RealGM

I believe this should serve as a separate thread at least until the event is over. (This could be merged with the offseason thread in a day or two.)

King is talking with the media and going over the season. I'll be updating this until the event is done:
[tweet]https://twitter.com/BrooklynNets/status/595979154719375360[/tweet]

Update: There were/are a lot of tweets. I'm going to list the categories of tweets in an alphabetical order so you can jump to the section you care about quickly.

A. 2014-15 Season & Playoffs
B. Brook & Thad
C. 2015 Draft
D. 2015 Offseason Goals & Potential Trades
E. Hollins & State of Roster
F. 2016 Offseason & Future
G. Paying Luxury Tax
H. The rookies /Young players
I. Alan Anderson
J. Mirza
K. Bobby Marks
L. Media & Fan Criticism of him
M. New Brooklyn Practice Facility
N. Hack-a-Player


A) Regarding season/playoffs:
[tweet]https://twitter.com/TimBontemps/status/595968734533136384[/tweet]
[tweet]https://twitter.com/rodboone/status/595967252995911681[/tweet]
[tweet]https://twitter.com/LennRobbins/status/595967237170790400[/tweet]
[tweet]https://twitter.com/TimBontemps/status/595967205671575553[/tweet]

B) Re: Brook & Thad
[tweet]https://twitter.com/SBondyNYDN/status/595967700649844736[/tweet]
[tweet]https://twitter.com/rodboone/status/595967828009873408[/tweet]
[tweet]https://twitter.com/andy_vasquez/status/595967779947343873[/tweet]
[tweet]https://twitter.com/TJDhoops/status/595967948935864320[/tweet]
[tweet]https://twitter.com/TJDhoops/status/595970209950920705[/tweet]
[tweet]https://twitter.com/BrooklynNets/status/595983039739645952[/tweet]


C) Re: 2015 Draft
[tweet]https://twitter.com/rodboone/status/595972881336643585[/tweet]
[tweet]https://twitter.com/TJDhoops/status/595973114783277056[/tweet]
[tweet]https://twitter.com/LennRobbins/status/595973049725366272[/tweet]
[tweet]https://twitter.com/uuords/status/595973013239177216[/tweet]
[tweet]https://twitter.com/LennRobbins/status/595974192396378113[/tweet]
[tweet]https://twitter.com/alexraskinNYC/status/595974364945846273[/tweet]


D) Re: 2015 Offseason Goals & Potential Trades
[tweet]https://twitter.com/uuords/status/595968136370909184[/tweet]
[tweet]https://twitter.com/TimBontemps/status/595967631506673665[/tweet]
[tweet]https://twitter.com/TimBontemps/status/595968200027799552[/tweet]
[tweet]https://twitter.com/TJDhoops/status/595968207413981185[/tweet]
[tweet]https://twitter.com/TJDhoops/status/595969300386738176[/tweet]
[tweet]https://twitter.com/uuords/status/595969881394302976[/tweet]
[tweet]https://twitter.com/TJDhoops/status/595974772032446464[/tweet]
[tweet]https://twitter.com/eLonePB/status/595975336258621441[/tweet]

E) Re: Hollins & State of Roster
[tweet]https://twitter.com/TimBontemps/status/595968523106689025[/tweet]
[tweet]https://twitter.com/rodboone/status/595968794419470336[/tweet]
[tweet]https://twitter.com/LennRobbins/status/595970227495641090[/tweet]
[tweet]https://twitter.com/rodboone/status/595971259013410816[/tweet]
[tweet]https://twitter.com/TimBontemps/status/595971203162050560[/tweet]
[tweet]https://twitter.com/johnschuhmann/status/595972707222687744[/tweet]


F) Re: 2016 Offseason & Future
[tweet]https://twitter.com/rodboone/status/595969470876819456[/tweet]
[tweet]https://twitter.com/andy_vasquez/status/595970191739215872[/tweet]

G) Re: Paying Luxury Tax
[tweet]https://twitter.com/uuords/status/595970634263429121[/tweet]

H) Re: The rookies /Young players
[tweet]https://twitter.com/TJDhoops/status/595967374672683008[/tweet]
[tweet]https://twitter.com/LennRobbins/status/595969557250072576[/tweet]
[tweet]https://twitter.com/LennRobbins/status/595969967385931777[/tweet]
[tweet]https://twitter.com/rodboone/status/595971390412627968[/tweet]
[tweet]https://twitter.com/LennRobbins/status/595971661498863616[/tweet]
[tweet]https://twitter.com/TimBontemps/status/595974492452708352[/tweet]


I) Re: Alan Anderson
[tweet]https://twitter.com/LennRobbins/status/595968663804649472[/tweet]
[tweet]https://twitter.com/TimBontemps/status/595975116846178304[/tweet]

J) Re: Mirza
[tweet]https://twitter.com/TimBontemps/status/595969570504060928[/tweet]
[tweet]https://twitter.com/SBondyNYDN/status/595971438072463361[/tweet]


K) Re: Bobby Marks
[tweet]https://twitter.com/TimBontemps/status/595967426388488192[/tweet]
[tweet]https://twitter.com/uuords/status/595981553051815936[/tweet]


L) Re: Media & Fan Criticism of him
[tweet]https://twitter.com/uuords/status/595971622395195393[/tweet]

M) Re: New Brooklyn Practice Facility
[tweet]https://twitter.com/alexraskinNYC/status/595973227396145152[/tweet]
[tweet]https://twitter.com/alexraskinNYC/status/595973372007309313[/tweet]

N) Re: Hack-a-Player
[tweet]https://twitter.com/briancmahoney/status/595975859120558080[/tweet]

pretty much as I had expected. Brook is getting a max deal and Thad is going to be getting something in the 3/30-36 to 4/40-48 range im sure.

puts another 32-36 million on the books in 16-17 if it happens and basically brings us back the same roster as last year and gaurantees we dont get under the tax

"we can pay them more then anyone" in regards to brook and thad. that statement should terrify all nets fans. Brook is gonna get the max either way, but an overpay on young could be catastrophic and would basically be a sign that king has no intention of a rebuild/retool and isnt looking to be a player in 16-17 free agency...

this is what was my biggest fear...

If he signs thad/brook, then makes a trade with joe johnson to bring back someone on a 3 year deal and locks us in to another 3-4 year window it could set us back even further. Like if he were to deal joe for Rudy Gay

we would be locked into Dwill/bogs/gay/young/brook through 2017. that would be bad

Right now I'm just posting whatever comes up and organizing on the fly.

When the event is over, I'll re-organize the categories such that the most important things will be towards the top of the OP.

I think the event is over. I've re-organized things.

Have a look and discuss. We now have a pretty picture of what they want to do in the next few months.

Great Job!!!

Thanks for this.

Nothing new here. It's a no brainer to keep Young/Lopez considering we have no other options and both were the only bright spots we had throughout the season.It seems like Mirza will be gone because there is no way he won't get a 20-25 million offer sheet from a team like San Antonio, Dallas, Detroit, etc.

I don't expect AA to be back at this point. Sure, he wants to get paid and we can do that but I don't think at this point we should invest money into a 33 year old who doesn't necessarily improve us alot. Besides, AA will probably look to sign with a championship contender like Washington, Cleveland, LA, Memphis, etc.

I'm glad King will try to move up. It's a damn shame we would be owning the Wizards 19th pick and be automatically higher in the late 1st round already. So, moving up would get us in the mid-1st round where sleeper lottery picks await like Bobby Portis, Jerian Grant, Devin Booker, Trey Lyles, etc but this is Billy King for you.

Mason Plumlee going through summer league again...LOL. I just don't understand how he had an all-star stretch for two months and now suddenly, he's reverted back to rookie camp. Embarrassing. I understand we shouldn't give up on him because we don't have alot of talent and he still shows flashes of being a really good big man but I would rather have most big men in this draft than Plumlee. I've always been high on him since his rookie season but he flat out gave up once Brook took the starting role again.


"Explore all options" on Deron is a nice way of saying "we want him gone in anyway possible". We need to draft a PG in the worst way possible. Anyone with a heart and two legs can be better than Deron Williams.

The reality is, we will be retaining atleast 20-30% of this roster into 2016. I don't necessarily mind it as long as we shed the two losers making 20 million in the next 2 seasons. However, I'm really hoping we don't max out Brook and if we are forced to max out Brook, the years should be shorter and/or the contract should have a non-guarantee provision to it.

Thad Young is not a player you build around if you have aspirations of being a contender.

Prokorov wrote:"we can pay them more then anyone" in regards to brook and thad. that statement should terrify all nets fans. Brook is gonna get the max either way, but an overpay on young could be catastrophic and would basically be a sign that king has no intention of a rebuild/retool and isnt looking to be a player in 16-17 free agency...

I think/hope that the "we can pay them more than anyone" comment wasn't a foreshadow of what will definitely happen but a comment on the advantages the Nets have in comparison to other teams.

this is what was my biggest fear...

If he signs thad/brook, then makes a trade with joe johnson to bring back someone on a 3 year deal and locks us in to another 3-4 year window it could set us back even further. Like if he were to deal joe for Rudy Gay

we would be locked into Dwill/bogs/gay/young/brook through 2017. that would be bad

Even though I don't like it, I can understand giving Brook the max for a 4-yr deal. What I don't understand is holding Thad in such high regard that you plan to build around him too. Thad isn't a star player. On very good teams, he'd be a borderline starter who'd most likely max out at 30mpg unless the opposition plays a super small lineup.

I don't look forward to seeing the type of deal he gives Thad. If we're this committed to keeping him, I really hope Thad just opts in so we don't have to worry about his contract running beyond 2016.

He seems to be working with the idea that since everyone will have cap space in 2016, free agents will decide to come based on the quality of the roster. I can understand believing Brook would be a positive asset for free agents, but Thad? Smh...

Paradise wrote:Nothing new here. It's a no brainer to keep Young/Lopez considering we have no other options and both were the only bright spots we had throughout the season.It seems like Mirza will be gone because there is no way he won't get a 20-25 million offer sheet from a team like San Antonio, Dallas, Detroit, etc.

Given that we know Billy's approach going forward, the best situation for us is signing Brook to a max deal now and hoping Thad opts in. Hearing that the screw in Brook's foot isn't bent and the fact that he played all year has probably given King enough confidence to believe that he'll be healthy going forward.

Yeah, I'm still a bit uneasy about giving Lopez a long-term deal but no one knows whether he'll get injured again next year. If he doesn't get injured, the max contract he is bound to get will look like a bargain due to the increasing cap. If he does get injured, it's back to square one and you're stuck in the first year of a max contract for an injury-prone center. There's no easy answer to this.

Thad, on the other hand, is a completely different situation. He's an undersized tweener who provides energy and some interior scoring but he's best served as a 4th/5th option whenever he's on the court. Thad averaged 5.9 rpg with us. You'd like to see at least 7rpg from your starting PF unless you have a great rebounding SG/SF like LBJ covering for you. You don't build around these type of players. King is again showing how reactionary he is. I really hope Thad opts-in so it prevents King from doling out a contract that he shouldn't be giving out with 2016 and better free agents right around the corner. We have no idea how the situations with KD, Love, AD, or even Ryan Anderson will turn out. There should be no rush to sign him to a deal now.

I don't expect AA to be back at this point. Sure, he wants to get paid and we can do that but I don't think at this point we should invest money into a 33 year old who doesn't necessarily improve us alot. Besides, AA will probably look to sign with a championship contender like Washington, Cleveland, LA, Memphis, etc.

Agreed. He talked about how he'd like to be back but he was definitely vocal about playing on a winning roster. AA's been on so many teams already that I can easily see him being on any team going forward lol.

I'm glad King will try to move up. It's a damn shame we would be owning the Wizards 19th pick and be automatically higher in the late 1st round already. So, moving up would get us in the mid-1st round where sleeper lottery picks await like Bobby Portis, Jerian Grant, Devin Booker, Trey Lyles, etc but this is Billy King for you.

We could've also moved up further if we had our own pick smh! This guy gives away all of his assets and now he talks about "of course he wants to move up". He's the one who put himself/the Nets in this situation. If we're not trading for a PG, then we definitely need to draft one. Depending on how good he is, he can take Jack's minutes.

Mason Plumlee going through summer league again...LOL. I just don't understand how he had an all-star stretch for two months and now suddenly, he's reverted back to rookie camp. Embarrassing. I understand we shouldn't give up on him because we don't have alot of talent and he still shows flashes of being a really good big man but I would rather have most big men in this draft than Plumlee. I've always been high on him since his rookie season but he flat out gave up once Brook took the starting role again.

He gave up once KG was traded. His mentor went away and he just didn't know what to do. Plumlee needs to work on everything. His defense, post-game, free throw shooting all suck. I wonder how long Hollins thinks it would take to fix all of those things. If Mason is a 3-4 year project, he'd be 28-29 by that point and his athleticism would start to wane. I don't mind trading him now if it helps us get a better player in the draft.

"Explore all options" on Deron is a nice way of saying "we want him gone in anyway possible". We need to draft a PG in the worst way possible. Anyone with a heart and two legs can be better than Deron Williams.

The problem is everyone knows this. Billy is going to have a ton of crappy offers to choose one and I'm afraid of the one that he probably wants to take.

The reality is, we will be retaining atleast 20-30% of this roster into 2016. I don't necessarily mind it as long as we shed the two losers making 20 million in the next 2 seasons. However, I'm really hoping we don't max out Brook and if we are forced to max out Brook, the years should be shorter and/or the contract should have a non-guarantee provision to it.

Billy needs to see if Hollins thinks he can fix Lance. If so, you do the JJ-Lance deal.
Then you see what you can get for D-Will. If he can get multiple smaller contracts that expire in 2017, take them and go. There's no need to keep fooling around with the idea that D-Will can help us out on a consistent basis.

Thad is ok but nothing to build around.... but this is Billy King...

Paradise wrote:Nothing new here. It's a no brainer to keep Young/Lopez considering we have no other options and both were the only bright spots we had throughout the season.It seems like Mirza will be gone because there is no way he won't get a 20-25 million offer sheet from a team like San Antonio, Dallas, Detroit, etc.

I know your stance on lopez, but are you really ok with extending a long term deal to Thad Young? I know the cap goes up, but tying 34-38M between brook and thad really puts a hinder on what we can do to add top end talent to this team. If the idea is to keep brook, im not sure how giving thad a long term deal can be part of that plan.

The reality is, we will be retaining atleast 20-30% of this roster into 2016. I don't necessarily mind it as long as we shed the two losers making 20 million in the next 2 seasons. However, I'm really hoping we don't max out Brook and if we are forced to max out Brook, the years should be shorter and/or the contract should have a non-guarantee provision to it.

I dont see how we can retain brook without the max. And i think we will be more likely to roll over 50-70% of this roster into 2016. if we extend brook and that you are already looking at having 4 of the 5 starters having gauranteed salary in 2016 as well as 3-4 reserves (dependign what happens with mirza and plumlee).

From everything king has said, it seems he doesnt plan to use 2016 free agency to try and bring in a top player. he is going to extend who we have and look to trade our expirings for the best players he can. I can easily see a rudy gay type being brought in for joe johnson.

the pipe dream of adding a star in 2016 is on life support

NyCeEvO wrote:Even though I don't like it, I can understand giving Brook the max for a 4-yr deal. What I don't understand is holding Thad in such high regard that you plan to build around him too.

I'm in this boat. I clearly dont want to extend lopez, but i can understand it if it is done. Signing thad longterm makes no sense to me at all. You are basically saying that Thad/Brook as your core with complimentary pieces and antoher fringe all star can make you a contender

He seems to be working with the idea that since everyone will have cap space in 2016, free agents will decide to come based on the quality of the roster. I can understand believing Brook would be a positive asset for free agents, but Thad? Smh...

the issue is, if we extend lopez/thad and cant move deron then we wont even have the money to offer a max contract. which would be irresponsible. i dont care if there is a 0.00000000000000000000000001% chance you land durant, if you dont clear the money to at least have the chance you are an idiot

NyCeEvO wrote:
Yeah, I'm still a bit uneasy about giving Lopez a long-term deal but no one knows whether he'll get injured again next year. If he doesn't get injured, the max contract he is bound to get will look like a bargain due to the increasing cap. If he does get injured, it's back to square one and you're stuck in the first year of a max contract for an injury-prone center. There's no easy answer to this.

People keep parroting this type of comment, but it really isnt the case. If we give brook a max contract using his bird rights on a 4 or 5 year deal this offseason he will be owed:

$21.4M in 16-17 when the cap is projected to be 88 M

22.8M in 17-18 when the cap is projected to be 106 M

So brook would cost about 25% of the cap in 16-17 and about 20% of the cap in 17-18


that is still a really large amount. to put that in perspective, deron williams accounted for 28% of our salary cap this year.

so while the cap is going up, these deals look a bit better, but they arent bargains and you still cant afford to give these guys max deals unless you really buy in that they can be your 1A or 1B players. also, to note, the cap projects to DECREASE to 100 million in 18-19.

Giving Brook a max deal if you believe he can be your 1A or 1B is fine. the issue is once you start throwing money at guys like thad young and using your exceptions or moving joe for long term salaried players.... that really limits the talent you can put aroudn thad and brook

call me a brook hater all you want, but I dont see a title or ECF appearance if you surround him with thad young and a minor joe johnson upgrade

Great job NyCeEvO.

I'd re-sign Lopez, but only if the contract is reasonable... not the max(20M). I'd re-sign him for the 16 million he is making today without hesitation. I'd do it because... he's one of the few assets the Nets have. So, he should be re-signed not as a building block, but as a trade asset. If Lopez is signed to his max contract, even with the cap jump... I don't think he'd be very attractive.

I would not re-sign Thad Young long therm, if his price is the over 10 million per year. He just feels like he is so average on all aspects of his game and he was totally absent from these playoffs. He doesn't bring any intangibles to the team, like he's not a leader, he doesn't really energize the team... he is just a passenger. Some days he looks great, very efficient, but more often than not you can't feel his impact. It sounds as if because this was one of the few good deals King made... that you're now going to overvalue him.

Obviously, the Nets are limited with their cap space, so these guys have some leverage I guess...(and in a scary way it does feel like it will happen...). Still, I think it would be so horrible to commit to salaries beyond those of Joe Johnson and Deron Williams. The goal should be win next year - YES - and by winning, you know, get to the playoffs, well at least not hand the Celtics a high pick. But with the bigger picture being... having a clean slate in two seasons(stretch/trade Deron).

Looking back at these two years, it's hard to imagine that somehow Hollins will be able to change the Nets culture and get these guys playing hard and together. Odds are it could be worse... because you get the feeling that most of those guys would rather be someone else and they also know what's going on. Even with their decline, ON PAPER, I think that with a more balanced roster, the Nets should be good enough to make the playoffs with comfort. But we know there's so many chemistry issues and leadership issues with this team, that hardly anyone flourishes. So the motivation is low and that can bring down even some of the better guys and young players... still... I think given the circumstances... it's the only "good" option - the absolute worst thing would be to re-sign players that will limit your flexibility to compete in the market when you are free of JJ and Deron. If somehow Lopez is extended as a franchise type guy and Thad Young is extended as a robin type guy, you're f*cked. Again.

Retaining Lopez is the no brainer, this team isn't getting jack **** on the FA market or through the draft.

But I nearly spit out my afternoon coffee when I read the words "building around" and "Thad Young" in the same sentence

jesus mary and **** ing joseph how ignorant is this man!??!

King on 2016: "Everybody is going to have cap space that year so you can't say, 'Let's, wait for that year.'"

I agree with this. But I do not agree with what he wants to do with Young. If he overpays him we are **** ED!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

And the absentee owner is once again asleep at the wheel. **** everyone in the front office. **** them!!!!!

Prokorov wrote:

NyCeEvO wrote:
Yeah, I'm still a bit uneasy about giving Lopez a long-term deal but no one knows whether he'll get injured again next year. If he doesn't get injured, the max contract he is bound to get will look like a bargain due to the increasing cap. If he does get injured, it's back to square one and you're stuck in the first year of a max contract for an injury-prone center. There's no easy answer to this.

People keep parroting this type of comment, but it really isnt the case. If we give brook a max contract using his bird rights on a 4 or 5 year deal this offseason he will be owed:

$21.4M in 16-17 when the cap is projected to be 88 M

22.8M in 17-18 when the cap is projected to be 106 M

So brook would cost about 25% of the cap in 16-17 and about 20% of the cap in 17-18


that is still a really large amount. to put that in perspective, deron williams accounted for 28% of our salary cap this year.

so while the cap is going up, these deals look a bit better, but they arent bargains and you still cant afford to give these guys max deals unless you really buy in that they can be your 1A or 1B players. also, to note, the cap projects to DECREASE to 100 million in 18-19.

Giving Brook a max deal if you believe he can be your 1A or 1B is fine. the issue is once you start throwing money at guys like thad young and using your exceptions or moving joe for long term salaried players.... that really limits the talent you can put aroudn thad and brook

call me a brook hater all you want, but I dont see a title or ECF appearance if you surround him with thad young and a minor joe johnson upgrade

You make total sense. The key should be to retain Brook because frankly, there is no other option, and getting Johnson/Williams off of the book via expiring(let joe expire) and either buy out/stretch deron after this season...that's like 40+ in cap space right there... but extending Young and increasing what he's getting now is madness.

MrDollarBills wrote:

King on 2016: "Everybody is going to have cap space that year so you can't say, 'Let's, wait for that year.'"

I agree with this. But I do not agree with what he wants to do with Young. If he overpays him we are **** ED!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

And the absentee owner is once again asleep at the wheel. **** everyone in the front office. **** them!!!!!

He has a point on that. Still... we know most fans will want to have a chance at competing in Free Agency, rather than settling for scraps and be looking at mediocrity for years.

But King always sounds like he's making excuses to justify things, rather than owning up the mistakes made. The line about Houston and draft picks is so ridiculous.

And YES - it's crazy how the Russian guy doesn't care about his money. Spent ridiculous money on luxury tax, all to waste... and still he hasn't learned a thing or gives a sign that they're trying to change their philosophy and adapting for the future?

Prokorov wrote:Giving Brook a max deal if you believe he can be your 1A or 1B is fine. the issue is once you start throwing money at guys like thad young and using your exceptions or moving joe for long term salaried players.... that really limits the talent you can put aroudn thad and brook

call me a brook hater all you want, but I dont see a title or ECF appearance if you surround him with thad young and a minor joe johnson upgrade

That's not hater talk. It's the honest truth.

The problem is we still don't know what we'd get from Lopez over a full max season.

Was that dominant stretch a 20-game high with the last few games of the season him reverting back to what he normally is? He didn't do anything special in the playoffs to make me think "Boy, he's really proving his worth now."

It's funny how Hollins told Brook that he can become dominant if he gets a post-game. For years, people have been talking about Lopez having a great post-game but Hollins knows what it means to have a true, effective post-game. No more of this 3-5 seconds of pounding the ball to get position and then a slow lumbering step towards the paint for a hook shot. While Brook makes those shots at a pretty good clip, everything needs to be faster. Marc Gasol's shots are one/two-steps then a shot is going up. If Brook can get that, he can be way more effective down there.

I'm saying all of that to say he's definitely not a 1A/1B player on a championship team. If Hollins is successful in implementing the changes he thinks Brook can make, then he might be able to reach that status (as long as he constantly attacks). Since he hasn't reached that level yet we need to be careful who we're surrounding him. Thad Young isn't doing much to push us over the top. I like Young but they need to be real and recognize that he's a 6th/7th man. If you want him to be a starter, that's fine, but recognize if Thad is a starter you better have 3 other very good pieces (each better than Thad himself) that will negate his weaknesses so he doesn't become a detriment to the team if he's out there for 30-35 minutes.

I agree with you bro.