A Tech Guy with a Jumper - Spencer Dinwiddie Thread

[Prokorov]

Spencer's explanation on why wins are important was amazing. It's why I don't buy the nonsense that wins don't matter at all just because we're young or in rebuilding mode.

On overcoming tough losses and what they mean to the team:
“It’s going to take a lot of maturity because the hardest part about this is that we have so many guys that are on the brink of being in the NBA or getting another contract, and these close losses when they stack up – two, three, four, five in a row – they change the tenure of the season because it completely shifts the narrative of how Nets basketball is played.

“If these close losses turn into wins, we’re close to .500 ball. We’re looking at the playoffs. There’s a different morale, different vibe. Instead of always coming in here feeling a certain way about whatever happened on the court. It’s hard because everybody in here is trying to put food on the table for their families and provide. A couple wins here and there really affect the tenure of a season for a young ball club that’s fighting.

“So, I’d say these close losses in a row that really hurt… they really hurt.”

Players will always want to win. but the franchise doesnt care about wins. they care about the process and building things the right way. and its not uncommon. thats the spurs/celtics/smart way to coach. Brad stevens harps on this. he doesnt care about results.

here is a good presentation that goes into more in depth analysis on how winning coaches care about developing and doing things the right way and not the results. the results will come if you build right.

Watch on YouTube

fast forward to 2:58

Watch on YouTube

winning doesnt matter. the results dont matter. what matters is developing these guys. making sure they do things the right way, regardless of how it ends up.

if you do that, once the talent is there, the wins will come.

[Prokorov]

Dinwiddie is currently 11th in the entire NBA in RPM:

1. harden
2. curry
3. lebron
4. westbrook
5. oladipo
6. giannis
7. cousins
8. jokic
9. butler
10. covington
11. Dinwiddie

Thats some good company... he is also 4th among PGs

1. harden
2. curry
3. westbrook
4. dinwiddie

[Hello Brooklyn]

What is Dinwiddie ceiling in your guys's views?

Any chance of him becoming a fringe all star in his prime?

[MrDollarBills]

Dinwiddie is currently 11th in the entire NBA in RPM:

1. harden
2. curry
3. lebron
4. westbrook
5. oladipo
6. giannis
7. cousins
8. jokic
9. butler
10. covington
11. Dinwiddie

Thats some good company... he is also 4th among PGs

1. harden
2. curry
3. westbrook
4. dinwiddie

Remind me again of why people wanted to trade him?

After his rough patch he has bounced back with three huge games versus playoff teams, two of which are among the best teams in the entire league. At some point, the folks who constantly mock "development" and have little patience for any of these kids will be the same ones cheering for these guys when they are stomping teams out in years to come

[MrDollarBills]

What is Dinwiddie ceiling in your guys's views?

Any chance of him becoming a fringe all star in his prime?

Not sure. If we become a really good team and he's the starting PG, you never know. I don't have expectations of all star games or anything, but I see him continuously evolving into a really solid pro.

[SpeedyG]

Dinwiddie is currently 11th in the entire NBA in RPM:

1. harden
2. curry
3. lebron
4. westbrook
5. oladipo
6. giannis
7. cousins
8. jokic
9. butler
10. covington
11. Dinwiddie

Thats some good company... he is also 4th among PGs

1. harden
2. curry
3. westbrook
4. dinwiddie

Remind me again of why people wanted to trade him?

After his rough patch he has bounced back with three huge games versus playoff teams, two of which are among the best teams in the entire league. At some point, the folks who constantly mock "development" and have little patience for any of these kids will be the same ones cheering for these guys when they are stomping teams out in years to come

People never mocked development, but the belief that you can't develop and also have winning in mind.

The belief that win at all cost is a flawed belief, but development without winning is also flawed.

these guys are humans too, and if the results don't show wins, at some point it will get to them. As dinwiddie said, it will take a great amount of maturity to deal with what whey are going through right now because fight as hard as they do, were still a bottom whatever in the standings.

And at the end of the day, while the Nets don't look at it in a vacuum, the NBA and the other teams doling out contracts don't necessarily look at it the same way.

You already see it in that dinwiddie thread in GB. Yeah, it's the GB. But had we won these close games, the narrative would be that dinwiddie is a starting PG for a playoff team rather than "oh he solid but you can't win if he's your starter"

[MrDollarBills]

Dinwiddie is currently 11th in the entire NBA in RPM:

1. harden
2. curry
3. lebron
4. westbrook
5. oladipo
6. giannis
7. cousins
8. jokic
9. butler
10. covington
11. Dinwiddie

Thats some good company... he is also 4th among PGs

1. harden
2. curry
3. westbrook
4. dinwiddie

Remind me again of why people wanted to trade him?

After his rough patch he has bounced back with three huge games versus playoff teams, two of which are among the best teams in the entire league. At some point, the folks who constantly mock "development" and have little patience for any of these kids will be the same ones cheering for these guys when they are stomping teams out in years to come

People never mocked development, but the belief that you can't develop and also have winning in mind.

The belief that win at all cost is a flawed belief, but development without winning is also flawed.

these guys are humans too, and if the results don't show wins, at some point it will get to them. As dinwiddie said, it will take a great amount of maturity to deal with what whey are going through right now because fight as hard as they do, were still a bottom whatever in the standings.

And at the end of the day, while the Nets don't look at it in a vacuum, the NBA and the other teams doling out contracts don't necessarily look at it the same way.

You already see it in that dinwiddie thread in GB. Yeah, it's the GB. But had we won these close games, the narrative would be that dinwiddie is a starting PG for a playoff team rather than "oh he solid but you can't win if he's your starter"

I'm not going to name names because it's not a big deal, but development gets mocked on here especially after a game where we get our asses kicked I agree that losing doesn't help morale. These last two losses hurt the team because they left everything on the floor and the officials jobbed them. I don't think they have anything to be down about, but I understand.

I believe that learning how to close out and win games is apart of development. Losing sucks, but losing while developing bad habits and not competing is where things go south. That's not the case here where we see guys being constantly corrected and improving. Had we won these games (we should have), it would have been great for morale. We have more wins in January than we did last year and we are coming off two straight games where we outplayed two of the better teams in the league and got jobbed. Things are improving quickly for this team whether people can see it or not.

[Prokorov]

Dinwiddie is currently 11th in the entire NBA in RPM:

1. harden
2. curry
3. lebron
4. westbrook
5. oladipo
6. giannis
7. cousins
8. jokic
9. butler
10. covington
11. Dinwiddie

Thats some good company... he is also 4th among PGs

1. harden
2. curry
3. westbrook
4. dinwiddie

Remind me again of why people wanted to trade him?

After his rough patch he has bounced back with three huge games versus playoff teams, two of which are among the best teams in the entire league. At some point, the folks who constantly mock "development" and have little patience for any of these kids will be the same ones cheering for these guys when they are stomping teams out in years to come

People never mocked development, but the belief that you can't develop and also have winning in mind.

The belief that win at all cost is a flawed belief, but development without winning is also flawed.

these guys are humans too, and if the results don't show wins, at some point it will get to them. As dinwiddie said, it will take a great amount of maturity to deal with what whey are going through right now because fight as hard as they do, were still a bottom whatever in the standings.

And at the end of the day, while the Nets don't look at it in a vacuum, the NBA and the other teams doling out contracts don't necessarily look at it the same way.

You already see it in that dinwiddie thread in GB. Yeah, it's the GB. But had we won these close games, the narrative would be that dinwiddie is a starting PG for a playoff team rather than "oh he solid but you can't win if he's your starter"

great coaches dont care about the results they care about the process. they know if things are done the right way, developed right, once the talent comes so will the wins. this also creates something more sustainable.

wins dont matter. nor should they,

[TheNetsFan]

What is Dinwiddie ceiling in your guys's views?

Any chance of him becoming a fringe all star in his prime?

It's tough to say. On one hand, he's young, so he theoretically should be able to continue to improve. On the other hand, he's by no means an elite-level NBA athlete. He'll be a good to very good player, but I don't think we're looking at an all-star or carry your franchise type of player. Absolute best case, but probably not scenario? Mike Conley. He's not nor never will be up there with guys like Westbrook, Paul, Curry, Irving, Wall, etc, but he could be a solid mid-level starter tier currently occupied by guys like Teague, Bledsoe and Holiday. You could do a lot better, but you could also do a lot worse.

[steady]

What is Dinwiddie ceiling in your guys's views?

Any chance of him becoming a fringe all star in his prime?

It's tough to say. On one hand, he's young, so he theoretically should be able to continue to improve. On the other hand, he's by no means an elite-level NBA athlete. He'll be a good to very good player, but I don't think we're looking at an all-star or carry your franchise type of player. Absolute best case, but probably not scenario? Mike Conley. He's not nor never will be up there with guys like Westbrook, Paul, Curry, Irving, Wall, etc, but he could be a solid mid-level starter tier currently occupied by guys like Teague, Bledsoe and Holiday. You could do a lot better, but you could also do a lot worse.

Mike Conley would be a fantastic ceiling. I would take that, any day of the week.

Nets are incredibly blessed to have Spencer on the team. It's weird how Its strangely easy to underestimate him still even with incredible season hes been having.

[MrDollarBills]

If Dinwiddie's ceiling is Mike Conley level that's huge. like franchise altering stuff. lol

[TheNetsFan]

If Dinwiddie's ceiling is Mike Conley level that's huge. like franchise altering stuff. lol

I did say absolutely best case, probably not happening. Not sure that's franchise altering though. I could see Dinwiddie as a top 50 guard potentially. DLo, LeVert and Dinwiddie all have that potential. As far as ceiling though, Din is likely the lowest of the 3.

[SpeedyG]

Remind me again of why people wanted to trade him?

After his rough patch he has bounced back with three huge games versus playoff teams, two of which are among the best teams in the entire league. At some point, the folks who constantly mock "development" and have little patience for any of these kids will be the same ones cheering for these guys when they are stomping teams out in years to come

People never mocked development, but the belief that you can't develop and also have winning in mind.

The belief that win at all cost is a flawed belief, but development without winning is also flawed.

these guys are humans too, and if the results don't show wins, at some point it will get to them. As dinwiddie said, it will take a great amount of maturity to deal with what whey are going through right now because fight as hard as they do, were still a bottom whatever in the standings.

And at the end of the day, while the Nets don't look at it in a vacuum, the NBA and the other teams doling out contracts don't necessarily look at it the same way.

You already see it in that dinwiddie thread in GB. Yeah, it's the GB. But had we won these close games, the narrative would be that dinwiddie is a starting PG for a playoff team rather than "oh he solid but you can't win if he's your starter"

great coaches dont care about the results they care about the process. they know if things are done the right way, developed right, once the talent comes so will the wins. this also creates something more sustainable.

wins dont matter. nor should they,

You guys are about two years behind me on following/supporting a team built on player development. I have read all the research and talked about the benefit of player development ad nauseum in so many different forums.

At some point, all that development needs to turn into wins because professional sports is still ultimately about wins (and the money winning generates).

[MrDollarBills]

If Dinwiddie's ceiling is Mike Conley level that's huge. like franchise altering stuff. lol

I did say absolutely best case, probably not happening. Not sure that's franchise altering though. I could see Dinwiddie as a top 50 guard potentially. DLo, LeVert and Dinwiddie all have that potential. As far as ceiling though, Din is likely the lowest of the 3.

If Dinwiddie was to reach Conley's level that is a pretty serious deal. Conley is a beast

[MGrand15]

Hard to say what his ceiling is at this point. He's been great on both ends. He's getting better as the year goes along.

I really want to see him next to Russell and LeVert more. He's been playing a lot as the number 1 option and only ball handler. That's a lot of responsibility and doesn't let him use one of his elite skills much - spot up shooting. I think he can be a REALLY good secondary ball handler.

[SpeedyG]

Hard to say what his ceiling is at this point. He's been great on both ends. He's getting better as the year goes along.

I really want to see him next to Russell and LeVert more. He's been playing a lot as the number 1 option and only ball handler. That's a lot of responsibility and doesn't let him use one of his elite skills much - spot up shooting. I think he can be a REALLY good secondary ball handler.

injuries have prevented us from doing this. With all three healthy I think we'll see more of that. It is the way Kenny wants this offense ran.

If there's a nit picky thing on Din it's that he has too much patience and really waits until way too low on the clock sometimes waiting for someone to come open. Having Caris and Russ there should help that as both can handle the ball and create.

There's plenty of times were the set opens up Crabbe and the defense helps on him as he puts the ball on the floor. But Crabbe isn't comfortable going all the way in so he just kicks it back to Din with the defense pretty much still in a position to contest Din.

Levert and Russell can attack, which theoretically should collapse the defense further and give din more chances at a spot up. And vice versa

[bud29]

Ringer: The Secret of Spencer Dinwiddie's Success

[Paradise]

Watch on YouTube

Sent from my iPhone using RealGM Forums

[MrDollarBills]

How the hell did we get this guy again?

you literally can ask this about a few players on this team, but this guy especially. Marks has assembled a group with high upside without the use of a top 10 draft pick. crazy.

[FlipFlopShot]

Our boy getting it done.