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Official Fire Nash thread - Part II

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Official Fire Nash thread - Part II 

Post#1 » by Prokorov » Tue Jan 11, 2022 5:27 am

He has to go. even with full health its not enough. He cant beat god awful tanking lotto teams missing 4 starters even with Kyrie on the floor.

Beyond winning, he cant find a way to score points regardless of what 2 superstars he has in the lineup. KD/Harden, KD/Kyrie doesnt matter.

that on top of the typical awful challenges, misuse/non use of timeouts, lack of adjustments, terrible lineups, etc....

It is not hyperbole to say he is the worst caoch in team history, maybe league history
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Re: Official Fire Nash thread - Part II 

Post#2 » by Sharcm1 » Tue Jan 11, 2022 12:31 pm

I think he ha to go. Unfortunately I don’t think the nets will do it until after we lose in the playoffs. The team looks completely lost on offense. Which is not something that happened last season. I know a lot of the role players are different. But as the coach he has to find a way to insert them into the offense. It’s too easy to stop the nets. They can’t score with two of the best offensive players in the history of the game on the team. That’s a problem
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Re: Official Fire Nash thread - Part II 

Post#3 » by HardenGoat » Tue Jan 11, 2022 1:16 pm

This is bigger than a coach. This has to do with a disgruntled star that knows a championship team has to be all in on the vision. We had the same coach last year and the players were playing with passion. The only thing that stopped them was injuries. This year we have a different situation and it’s not because we changed some role players.
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Re: Official Fire Nash thread - Part II 

Post#4 » by KD35Netted » Tue Jan 11, 2022 1:35 pm

HardenGoat wrote:This is bigger than a coach. This has to do with a disgruntled star that knows a championship team has to be all in on the vision. We had the same coach last year and the players were playing with passion. The only thing that stopped them was injuries. This year we have a different situation and it’s not because we changed some role players.



I have a feeling that Harden resents Kyrie because of everything going on. KD doesn't seem like he cares about winning anymore and he subtly admit it previously. Kyrie/KD have rings so they probably believe they have nothing left to prove. At this rate, the Nets are going to be in a disarray and one of Kyrie or Harden has to go. Kyrie was the drama queen all season so it wouldn't be fair to Harden.
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Re: Official Fire Nash thread - Part II 

Post#5 » by HardenGoat » Tue Jan 11, 2022 2:37 pm

KD35Netted wrote:
HardenGoat wrote:This is bigger than a coach. This has to do with a disgruntled star that knows a championship team has to be all in on the vision. We had the same coach last year and the players were playing with passion. The only thing that stopped them was injuries. This year we have a different situation and it’s not because we changed some role players.



I have a feeling that Harden resents Kyrie because of everything going on. KD doesn't seem like he cares about winning anymore and he subtly admit it previously. Kyrie/KD have rings so they probably believe they have nothing left to prove. At this rate, the Nets are going to be in a disarray and one of Kyrie or Harden has to go. Kyrie was the drama queen all season so it wouldn't be fair to Harden.


It's not even just Harden, there's Griffin, Millsap, Mills, and LMA that joined the team believing Kyrie would be on the team to make a chip run. How big a let down is that? To join a team with the promise of having star talent available as a pitch to get you there only to see this lunacy unfold. Harden is not going to give 100 percent until there's a major change, and the people that want him traded will likely get their wish. Morey is going to add him to a bunch of shooters with that monster in Philly.
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Re: Official Fire Nash thread - Part II 

Post#6 » by Stone » Tue Jan 11, 2022 2:40 pm

We also need to the an honest conversation about our roster....

We have the 4 rookie's....DDJ, Kessler, Sharp and Cam.. How much can we reasonably expect from them on a team where a chip is supposedly the goal?

Nic Claxton....3rd year player with a total of 66 games under his belt and 14 starts. We have played 39 games tis season and he has played in only 19 of them. The point I am making is although he progressing nicely, he is no iron man and does not have a lot of experience.

Then we have ring chasing old timers. LMA, Blake, Millsap, Johnson and Patty.

Add to that, an at best third string player in Carter.

Bembry and Bruce......these two are probably the players most effected by Nash's rotations. Bembry stared in 14 games and Nash gave him the hook and replaced him with DDJ.....Why? As for Bruce He started in 17 games and is now watching DDJ out there shooting a whopping 11% from 3PT.

Joe Harris.....played in 14 games

Kyrie Irving...played in two games

James Harden....I can only speculate why he is under-performing this season. Is he disgruntled? Is he still not 100% ? Is playing and being a superstar in NYC too distracting? Has he peeked and this is his new normal?

Kevin Durant.....The glue holding this whole S*** show together.

At this point I don't think handing the keys to Jacque Vaughn is going to make a difference, it could actually make it worse.
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Re: Official Fire Nash thread - Part II 

Post#7 » by Sharcm1 » Tue Jan 11, 2022 4:06 pm

I think a better coach would be able to use the players we have better. I think his rotations need to be consistent. And make changes if what’s consistent isn’t working in a particular game. This in and out of the line up crap for no reason has to stop. These guys needs consistency. Why hasn’t brown played the last couple games. Why is duke still starting now that Irving is playing. He took mills out and left duke in the starting line up. It’s all very confusing. Blake doesn’t know his role. It’s clear as he played very well when everyone was missing and is back to playing poorly again when players are back. It’s clear he knew he had to do more when everyone was out and now he is back to just taking charges.

No one seems to know their roles in the offense. Who would have thought last year that this year offense would be the problem.
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Re: Official Fire Nash thread - Part II 

Post#8 » by MrDollarBills » Tue Jan 11, 2022 4:13 pm

This is officially a disaster and there is definitely some garbage that is going on behind the scenes that is going to come out.

I am sorry, but the team was doing well up until it was announced that Kyrie was coming back. Then starting in the Philly game, everything just went right out of the window. Everything we were doing well just stopped. What the hell is going on????
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Re: Official Fire Nash thread - Part II 

Post#9 » by Prokorov » Tue Jan 11, 2022 4:57 pm

HardenGoat wrote:This is bigger than a coach. This has to do with a disgruntled star that knows a championship team has to be all in on the vision. We had the same coach last year and the players were playing with passion. The only thing that stopped them was injuries. This year we have a different situation and it’s not because we changed some role players.


It has nothing to do with that. Our issues started as soon as Joe Harris went down and Nash couldn't rely on the crutch of 2 super mega stars + 2 elite floor spacers. 10-10 since harris went down, last in threes since harris went down, bottom 8 offense since Harris went down. These issues weren't there Pre-Harris. Nash was talking about "we have to win with defense" before Harris went down. Harden wasnt talking about "our spacing isnt there" before Harris went down.

Guys are disgruntled because the Nets can find a way to score despite riding 2 mega-stars 40 minutes a night.
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Re: Official Fire Nash thread - Part II 

Post#10 » by Prokorov » Tue Jan 11, 2022 5:05 pm

MrDollarBills wrote:This is officially a disaster and there is definitely some garbage that is going on behind the scenes that is going to come out.

I am sorry, but the team was doing well up until it was announced that Kyrie was coming back. Then starting in the Philly game, everything just went right out of the window. Everything we were doing well just stopped. What the hell is going on????


This is just false.

** 6-3 before Kyrie's Annoucement. (including barely scraping by depleted bad teams like toronto and minny)

** 3-1 Immediately following Kyrie's Announcement (only loss was to the magic with Mils/galloway/thomas/duke/blake starting).

** Harden's 3 best games of the year following the annoucement

This went south when Joe Harris got hurt. We are 14-10 since Harris injury (12-3 prior to the injury). Dead last in threes, bottom 8 in offense

Again, Bash Kyrie for being out if you want, but lets not create some false narrative that this teams issues started once he came back. We have been flat out bad since Harris got hurt.
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Re: Official Fire Nash thread - Part II 

Post#11 » by Prokorov » Tue Jan 11, 2022 5:12 pm

Another massive issue with Nash. He doesn't even adjust to what he publically states are the issues with this team. For instance:

1) "Spacing is a problem"
Nash Solution: Start Duke Jr, the worst 3 point shooter on the team this year (11.1%). Dont play edwards (42.9%)

2) "Our guys have no legs"
Nash Solution: Play KD/Harden 40+ minutes a night including asking KD to play 43 OT minutes then fly 3000 miles to play 40 vs. POR

3) "Chemistry is an issue, consistency"
Nash Solution: Constantly shuffle guys in and out of the lineup, DNP brown, remove Bembry from the lineup...

4) "We lack energy, we need to play with Joy"
Nash Solution: Sit Brown our most happy go lucky energy guy, Sit Bembry our best energy guy who helped turn pacers game

Losing Harris is tough. But at the same time, there is ALOT you can do to address those 4 things with what we have active vs. the Calibur of team we are playing. I mean the Clippers team that beat us needed to figure those things out with Terrance Mann and James Ennis not KD and Harden.
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Re: Official Fire Nash thread - Part II 

Post#12 » by MGrand15 » Tue Jan 11, 2022 6:58 pm

I don't think Nash will make it much longer but I don't think the solution is on the coaching staff. Vaughn isn't a good coach. Not sure about Vanterpool but Nash seems to be very collaborative - so I feel like everyone is at fault for the issues here. That includes Marks and the now non-existent performance team allowing Nash to play our stars heavy minutes every single night.

I also feel like there's a lot going on behind the scenes that we don't know about. If Nash got fired today and a report came out tomorrow that Nash didn't want to coach at all and didn't give an F - I wouldn't be shocked. Or if the stars were calling all the shots and Nash had no power. Or if Vaughn actually made all the decisions and Nash didn't do an Xs and Os. I don't know. A lot of this stuff isn't just regular bad coaching. And we have enough experienced assistants to guide Nash if it's just a "rookie coach" thing. Something is up.

I will say our roster construction did the coaches no favors. With Kyrie out + Blake/Millsap looking completely washed + Harris injury + Carter struggling - the team was in a tough spot. We're at the point where we desperately need late draft picks to be productive. We need production out of guys who struggled to play on lottery teams. We need production out of a guy who was retired last year.

This sucks cause I actually really liked what the coaches did last year but it feels like that was all MDA with Nash just serving as the emotional leader.
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Re: Official Fire Nash thread - Part II 

Post#13 » by HardenGoat » Tue Jan 11, 2022 8:29 pm

Prokorov wrote:Another massive issue with Nash. He doesn't even adjust to what he publically states are the issues with this team. For instance:

1) "Spacing is a problem"
Nash Solution: Start Duke Jr, the worst 3 point shooter on the team this year (11.1%). Dont play edwards (42.9%)

2) "Our guys have no legs"
Nash Solution: Play KD/Harden 40+ minutes a night including asking KD to play 43 OT minutes then fly 3000 miles to play 40 vs. POR

3) "Chemistry is an issue, consistency"
Nash Solution: Constantly shuffle guys in and out of the lineup, DNP brown, remove Bembry from the lineup...

4) "We lack energy, we need to play with Joy"
Nash Solution: Sit Brown our most happy go lucky energy guy, Sit Bembry our best energy guy who helped turn pacers game

Losing Harris is tough. But at the same time, there is ALOT you can do to address those 4 things with what we have active vs. the Calibur of team we are playing. I mean the Clippers team that beat us needed to figure those things out with Terrance Mann and James Ennis not KD and Harden.


I would agree with this. Where is Brown, and why is Bembry getting inconsistent rotational minutes? Why is DDJ starting. These are relevant questions. Not that I want him to play but I haven't even seen Millsap on the sideline. Truth is we are struggling and have a very jumbled roster despite having most of our players back. One of which is part time.
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Re: Official Fire Nash thread - Part II 

Post#14 » by Prokorov » Tue Jan 11, 2022 8:52 pm

MGrand15 wrote:I don't think Nash will make it much longer but I don't think the solution is on the coaching staff. Vaughn isn't a good coach. Not sure about Vanterpool but Nash seems to be very collaborative - so I feel like everyone is at fault for the issues here. That includes Marks and the now non-existent performance team allowing Nash to play our stars heavy minutes every single night.

I also feel like there's a lot going on behind the scenes that we don't know about. If Nash got fired today and a report came out tomorrow that Nash didn't want to coach at all and didn't give an F - I wouldn't be shocked. Or if the stars were calling all the shots and Nash had no power. Or if Vaughn actually made all the decisions and Nash didn't do an Xs and Os. I don't know. A lot of this stuff isn't just regular bad coaching. And we have enough experienced assistants to guide Nash if it's just a "rookie coach" thing. Something is up.


Yea I'd believe any of that. One thing to consider is that firing Nash is the biggest impact immediate move that has the lowest risk of hurting us and the biggest chance of rejuvenating the team. Like we wont get worse if Nash isnt here. his replacement would likely change something - play more shooters, more consistent rotations, run more actual offense or limit stars minutes.

or just guys seeing a drastic move and saying i need to get my but in gear. or maybe they just get fired up finally.

I will say our roster construction did the coaches no favors. With Kyrie out + Blake/Millsap looking completely washed + Harris injury + Carter struggling - the team was in a tough spot. We're at the point where we desperately need late draft picks to be productive. We need production out of guys who struggled to play on lottery teams. We need production out of a guy who was retired last year.


If you want to tell me roster construction is why we are 0-8 vs good teams, ill accept that. If you are telling me roster construction/injury is why we are 4-7 in our last 11 I call BS. Our roster construction is certainly better then a clippers roster that needed to sign James Ennis off the end of our bench to field and eligible 8-man team.
This sucks cause I actually really liked what the coaches did last year but it feels like that was all MDA with Nash just serving as the emotional leader.


We should have been a better version then last year. We had shooting with mills/milsap replacing shamet/green. We had more big offense with LMA in the fold and we added much needed D and toughness with Bembry/Johnson.

sad sad sad
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Re: Official Fire Nash thread - Part II 

Post#15 » by Prokorov » Tue Jan 11, 2022 8:54 pm

HardenGoat wrote:
Prokorov wrote:Another massive issue with Nash. He doesn't even adjust to what he publically states are the issues with this team. For instance:

1) "Spacing is a problem"
Nash Solution: Start Duke Jr, the worst 3 point shooter on the team this year (11.1%). Dont play edwards (42.9%)

2) "Our guys have no legs"
Nash Solution: Play KD/Harden 40+ minutes a night including asking KD to play 43 OT minutes then fly 3000 miles to play 40 vs. POR

3) "Chemistry is an issue, consistency"
Nash Solution: Constantly shuffle guys in and out of the lineup, DNP brown, remove Bembry from the lineup...

4) "We lack energy, we need to play with Joy"
Nash Solution: Sit Brown our most happy go lucky energy guy, Sit Bembry our best energy guy who helped turn pacers game

Losing Harris is tough. But at the same time, there is ALOT you can do to address those 4 things with what we have active vs. the Calibur of team we are playing. I mean the Clippers team that beat us needed to figure those things out with Terrance Mann and James Ennis not KD and Harden.


I would agree with this. Where is Brown, and why is Bembry getting inconsistent rotational minutes? Why is DDJ starting. These are relevant questions. Not that I want him to play but I haven't even seen Millsap on the sideline. Truth is we are struggling and have a very jumbled roster despite having most of our players back. One of which is part time.


Our roster is jumbled in a Vaccuum. relative to the league we have a full roster with depth and stars. We aren't relying on 10-day contracts to give us 25+ mpg like most teams who have just beat us.

It is simply not a valid excuse to point to the roster for this 4-7 stretch or this 13-11 stretch
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Re: Official Fire Nash thread - Part II 

Post#16 » by MrDollarBills » Tue Jan 11, 2022 9:04 pm

Prokorov wrote:Another massive issue with Nash. He doesn't even adjust to what he publically states are the issues with this team. For instance:

1) "Spacing is a problem"
Nash Solution: Start Duke Jr, the worst 3 point shooter on the team this year (11.1%). Dont play edwards (42.9%)

2) "Our guys have no legs"
Nash Solution: Play KD/Harden 40+ minutes a night including asking KD to play 43 OT minutes then fly 3000 miles to play 40 vs. POR

3) "Chemistry is an issue, consistency"
Nash Solution: Constantly shuffle guys in and out of the lineup, DNP brown, remove Bembry from the lineup...

4) "We lack energy, we need to play with Joy"
Nash Solution: Sit Brown our most happy go lucky energy guy, Sit Bembry our best energy guy who helped turn pacers game

Losing Harris is tough. But at the same time, there is ALOT you can do to address those 4 things with what we have active vs. the Calibur of team we are playing. I mean the Clippers team that beat us needed to figure those things out with Terrance Mann and James Ennis not KD and Harden.



This is a complete sh*tshow. There is zero leadership from the bench.

Marks will need to put business before friendship.

I would suggest KD do the same.
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Re: Official Fire Nash thread - Part II 

Post#17 » by MrDollarBills » Tue Jan 11, 2022 9:09 pm

MGrand15 wrote:I don't think Nash will make it much longer but I don't think the solution is on the coaching staff. Vaughn isn't a good coach. Not sure about Vanterpool but Nash seems to be very collaborative - so I feel like everyone is at fault for the issues here. That includes Marks and the now non-existent performance team allowing Nash to play our stars heavy minutes every single night.

I also feel like there's a lot going on behind the scenes that we don't know about. If Nash got fired today and a report came out tomorrow that Nash didn't want to coach at all and didn't give an F - I wouldn't be shocked. Or if the stars were calling all the shots and Nash had no power. Or if Vaughn actually made all the decisions and Nash didn't do an Xs and Os. I don't know. A lot of this stuff isn't just regular bad coaching. And we have enough experienced assistants to guide Nash if it's just a "rookie coach" thing. Something is up.

I will say our roster construction did the coaches no favors. With Kyrie out + Blake/Millsap looking completely washed + Harris injury + Carter struggling - the team was in a tough spot. We're at the point where we desperately need late draft picks to be productive. We need production out of guys who struggled to play on lottery teams. We need production out of a guy who was retired last year.

This sucks cause I actually really liked what the coaches did last year but it feels like that was all MDA with Nash just serving as the emotional leader.


Marks owns this mess.

That being said, I 100% believe that there is something going on behind the scenes. This team went from competent, then all of a sudden the Philly game comes along and everything goes to hell. What happened?
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Re: Official Fire Nash thread - Part II 

Post#18 » by Prokorov » Tue Jan 11, 2022 9:24 pm

MrDollarBills wrote:
MGrand15 wrote:I don't think Nash will make it much longer but I don't think the solution is on the coaching staff. Vaughn isn't a good coach. Not sure about Vanterpool but Nash seems to be very collaborative - so I feel like everyone is at fault for the issues here. That includes Marks and the now non-existent performance team allowing Nash to play our stars heavy minutes every single night.

I also feel like there's a lot going on behind the scenes that we don't know about. If Nash got fired today and a report came out tomorrow that Nash didn't want to coach at all and didn't give an F - I wouldn't be shocked. Or if the stars were calling all the shots and Nash had no power. Or if Vaughn actually made all the decisions and Nash didn't do an Xs and Os. I don't know. A lot of this stuff isn't just regular bad coaching. And we have enough experienced assistants to guide Nash if it's just a "rookie coach" thing. Something is up.

I will say our roster construction did the coaches no favors. With Kyrie out + Blake/Millsap looking completely washed + Harris injury + Carter struggling - the team was in a tough spot. We're at the point where we desperately need late draft picks to be productive. We need production out of guys who struggled to play on lottery teams. We need production out of a guy who was retired last year.

This sucks cause I actually really liked what the coaches did last year but it feels like that was all MDA with Nash just serving as the emotional leader.


Marks owns this mess.

That being said, I 100% believe that there is something going on behind the scenes. This team went from competent, then all of a sudden the Philly game comes along and everything goes to hell. What happened?


I think you need to take a second look if you think this started with the Philly game.

13-11 since Harris went down. 10-10 in the last 20 games. Bottom of the league on both ends of the ball in that stretch.

We already were hamstrung by a lack of adjustments and creativity before the injury. but with 2 mega-superstars and 2 top 5 three point shooters we overcame coaching handicaps. once Harris went down, we no longer had so much talent we could overcome the incompetence.

The issues snowball with the cumulative effect of 40 minutes of heavy load on KD/Harden. Nash meddling with nonsense moves like starting Duke Jr. hurt it further.

Maybe there is more behind the scenes, but you can clearly trade this to Joe Harris Injury. There is nothing more claring then us being a .500 team and going from top 8 to dead last in threes since then.
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Re: Official Fire Nash thread - Part II 

Post#19 » by MrDollarBills » Tue Jan 11, 2022 9:32 pm

Prokorov wrote:
MrDollarBills wrote:This is officially a disaster and there is definitely some garbage that is going on behind the scenes that is going to come out.

I am sorry, but the team was doing well up until it was announced that Kyrie was coming back. Then starting in the Philly game, everything just went right out of the window. Everything we were doing well just stopped. What the hell is going on????


This is just false.

** 6-3 before Kyrie's Annoucement. (including barely scraping by depleted bad teams like toronto and minny)

** 3-1 Immediately following Kyrie's Announcement (only loss was to the magic with Mils/galloway/thomas/duke/blake starting).

** Harden's 3 best games of the year following the announcement

This went south when Joe Harris got hurt. We are 14-10 since Harris injury (12-3 prior to the injury). Dead last in threes, bottom 8 in offense

Again, Bash Kyrie for being out if you want, but lets not create some false narrative that this teams issues started once he came back. We have been flat out bad since Harris got hurt.


Something happened between December 27th (end of the successful LA trip) and December 30th, the date of the game versus Philly where we suddenly fell apart. To act like the team has been falling apart since November 29th, the date that Harris' surgery was announced is just not true. We went 9-3 since that time to the return home after Christmas.

Since the team came back from LA, we've been complete crap with a 2-5 record.

Not going to say it's Kyrie's fault, but something is going on here. We were navigating and managing wins even with a covid wrecked roster. Now we look like a complete mess with our roster nearly complete again. The effort has been bad, the coaching even worse. What is going on in that locker room?
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Re: Official Fire Nash thread - Part II 

Post#20 » by Sharcm1 » Tue Jan 11, 2022 11:19 pm

All of the nets problems have been the same since the start of the season. They were losing to winning teams since the start of the season. The losing to bad teams now is just a matter of the teams knowing what to expect and playing to the nets weaknesses. All of the weakness have been glaring from the beginning and we have all complained about them the whole time. Even when they won they didn’t look good. I can’t remember a game that they just blew out the other team.

It’s not Irving. Or the announcement that he was returning that changed things. They have played this way. The difference is Durant has looked a little tired since coming back. He’s just not shooting as well. Harden had like four great games all season. But this is his normal so far. Lack of effort. And the rest have had no consistent playing time and rotations to get used to playing with each other. A lot of basketball is timing and knowing where your teammates are going to be and when you don’t play with the same people it’s very hard to get that rhythm .

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