draft with the 4th pick. It's that f'ing simple. If it's Derrick Favors, fine. If it's DeMarcus Cousins, even better. If it's Evan Turner, go nuts. If Derrick Favors is ranked higher on their board than DeMarcus Cousins, then they should try to do whatever they can to get him. If Evan Turner is ranked higher than that, the same thing holds true.

What should not happen is for this team to trade out of the plush O'Neal/Mourning surroundings into Laettner-ville. That's insane. Unless the team is able to move the 4th pick for an honest-to-Pete NBA All Star level performer, there is no reason to pull a Hello Kitty and get all cute. None. Zilch. Zip.

What will be especially frustrating about this draft is if the top talent in the draft falls in their laps at the 4th spot and they pass on him for a 23 year old athletic swingman.

Getting off my soapbox for just a little bit, at this point I think the Wolves' draft should be viewed in the very stark terms of Turner, Favors, Cousins or bust. While I think that DeMarcus Cousins is the best player in this draft (teenagers with that type of size, skill and production are once-in-a-decade type talents), there is absolutely nothing wrong with "settling" for Derrick Favors. Nothing at all.

If Evan Turner is taken with the 2nd pick, and the Wolves are unable to move up for his services, Favors and Cousins offer the Wolves two high percentage chances of success with similar roster implications. Either player makes it necessary to move one of their power forwards for a wing player. Either player lets them use their remaining assets to move up for another draft pick. Do not get cute. If Wall and Turner are off the board, there should be no excuse for this team not to walk away with Cousins or Favors. Wes Johnson is a massive step down from these two players.

Just what sort of players are we talking about with Favors and Cousins?


%poss TS% OR%/DR% TORate Blk% FD/40 FTR 2p% pts/poss PPR
DMC 31.3 57.9 19.6/25.1 15.8 7.5 8.3 72.6 .565 .1.14 --5.93
DF 22.1 62.1 12.3/20.5 23.2 7.9 4.7 48.8 .613 .1.11 -6.63


It really is hard to overstate just how efficient and productive DMC was during his single season at Kentucky. When he was on the court, he ended nearly a 3rd of his team's possessions while shooting the ball at a fair clip, dominating the glass, blocking shots, scoring more than a point/possession, and hardly turning the ball over. The guy flat out ends mountains of possessions in a positive fashion. Again, it's that simple.

Derrick Favors had about 70% of DMC's usage rate and he was unable to match not only his efficiency rates, but, in most cases, his net production. That's crazy. Now put that production into a guy with a massive wingspan, amazing standing reach, and...well, let's take a look at the physical numbers:


Height w/shoes Weight Wingspan Standing Reach No-Step Vert Lane Agility
DF 6'10.25" 245 7'4" 9'2" 31.5" 11.74
DMC 6'10.75" 292 7'5.75" 9'5" 23.5" 11.4


Favors clearly can jump with the best of them but DMC has what we Wolves fans have grown to love: small area quickness. For those of you who watched Kentucky this year, the big fella can hedge on screens, run the floor, and even make his way out to 15-17 feet to contest some jump shots with a bit of room to recover. He's clearly not in Favors' league in terms of getting from end to end, but with 1/2 court defense and the pick and roll, the guy will do just fine.

As for Favors, the guy is a huge athletic marvel with phenomenal shooting numbers and amazing defensive potential at age 18. Age, rebounding, athleticism....if the kid picked a better college he probably could be in the conversation for the top pick. Big 18 year olds who can shoot over 60% from 2 are pretty hard to find too.

Cutting back to the main point of this post, the Wolves are damn-near guaranteed one of these two players. If they don't get one of these guys, they are guaranteed the 2nd best player in the draft in Turner. Think about that for a moment before you think about how nice it would be for Wes Johnson to be a Timberwolf. The Wolves, if they just stand pat with the 4th pick, get one of the 4 best players in a 4 player draft. If Kevin McHale were still GM, they'd finally be in a position where he couldn't screw it up. All they have to do is take the BPA and be done with it.

Anywho, no matter what happened at yesterday's workout, and no matter what happens with DMC's agent, nothing is going to change the fact that the Wolves will get a shot at one of the 4 best players in a 4 player draft. They cannot mess this up...unless they get cute. They can then use the rest of their considerable assets to build a winning team. Please, do not over think this one.

OK, here's where we stand with the Community Draft Board:


1.John Wall (54%)
2.Evan Turner (81%)
3.Derrick Favors (50.8%)
4.DeMarcus Cousins (64.3%)
5.Wes Johnson (85.9%)
6.Al Faroq Aminu (38%)
7.Greg Monroe (30.4%)
8.Paul George (37.1%)
9.Xavier Henry (61.7%)
10.Cole Aldrich (35.1%)
11.Gordon Hayward (28%)
12.Luke Babbitt (33.6%)
13.Ed Davis (26.9%)
14.Hassan Whiteside (29.4%)
15.Ekpe Udoh (41.4%)

Re: What's happening in Twolves land...

Posted: Sat Jun 19, 2010 10:08 pm
by deviljets7
^^^^

I agree with all of this stuff regarding Minnesota.

The stupidity of trading down is only more magnified by the fact that in terms or pure depth/assets they already have plenty (have picks 16 and 23 as well). This is not a 2001 Nets/Eddie Griffin situation when they literally needed multiple bodies just to fill a rotation.

The fit issues with Cousins should also be less of an issue considering the current issues of Love/Jefferson would seem to make it unlikely that both stay in Minnesota regardless of pick #4.

There are more than enough pieces (especially if you're willing to take a bad contract) for MIN to get back into the lottery and add that wing later on, whether it's Aminu, George or Xavier Henry.

Re: What's happening in Twolves land...

Posted: Sat Jun 19, 2010 10:48 pm
by prefuse73
Im a wolves fan just poppin' over to see who you guys prefer at #3 and I was please to see a great, non-twolve bashing (which I admit is easy to do) post.

I agree. Johnson can't be the pick @#4. They only need to take the last man standing after you guys pick. I can't speak for all t-wolves fans, but I think, if given the choice, we would go for Favors over cousins as he could potentially help us recreate the Sun's nash/amare combo with rubio/favors.

However, reading the stuff about Cousins's "small area quickness" and seeing some footage, the guy is actually quite nimble for his size.

My question is who do you guys prefer next to Lopez. Favors seems like the obvious pick. However, Cousins fits like a glove with lopez on offense since Brook plays more like a 4. What are thoughts on these guys? Are you hoping to go a different route and sign LBJ and maybe do a S&T for Amare or Bosh? Would Cousins, make a S&T easier to do.....


Anyways, good look next week regardless :)

Re: What's happening in Twolves land...

Posted: Sat Jun 19, 2010 11:48 pm
by enetric
I posted the article (the second post) because I really feel he nailed the thinking for this draft...not just for the Twolves but for the Nets as well. Both teams are young, and are rebuilding with lots of cap space. We are in very different situations for free agency due to the impending move from small market to big market for the Nets....but IMO that shouldnt effect how to plan for the draft.

I think its a BPA draft for both our teams. Ideally...you always want to draft BPA anyway.

As it stands...I think most so called experts do not feel Cousins fits personnel wise with either team as well as Favors does. I have been strong in my criticism of Cousins for the many red flags that have been raised by him that could be major obstacles for him using his talent and size as effectively at the next level of competition.

To me unless Cousins answers more in the workouts than what we already know about him (that is a talented, big basketball player) I think its easy and smarter for the Nets to just stay away and take Favors. But as this guy said in the artle, if Cousins comes in and moves up your draft board after you satisfy all your long term concerns...take him. If our management goes that way...fine. Hope for the best. Right now?

The thinking seems to be that the order of preference is Turner/Favors...and not sure if Cousins is ahead of Wes. But that is from media rumors and the specuation of how scouts have ranked them overall. The scouts and the Chicago combines...have Favors as the guy more people really love long term.

Age, size, strength, end to end speed and still developing his already impressive body and his game with a good atitude seems to be trumping the good and bad Cousins offes. Which is: Bigger, better hoops skills, polish, great footwork....poor athleticism, question marks about his ability to guard NBA 4's, his discipline for working out and desire to get in better shape, stamina, running hard every play, getting back on D, listening to coaching, characterized as having a bad atitude.

It sounds like Cousins is going to have to wow everyone in many ways...more than just how he plays on Monday to move up the Nets draft board. At least that is the perception. Even if they say...he out played Favors head to head today. Still not resolving what could keep him lower on the list.

In the end I think the majority of our posters are hoping Turner drops to us...which I think is unlikely. I think again like the writer said...if you want someone specific see if you can trade up to get him. I think the Nets would give up something to move up in terms of assets...but not cap space. Like, they are unlikely to help Philly clear cap space just to move up. They could do a 3 way deal and send them Dooling as long as nothing undesireable comes back..but that's it in terms of cap relief. The question is...what would be the price to move up asset wise and is it worth it? if it were the #27? A future first or the GSW pick? I think they might consider that. Twill or Lee? Doubtful.

Re: What's happening in Twolves land...

Posted: Wed Jun 23, 2010 10:50 pm
by enetric
http://www.nj.com/nets/index.ssf/2010/06/nj_nets_getting_drafty_its_sti.html




Meanwhile, here’s one thing Rod Thorn knows:

“It would be so much easier for us if free agency was before the draft,” he said. “Then you’d have some idea what you can and cannot get. So as far as drafting goes, you have to just go for the best guy for us.”

We’re told that he’s getting offers that might be attractive in any other era – Al Jefferson for basically nothing, as long as they swap spots – but there’s no way he can do that without blowing up his cap space.

Re: What's happening in Twolves land...

Posted: Wed Jun 23, 2010 11:35 pm
by vincecarter4pres
I don't have a link(I'll get one, but I'm about to eat a late dinner), but reportedly the Wolves are offering Al Jefferson/16th pick/23rd pick for 7th pick/Tayshaun Prince/Chris Wilcox...