ImageImageImage

Rumours thread

Moderator: Crowned

Griff83
Assistant Coach
Posts: 3,832
And1: 187
Joined: Dec 10, 2006

 

Post#341 » by Griff83 » Sun Aug 5, 2007 2:29 pm

Tor-Rap-Tor wrote:-= original quote snipped =-



Seems it's just a rumour ...

http://www.tsn.ca/nhl/news_story/?ID=215506&hubname=


who knows , just last month when this first came up the Red Wings brass denied that Bowman had any discussions at all with the Leafs about filling a position when infact he did have a few sit downs. I wouldnt be shocked if there is some truth to this and Bowman just doesnt feel like dissclosing anything right at the moment.

wouldnt be the first time a executive has lied to the media.
User avatar
whysoserious
RealGM
Posts: 30,555
And1: 8,634
Joined: Jun 19, 2004
       

 

Post#342 » by whysoserious » Sun Aug 5, 2007 3:30 pm

Tor-Rap-Tor wrote:-= original quote snipped =-



Seems it's just a rumour ...

http://www.tsn.ca/nhl/news_story/?ID=215506&hubname=


Where there's smoke there's usually a fire. Not to say Bowman is coming, but I'm sure they talked in July and have probably approached him again.

To me it's simple, the Leafs should be putting as much pressure possibly on Scotty to come here and offer him full power to do whatever he wants. If he doesn't come after that, well that speaks more about the lack of confidence he has in the organization.
User avatar
Tor-Rap-Tor
Junior
Posts: 490
And1: 3
Joined: Feb 06, 2006
Location: Here!

 

Post#343 » by Tor-Rap-Tor » Thu Aug 9, 2007 9:30 pm

http://www2.sportsnet.ca/blogs/hockey_h ... e_horizon/

Seems MLSE in no hurry to get Mentor for JFJ, They like the moves he's made this off-season...
User avatar
whysoserious
RealGM
Posts: 30,555
And1: 8,634
Joined: Jun 19, 2004
       

 

Post#344 » by whysoserious » Fri Aug 10, 2007 1:07 am

Once again, the Leafs themselves don't know what they want. If you want a consultant and Scotty is the guy, go hard and offer him whatever is necessary. If your going to go into it half-a$$ed then your going to get lukewarm interest. If your going to meddle, nobody's going to want the job.

They just have no idea what they want to do and it starts with the board. OTP is happy with the status quo, Tanenbaum wants to overhaul the staff and bring in the best and others want some change but not fully and all this just leads to nothing. Looking at this sort of struggle amongst the board, why would anyone from the outside want to come take the job.
Crowned
Forum Mod
Forum Mod
Posts: 4,491
And1: 155
Joined: Jun 22, 2003
Location: Toronto

 

Post#345 » by Crowned » Fri Aug 10, 2007 4:18 am

It was either all or nothing in regards to the position IMO. They wanted Scotty Bowman or John Muckler, Bowman wasn't interested in the job, and I really don't think they liked what Muckler had to say in his interview. It was reported that Muckler believed JFJ deserved an extension, and didn't want him gone, same with Maurice. On the other hand, Bowman wanted them both gone, and MLSE wanted to atleast play out the beginning of the season before making a decision on JFJ. I've heard reports here and there, and I honestly think that's what transpired.

Personally, I'd be satisfied with keeping JFJ, and allowing Muckler to play a mentor type of role along side him as that advisor. JFJ is beginning to improve with his decision making, and a little more experience and perhaps additional help would go along way with him. It was believed that JFJ would one day make an excellent GM, he was highly regarded by many while he was with the Blues. The Leafs took the cheap route, and hired an inexperienced GM to take over likely the toughest franchise in the league. He's growing as a GM, just like players do with additional experience. If Muckler, or any senior hockey mind played a mentor role with him, I wouldn't think twice about giving JFJ an extension.
User avatar
Tor-Rap-Tor
Junior
Posts: 490
And1: 3
Joined: Feb 06, 2006
Location: Here!

 

Post#346 » by Tor-Rap-Tor » Fri Aug 10, 2007 1:29 pm

Crowned wrote:It was either all or nothing in regards to the position IMO. They wanted Scotty Bowman or John Muckler, Bowman wasn't interested in the job, and I really don't think they liked what Muckler had to say in his interview. It was reported that Muckler believed JFJ deserved an extension, and didn't want him gone, same with Maurice. On the other hand, Bowman wanted them both gone, and MLSE wanted to atleast play out the beginning of the season before making a decision on JFJ. I've heard reports here and there, and I honestly think that's what transpired.

Personally, I'd be satisfied with keeping JFJ, and allowing Muckler to play a mentor type of role along side him as that advisor. JFJ is beginning to improve with his decision making, and a little more experience and perhaps additional help would go along way with him. It was believed that JFJ would one day make an excellent GM, he was highly regarded by many while he was with the Blues. The Leafs took the cheap route, and hired an inexperienced GM to take over likely the toughest franchise in the league. He's growing as a GM, just like players do with additional experience. If Muckler, or any senior hockey mind played a mentor role with him, I wouldn't think twice about giving JFJ an extension.


I agree, I think that JFJ has done a pretty creditable job recently and should stay as GM, as a few here know, I wasn't always in his corner but I like the moves he has made this off season and I think we are a much improved team and may surprise a few people, as long as we can stay healthy...

I'm not as sold on Scotty Bowman as a lot here are. He was an outstanding coach and there is no getting around that but I remember when he was GM in Buffalo, he wasn't exactly a world beater there and his teams were just average as I remember. His tenure there was unremarkable, so not to say he couldn't do the job here but he has yet to prove that he could...

Muckler built Ottawa into the division power they are now, he had a few bad moves like signing Gerber and losing Chara but he over all did a pretty good job and had to deal with a meddling Melnyk, so if he were hired and became consultant/mentor to JFJ, it wouldn't be a bad move and as I understand it, it's only a 1 or 2 year contract. Maybe he can recommend some changes that can help, without blowing up the entire team...
Griff83
Assistant Coach
Posts: 3,832
And1: 187
Joined: Dec 10, 2006

 

Post#347 » by Griff83 » Fri Aug 10, 2007 1:30 pm

Crowned wrote:It was either all or nothing in regards to the position IMO. They wanted Scotty Bowman or John Muckler, Bowman wasn't interested in the job, and I really don't think they liked what Muckler had to say in his interview. It was reported that Muckler believed JFJ deserved an extension, and didn't want him gone, same with Maurice. On the other hand, Bowman wanted them both gone, and MLSE wanted to atleast play out the beginning of the season before making a decision on JFJ. I've heard reports here and there, and I honestly think that's what transpired.

Personally, I'd be satisfied with keeping JFJ, and allowing Muckler to play a mentor type of role along side him as that advisor. JFJ is beginning to improve with his decision making, and a little more experience and perhaps additional help would go along way with him. It was believed that JFJ would one day make an excellent GM, he was highly regarded by many while he was with the Blues. The Leafs took the cheap route, and hired an inexperienced GM to take over likely the toughest franchise in the league. He's growing as a GM, just like players do with additional experience. If Muckler, or any senior hockey mind played a mentor role with him, I wouldn't think twice about giving JFJ an extension.


I dont see how the first statement can be made right now, hes made 2 big moves this offseason and we havent seen if they are good moves or bad ones. Toskala could easily come in and bomb and Mark Bell turns out to be a cap chokehold rather then a effective player. Jason Blake could come in and turn out to just be a 20-25 goal scorer and therefore make him look overpaid. His decision making might look like its improving to some, but Ill wait to see the results on the ice before I start to give him any credit. I remember this time last year certain people were praising him for the raycroft/Kubina trade-signings and said that JFJ had a really good offseason.

I also dont understand how you or anyone could possibly give Ferguson a extension, since his tenure started we have made the playoffs once? or even at all? last time I checked in the world of business if you dont bring results you dont get a raise or a contract extension and in most cases you actually LOSE your job. If Ferguson gets this team into the playoffs and the Toskala trade works out in his favour, then you could certainly make a case for a extension, but at this point he has proven very little in terms of production and has done really nothing that would warrant a extension.
Griff83
Assistant Coach
Posts: 3,832
And1: 187
Joined: Dec 10, 2006

 

Post#348 » by Griff83 » Fri Aug 10, 2007 1:34 pm

[quote="Tor-Rap-Tor"][/quote]

Losing Chara and replacing him with 2 quick puck moving defencemen in Preissing and Corvo was actually a good move in my book. Part of the reason why Ottawa was so sucessfull running thru the east in the playoffs was due to there defence and ability to break the forecheck with guys like Corvo/Preissing/Redden skating the puck out of there own end. Plus if he had of resigned Chara for the price he went for, the Sens would be in even more cap trouble going into next year then they already are.
User avatar
Tor-Rap-Tor
Junior
Posts: 490
And1: 3
Joined: Feb 06, 2006
Location: Here!

 

Post#349 » by Tor-Rap-Tor » Fri Aug 10, 2007 1:51 pm

BlueJay_ wrote:-= original quote snipped =-
Losing Chara and replacing him with 2 quick puck moving defencemen in Preissing and Corvo was actually a good move in my book. Part of the reason why Ottawa was so sucessfull running thru the east in the playoffs was due to there defence and ability to break the forecheck with guys like Corvo/Preissing/Redden skating the puck out of there own end. Plus if he had of resigned Chara for the price he went for, the Sens would be in even more cap trouble going into next year then they already are.


Thats true to a certain degree but the Ducks showed them that finesse and Puck moving isn't everything and that tough banging forwards can put them off their game. Chara was a force in his own end that punished a lot of those players that did that...

Pat Quinn also did the same thing but when Chara was brought in we couldn't manhandle him and if I remember the first year Chara was here, was the first year we lost in the play-offs to Ottawa...
Griff83
Assistant Coach
Posts: 3,832
And1: 187
Joined: Dec 10, 2006

 

Post#350 » by Griff83 » Fri Aug 10, 2007 2:05 pm

Tor-Rap-Tor wrote:-= original quote snipped =-



Thats true to a certain degree but the Ducks showed them that finesse and Puck moving isn't everything and that tough banging forwards can put them off their game. Chara was a force in his own end that punished a lot of those players that did that...

Pat Quinn also did the same thing but when Chara was brought in we couldn't manhandle him and if I remember the first year Chara was here, was the first year we lost in the play-offs to Ottawa...


Your right Finesse/puck movement isnt everything but I think Muckler made the right move in not resigning him for the price he went for. They would be in major cap trouble next offseason if he was resigned, hell there prolly going to have to trade Redden this season just to shed salary and be able to resign Heatley and Spezza. I blame the Sens forwards just as much or more for the brutal showing in the finals against the Ducks.
User avatar
Tor-Rap-Tor
Junior
Posts: 490
And1: 3
Joined: Feb 06, 2006
Location: Here!

 

Post#351 » by Tor-Rap-Tor » Fri Aug 10, 2007 2:24 pm

BlueJay_ wrote:-= original quote snipped =-
Your right Finesse/puck movement isnt everything but I think Muckler made the right move in not resigning him for the price he went for. They would be in major cap trouble next offseason if he was resigned, hell there prolly going to have to trade Redden this season just to shed salary and be able to resign Heatley and Spezza. I blame the Sens forwards just as much or more for the brutal showing in the finals against the Ducks.


I agree and your right about keeping players and decisions under the new agreement have tied a lot of GM hands on which players to keep and which should go and that I guess, was a decision he had to make at the time but I would have been more inclined to keep Chara and trade Redden but maybe I'm wrong too...

I do know next year Ottawa will face some really big choices in resigning some of their top players and it will impact their team unless the cap becomes much higher...
User avatar
TR50
General Manager
Posts: 7,538
And1: 1,221
Joined: Dec 19, 2004
       

 

Post#352 » by TR50 » Fri Aug 10, 2007 3:08 pm

I still don't think a true "GM" would need any other help, if you need help then i don't know if you are cut out to be the GM in the first place...? It's just something which bugs me so much, if freaking JFJ can't do the job himself, what good will it do to leave him in charge? Gut him and sign your so called mentor or make him step down to say AstGM and get Muckler to do the bulk. It just irks me when you want to get a guy who has almost squat and you wanna get him help....geezaloo let him go if you don't have faith in him
User avatar
Tor-Rap-Tor
Junior
Posts: 490
And1: 3
Joined: Feb 06, 2006
Location: Here!

 

Post#353 » by Tor-Rap-Tor » Fri Aug 10, 2007 3:25 pm

toronto_raptors50 wrote:I still don't think a true "GM" would need any other help, if you need help then i don't know if you are cut out to be the GM in the first place...? It's just something which bugs me so much, if freaking JFJ can't do the job himself, what good will it do to leave him in charge? Gut him and sign your so called mentor or make him step down to say AstGM and get Muckler to do the bulk. It just irks me when you want to get a guy who has almost squat and you wanna get him help....geezaloo let him go if you don't have faith in him


In a normal situation this may be true but when you take into account the upper management Peddie and the other non hockey minds that are pulling in different directions and send different signals of team direction, then putting a buffer between JFJ and them is important...
User avatar
trevc3
Lead Assistant
Posts: 5,301
And1: 0
Joined: Feb 02, 2004
Location: Tiverton, Ontario

 

Post#354 » by trevc3 » Fri Aug 17, 2007 12:55 pm

what a boring offseason!
User avatar
Mak
RealGM
Posts: 26,776
And1: 4,871
Joined: Apr 24, 2001
Location: Fire Nurse

 

Post#355 » by Mak » Sat Aug 18, 2007 6:45 pm

trevc3 wrote:what a boring offseason!


Watching leafs play is more boring than this offseason. According to my sources.
User avatar
Andrea>Dirk
Bench Warmer
Posts: 1,262
And1: 0
Joined: Feb 18, 2007

 

Post#356 » by Andrea>Dirk » Sat Aug 18, 2007 9:11 pm

toronto_raptors50 wrote:I still don't think a true "GM" would need any other help, if you need help then i don't know if you are cut out to be the GM in the first place...? It's just something which bugs me so much, if freaking JFJ can't do the job himself, what good will it do to leave him in charge? Gut him and sign your so called mentor or make him step down to say AstGM and get Muckler to do the bulk. It just irks me when you want to get a guy who has almost squat and you wanna get him help....geezaloo let him go if you don't have faith in him


Look at Colangelo.
Image
User avatar
MAS
Retired Mod
Retired Mod
Posts: 14,271
And1: 53
Joined: Aug 12, 2004
Location: Thornhill
     

 

Post#357 » by MAS » Sun Aug 26, 2007 6:56 am

Tor-Rap-Tor wrote:-= original quote snipped =-



Thats true to a certain degree but the Ducks showed them that finesse and Puck moving isn't everything and that tough banging forwards can put them off their game. Chara was a force in his own end that punished a lot of those players that did that...

Pat Quinn also did the same thing but when Chara was brought in we couldn't manhandle him and if I remember the first year Chara was here, was the first year we lost in the play-offs to Ottawa...


When did we lose in the playoffs to Ottawa?
User avatar
Tor-Rap-Tor
Junior
Posts: 490
And1: 3
Joined: Feb 06, 2006
Location: Here!

 

Post#358 » by Tor-Rap-Tor » Sun Aug 26, 2007 2:12 pm

MAS wrote:-= original quote snipped =-
When did we lose in the playoffs to Ottawa?


Your Right and we haven't even made the play-offs the last two years...LOL

Ottawa was hard to beat though when he was in the line up even in regular season play but maybe it was more to do with how bad Toronto has become, at least from our perspective...

Return to Toronto Maple Leafs