ImageImageImageImageImage

The Official Lin Net Thread III.5

Moderators: Rich Rane, NyCeEvO

bws94
Head Coach
Posts: 6,993
And1: 1,222
Joined: Jan 08, 2014

Re: The Official Lin Net Thread III.5 

Post#201 » by bws94 » Fri Dec 29, 2017 9:30 pm

Roy Tarpley wrote:
LKIRNets wrote:
bws94 wrote:
Yes, probably in a whole season Lin is top 10 in drives/minutes. Is that the case for say when he was with the Hornets two seasons ago?

In Charlotte he drove 35.8% of the time, that's nowhere near top 10
In the Lakers 40.4%, again not top 10
In Houston the year before 37.8%

What @Roy Tarpley gave you was a probable stat of last season's drive and kick numbers for Lin per mins. Which he did not play more than 37 games.


This is true. In 2016-17, Lin was probably Top 10 in drives per minute -- a bit of an anomaly year. But in 2013-2016, he was probably Top 30? I think this would still classify him as a "driver" relative to the NBA overall, but yeah, not Top 10.


Maybe it's the wrong metric. Maybe it is more per touches. If you watch Lin, he drives a lot. He shoots 3s but spends much time driving into the paint, or towards the paint, and on the baseline and such. But he can go many minutes in a game without touching or just passing it when he gets it. Usage may play a role here as well. Actually, I'd like to see him drive less when he comes back. I love the midrange shot, it's sad it's de-emphasized so much now. But I think that's what Lin needs to try to get automatic while getting more elusive rather than speed moves.
User avatar
LKIRNets
Starter
Posts: 2,387
And1: 598
Joined: Nov 23, 2017

Re: The Official Lin Net Thread III.5 

Post#202 » by LKIRNets » Fri Dec 29, 2017 9:55 pm

bws94 wrote:
Roy Tarpley wrote:
LKIRNets wrote:In Charlotte he drove 35.8% of the time, that's nowhere near top 10
In the Lakers 40.4%, again not top 10
In Houston the year before 37.8%

What @Roy Tarpley gave you was a probable stat of last season's drive and kick numbers for Lin per mins. Which he did not play more than 37 games.


This is true. In 2016-17, Lin was probably Top 10 in drives per minute -- a bit of an anomaly year. But in 2013-2016, he was probably Top 30? I think this would still classify him as a "driver" relative to the NBA overall, but yeah, not Top 10.


Maybe it's the wrong metric. Maybe it is more per touches. If you watch Lin, he drives a lot. He shoots 3s but spends much time driving into the paint, or towards the paint, and on the baseline and such. But he can go many minutes in a game without touching or just passing it when he gets it. Usage may play a role here as well. Actually, I'd like to see him drive less when he comes back. I love the midrange shot, it's sad it's de-emphasized so much now. But I think that's what Lin needs to try to get automatic while getting more elusive rather than speed moves.


you know you're a funny guy. I gave you the same stat you claimed as top 10, accurately. You want to do a per touch breakdown?
Lin in 2016/17 averaged 4.66 secs per touch, 4.38 secs per dribble. That's in 61.7 touches, that was set to be most on the team. We can breakdown his midrange and paint production, points her elbow touch 0.429, pp post 0.417, pp paint 0.515

Caris Levert was averaging 0.658 per paint touch
Joe Harris 0.808
Stauskas 0.683
D'Angelo Russell 0.684
Kilpatrick 0.803

Jeremy Lin's pp paint was more comparable to Allen Crabbe's 0.580
bws94
Head Coach
Posts: 6,993
And1: 1,222
Joined: Jan 08, 2014

Re: The Official Lin Net Thread III.5 

Post#203 » by bws94 » Fri Dec 29, 2017 11:49 pm

LKIRNets wrote:
bws94 wrote:
Roy Tarpley wrote:
This is true. In 2016-17, Lin was probably Top 10 in drives per minute -- a bit of an anomaly year. But in 2013-2016, he was probably Top 30? I think this would still classify him as a "driver" relative to the NBA overall, but yeah, not Top 10.


Maybe it's the wrong metric. Maybe it is more per touches. If you watch Lin, he drives a lot. He shoots 3s but spends much time driving into the paint, or towards the paint, and on the baseline and such. But he can go many minutes in a game without touching or just passing it when he gets it. Usage may play a role here as well. Actually, I'd like to see him drive less when he comes back. I love the midrange shot, it's sad it's de-emphasized so much now. But I think that's what Lin needs to try to get automatic while getting more elusive rather than speed moves.


you know you're a funny guy. I gave you the same stat you claimed as top 10, accurately. You want to do a per touch breakdown?
Lin in 2016/17 averaged 4.66 secs per touch, 4.38 secs per dribble. That's in 61.7 touches, that was set to be most on the team. We can breakdown his midrange and paint production, points her elbow touch 0.429, pp post 0.417, pp paint 0.515

Caris Levert was averaging 0.658 per paint touch
Joe Harris 0.808
Stauskas 0.683
D'Angelo Russell 0.684
Kilpatrick 0.803

Jeremy Lin's pp paint was more comparable to Allen Crabbe's 0.580


For the record I didn't claim Lin was top 10 anything. I agreed with Roy that he may be and that's all and I mentioned MAYBE it's the wrong metric per minutes. I don't get into top 10 'cause I don't really get into that stuff. I've always said Lin isn't about stats, he's about being a big contributor to wins and having intangibles, timing, etc., and his attributes aren't well represented by stats. I think you should just cool the jets some with you posts and get a better feel for some of the folks posting here.
Sweetdownlow
Senior
Posts: 743
And1: 308
Joined: Aug 02, 2015
 

Re: The Official Lin Net Thread III.5 

Post#204 » by Sweetdownlow » Thu Jan 4, 2018 8:57 pm

jlin7#NeverDone - 2017 was a tough year with the most devastating setback of my life. Since surgery, I refused to rewatch the injury. I’ve seen my fans support me in the past but with this injury, you guys all collaborated to make gifts. Some of which included hundreds or thousands of fans pitching into one gift, and you kept using #NeverDone which is now my 2018 mindset. This injury hurts in the short-term but I truly believe it’ll help my career in the long run. Im rebuilding myself mentally, physically and spiritually. Im finding ways to be better than before, leaving no stone unturned. Its about to be an epic comeback! So as you guys approach the new year, take every last setback to fuel going forward. Adversity forces us to reevaluate, adapt, improve. It forces us to ask the tough questions, to go the extra mile and push our limits. Comfort

Prokorov
RealGM
Posts: 43,027
And1: 14,676
Joined: Dec 06, 2013

Re: The Official Lin Net Thread III.5 

Post#205 » by Prokorov » Fri Jan 5, 2018 1:19 am

any chance Lin opts out. would suck to have to move on from joe harris because of lin
TheNetsFan
Head Coach
Posts: 6,948
And1: 2,597
Joined: Feb 11, 2007
   

Re: The Official Lin Net Thread III.5 

Post#206 » by TheNetsFan » Fri Jan 5, 2018 1:33 am

Prokorov wrote:any chance Lin opts out. would suck to have to move on from joe harris because of lin

None. Both he and the team have said he'll be back. Nobody is offering him more than the minimum coming off that injury, so I can't even see a reasonable buyout occuring.
13th Man
General Manager
Posts: 8,936
And1: 6,117
Joined: Feb 12, 2012
 

Re: The Official Lin Net Thread III.5 

Post#207 » by 13th Man » Fri Jan 5, 2018 2:11 am

Prokorov wrote:any chance Lin opts out. would suck to have to move on from joe harris because of lin


Little chance and he shouldn't have to or feel obligated to. It's part of the business, sometimes contacts work out better for the team, somtimes for the player. The option is for the player, not the team.
tonman
Senior
Posts: 599
And1: 131
Joined: Feb 17, 2009
       

Re: The Official Lin Net Thread III.5 

Post#208 » by tonman » Fri Jan 5, 2018 10:04 am

LKIRNets wrote:
bws94 wrote:
Roy Tarpley wrote:
This is true. In 2016-17, Lin was probably Top 10 in drives per minute -- a bit of an anomaly year. But in 2013-2016, he was probably Top 30? I think this would still classify him as a "driver" relative to the NBA overall, but yeah, not Top 10.


Maybe it's the wrong metric. Maybe it is more per touches. If you watch Lin, he drives a lot. He shoots 3s but spends much time driving into the paint, or towards the paint, and on the baseline and such. But he can go many minutes in a game without touching or just passing it when he gets it. Usage may play a role here as well. Actually, I'd like to see him drive less when he comes back. I love the midrange shot, it's sad it's de-emphasized so much now. But I think that's what Lin needs to try to get automatic while getting more elusive rather than speed moves.


you know you're a funny guy. I gave you the same stat you claimed as top 10, accurately. You want to do a per touch breakdown?
Lin in 2016/17 averaged 4.66 secs per touch, 4.38 secs per dribble. That's in 61.7 touches, that was set to be most on the team. We can breakdown his midrange and paint production, points her elbow touch 0.429, pp post 0.417, pp paint 0.515

Caris Levert was averaging 0.658 per paint touch
Joe Harris 0.808
Stauskas 0.683
D'Angelo Russell 0.684
Kilpatrick 0.803

Jeremy Lin's pp paint was more comparable to Allen Crabbe's 0.580


Meaningless stats. What context? How is player used? Situation?

When lin played last season on that team the team went 13-23 despite limited minutes for lin. That means rest of the season team went 7-39 without him.

This season, the team stood at 13-23 before winning last 2 games to go 15-23. Was last years brook lin team just as good as this year? Caveat russell being out but we dont know if that is a net positive or negative.

Not saying lin was the sole reason. But theres more to lin than statistical numbers. Lin had a poor statistical season in charlotte yet was looked at as a possible 6th man of the year candidate.
Prokorov
RealGM
Posts: 43,027
And1: 14,676
Joined: Dec 06, 2013

Re: The Official Lin Net Thread III.5 

Post#209 » by Prokorov » Fri Jan 5, 2018 1:52 pm

13th Man wrote:
Prokorov wrote:any chance Lin opts out. would suck to have to move on from joe harris because of lin


Little chance and he shouldn't have to or feel obligated to. It's part of the business, sometimes contacts work out better for the team, somtimes for the player. The option is for the player, not the team.


yea i mean its his right to pick it up... i just didnt know if maybe he would want a shot at starting again or maybe go somewhere they are looking to "win now" maybe?
Roy Tarpley
Veteran
Posts: 2,888
And1: 987
Joined: Jul 06, 2015
     

Re: The Official Lin Net Thread III.5 

Post#210 » by Roy Tarpley » Fri Jan 5, 2018 3:21 pm

Prokorov wrote:
13th Man wrote:
Prokorov wrote:any chance Lin opts out. would suck to have to move on from joe harris because of lin


Little chance and he shouldn't have to or feel obligated to. It's part of the business, sometimes contacts work out better for the team, somtimes for the player. The option is for the player, not the team.


yea i mean its his right to pick it up... i just didnt know if maybe he would want a shot at starting again or maybe go somewhere they are looking to "win now" maybe?


When Lin left Charlotte, it was clear that his priorities were to start, to be with a team that had the right culture, and be in a position to compete (not necessarily win a championship). The culture and competitiveness of the Nets are still in place, but after the injury, who knows whether Lin still thinks he can/should start. My guess is that both Lin and management will think it's the prudent move to have Lin start on the bench and play limited minutes in the first part of the 2018-19. So everyone's on the same page so far.

I think where things may get interesting is if by mid-season, everyone is healthy including Lin, but he's only getting like 12 minutes a game -- I could see him feeling frustrated then. But given our history of injuries, I don't think we'll get to this point. Someone or multiple people will go down among Dlo, Levert, Crabbe, Stauskas, Lin, and Dinwiddie, and there will be enough minutes to go around. And then, the next question will be whether Lin wants to re-sign and whether the Nets want him back. This will depend on Lin's health, what level of money Lin wants, and the status of the other wings.
13th Man
General Manager
Posts: 8,936
And1: 6,117
Joined: Feb 12, 2012
 

Re: The Official Lin Net Thread III.5 

Post#211 » by 13th Man » Fri Jan 5, 2018 3:33 pm

Prokorov wrote:
13th Man wrote:
Prokorov wrote:any chance Lin opts out. would suck to have to move on from joe harris because of lin


Little chance and he shouldn't have to or feel obligated to. It's part of the business, sometimes contacts work out better for the team, somtimes for the player. The option is for the player, not the team.


yea i mean its his right to pick it up... i just didnt know if maybe he would want a shot at starting again or maybe go somewhere they are looking to "win now" maybe?


I think he has to be realistic as well given his fragility over the past 2 seasons. No team is going to offer him a starting gig given his state. It seems to me that the team is giving him every opportunity to rebuild his body properly, which is a classy gesture and he's going to be hungry to give back to the team.

Aren't the Nets overloaded with similar shooting guards in Crabbe, Harris and Stauskus? Not to mention these guys are backing up Levert so I think that as long as we have 2 of the 3 it wont' be so bad.

A near healthy (90%) Lin would be more valuable to the team than a backlogged SG I'm thinking, not just on the leadership front but also on the court as a veteran point guard.
13th Man
General Manager
Posts: 8,936
And1: 6,117
Joined: Feb 12, 2012
 

Re: The Official Lin Net Thread III.5 

Post#212 » by 13th Man » Fri Jan 5, 2018 3:47 pm

Which was another reason why I didn't understand the Crabbe signing. So I agree with you (Prok) that his role could have been filled by Harris for much cheaper and now with Stauskus. But what's done is done, looking forward Lin will likely be here next year and we will probably lose Harris before the trade deadline.

It's too bad to be losing a good player in Harris but if you want to put a positive spin on this, Harris would've demanded more money next year anyway and we are sitting nicely at the SG position. At least we'd be able to get something for him now that his stock is high.
bws94
Head Coach
Posts: 6,993
And1: 1,222
Joined: Jan 08, 2014

Re: The Official Lin Net Thread III.5 

Post#213 » by bws94 » Fri Jan 5, 2018 5:02 pm

I don't want to lose Harris. Harris has a toughness about him that Staukus and Crabbe don't. And, I like Staukus as well. But, when you look at the numbers, it looks like Harris will be the one that's not with the Nets next season.

I think we have to see what Lin brings. If he comes back and somehow just is a factor in one way or another, whether it is points, defense, drawing fouls, playmaking, and factor in leadership, I think the fans will remember why having him on a team is a good thing. But 12 million is 12 million, so Lin has to be a factor. The first thing is, stay on the court. No more extended out time due to injuries.
bws94
Head Coach
Posts: 6,993
And1: 1,222
Joined: Jan 08, 2014

Re: The Official Lin Net Thread III.5 

Post#214 » by bws94 » Fri Jan 5, 2018 5:05 pm

Prokorov wrote:
13th Man wrote:
Prokorov wrote:any chance Lin opts out. would suck to have to move on from joe harris because of lin


Little chance and he shouldn't have to or feel obligated to. It's part of the business, sometimes contacts work out better for the team, somtimes for the player. The option is for the player, not the team.


yea i mean its his right to pick it up... i just didnt know if maybe he would want a shot at starting again or maybe go somewhere they are looking to "win now" maybe?


I think Lin wants to see what he can do with the Nets, and worry about the season beyond when it comes. He also probably wants to see what he has. Losing Harris will suck, but I don't think it's because of Lin. It's because of other deals Marks made, that's not the doing or choice of Jeremy.
MGrand15
Lead Assistant
Posts: 5,987
And1: 2,758
Joined: Nov 17, 2009

Re: The Official Lin Net Thread III.5 

Post#215 » by MGrand15 » Fri Jan 5, 2018 8:44 pm

Lin opting out after a career altering injury :lol:
13th Man
General Manager
Posts: 8,936
And1: 6,117
Joined: Feb 12, 2012
 

Re: The Official Lin Net Thread III.5 

Post#216 » by 13th Man » Fri Jan 5, 2018 10:23 pm

MGrand15 wrote:Lin opting out after a career altering injury :lol:


Yep, no player in his current situation would not pick up their option. The management knows this and don't even bother entertaining that possibility.
stretchy
Freshman
Posts: 68
And1: 24
Joined: Dec 28, 2016

Re: The Official Lin Net Thread III.5 

Post#217 » by stretchy » Fri Jan 5, 2018 11:25 pm

Any chance Nets could renegotiate his contract and buy him out? or waive him?
MGrand15
Lead Assistant
Posts: 5,987
And1: 2,758
Joined: Nov 17, 2009

Re: The Official Lin Net Thread III.5 

Post#218 » by MGrand15 » Fri Jan 5, 2018 11:38 pm

Absolutely not.

The anti-Lin guys are really bringing the nonsense these days.
hood30
Rookie
Posts: 1,108
And1: 229
Joined: Nov 30, 2015

Re: The Official Lin Net Thread III.5 

Post#219 » by hood30 » Mon Jan 8, 2018 9:00 am

Lin is opting in for next year but he knows well a starting spot with Brooklyn is no longer guaranty...He'll definitely be coming off the bench as a sixth-man with Dinwiddie starting at PG and Russell at SG and possibly LeVert at SF..Or Russell/LeVert starting in the back-court while Dinwiddie and Lin fight it out for back-up PG role behind Russell.

If Lin is healthy with no drop-off in skill, Nets would have a strong team next year...If Lin can score in double digit coming off the bench like he did for Charlotte, maybe he could get another chance to start elsewhere once his contract expires..Every year, there's always a couple teams that are looking for a veteran stop-gap PG, so maybe it won't be the last time we see Lin start in the NBA.
User avatar
ChokeFasncists
RealGM
Posts: 14,978
And1: 1,501
Joined: Jan 19, 2014
 

Re: The Official Lin Net Thread III.5 

Post#220 » by ChokeFasncists » Wed Jan 10, 2018 1:10 am

Sweetdownlow wrote:jlin7#NeverDone

Its about to be an epic comeback!



:pray:
MorbidHEAT wrote:My dislike for Lin started during Linsanity. It was absurd. It's probably irrational dislike at this point, but man he gets on my nerves. He's been tearing us up though.
Thanks for the honesty.

Return to Brooklyn Nets