People were interested in these podcasts
Another Trade Idea...
Moderators: Rich Rane, NyCeEvO
Another Trade Idea...
-
- Veteran
- Posts: 2,613
- And1: 0
- Joined: Sep 19, 2004
Another Trade Idea...
Now before I mention this...and everyone starts saying, "imagine that another trade thread"... hear me out. This team obviously isn't working, whether it be the coach, chemistry, whatever. So... I'm starting to think we don't necessarily need a "superstar" big man, if we can obtain the other 2 things I think we need...
1) production at PF/C, something we desperately lack since Krstic has gone down, but hopefully will be back soon.
2) outside consistent shooting
Even if Krstic returns, for us to realistically think he's going to play like he did pre-injury, it's wishful thinking. With this deal we get a big who can shoot the ball, similar or maybe even better than Krstic, can rebound. PLUS we get an outside shooter we desperately need. We'd also get a backup PG since DA is up there in age and Marcus is struggling.
http://games.espn.go.com/nba/features/t ... &te=&cash=
I know New Orleans fans would be hesitant at first glance. They're playing great right now. But, West provides us with what we need. So does Butler and Jackson. We'd be parting with 2 expiring deals in Wright and Magloire and taking on the contracts of Jackson and Butler. New Orleans gains a year on contractual agreements with RJ as opposed to West. Roughly New Orleans would be saving around $22M with this deal. Is West worth the extra $22M to Hornets fans? Because I don't see them declining a deal of just Jackson and Butler. West is the kicker here -- but they get RJ and save a ton of money.
Thoughts?
1) production at PF/C, something we desperately lack since Krstic has gone down, but hopefully will be back soon.
2) outside consistent shooting
Even if Krstic returns, for us to realistically think he's going to play like he did pre-injury, it's wishful thinking. With this deal we get a big who can shoot the ball, similar or maybe even better than Krstic, can rebound. PLUS we get an outside shooter we desperately need. We'd also get a backup PG since DA is up there in age and Marcus is struggling.
http://games.espn.go.com/nba/features/t ... &te=&cash=
I know New Orleans fans would be hesitant at first glance. They're playing great right now. But, West provides us with what we need. So does Butler and Jackson. We'd be parting with 2 expiring deals in Wright and Magloire and taking on the contracts of Jackson and Butler. New Orleans gains a year on contractual agreements with RJ as opposed to West. Roughly New Orleans would be saving around $22M with this deal. Is West worth the extra $22M to Hornets fans? Because I don't see them declining a deal of just Jackson and Butler. West is the kicker here -- but they get RJ and save a ton of money.
Thoughts?
-
- RealGM
- Posts: 16,353
- And1: 2
- Joined: Apr 03, 2006
That would leave with N.O in the spot you guys are in right now, void of an inside presence. Tyson Chandler isn't a scoring big, great defensive player and rebounder, but he doesn't have much of an offensive game. With Chris Paul around they don't really need a high caliber 2/3, they can fill out those positions with average players because Paul always has the ball in his hands and creates easy looks for everyone else. Sure they'd love to have one, but not at the expense of West. He needs a big man to work with, it gives them that inside/outside combo. N.O would never do this deal.
-
- Veteran
- Posts: 2,613
- And1: 0
- Joined: Sep 19, 2004
I understand they have a hole at 4. But is West worth the $22M roughly they'd be saving if they dealt him. With NO's offense, which involves much more motion, I don't think it'd hinder their play that much. I know where you're coming from though, I thought the same thing. I think it's worth a shot though....I wouldn't be surprised if they did do it, just from a money standpoint.
And to Adam who mentioned the running argument. I'm sorry, I just don't buy into that. I've watched NBA basketball for nearly 20 years now. Teams that get out and run are dynamic and everything, but there comes a time when the game slows down, especially in the playoffs, and you have to execute in the half court.
I disagree with people stating deal VC instead of RJ. Watch how the offense flows when VC is in the game, people would generally tend to argue the opposite. VC finds the open man, probes in the lanes, has far better passing and dribbling skills than RJ, not to mention his ability to take over and create his own shot.
RJ is the one who gets the ball, dribbles 10 seconds off and either turns the ball over or goes to the basket looking for a call and flails his arms up, it's good and all when he gets the calls; but there's numerous times throughout a game where it hinders us, empty possessions. Personally, I feel RJ will never reach the level VC is at.
Let me ask to those who say trade VC instead of RJ...is your only argument about the "running on a fast break"...because if that's it, your argument doesn't hold much water. VC CAN run, RJ just does it so VC doesn't necessarily have to, doesn't mean he can't. Wright can run, Nachbar can run, Williams can run. My only point is, when it comes down to it, can you execute a half-court set -- right now we can't, whether it be -- coach's flaws, no post presence, whatever... More times than not; your in a half-court set than you are running a fastbreak, that doesn't bode well for Nets fans if RJ is your "go-to guy"
Would you rather have 17/5/3 or 25/5/4? RJ's PPG numbers are slowly decreasing, like I predicted. VC is almost tied with him, and will surpass him before this season is over. And look how many plays are ran for RJ while VC stands there? RJ gets the majority of the touches now and how are we doing with that? Each time VC touches the ball it seems, he's either hitting a shot, or finding an open man who either makes or misses, but at least it's a good shot and we're getting one; rather than turning the ball over. You want more production from VC? Get the ball in his hands. Frank isn't utilizing, any player, for that matter like he should be. He's not putting his players in the best positions to make plays. Refer to my avatar and location to prove my point about RJ, it's funny but true.
And to Adam who mentioned the running argument. I'm sorry, I just don't buy into that. I've watched NBA basketball for nearly 20 years now. Teams that get out and run are dynamic and everything, but there comes a time when the game slows down, especially in the playoffs, and you have to execute in the half court.
I disagree with people stating deal VC instead of RJ. Watch how the offense flows when VC is in the game, people would generally tend to argue the opposite. VC finds the open man, probes in the lanes, has far better passing and dribbling skills than RJ, not to mention his ability to take over and create his own shot.
RJ is the one who gets the ball, dribbles 10 seconds off and either turns the ball over or goes to the basket looking for a call and flails his arms up, it's good and all when he gets the calls; but there's numerous times throughout a game where it hinders us, empty possessions. Personally, I feel RJ will never reach the level VC is at.
Let me ask to those who say trade VC instead of RJ...is your only argument about the "running on a fast break"...because if that's it, your argument doesn't hold much water. VC CAN run, RJ just does it so VC doesn't necessarily have to, doesn't mean he can't. Wright can run, Nachbar can run, Williams can run. My only point is, when it comes down to it, can you execute a half-court set -- right now we can't, whether it be -- coach's flaws, no post presence, whatever... More times than not; your in a half-court set than you are running a fastbreak, that doesn't bode well for Nets fans if RJ is your "go-to guy"
Would you rather have 17/5/3 or 25/5/4? RJ's PPG numbers are slowly decreasing, like I predicted. VC is almost tied with him, and will surpass him before this season is over. And look how many plays are ran for RJ while VC stands there? RJ gets the majority of the touches now and how are we doing with that? Each time VC touches the ball it seems, he's either hitting a shot, or finding an open man who either makes or misses, but at least it's a good shot and we're getting one; rather than turning the ball over. You want more production from VC? Get the ball in his hands. Frank isn't utilizing, any player, for that matter like he should be. He's not putting his players in the best positions to make plays. Refer to my avatar and location to prove my point about RJ, it's funny but true.
-
- Veteran
- Posts: 2,939
- And1: 2
- Joined: Jul 31, 2002
G_MoNeY wrote:I understand they have a hole at 4. But is West worth the $22M roughly they'd be saving if they dealt him. With NO's offense, which involves much more motion, I don't think it'd hinder their play that much. I know where you're coming from though, I thought the same thing. I think it's worth a shot though....I wouldn't be surprised if they did do it, just from a money standpoint.
And to Adam who mentioned the running argument. I'm sorry, I just don't buy into that. I've watched NBA basketball for nearly 20 years now. Teams that get out and run are dynamic and everything, but there comes a time when the game slows down, especially in the playoffs, and you have to execute in the half court.
I disagree with people stating deal VC instead of RJ. Watch how the offense flows when VC is in the game, people would generally tend to argue the opposite. VC finds the open man, probes in the lanes, has far better passing and dribbling skills than RJ, not to mention his ability to take over and create his own shot.
RJ is the one who gets the ball, dribbles 10 seconds off and either turns the ball over or goes to the basket looking for a call and flails his arms up, it's good and all when he gets the calls; but there's numerous times throughout a game where it hinders us, empty possessions. Personally, I feel RJ will never reach the level VC is at.
Let me ask to those who say trade VC instead of RJ...is your only argument about the "running on a fast break"...because if that's it, your argument doesn't hold much water. VC CAN run, RJ just does it so VC doesn't necessarily have to, doesn't mean he can't. Wright can run, Nachbar can run, Williams can run. My only point is, when it comes down to it, can you execute a half-court set -- right now we can't, whether it be -- coach's flaws, no post presence, whatever... More times than not; your in a half-court set than you are running a fastbreak, that doesn't bode well for Nets fans if RJ is your "go-to guy"
Would you rather have 17/5/3 or 25/5/4? RJ's PPG numbers are slowly decreasing, like I predicted. VC is almost tied with him, and will surpass him before this season is over. And look how many plays are ran for RJ while VC stands there? RJ gets the majority of the touches now and how are we doing with that? Each time VC touches the ball it seems, he's either hitting a shot, or finding an open man who either makes or misses, but at least it's a good shot and we're getting one; rather than turning the ball over. You want more production from VC? Get the ball in his hands. Frank isn't utilizing, any player, for that matter like he should be. He's not putting his players in the best positions to make plays. Refer to my avatar and location to prove my point about RJ, it's funny but true.
yeah it helps VC but limits Kidd. Kidd thrives leading the team and dont forget Kidd's shooting isnt perfect.
As far as your message under your avator, it is kinda childish because two of VC's most clutch moments this year, as some people on this board like to call it, came from kick outs from RJ driving to the basket.
As far as trades with NO that improves this team even though they might not want to,woud be anything reasonable for Mo pete. I know they needed someone to back up their PF/C and PG. The Nets would get a good perimeter defender that can shoot the 3 occasionally.
SIC
-
- Pro Prospect
- Posts: 928
- And1: 0
- Joined: Sep 04, 2005
Adam1221 wrote:Yeah West would help this team a lot.
But I'd rather trade Vince instead because without RJ whose gonna run with Kidd aside from Sean?
Collins?
Nobody cares about two break away baskets per game that RJ and Kidd pulls off.
This running game aspect is so overrated. You will need to score in the half court.
The "Turnpike" deserve a NBA championship!!!!!!!!!!!!!
-
- Pro Prospect
- Posts: 928
- And1: 0
- Joined: Sep 04, 2005
Kosta wrote:That would leave with N.O in the spot you guys are in right now, void of an inside presence. Tyson Chandler isn't a scoring big, great defensive player and rebounder, but he doesn't have much of an offensive game. With Chris Paul around they don't really need a high caliber 2/3, they can fill out those positions with average players because Paul always has the ball in his hands and creates easy looks for everyone else. Sure they'd love to have one, but not at the expense of West. He needs a big man to work with, it gives them that inside/outside combo. N.O would never do this deal.
YUP!!!!!!!!
West is the second best player on the team!!!!!!!!
The "Turnpike" deserve a NBA championship!!!!!!!!!!!!!
-
- Pro Prospect
- Posts: 928
- And1: 0
- Joined: Sep 04, 2005
S.I.C. GM wrote:-= original quote snipped =-
yeah it helps VC but limits Kidd. Kidd thrives leading the team and dont forget Kidd's shooting isnt perfect.
As far as your message under your avator, it is kinda childish because two of VC's most clutch moments this year, as some people on this board like to call it, came from kick outs from RJ driving to the basket.
As far as trades with NO that improves this team even though they might not want to,woud be anything reasonable for Mo pete. I know they needed someone to back up their PF/C and PG. The Nets would get a good perimeter defender that can shoot the 3 occasionally.
So then SIC who do you want to stay Carter or RJ?
The "Turnpike" deserve a NBA championship!!!!!!!!!!!!!
-
- RealGM
- Posts: 16,353
- And1: 2
- Joined: Apr 03, 2006
But is West worth the $22M roughly they'd be saving if they dealt him.
Simply, yes he is worth it. He's a legit big that can get you near 20 and 10, he's not a superstar, but he's pretty underrated. For the production he gives and with him only being 27 years old, his contract is more than reasonable.
$10,650,000
$9,862,500
$9,075,000
$8,287,500
That's what he's getting paid the next 4 years! They front loaded his contract, which makes it even more reasonable every year. He'll still be 31 in that 4th year. We're talking about a legit big here who is near all-star caliber for under 10 a season? That's a great deal for the Hornets. Kind of reminds me of Caron Butler's contract. West and Butler are probably two of the best bang for your buck guys in the league. If anything, his contract raises his value on the market.
Think about it, when you're building a team, would you rather have a 1/4 combo to work around, or a 1/3? When the 4 is on the same level as the 3, I don't think there's any question you go with the 1/4 combo.
Lastly, you being a Nets fan should know the value of having an inside presence and how critical it is to success in the NBA. Things haven't been the same in N.J ever since Kidd lost Kenyon. Just ask the Chicago Bulls!
-
- Veteran
- Posts: 2,939
- And1: 2
- Joined: Jul 31, 2002
mack69 wrote:-= original quote snipped =-
So then SIC who do you want to stay Carter or RJ?
I personally want a team that works with Kidd. I think VC and RJ can work, but the D is the issue. This team would be able to go basket for basket with teams. So we have to play better D. I dont think VC can do it.Sometimes he looks lost. Who Am I Guarding? I know Kidd and RJ are capable, because they have done it before. Offensively, I like what RJ is doing this year. VC, IMO, is someone that likes to coast. Or the other day he just starring at Nachbar with the ball. Call for the Ball and BE AGGRESSIVE. I dont like his attitude. It pissed me off to see him chuckling with Crawford after that knick game. Then the next day, there is some stupid articles talking about VC calling himself out.
Kenyon, Kittles, RJ, and Kidd were so competitive. VC just puts up his numbers.
SIC
-
- Veteran
- Posts: 2,613
- And1: 0
- Joined: Sep 19, 2004
you couldn't be more wrong. VC has sacrificed so much to help this team. He has taken a backseat to Frank's offense and haters want to say VC has lost it or something. Funny how you mentioned 2 of VC's key plays were off dishes by RJ, what about nearly the other 80% of his possessions? Does he look for an open man? Does he turn the ball over? Does he complain on a call? Empty possessions.
I don't think defense is the issue either. It's inconsistency, in general. I think the droughts we go through and lack of scoring is our main issue. Check out RJ playing defense on the perimeter lately, he's the one getting beat.
I don't think defense is the issue either. It's inconsistency, in general. I think the droughts we go through and lack of scoring is our main issue. Check out RJ playing defense on the perimeter lately, he's the one getting beat.