RealGM

Posted: **Mon Jun 23, 2008 11:08 pm**

Would Nets fans consider this a fair trade? Would you like to add a premier big like Elton, and go into contending mode? Let me know

a) if you think the value in this deal is off,
b) if you feel we should be rebuilding/retooling etc., or
c) if you have any other concerns.

Nets-Clippers-Wolves

New Jersey Trade Breakdown
Incoming Players: Elton Brand, Marko Jaric
Outgoing Players: Stromile Swift, Trenton Hassell, Keith Van Horn, Sean Williams, Marcus Williams, Josh Boone, #10
Harris, Carter, Jefferson, Brand, Krstic
(Dragic), Ager, (MLE), (Speights)

L.A. Clippers Trade Breakdown
Incoming Players: Stromile Swift, Trenton Hassell, Marcus Williams, Josh Boone, #3
Outgoing Players: Elton Brand, future MIN 1st
Williams, (Mayo), Thornton, Thomas, Kaman
Knight, Mobley, Ross, (Randolph), Boone

Minnesota Trade Breakdown
Incoming Players: Keith Van Horn, Sean Williams, #10, future MIN 1st
Outgoing Players: Marko Jaric, #3
Foye, Brewer, Gomes, Jefferson, (Jordan)
Telfair, McCants, Walker, Smith, Williams

Posted: **Mon Jun 23, 2008 11:33 pm**

We're giving way too much youth. Either take out Boone or Take out Sean Williams. and I'll sign off on this deal.

Posted: **Mon Jun 23, 2008 11:38 pm**

^

What if we gave the #21 instead of the #10? Would that help the value discrepancy? Would the Clippers still go for it?

Posted: **Mon Jun 23, 2008 11:42 pm**

what 2 jeffersons?

Posted: **Tue Jun 24, 2008 3:11 am**

I am starting to have second thoughts on Brand. I notice how Boozer was ineffective in the laker series. I wonder if Brand will have the same problems with taller frontlines.

Posted: **Tue Jun 24, 2008 3:30 am**

I like Boone and Williams, but any deal that brings Brand to the Nets while keeping our top 3 players is an absolute no-brainer.

Posted: **Tue Jun 24, 2008 4:01 am**

ecuhus1981 wrote:Would Nets fans consider this a fair trade? Would you like to add a premier big like Elton, and go into contending mode? Let me know

a) if you think the value in this deal is off,
b) if you feel we should be rebuilding/retooling etc., or
c) if you have any other concerns.

Nets-Clippers-Wolves

New Jersey Trade Breakdown
Incoming Players: Elton Brand, Marko Jaric
Outgoing Players: Stromile Swift, Trenton Hassell, Keith Van Horn, Sean Williams, Marcus Williams, Josh Boone, #10
Harris, Carter, Jefferson, Brand, Krstic
(Dragic), Ager, (MLE), (Speights)

L.A. Clippers Trade Breakdown
Incoming Players: Stromile Swift, Trenton Hassell, Marcus Williams, Josh Boone, #3
Outgoing Players: Elton Brand, future MIN 1st
Williams, (Mayo), Thornton, Thomas, Kaman
Knight, Mobley, Ross, (Randolph), Boone

Minnesota Trade Breakdown
Incoming Players: Keith Van Horn, Sean Williams, #10, future MIN 1st
Outgoing Players: Marko Jaric, #3
Foye, Brewer, Gomes, Jefferson, (Jordan)
Telfair, McCants, Walker, Smith, Williams

I think we are giving up too much. First of all, let's face it, Elton Brand, as good as he is, is a MAJOR MAJOR risk at this point. To give up Boone, Marcus, Sean, AND a #10 is too much IMO given the circumstance regarding Brand (with injury and it being his last year on his contract IIRC).

Secondly, Marko Jaric's contract extends past the 2011 season, and I'm not sure I'd want to be tied up to him for how much he's making. Finally, depth...we have NONE. There's no telling that Speights would be available at 21, if he's not, then this deal takes further hit as far as I'm concerned (I like Speights). We're expecting Jaric to backup both guard spots? As for that MLE, Carter, RJ, and Devin will cost us $38 M next year. Brand makes $16M. That's $54M for four players. Jaric makes $7M. Then you factor in how much Nenad will get, how much you'll pay the rookie, and I can say there's no way we spend the MLE with that kind of payroll.

Posted: **Tue Jun 24, 2008 5:47 am**

The Clippers wouldn't consider that IMO.

Posted: **Tue Jun 24, 2008 3:35 pm**

lurkingobeiscity wrote:The Clippers wouldn't consider that IMO.

Why wouldn't they? They're trading

Brand, Jordan and a future pick with massive protection

for

expirings, Boone, Marcus and OJ Mayo.

I don't know how much better LAC can expect for Brand coming off of a major injury AND wanting to get a massive extension soon.

I figured most Nets fans would be a bit skittish about bringing in Elton, and I think my suspicions were correct. I would like to see our FO go after Jermaine O'neal this summer; he's taller, so he can match up with the Garnetts and Gasols of the playoffs better than Brand. Also, we have a better chance of signing JO to a reasonable extension, I think. Plus, he should be a bit cheaper than Brand.

Posted: **Tue Jun 24, 2008 4:16 pm**

Seriously any deal that can snag us Brand without touching Vince,RJ and Harris is an auto deal for me.
Trying to keep Boone or Sean would be appriciated but if Thorn cant do it than that's still fine and dandy as far as Im concerned.

Posted: **Tue Jun 24, 2008 4:43 pm**

Adam1221 wrote:Seriously any deal that can snag us Brand without touching Vince,RJ and Harris is an auto deal for me.
Trying to keep Boone or Sean would be appriciated but if Thorn cant do it than that's still fine and dandy as far as Im concerned.

Good luck trying to fill out the roster without murdering us with the lux tax if that were the case. Please, if we bring in any big contract, Vince or RJ is gone. End of story.

Posted: **Tue Jun 24, 2008 5:00 pm**

^

Even after this trade AND extending Krstic, we should only have around $60mil on the book for '08-'09. The luxury tax threshold will be right around $70mil, so we could afford to split the MLE on a couple of vets, and fill out the roster with a couple more via the LLE and the vet's minimum. We'd be right around the lux tax, but not above it. And don't question for a minute what kind of vets we could get with Harris-Carter-Jefferson-Brand as our core. Ring chasers would be coming out of the woodworks to sign with us! :lol:

Posted: **Tue Jun 24, 2008 9:02 pm**

Preludepunk27 wrote:We're giving way too much youth. Either take out Boone or Take out Sean Williams. and I'll sign off on this deal.

Posted: **Tue Jun 24, 2008 9:17 pm**

ecuhus1981 wrote:^

Even after this trade AND extending Krstic, we should only have around $60mil on the book for '08-'09. The luxury tax threshold will be right around $70mil, so we could afford to split the MLE on a couple of vets, and fill out the roster with a couple more via the LLE and the vet's minimum. We'd be right around the lux tax, but not above it. And don't question for a minute what kind of vets we could get with Harris-Carter-Jefferson-Brand as our core. Ring chasers would be coming out of the woodworks to sign with us!

Starting 5:

Harris
Carter
RJ
Brand
Krstic

Bench:

#21 (Speights)
#40

That would be our team after the pick $60,000,000.00 would be on our starting 5. $1,600,000.00 in salary for those 2 picks combined. This still means we have to sign 6 guys (if we actually sign our 2nd round pick) who are servicable to fill out the roster at minimum. If you can keep us under the cap and give me a bench that is consistent, then you deserve a front office job. Decent vets will come cheap for a good chance to win a ring...but they won't come for garbage either.

Posted: **Wed Jun 25, 2008 3:25 am**

Keep in mind also that the team you constructed, while it looks good on paper, is still a team with lots of risk.

Our starting frontcourt are both coming back from serious injury. Carter will always be linked to his soft reputation, RJ for whatever reason has the rep of being a primadonna, and our starting PG is really not a pass first PG.

There's no KG or Shaq or Duncan there to draw players in.

Posted: **Wed Jun 25, 2008 6:26 am**

I think it is possible to have a bench on the same level as you we had for most of last year (I know that's not exactly a positive), while staying under the luxury tax, if the following tweak to the initial trade was made:

Krstic, Ager and NJ's 09 1st rounder to the Clippers for Boone and Brevin Knight.

Is it an overpayment? It probably is, but if Krstic got an offer from another team, you are likely going to be paying over $5 mil for him in 08/09. Getting a somewhat viable bench is not feasible money wise with a resigned Krstic. Boone gives you that cost certainty (plus he was the better player last year) and Knight gives you a solid veteran guard off the bench. I think Ager's a waste of space, so I'd rather get his (small) salary off the books.

The luxury tax is probably going to be at $70 million (might be a touch more). Here is the moves I would make (in addition to the change I made to the initial deal) to fill out the roster while staying under the tax:
Draft: Chris Douglas-Roberts at pick #21, Joey Dorsey at #40
Re-Sign: Bostjan Nachbar, 1 year at $2.5 mil (same as last year) with a player option for 09/10
Sign: Malik Allen, 1 year at $770K (same as last year); Antoine Wright, 2 years at $1.5 mil per (roughly the same as last year) and Adonal Foyle, 2 years at $1.5 mil per.

Starting Lineup: Harris $7.80 mil; Carter $14.72 mil; Jefferson $13.20 mil; Brand $16.44 mil; Boone $1.21 mil.
Bench: Jaric $6.58 mil; Nachbar $2.50 mil; Knight $1.73 mil; Foyle $1.50 mil; Wright $1.50 mil; Douglas-Roberts $1.18 mil; Allen $0.77 mil; Dorsey $0.43 mil.
Total: $69.56 million (13 players).

Depth Chart
PG: Harris/Knight/Jaric
SG: Carter/Jaric/Wright
SF: Jefferson/Douglas-Roberts/Wright
PF: Brand/Nachbar/Dorsey
C: Boone/Foyle/Allen

Is it a great bench? Far from it. However, I'd say the bench is better than it was for most of last year with Jaric, Knight, Douglas-Roberts, Foyle and Dorsey replacing Krstic, Marcus Williams, Darrell Armstrong, Jamal Magliore and Jason Collins.

If Ratner is willing to go over the luxury tax and get Brand, I'd try to do at these two moves:
1. Instead of signing Foyle, sign Kurt Thomas for 2 years at the full MLE (Would add $4 million to payroll)
2. Instead of signing Wright, trade the $3 million TE (from Kidd trade) with a future #2 to the Sonics for Damien Wilkins. (Would add $1.6 million to payroll)

Posted: **Wed Jun 25, 2008 10:57 am**

Good luck getting some of those players for those amounts. I think Foyle sucks something fierce, but he'll get more than 1.5 million. Christ we gave Magloire more than that. Plus to me, that bench looks inconsistant. Lot of guys that never panned out or are not as good as their best contracts during their career claimed they should be are on that bench.

However I do like you're trading for Damien Wilkens and adding Brevin Knight haha. Again, if you were able to put a decent bench together that could keep us under the lux tax, then you deserve a front office job.

Posted: **Wed Jun 25, 2008 6:36 pm**

Preludepunk27 wrote:Good luck getting some of those players for those amounts. I think Foyle sucks something fierce, but he'll get more than 1.5 million. Christ we gave Magloire more than that. Plus to me, that bench looks inconsistant. Lot of guys that never panned out or are not as good as their best contracts during their career claimed they should be are on that bench.

However I do like you're trading for Damien Wilkens and adding Brevin Knight haha. Again, if you were able to put a decent bench together that could keep us under the lux tax, then you deserve a front office job.

As to the salary part, this past year Foyle had to take $1.22 mil with a player option ($1.26 mil). So I don't think it's completely unrealisitic.

How decent of a bench you can put together is based on two factors IMO.
1. Is Ratner willing to over the luxury tax.
2. Finding a way to replace Boone or SWill with Krstic in the trade.

If you get both, I think you can pretty together a very solid bench (can use the MLE, add Wilkins and keep Nachbar/Diop while keeping the payroll under $80 mil). If you can get one, I think you can at least put together a bench on par to last year (not necessarily saying much). If you get neither, then you need some extraordinary luck to put a viable bench together.

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