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The Official D'Angelo Russell Thread II

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Re: The Official D'Angelo Russell Thread II 

Post#41 » by Roy Tarpley » Fri Apr 13, 2018 9:03 pm

SpeedyG wrote:his trigger is so quick that he can pretty much get his shot off against anyone. That last statement is pretty much the definition of a superstar...the ability to get your shot against their best defender, whenever you want. Again, consistency is an issue, but you see it there.


I dunno -- I think that's the definition of a false star. I always think of Antoine Walker as the model of a false star.

He had the pedigree from Kentucky, 6th overall pick, averaged 20 pts several times, 3-time All-star, had the swagger and the shimmy.

But his career percentages were 41/33/63. And the Celtics went nowhere as long as Walker was their "star."

There's no one as bad as Walker today but today's version might be Lillard or Wall.
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Re: The Official D'Angelo Russell Thread II 

Post#42 » by kamaze » Fri Apr 13, 2018 9:17 pm

MGrand15 wrote:His ball handling is nice but won't really be effective until his shooting scares the defense. His vision is as good as advertised but it's nullified by his poor decision making.

All of this skill stuff is crucial since he's been a BAD athlete this year. Slow, not explosive, not strong.

I guess people still see the potential because he has the draft pedigree and he plays with that alpha dog, #1 option swagger. I do think there's something to that. But as the sample size of games increases, it's hard for me to look at him with a STAR ceiling.

I don't think he separated himself from LeVert or Dinwiddie this year but I could see if someone is wowed by his shot creator potential, his vision, and his shooting touch.


The last game out of a timeout Jacque Vaughn was telling him something before they went out on the court he threw a post entry pass to Rhondae out of bounds...
A simple A to B pass he turns into a turnover That's something you work on in grade school.

I want a light switch to go off and he gets it over the summer we'll see.

He wasn't just a bad athlete this year he's a bad athlete period. He's got the alpha dog mentality without the alpha dog's work ethic and like we said he's not athletic. Marshon Brooks had the "star" mentality too and he ended up in China...
I don't think he's better than LeVert nor is he better than Dinwiddie the only thing that can make DLO better is him.
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Re: The Official D'Angelo Russell Thread II 

Post#43 » by MrDollarBills » Fri Apr 13, 2018 9:28 pm

kamaze wrote:
MGrand15 wrote:His ball handling is nice but won't really be effective until his shooting scares the defense. His vision is as good as advertised but it's nullified by his poor decision making.

All of this skill stuff is crucial since he's been a BAD athlete this year. Slow, not explosive, not strong.

I guess people still see the potential because he has the draft pedigree and he plays with that alpha dog, #1 option swagger. I do think there's something to that. But as the sample size of games increases, it's hard for me to look at him with a STAR ceiling.

I don't think he separated himself from LeVert or Dinwiddie this year but I could see if someone is wowed by his shot creator potential, his vision, and his shooting touch.


The last game out of a timeout Jacque Vaughn was telling him something before they went out on the court he threw a post entry pass to Rhondae out of bounds...
A simple A to B pass he turns into a turnover That's something you work on in grade school.

I want a light switch to go off and he gets it over the summer we'll see.

He wasn't just a bad athlete this year he's a bad athlete period. He's got the alpha dog mentality without the alpha dog's work ethic and like we said he's not athletic. Marshon Brooks had the "star" mentality too and he ended up in China...
I don't think he's better than LeVert nor is he better than Dinwiddie the only thing that can make DLO better is him.



Can you provide evidence that his work ethic is poor? We have not heard anything that calls that into question yet I keep seeing you questioning it. The coach has been fairly honest with his public assessments of Russell and his work habit is not something that has been questioned.

Also, lets be real. Caris LeVert is just as inconsistent as he is. I don't know why people whip on Russell but act like LeVert isn't going through the same growth process.
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Re: The Official D'Angelo Russell Thread II 

Post#44 » by kamaze » Fri Apr 13, 2018 9:35 pm

MrDollarBills wrote:
kamaze wrote:
MGrand15 wrote:His ball handling is nice but won't really be effective until his shooting scares the defense. His vision is as good as advertised but it's nullified by his poor decision making.

All of this skill stuff is crucial since he's been a BAD athlete this year. Slow, not explosive, not strong.

I guess people still see the potential because he has the draft pedigree and he plays with that alpha dog, #1 option swagger. I do think there's something to that. But as the sample size of games increases, it's hard for me to look at him with a STAR ceiling.

I don't think he separated himself from LeVert or Dinwiddie this year but I could see if someone is wowed by his shot creator potential, his vision, and his shooting touch.


The last game out of a timeout Jacque Vaughn was telling him something before they went out on the court he threw a post entry pass to Rhondae out of bounds...
A simple A to B pass he turns into a turnover That's something you work on in grade school.

I want a light switch to go off and he gets it over the summer we'll see.

He wasn't just a bad athlete this year he's a bad athlete period. He's got the alpha dog mentality without the alpha dog's work ethic and like we said he's not athletic. Marshon Brooks had the "star" mentality too and he ended up in China...
I don't think he's better than LeVert nor is he better than Dinwiddie the only thing that can make DLO better is him.



Can you provide evidence that his work ethic is poor? We have not heard anything that calls that into question yet I keep seeing you questioning it. The coach has been fairly honest with his public assessments of Russell and his work habit is not something that has been questioned.

Also, lets be real. Caris LeVert is just as inconsistent as he is. I don't know why people whip on Russell but act like LeVert isn't going through the same growth process.


Before the season, Carroll was asked which of the young players impressed him the most. Without hesitation, he said Caris LeVert because of his work ethic. The Nets want Carroll to guide D’Angelo Russell and be that voice in his head.

Carroll wants Russell to show him what LeVert showed him last summer.


https://www.netsdaily.com/2018/4/12/17231396/demarre-carroll-wants-to-take-dangelo-russell-under-his-wing-this-summer

“Defensively, we have to get nastier. We have to want it more.”

“We need players on the court who will be leaders, who will drive the defense forward,”

“In the fourth quarter, stuff will dry up. You really have to work for your buckets, and you really have to work for your stops. So, us being able to go from gear five to gear six, that’s a gear we need to find.”


Read between the lines bruh.
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Re: The Official D'Angelo Russell Thread II 

Post#45 » by MrDollarBills » Fri Apr 13, 2018 9:36 pm

MGrand15 wrote:
vincecarter4pres wrote:So in a lot of threads I keep reading how D'Angelo is the Nets most talented player, has the most potential, has near franchise level potential, has the most skills, can leap tall buildings in a single bound, etc.

And I have to ask... after 3 seasons in this league of nearly the exact same stuff, why is that perception accurate?

I still feel the need to start with the disclaimers of, I get why the trade was done, I would do it again myself and I do not flatout dislike D-Lo... but I just don't see it. LeVert, Allen and RHJ have massively more potential in my eyes, 2 of the 3 are just as if not more talented, pretty much no one on this roster has true near franchise level potential and only 2 of these guys can leap medium buildings off one foot or a jump stop.


I really want him to turn the corner, I really want to like him as a player, but I really need someone to convince me here. I even see the flashes of fantastic passes and court vision, the times his shot is falling where you say if he even became a consistent 38 from 3 and 44 from the field he'd light it up and he has the ball on a string. But his burst and first step are meh as hell, he's not even excessively quick in the open court, his bbiq overall is low, his decision making poor, his foot speed and defense is abysmal, his attitude is all **** up and real $hitty and he can barely dunk.

Someone make me see the light.


I wouldn't go as far as you're going but I mostly agree.

His potential coming into the draft came from: great size for a PG, elite ball handling, elite shooting (off the dribble especially) and elite vision.

His size at PG helps but with questions about whether hes better on or off the ball, it becomes less of a strength. His shooting has been average at best, very inconsistent. His ball handling is nice but won't really be effective until his shooting scares the defense. His vision is as good as advertised but it's nullified by his poor decision making.

All of this skill stuff is crucial since he's been a BAD athlete this year. Slow, not explosive, not strong.

I guess people still see the potential because he has the draft pedigree and he plays with that alpha dog, #1 option swagger. I do think there's something to that. But as the sample size of games increases, it's hard for me to look at him with a STAR ceiling.

I don't think he separated himself from LeVert or Dinwiddie this year but I could see if someone is wowed by his shot creator potential, his vision, and his shooting touch.


I agree with this. he needs to get stronger physically to make up for his athletic shortcomings and he needs to become more consistent.

My question is, for vc4p, how is his attitude **** ed?

He could have gone off the rails when he got benched that last time but he didn't. In fact each time he got benched he kept engaged in the game and was rooting for his teammates. post game, he didn't say anything out of pocket.

The on court criticisms are valid. this stuff about his attitude being messed up or him having a poor work ethic is pretty much conjecture imo. Unless you can point out specific instances?
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Re: The Official D'Angelo Russell Thread II 

Post#46 » by MrDollarBills » Fri Apr 13, 2018 9:37 pm

kamaze wrote:
MrDollarBills wrote:
kamaze wrote:
The last game out of a timeout Jacque Vaughn was telling him something before they went out on the court he threw a post entry pass to Rhondae out of bounds...
A simple A to B pass he turns into a turnover That's something you work on in grade school.

I want a light switch to go off and he gets it over the summer we'll see.

He wasn't just a bad athlete this year he's a bad athlete period. He's got the alpha dog mentality without the alpha dog's work ethic and like we said he's not athletic. Marshon Brooks had the "star" mentality too and he ended up in China...
I don't think he's better than LeVert nor is he better than Dinwiddie the only thing that can make DLO better is him.



Can you provide evidence that his work ethic is poor? We have not heard anything that calls that into question yet I keep seeing you questioning it. The coach has been fairly honest with his public assessments of Russell and his work habit is not something that has been questioned.

Also, lets be real. Caris LeVert is just as inconsistent as he is. I don't know why people whip on Russell but act like LeVert isn't going through the same growth process.


Before the season, Carroll was asked which of the young players impressed him the most. Without hesitation, he said Caris LeVert because of his work ethic. The Nets want Carroll to guide D’Angelo Russell and be that voice in his head.

Carroll wants Russell to show him what LeVert showed him last summer.


https://www.netsdaily.com/2018/4/12/17231396/demarre-carroll-wants-to-take-dangelo-russell-under-his-wing-this-summer

“Defensively, we have to get nastier. We have to want it more.”

“We need players on the court who will be leaders, who will drive the defense forward,”

“In the fourth quarter, stuff will dry up. You really have to work for your buckets, and you really have to work for your stops. So, us being able to go from gear five to gear six, that’s a gear we need to find.”


Read between the lines bruh.


None of this implies what you're saying.
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Re: The Official D'Angelo Russell Thread II 

Post#47 » by vincecarter4pres » Fri Apr 13, 2018 10:01 pm

MrDollarBills wrote:
MGrand15 wrote:
vincecarter4pres wrote:So in a lot of threads I keep reading how D'Angelo is the Nets most talented player, has the most potential, has near franchise level potential, has the most skills, can leap tall buildings in a single bound, etc.

And I have to ask... after 3 seasons in this league of nearly the exact same stuff, why is that perception accurate?

I still feel the need to start with the disclaimers of, I get why the trade was done, I would do it again myself and I do not flatout dislike D-Lo... but I just don't see it. LeVert, Allen and RHJ have massively more potential in my eyes, 2 of the 3 are just as if not more talented, pretty much no one on this roster has true near franchise level potential and only 2 of these guys can leap medium buildings off one foot or a jump stop.


I really want him to turn the corner, I really want to like him as a player, but I really need someone to convince me here. I even see the flashes of fantastic passes and court vision, the times his shot is falling where you say if he even became a consistent 38 from 3 and 44 from the field he'd light it up and he has the ball on a string. But his burst and first step are meh as hell, he's not even excessively quick in the open court, his bbiq overall is low, his decision making poor, his foot speed and defense is abysmal, his attitude is all **** up and real $hitty and he can barely dunk.

Someone make me see the light.


I wouldn't go as far as you're going but I mostly agree.

His potential coming into the draft came from: great size for a PG, elite ball handling, elite shooting (off the dribble especially) and elite vision.

His size at PG helps but with questions about whether hes better on or off the ball, it becomes less of a strength. His shooting has been average at best, very inconsistent. His ball handling is nice but won't really be effective until his shooting scares the defense. His vision is as good as advertised but it's nullified by his poor decision making.

All of this skill stuff is crucial since he's been a BAD athlete this year. Slow, not explosive, not strong.

I guess people still see the potential because he has the draft pedigree and he plays with that alpha dog, #1 option swagger. I do think there's something to that. But as the sample size of games increases, it's hard for me to look at him with a STAR ceiling.

I don't think he separated himself from LeVert or Dinwiddie this year but I could see if someone is wowed by his shot creator potential, his vision, and his shooting touch.


I agree with this. he needs to get stronger physically to make up for his athletic shortcomings and he needs to become more consistent.

My question is, for vc4p, how is his attitude **** ed?

He could have gone off the rails when he got benched that last time but he didn't. In fact each time he got benched he kept engaged in the game and was rooting for his teammates. post game, he didn't say anything out of pocket.

The on court criticisms are valid. this stuff about his attitude being messed up or him having a poor work ethic is pretty much conjecture imo. Unless you can point out specific instances?

My attitude comment was an ode to Prodigy, but what I mean is what everyone here has discussed... stuff where his attitude towards the game leads to carelessness, turnovers, poor decisions, etc. I'm not saying he's a cancer, or a guy starting **** over his minutes and the such, but he has a sense of entitlement that other players on this roster do not and that big dog swagger and air about him, but with none of the big dog stats, athleticism, game, or strength.

And I agree with Kamaze on this one, read between the lines. He does not hit the weight room like he should, has to skip leg days, hasn't worked on his explosion, etc. He's all glamour muscles, no core, no lower body, no fast twitch. Some of that stuff is quite genetic, but it's obvious he doesn't work on this stuff like he should if he cared more. Carroll, RHJ, Dinwiddie, Coach K, others, they've all made obvious read between the lines stuff about his conditioning, approach, attitude and mentality.

Dude is not focused and not quick witted and his on court goofiness is an obvious microcosm of that.
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Re: The Official D'Angelo Russell Thread II 

Post#48 » by TinmanZBoy » Fri Apr 13, 2018 10:08 pm

vincecarter4pres wrote:
MrDollarBills wrote:
MGrand15 wrote:
I wouldn't go as far as you're going but I mostly agree.

His potential coming into the draft came from: great size for a PG, elite ball handling, elite shooting (off the dribble especially) and elite vision.

His size at PG helps but with questions about whether hes better on or off the ball, it becomes less of a strength. His shooting has been average at best, very inconsistent. His ball handling is nice but won't really be effective until his shooting scares the defense. His vision is as good as advertised but it's nullified by his poor decision making.

All of this skill stuff is crucial since he's been a BAD athlete this year. Slow, not explosive, not strong.

I guess people still see the potential because he has the draft pedigree and he plays with that alpha dog, #1 option swagger. I do think there's something to that. But as the sample size of games increases, it's hard for me to look at him with a STAR ceiling.

I don't think he separated himself from LeVert or Dinwiddie this year but I could see if someone is wowed by his shot creator potential, his vision, and his shooting touch.


I agree with this. he needs to get stronger physically to make up for his athletic shortcomings and he needs to become more consistent.

My question is, for vc4p, how is his attitude **** ed?

He could have gone off the rails when he got benched that last time but he didn't. In fact each time he got benched he kept engaged in the game and was rooting for his teammates. post game, he didn't say anything out of pocket.

The on court criticisms are valid. this stuff about his attitude being messed up or him having a poor work ethic is pretty much conjecture imo. Unless you can point out specific instances?

My attitude comment was an ode to Prodigy, but what I mean is what everyone here has discussed... stuff where his attitude towards the game leads to carelessness, turnovers, poor decisions, etc. I'm not saying he's a cancer, or a guy starting **** over his minutes and the such, but he has a sense of entitlement that other players on this roster do not and that big dog swagger and air about him, but with none of the big dog stats, athleticism, game, or strength.

And I agree with Kamaze on this one, read between the lines. He does not hit the weight room like he should, has to skip leg days, hasn't worked on his explosion, etc. He's all glamour muscles, no core, no lower body, no fast twitch. Some of that stuff is quite genetic, but it's obvious he doesn't work on this stuff like he should if he cared more. Carroll, RHJ, Dinwiddie, Coach K, others, they've all made obvious read between the lines stuff about his conditioning, approach, attitude and mentality.

Dude is not focused and not quick witted and his on court goofiness is an obvious microcosm of that.


DLo has been a good solider.... this is the strength of this team.... I expect Dlo will improve a lot next season, just like what Harris, RHJ, LeVert make this season.... next season is crucial for her and the organization too
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Re: The Official D'Angelo Russell Thread II 

Post#49 » by vincecarter4pres » Fri Apr 13, 2018 10:12 pm

TinmanZBoy wrote:
vincecarter4pres wrote:
MrDollarBills wrote:
I agree with this. he needs to get stronger physically to make up for his athletic shortcomings and he needs to become more consistent.

My question is, for vc4p, how is his attitude **** ed?

He could have gone off the rails when he got benched that last time but he didn't. In fact each time he got benched he kept engaged in the game and was rooting for his teammates. post game, he didn't say anything out of pocket.

The on court criticisms are valid. this stuff about his attitude being messed up or him having a poor work ethic is pretty much conjecture imo. Unless you can point out specific instances?

My attitude comment was an ode to Prodigy, but what I mean is what everyone here has discussed... stuff where his attitude towards the game leads to carelessness, turnovers, poor decisions, etc. I'm not saying he's a cancer, or a guy starting **** over his minutes and the such, but he has a sense of entitlement that other players on this roster do not and that big dog swagger and air about him, but with none of the big dog stats, athleticism, game, or strength.

And I agree with Kamaze on this one, read between the lines. He does not hit the weight room like he should, has to skip leg days, hasn't worked on his explosion, etc. He's all glamour muscles, no core, no lower body, no fast twitch. Some of that stuff is quite genetic, but it's obvious he doesn't work on this stuff like he should if he cared more. Carroll, RHJ, Dinwiddie, Coach K, others, they've all made obvious read between the lines stuff about his conditioning, approach, attitude and mentality.

Dude is not focused and not quick witted and his on court goofiness is an obvious microcosm of that.


DLo has been a good solider.... this is the strength of this team.... I expect Dlo will improve a lot next season, just like what Harris, RHJ, LeVert make this season.... next season is crucial for her and the organization too

I agree he's been a good soldier. I hope he makes that jump. My attitude concerns aren't with him causing waves, at least not thus far, it's more of what Roy was saying, a false star. He mentions Antoine Walker, again for me, JR Smith comes to mind minus a lot of the actual craziness, or recently I was thinking he reminds me of White Chocolate a little something.
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Re: The Official D'Angelo Russell Thread II 

Post#50 » by MGrand15 » Fri Apr 13, 2018 10:32 pm

MrDollarBills wrote:
MGrand15 wrote:
vincecarter4pres wrote:So in a lot of threads I keep reading how D'Angelo is the Nets most talented player, has the most potential, has near franchise level potential, has the most skills, can leap tall buildings in a single bound, etc.

And I have to ask... after 3 seasons in this league of nearly the exact same stuff, why is that perception accurate?

I still feel the need to start with the disclaimers of, I get why the trade was done, I would do it again myself and I do not flatout dislike D-Lo... but I just don't see it. LeVert, Allen and RHJ have massively more potential in my eyes, 2 of the 3 are just as if not more talented, pretty much no one on this roster has true near franchise level potential and only 2 of these guys can leap medium buildings off one foot or a jump stop.


I really want him to turn the corner, I really want to like him as a player, but I really need someone to convince me here. I even see the flashes of fantastic passes and court vision, the times his shot is falling where you say if he even became a consistent 38 from 3 and 44 from the field he'd light it up and he has the ball on a string. But his burst and first step are meh as hell, he's not even excessively quick in the open court, his bbiq overall is low, his decision making poor, his foot speed and defense is abysmal, his attitude is all **** up and real $hitty and he can barely dunk.

Someone make me see the light.


I wouldn't go as far as you're going but I mostly agree.

His potential coming into the draft came from: great size for a PG, elite ball handling, elite shooting (off the dribble especially) and elite vision.

His size at PG helps but with questions about whether hes better on or off the ball, it becomes less of a strength. His shooting has been average at best, very inconsistent. His ball handling is nice but won't really be effective until his shooting scares the defense. His vision is as good as advertised but it's nullified by his poor decision making.

All of this skill stuff is crucial since he's been a BAD athlete this year. Slow, not explosive, not strong.

I guess people still see the potential because he has the draft pedigree and he plays with that alpha dog, #1 option swagger. I do think there's something to that. But as the sample size of games increases, it's hard for me to look at him with a STAR ceiling.

I don't think he separated himself from LeVert or Dinwiddie this year but I could see if someone is wowed by his shot creator potential, his vision, and his shooting touch.


I agree with this. he needs to get stronger physically to make up for his athletic shortcomings and he needs to become more consistent.

My question is, for vc4p, how is his attitude **** ed?

He could have gone off the rails when he got benched that last time but he didn't. In fact each time he got benched he kept engaged in the game and was rooting for his teammates. post game, he didn't say anything out of pocket.

The on court criticisms are valid. this stuff about his attitude being messed up or him having a poor work ethic is pretty much conjecture imo. Unless you can point out specific instances?


I think his swagger and chill demeanor on the court rubs people the wrong way. I do feel like he needs to learn to play HARD. It's a skill. Fighting for boards that you have a 5% chance of getting, diving on the floor, going for chase down blocks, not giving up on plays. It's work.

We do a decent job of keeping any issues in house. The only thing I could think of that got me worried was when Russell called the team out for their effort vs. a bad team and compared it to a game where we played well against the Warriors. RHJ's twitter is mostly nonsense but he responded immediately and basically said PRACTICE WHAT YOU PREACH.

RHJ is a hot head and I'm sure it was nothing. Most likely an isolated incident. But he wouldn't respond like that if Carroll called him out.

These issues are pretty common for young players though.
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Re: The Official D'Angelo Russell Thread II 

Post#51 » by kamaze » Fri Apr 13, 2018 10:47 pm

vincecarter4pres wrote:
MrDollarBills wrote:
MGrand15 wrote:
I wouldn't go as far as you're going but I mostly agree.

His potential coming into the draft came from: great size for a PG, elite ball handling, elite shooting (off the dribble especially) and elite vision.

His size at PG helps but with questions about whether hes better on or off the ball, it becomes less of a strength. His shooting has been average at best, very inconsistent. His ball handling is nice but won't really be effective until his shooting scares the defense. His vision is as good as advertised but it's nullified by his poor decision making.

All of this skill stuff is crucial since he's been a BAD athlete this year. Slow, not explosive, not strong.

I guess people still see the potential because he has the draft pedigree and he plays with that alpha dog, #1 option swagger. I do think there's something to that. But as the sample size of games increases, it's hard for me to look at him with a STAR ceiling.

I don't think he separated himself from LeVert or Dinwiddie this year but I could see if someone is wowed by his shot creator potential, his vision, and his shooting touch.


I agree with this. he needs to get stronger physically to make up for his athletic shortcomings and he needs to become more consistent.

My question is, for vc4p, how is his attitude **** ed?

He could have gone off the rails when he got benched that last time but he didn't. In fact each time he got benched he kept engaged in the game and was rooting for his teammates. post game, he didn't say anything out of pocket.

The on court criticisms are valid. this stuff about his attitude being messed up or him having a poor work ethic is pretty much conjecture imo. Unless you can point out specific instances?

My attitude comment was an ode to Prodigy, but what I mean is what everyone here has discussed... stuff where his attitude towards the game leads to carelessness, turnovers, poor decisions, etc. I'm not saying he's a cancer, or a guy starting **** over his minutes and the such, but he has a sense of entitlement that other players on this roster do not and that big dog swagger and air about him, but with none of the big dog stats, athleticism, game, or strength.

And I agree with Kamaze on this one, read between the lines. He does not hit the weight room like he should, has to skip leg days, hasn't worked on his explosion, etc. He's all glamour muscles, no core, no lower body, no fast twitch. Some of that stuff is quite genetic, but it's obvious he doesn't work on this stuff like he should if he cared more. Carroll, RHJ, Dinwiddie, Coach K, others, they've all made obvious read between the lines stuff about his conditioning, approach, attitude and mentality.

Dude is not focused and not quick witted and his on court goofiness is an obvious microcosm of that.


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Re: The Official D'Angelo Russell Thread II 

Post#52 » by IceManBK1 » Fri Apr 13, 2018 11:12 pm

nets need sign/trade for big good pick and roll bigs to complement dlo's game...more pick and roll, less 3s will do him good. they had trevor booker and tyler zeller; and mozgov who's a big body that sets stagnant picks but plays horrible defense. I wish they never traded booker/zeller. they're all we need; guys who can do the dirty work who would focus on reb and def and not just shooting.
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Re: The Official D'Angelo Russell Thread II 

Post#53 » by MrDollarBills » Sat Apr 14, 2018 1:45 am

vincecarter4pres wrote:
MrDollarBills wrote:
MGrand15 wrote:
I wouldn't go as far as you're going but I mostly agree.

His potential coming into the draft came from: great size for a PG, elite ball handling, elite shooting (off the dribble especially) and elite vision.

His size at PG helps but with questions about whether hes better on or off the ball, it becomes less of a strength. His shooting has been average at best, very inconsistent. His ball handling is nice but won't really be effective until his shooting scares the defense. His vision is as good as advertised but it's nullified by his poor decision making.

All of this skill stuff is crucial since he's been a BAD athlete this year. Slow, not explosive, not strong.

I guess people still see the potential because he has the draft pedigree and he plays with that alpha dog, #1 option swagger. I do think there's something to that. But as the sample size of games increases, it's hard for me to look at him with a STAR ceiling.

I don't think he separated himself from LeVert or Dinwiddie this year but I could see if someone is wowed by his shot creator potential, his vision, and his shooting touch.


I agree with this. he needs to get stronger physically to make up for his athletic shortcomings and he needs to become more consistent.

My question is, for vc4p, how is his attitude **** ed?

He could have gone off the rails when he got benched that last time but he didn't. In fact each time he got benched he kept engaged in the game and was rooting for his teammates. post game, he didn't say anything out of pocket.

The on court criticisms are valid. this stuff about his attitude being messed up or him having a poor work ethic is pretty much conjecture imo. Unless you can point out specific instances?

My attitude comment was an ode to Prodigy, but what I mean is what everyone here has discussed... stuff where his attitude towards the game leads to carelessness, turnovers, poor decisions, etc. I'm not saying he's a cancer, or a guy starting **** over his minutes and the such, but he has a sense of entitlement that other players on this roster do not and that big dog swagger and air about him, but with none of the big dog stats, athleticism, game, or strength.

And I agree with Kamaze on this one, read between the lines. He does not hit the weight room like he should, has to skip leg days, hasn't worked on his explosion, etc. He's all glamour muscles, no core, no lower body, no fast twitch. Some of that stuff is quite genetic, but it's obvious he doesn't work on this stuff like he should if he cared more. Carroll, RHJ, Dinwiddie, Coach K, others, they've all made obvious read between the lines stuff about his conditioning, approach, attitude and mentality.

Dude is not focused and not quick witted and his on court goofiness is an obvious microcosm of that.


Did you read the commentary about him when he was rehabbing to get back on the court? what was being said, and what you're saying, despite his chicken legs, are quite opposite. from everything that has been available for public consumption, he was busting his tail with the training team.

I'm just saying dude, give the kid a chance. lets see what the summer will bring and how he comes into camp next season. I'm pretty sure his exit interview was blunt and to the point. he needs to get stronger lower, core, and upper body. he needs to stop being careless. I'm not going to just give up on a 22 year old kid who hasn't done anything so bad to the point where we should wash our hands of him.

I guess I'm more patient with him because I remember when i was his age. i'd love to go back in time and slap my 22 year old self. so i understand...for some guys it takes a bit longer to figure it out.

I think that his focus is inconsistent as well. the games where i saw him completely focused were the ones where he scored maybe 16 pts but had a good number of assists and orchestrated the team's offense masterfully, with maybe 2 TOs at most. i see that kind of play and i think hey maybe he can start doing this a lot more in time. Give him a chance man.
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Re: The Official D'Angelo Russell Thread II 

Post#54 » by MrDollarBills » Sat Apr 14, 2018 1:54 am

vincecarter4pres wrote:
TinmanZBoy wrote:
vincecarter4pres wrote:My attitude comment was an ode to Prodigy, but what I mean is what everyone here has discussed... stuff where his attitude towards the game leads to carelessness, turnovers, poor decisions, etc. I'm not saying he's a cancer, or a guy starting **** over his minutes and the such, but he has a sense of entitlement that other players on this roster do not and that big dog swagger and air about him, but with none of the big dog stats, athleticism, game, or strength.

And I agree with Kamaze on this one, read between the lines. He does not hit the weight room like he should, has to skip leg days, hasn't worked on his explosion, etc. He's all glamour muscles, no core, no lower body, no fast twitch. Some of that stuff is quite genetic, but it's obvious he doesn't work on this stuff like he should if he cared more. Carroll, RHJ, Dinwiddie, Coach K, others, they've all made obvious read between the lines stuff about his conditioning, approach, attitude and mentality.

Dude is not focused and not quick witted and his on court goofiness is an obvious microcosm of that.


DLo has been a good solider.... this is the strength of this team.... I expect Dlo will improve a lot next season, just like what Harris, RHJ, LeVert make this season.... next season is crucial for her and the organization too

I agree he's been a good soldier. I hope he makes that jump. My attitude concerns aren't with him causing waves, at least not thus far, it's more of what Roy was saying, a false star. He mentions Antoine Walker, again for me, JR Smith comes to mind minus a lot of the actual craziness, or recently I was thinking he reminds me of White Chocolate a little something.


JR Smith actually killed one of his friends and has rarely been a good soldier anywhere he has went. even comparing him to Jason Williams is a bit much because Williams had far more attitude issues than Russell has had -here- with us. These comparisons imo are unwarranted. You're comparing him to two stoners, one of whom actually got someone killed in a manslaughter car crash, the other who yelled racist slurs at asian fans during a game. come on. Russell's worst behavior was the fact that he snitched out Nick Young who is a man in his 30s who preys on 19 year old girls or worse. i don't care about that. Comparing him to JR Smith, who is legit a seriously garbage human being is way over the top.

Him being a false star...well, here's the thing. he has a long ways to go physically and mentally. but here's where confidence comes into play. to actually be a star player, you have to believe that you're the best player on the court at all times regardless of who you're facing. the fact that Russell has that swagger about him is what leads him towards going into scoring outbursts that not one player on this team right now outside of Allen Crabbe has proven capable of. I'd prefer that he humble himself a bit after this rough season, but i actually think that his brashness isn't a bad thing either. compare that to Spencer, who goes through bouts of confidence issues routinely which clearly impacts his game. you have to believe in yourself.

Russell's issue is that he needs to find balance to his game. he needs to know when he should be focused on making his teammates better, and when he should be taking the game over, because we both know that he has the talent and skills to do so. this will come with time and maturity.
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Re: The Official D'Angelo Russell Thread II 

Post#55 » by MrDollarBills » Sat Apr 14, 2018 2:11 am

MGrand15 wrote:
MrDollarBills wrote:
MGrand15 wrote:
I wouldn't go as far as you're going but I mostly agree.

His potential coming into the draft came from: great size for a PG, elite ball handling, elite shooting (off the dribble especially) and elite vision.

His size at PG helps but with questions about whether hes better on or off the ball, it becomes less of a strength. His shooting has been average at best, very inconsistent. His ball handling is nice but won't really be effective until his shooting scares the defense. His vision is as good as advertised but it's nullified by his poor decision making.

All of this skill stuff is crucial since he's been a BAD athlete this year. Slow, not explosive, not strong.

I guess people still see the potential because he has the draft pedigree and he plays with that alpha dog, #1 option swagger. I do think there's something to that. But as the sample size of games increases, it's hard for me to look at him with a STAR ceiling.

I don't think he separated himself from LeVert or Dinwiddie this year but I could see if someone is wowed by his shot creator potential, his vision, and his shooting touch.


I agree with this. he needs to get stronger physically to make up for his athletic shortcomings and he needs to become more consistent.

My question is, for vc4p, how is his attitude **** ed?

He could have gone off the rails when he got benched that last time but he didn't. In fact each time he got benched he kept engaged in the game and was rooting for his teammates. post game, he didn't say anything out of pocket.

The on court criticisms are valid. this stuff about his attitude being messed up or him having a poor work ethic is pretty much conjecture imo. Unless you can point out specific instances?


I think his swagger and chill demeanor on the court rubs people the wrong way. I do feel like he needs to learn to play HARD. It's a skill. Fighting for boards that you have a 5% chance of getting, diving on the floor, going for chase down blocks, not giving up on plays. It's work.

We do a decent job of keeping any issues in house. The only thing I could think of that got me worried was when Russell called the team out for their effort vs. a bad team and compared it to a game where we played well against the Warriors. RHJ's twitter is mostly nonsense but he responded immediately and basically said PRACTICE WHAT YOU PREACH.

RHJ is a hot head and I'm sure it was nothing. Most likely an isolated incident. But he wouldn't respond like that if Carroll called him out.

These issues are pretty common for young players though.


Rondae is a leader on this team. He's kind of weird too, but not in a bad way. I don't mind him saying that. also, these guys need to check each other.

that being said. if i don't see Russell locked in working out with DMC after these statements....i will have concerns. Here we have a solid vet extending his hand towards this kid. he needs to do it. if he doesn't, i will question him. big time.

this is make or break time. because if i'm Sean Marks, and I see what is going down, and if Russell chooses otherwise...i'm not offering big money.

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Re: The Official D'Angelo Russell Thread II 

Post#56 » by kamaze » Sat Apr 14, 2018 3:30 am

MrDollarBills wrote:
MGrand15 wrote:
MrDollarBills wrote:
I agree with this. he needs to get stronger physically to make up for his athletic shortcomings and he needs to become more consistent.

My question is, for vc4p, how is his attitude **** ed?

He could have gone off the rails when he got benched that last time but he didn't. In fact each time he got benched he kept engaged in the game and was rooting for his teammates. post game, he didn't say anything out of pocket.

The on court criticisms are valid. this stuff about his attitude being messed up or him having a poor work ethic is pretty much conjecture imo. Unless you can point out specific instances?


I think his swagger and chill demeanor on the court rubs people the wrong way. I do feel like he needs to learn to play HARD. It's a skill. Fighting for boards that you have a 5% chance of getting, diving on the floor, going for chase down blocks, not giving up on plays. It's work.

We do a decent job of keeping any issues in house. The only thing I could think of that got me worried was when Russell called the team out for their effort vs. a bad team and compared it to a game where we played well against the Warriors. RHJ's twitter is mostly nonsense but he responded immediately and basically said PRACTICE WHAT YOU PREACH.

RHJ is a hot head and I'm sure it was nothing. Most likely an isolated incident. But he wouldn't respond like that if Carroll called him out.

These issues are pretty common for young players though.


Rondae is a leader on this team. He's kind of weird too, but not in a bad way. I don't mind him saying that. also, these guys need to check each other.

that being said. if i don't see Russell locked in working out with DMC after these statements....i will have concerns. Here we have a solid vet extending his hand towards this kid. he needs to do it. if he doesn't, i will question him. big time.

this is make or break time. because if i'm Sean Marks, and I see what is going down, and if Russell chooses otherwise...i'm not offering big money.

the ball is in his court.


I wouldn't offer him any money. I'm looking at what he brings now so far his production has been bad and I din't see any improvement this season in his defense or turnovers I don't think he wants it as bad as we want it for him. I get you want to give him a leash MDB but the NBA's a business he already knows that. Tighten up and get with the program or get the f out. Some kids have to learn the hard way.

Brooklyn has enough point guards they'll be fine with or without D'Angelo.
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Re: The Official D'Angelo Russell Thread II 

Post#57 » by MrDollarBills » Sat Apr 14, 2018 4:11 am

that's fine. we'll see whose viewpoint wins out, my friend.
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Re: The Official D'Angelo Russell Thread II 

Post#58 » by Prokorov » Sun Apr 15, 2018 12:32 am

kamaze wrote:
MrDollarBills wrote:
MGrand15 wrote:
I think his swagger and chill demeanor on the court rubs people the wrong way. I do feel like he needs to learn to play HARD. It's a skill. Fighting for boards that you have a 5% chance of getting, diving on the floor, going for chase down blocks, not giving up on plays. It's work.

We do a decent job of keeping any issues in house. The only thing I could think of that got me worried was when Russell called the team out for their effort vs. a bad team and compared it to a game where we played well against the Warriors. RHJ's twitter is mostly nonsense but he responded immediately and basically said PRACTICE WHAT YOU PREACH.

RHJ is a hot head and I'm sure it was nothing. Most likely an isolated incident. But he wouldn't respond like that if Carroll called him out.

These issues are pretty common for young players though.


Rondae is a leader on this team. He's kind of weird too, but not in a bad way. I don't mind him saying that. also, these guys need to check each other.

that being said. if i don't see Russell locked in working out with DMC after these statements....i will have concerns. Here we have a solid vet extending his hand towards this kid. he needs to do it. if he doesn't, i will question him. big time.

this is make or break time. because if i'm Sean Marks, and I see what is going down, and if Russell chooses otherwise...i'm not offering big money.

the ball is in his court.


I wouldn't offer him any money. I'm looking at what he brings now so far his production has been bad and I din't see any improvement this season in his defense or turnovers I don't think he wants it as bad as we want it for him. I get you want to give him a leash MDB but the NBA's a business he already knows that. Tighten up and get with the program or get the f out. Some kids have to learn the hard way.

Brooklyn has enough point guards they'll be fine with or without D'Angelo.


defense is irrelevant, especially if he plays mostly PG (since PG defense doesnt matter much).

if he stays and is ever worth the money it will be because of his offense. he needs to shoot 40% from three and use that shooting threat to get to the lane and rim like pierce.

if he cant then he wont be here. but he defense should play 0 factor into his future here. same with okafor
Kswiss wrote:Go watch a D'Angelo Russell highlight tape and tell me with a straight face the kid looks like a NBA prospect. I just can't see him in the league in three years.


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Re: The Official D'Angelo Russell Thread II 

Post#59 » by MrDollarBills » Sun Apr 15, 2018 1:21 am

i'll even take 37% 3PT tbh if we want him to be like Pierce. But I agree, if he isn't hitting his threes then he's not worth the money. next year we need to see an uptick in efficiency. this is why i point to his games where he may have had 16-18 points but a solid amount of assists, few turnovers and good efficiency from downtown. those were the games where he was at his best and led us to wins. that's the guy who is worth the money. the games where he drops 20+ points but on mediocre efficiency and high turnovers? that isn't worth a contract extension.
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Re: The Official D'Angelo Russell Thread II 

Post#60 » by SpeedyG » Sun Apr 15, 2018 3:18 am

Roy Tarpley wrote:
SpeedyG wrote:his trigger is so quick that he can pretty much get his shot off against anyone. That last statement is pretty much the definition of a superstar...the ability to get your shot against their best defender, whenever you want. Again, consistency is an issue, but you see it there.


I dunno -- I think that's the definition of a false star. I always think of Antoine Walker as the model of a false star.

He had the pedigree from Kentucky, 6th overall pick, averaged 20 pts several times, 3-time All-star, had the swagger and the shimmy.

But his career percentages were 41/33/63. And the Celtics went nowhere as long as Walker was their "star."

There's no one as bad as Walker today but today's version might be Lillard or Wall.


It's a fine line..but to clarify I didn't say thats the end all be all of a superstar. I said that to illustrate what is ultimately asked of a superstar and why Russell has a higher potential.

Walker was a black hole who wasn't all that efficient, didn't defend, and wasn't a great rebounder.

But Russell is also only 22, for the most part is willing to share the ball and uses his vision and creativity to do so (to a fault due to high risk at times). Hes even gotten more aggressive rebounding and shown more willingness to defend in later parts of season.

So naturally, if he becomes more consistent with his strength while continuing to improve his effort and decision making (which are both improbable through experience and being in better shape) that ultimately can make him a bona fide star
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