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Nets Media Day/Training Camp Thread

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Re: Nets Media Day/Training Camp Thread 

Post#81 » by NyCeEvO » Wed Sep 26, 2018 10:48 pm

MrDollarBills wrote:I'm not sure how my criticism of LeVert's inconsistency equates to hate? That's just a weird false equivalency to throw out there.

The guy was very inconsistent last year. That's a fact. He needs to become more reliable night in, night out. He needs to defend the pick and roll better. He needs to show that he can get to anywhere on the floor versus teams with length. He needs to up his three point efficiency. Those are valid and fair critiques, I'm not sure how that means i hate the kid?

I say the same exact things about Russell, but no one here considers that hate. I wonder why?

I'm also keeping my expectations tempered because we hear the same stuff every preseason. I'd rather do that and view Caris objectively instead of getting amped off of meaningless quotes for Jared Dudley about LeVert kicking ass in pick up games on a team that is notoriously bad at defense in the first place.

I mean (and no offense Claud) we have people putting LeVert's name in the same sentence as Paul George, Jimmy Butler, Jrue Holiday...its okay to be excited I am too but me pumping the breaks on the hype train isn't hate for Caris LeVert. Me saying that he is seriously overrated on this board and on NetsDaily isn't hate. The guy has to show on court improvement in consistency and show that he can be relied upon each night. I don't care about "flashes". I care about consistency, because that's what will win games. Russell showed flashes too, are you guys going to get amped about that or do you want him to show and prove? I guaruntee for 90% of the board, its the latter.

We all have our favorites on the squad, and that's cool. But that's not going to stop me from telling the truth about each player and holding them to the same standard.

Also, for perspective, Paul George was already an all star at age 22. Caris LeVert is 24 and hasn't even come close to that production. That's a really unfair expectation to put on him to be honest.

It's exceedingly rare for young players to come in and be consistent. That's why we usually wait a couple of years before definitively declaring whether a player is a bust or not. It usually takes a few seasons to be able to sort out all the sheep from the goats.

Also, PG was 22 in his 3rd season in the league. This is LeVert's 3rd season (and he missed half of the first one). Game played and time training is a bigger marker for me than age. Injuries are what kept Caris from being drafted at an earlier age and what kept him from being an actual lottery pick.
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Re: Nets Media Day/Training Camp Thread 

Post#82 » by NyCeEvO » Wed Sep 26, 2018 10:52 pm

vincecarter4pres wrote:The quote that gives me promise for LeVert is the one by I believe Carroll, where he takes about slowing down, switching gears and not always playing at that break neck, frantic pace with his head down, running into defenders.

If Caris can learn to start switching gears and can up his shooting off the dribble, he becomes a very dangerous, potential Khris Middleton type of player.

I said this exact thing last year. He needs to learn how to play at different speeds. If you play at 1 speed, NBA players will adjust to you. CP3 was a superstar long after his athleticism declined due to the removal of his meniscus. His mastery of changing pace while maintaining ball control is what makes him so good.
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Nets Media Day/Training Camp Thread 

Post#83 » by Paradise » Wed Sep 26, 2018 11:34 pm

MrDollarBills wrote:
Paradise wrote:
Prokorov wrote:
exactly... you never hear that guys have plateaued, made only marginal improvement, or declined (unless its an older guy). its always how great everyone looks.

Last year we heard how we should expect big things from caris now that the injuries were behind him headed into year 2. he went on to start the year with the worst month of his career.

They never once said how great everyone looks. It was simply them ANSWERING who LOOKED good throughout the summer. The unanimous answer was LeVert. Not, DLO, not Harris, not Dinwiddie. Most of the quotes came from guys who are BRAND NEW to the organization. They were unaware of his own talent.

So, because he didn’t develop at this impatient pace last season that means they are simply lying and giving lip service? Imagine what Wolves, Kings, Suns fans feel every time they watch media day interviews. They actually haven’t been to the postseason in decades.

Caris endured his FIRST off-season of his career, first full season with no foot restrictions last summer. It’s PERFECTLY normal to expect or to see a surge of growth in a year 3 player...the older they get the more mature and experience they gain.

Net fans with this high horse attitude that other fans don’t show to me is very, very cringeworthy. You’d think these guys are robots and not a developing rebuilding situation...

I don’t think this board knows what a rebuild looks like or how development works. Seriously.


Who is being impatient?

The basic point being made is that we heard good things last preseason too and LeVert struggled hard, so I'll wait and see before I get all excited. I'm already excited just to see the team play, I don't really want to cast obscene expectations on LeVert based off of Dudley's hyperbole or LeVert molly whopping people in practice.

When he was going through that struggle period last year I was one of the people on here who was saying that we needed to be patient while he worked his way out of his slow start. I'm not sure why saying "yeah okay pre camp quotes are great but I'll wait to see him in real games before buying in to the hype" = being impatient with the rebuilding process?

Its funny to see people getting upset at posters for wanting to take a measured approach to preseason expectations, and then come January when frustration sets in you'll see posts in game threads where people start bitching (not you) and start saying that they can't watch this **** anymore. The people who make those comments are the ones that you need to direct those 'yall don't understand how a rebuild works" towards, not me.

It’s not a problem with a measured approach. It’s just insanely rare to expect these guys to develop in leaps.

Because it didn’t happen during the season the way we wanted doesn’t mean he didn’t look improved. It certainly didn’t make it lip service.

I hear you with the tempered expectations but it’s hard to criticize harshly the comments of media day when these kids in particular are still evolving and this is only his second full off-season in the NBA.

My stance is always the same here so it’s not personal. I just know this board is insanely bi-polar with judging development and equating the support which I hate because we should be grateful to even be here because these are literally diamonds in a rough we are dealing with and we should be thrilled we are WAY ahead of schedule now that we’re legitimately in the conversation (still) for an all-star.

I just hate when everyone gets so frustrated when in reality we’ve only been chipping away at this for 4 seasons. This upcoming season is the first true step to relevancy. Either way, we win the draft and come away with (Zion, Barrett, Reddish) or make a significant push for the playoffs and solidify our rep as a FA destination for some guys.

I’ll truly be upset at any injuries or lack of interest, identity, culture, bad deals, etc. However, I’m all the way good with how this season and next season is shaping up. It’s a win-win situation and I wouldn’t be surprised if we acquired another 1st round pick for DeMarre Carroll. If Sean Marks pulls that off around February which is very realistic IMO...we step into the spotlight once again on draft night (in our own arena).
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Re: Nets Media Day/Training Camp Thread 

Post#84 » by MrDollarBills » Thu Sep 27, 2018 12:29 am

NyCeEvO wrote:
MrDollarBills wrote:I'm not sure how my criticism of LeVert's inconsistency equates to hate? That's just a weird false equivalency to throw out there.

The guy was very inconsistent last year. That's a fact. He needs to become more reliable night in, night out. He needs to defend the pick and roll better. He needs to show that he can get to anywhere on the floor versus teams with length. He needs to up his three point efficiency. Those are valid and fair critiques, I'm not sure how that means i hate the kid?

I say the same exact things about Russell, but no one here considers that hate. I wonder why?

I'm also keeping my expectations tempered because we hear the same stuff every preseason. I'd rather do that and view Caris objectively instead of getting amped off of meaningless quotes for Jared Dudley about LeVert kicking ass in pick up games on a team that is notoriously bad at defense in the first place.

I mean (and no offense Claud) we have people putting LeVert's name in the same sentence as Paul George, Jimmy Butler, Jrue Holiday...its okay to be excited I am too but me pumping the breaks on the hype train isn't hate for Caris LeVert. Me saying that he is seriously overrated on this board and on NetsDaily isn't hate. The guy has to show on court improvement in consistency and show that he can be relied upon each night. I don't care about "flashes". I care about consistency, because that's what will win games. Russell showed flashes too, are you guys going to get amped about that or do you want him to show and prove? I guaruntee for 90% of the board, its the latter.

We all have our favorites on the squad, and that's cool. But that's not going to stop me from telling the truth about each player and holding them to the same standard.

Also, for perspective, Paul George was already an all star at age 22. Caris LeVert is 24 and hasn't even come close to that production. That's a really unfair expectation to put on him to be honest.

It's exceedingly rare for young players to come in and be consistent. That's why we usually wait a couple of years before definitively declaring whether a player is a bust or not. It usually takes a few seasons to be able to sort out all the sheep from the goats.

Also, PG was 22 in his 3rd season in the league. This is LeVert's 3rd season (and he missed half of the first one). Game played and time training is a bigger marker for me than age. Injuries are what kept Caris from being drafted at an earlier age and what kept him from being an actual lottery pick.


Yeah, that's why I'm being measured, I know that he has talent and should be able to put it together in time, which is why I'm not capping his ceiling either, but this stuff takes time. I'm happy to hear that he's improved. Now comes time for him to start being a bit more reliable at age 24.
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Re: Nets Media Day/Training Camp Thread 

Post#85 » by MrDollarBills » Thu Sep 27, 2018 12:35 am

Paradise wrote:
MrDollarBills wrote:
Paradise wrote:They never once said how great everyone looks. It was simply them ANSWERING who LOOKED good throughout the summer. The unanimous answer was LeVert. Not, DLO, not Harris, not Dinwiddie. Most of the quotes came from guys who are BRAND NEW to the organization. They were unaware of his own talent.

So, because he didn’t develop at this impatient pace last season that means they are simply lying and giving lip service? Imagine what Wolves, Kings, Suns fans feel every time they watch media day interviews. They actually haven’t been to the postseason in decades.

Caris endured his FIRST off-season of his career, first full season with no foot restrictions last summer. It’s PERFECTLY normal to expect or to see a surge of growth in a year 3 player...the older they get the more mature and experience they gain.

Net fans with this high horse attitude that other fans don’t show to me is very, very cringeworthy. You’d think these guys are robots and not a developing rebuilding situation...

I don’t think this board knows what a rebuild looks like or how development works. Seriously.


Who is being impatient?

The basic point being made is that we heard good things last preseason too and LeVert struggled hard, so I'll wait and see before I get all excited. I'm already excited just to see the team play, I don't really want to cast obscene expectations on LeVert based off of Dudley's hyperbole or LeVert molly whopping people in practice.

When he was going through that struggle period last year I was one of the people on here who was saying that we needed to be patient while he worked his way out of his slow start. I'm not sure why saying "yeah okay pre camp quotes are great but I'll wait to see him in real games before buying in to the hype" = being impatient with the rebuilding process?

Its funny to see people getting upset at posters for wanting to take a measured approach to preseason expectations, and then come January when frustration sets in you'll see posts in game threads where people start bitching (not you) and start saying that they can't watch this **** anymore. The people who make those comments are the ones that you need to direct those 'yall don't understand how a rebuild works" towards, not me.

It’s not a problem with a measured approach. It’s just insanely rare to expect these guys to develop in leaps.

Because it didn’t happen during the season the way we wanted doesn’t mean he didn’t look improved. It certainly didn’t make it lip service.

I hear you with the tempered expectations but it’s hard to criticize harshly the comments of media day when these kids in particular are still evolving and this is only his second full off-season in the NBA.

My stance is always the same here so it’s not personal. I just know this board is insanely bi-polar with judging development and equating the support which I hate because we should be grateful to even be here because these are literally diamonds in a rough we are dealing with and we should be thrilled we are WAY ahead of schedule now that we’re legitimately in the conversation (still) for an all-star.

I just hate when everyone gets so frustrated when in reality we’ve only been chipping away at this for 4 seasons. This upcoming season is the first true step to relevancy. Either way, we win the draft and come away with (Zion, Barrett, Reddish) or make a significant push for the playoffs and solidify our rep as a FA destination for some guys.

I’ll truly be upset at any injuries or lack of interest, identity, culture, bad deals, etc. However, I’m all the way good with how this season and next season is shaping up. It’s a win-win situation and I wouldn’t be surprised if we acquired another 1st round pick for DeMarre Carroll. If Sean Marks pulls that off around February which is very realistic IMO...we step into the spotlight once again on draft night (in our own arena).


I thought he showed improvement and also a really solid grasp of running the offense last season. I expect him to be better this season. I just take pause when I hear him being called unguardable on media day. I'll believe it when I see it, no offense to LeVert.

I'm not frustrated at all. We are in great position as a team. The fact that Jimmy Butler had us in the conversation made me think that I was wrong and that guys are paying attention to what is happening here, but I think it may take a few more seasons before we land a big fish. Nothing wrong with that. I'm focused on the young guys improving and who we can land in the draft.

If Marks manages to flip a veteran for another 1st rder to add to the package already I would be thrilled.
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Nets Media Day/Training Camp Thread 

Post#86 » by Paradise » Thu Sep 27, 2018 12:36 am

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Re: Nets Media Day/Training Camp Thread 

Post#87 » by Prokorov » Thu Sep 27, 2018 12:40 am

NyCeEvO wrote:It's exceedingly rare for young players to come in and be consistent. That's why we usually wait a couple of years before definitively declaring whether a player is a bust or not. It usually takes a few seasons to be able to sort out all the sheep from the goats.


Levert already is not a bust. if you pick someone in the 20-30 range and they become a top 7 or 8 rotation player then you've done well. he is FAR from a bust

Also, PG was 22 in his 3rd season in the league. This is LeVert's 3rd season (and he missed half of the first one). Game played and time training is a bigger marker for me than age. Injuries are what kept Caris from being drafted at an earlier age and what kept him from being an actual lottery pick.


statistically speaking, that is inaccurate... generally, regardless of how long they spent in college or NBA service time, NBA players development begin to drastically flat line at ages 24-26. their are outliers, but if a player is going to be a s tar, we typically know by 23-24 years old
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Nets Media Day/Training Camp Thread 

Post#88 » by Paradise » Thu Sep 27, 2018 12:43 am

Joe ‘Moses’ Harris appears to have increased the speed on his catch and shoot motion.

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Re: Nets Media Day/Training Camp Thread 

Post#89 » by vincecarter4pres » Thu Sep 27, 2018 2:01 am

I'm pretty sure I saw 5 of this dude in Williamsburg last night.
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Re: Nets Media Day/Training Camp Thread 

Post#90 » by DeRoma » Thu Sep 27, 2018 4:45 am

NyCeEvO wrote:
vincecarter4pres wrote:The quote that gives me promise for LeVert is the one by I believe Carroll, where he takes about slowing down, switching gears and not always playing at that break neck, frantic pace with his head down, running into defenders.

If Caris can learn to start switching gears and can up his shooting off the dribble, he becomes a very dangerous, potential Khris Middleton type of player.

I said this exact thing last year. He needs to learn how to play at different speeds. If you play at 1 speed, NBA players will adjust to you. CP3 was a superstar long after his athleticism declined due to the removal of his meniscus. His mastery of changing pace while maintaining ball control is what makes him so good.


CP3 is also the most skilled player in the NBA though. It's what makes him be able to think deeper. His skills are soo over the top that all he is doing all game is thinking about is the meta of the situation. Not saying LeVert is not capable of doing the same thing but I think a big importance for him into taking the next step is foot work. This is a big part of his game which is why he was such a bad off-the dribble shooter.
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Re: Nets Media Day/Training Camp Thread 

Post#91 » by MrDollarBills » Thu Sep 27, 2018 5:07 am

vincecarter4pres wrote:I'm pretty sure I saw 5 of this dude in Williamsburg last night.



as soon as Joe signed that contract he began growing his hair out.

i'm not saying that Joe is on some other ****...but that is the look of a man who was living clean cut because he was hustling to survive off of his skills, and now he just came into some money.

Dude was taking the subway home on six figures after taxes. Now he's calling Ubers and hasn't shaved since July.

I think dude is going to kill it this year.
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Re: Nets Media Day/Training Camp Thread 

Post#92 » by Paradise » Thu Sep 27, 2018 2:25 pm

NBA is covering our Day 3.

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Re: Nets Media Day/Training Camp Thread 

Post#93 » by Paradise » Thu Sep 27, 2018 3:57 pm

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Re: Nets Media Day/Training Camp Thread 

Post#94 » by MrDollarBills » Thu Sep 27, 2018 4:10 pm

boy the haters are out in those tweets. **** ing ass holes
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Re: Nets Media Day/Training Camp Thread 

Post#95 » by MGrand15 » Thu Sep 27, 2018 5:36 pm

Russell gave a pretty awesome interview talking about learning to be a professional vs. just wanting to go out and play. I think missing 30+ games last year and being limited when he got back was an eye opener. Its impossible to avoid injuries and stuff obviously but taking care of your body has to be priority #1 for any NBA player.
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Re: Nets Media Day/Training Camp Thread 

Post#96 » by moonpie » Thu Sep 27, 2018 6:10 pm

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Re: Nets Media Day/Training Camp Thread 

Post#97 » by moonpie » Thu Sep 27, 2018 6:56 pm

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Re: Nets Media Day/Training Camp Thread 

Post#98 » by moonpie » Thu Sep 27, 2018 7:26 pm

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Re: Nets Media Day/Training Camp Thread 

Post#99 » by MrDollarBills » Thu Sep 27, 2018 8:26 pm

Kenny on Russell:

”We’re emphasizing in practice. It’s funny, the first day of practice we scrimmaged a ton, yeah, I’d say a ton, and D’Angelo had one turnover in the whole scrimmage and of course I stopped the practice and told him about it. And then the next day I came back and I said, ‘you know what? You did a hell of a job handling the ball. And I pointed out the only turnover you made.’ His response was, ‘keep coaching me.’ That’s the kind of rapport we have. I felt a little guilty. Jeez, he had the ball in his hands all practice and had one turnover and I pointed it out."


I do emphasize team success and our improvement as a team is going to help everybody. That’s me included. Help our professional future. That’s as far as those conversations go. I didn’t see any change in demeanor, any change in the person. And I saw an elite work ethic. Because I was here every day and I saw it. He made a commitment to be here of his own volition. Every time I walked in the weight room, he was in there. It gives me confidence as a coach and I think as a player, he knows he put in the work this offseason.”
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Re: Nets Media Day/Training Camp Thread 

Post#100 » by moonpie » Thu Sep 27, 2018 11:15 pm

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