Leafs 2013-14 Regular Season Thread

Waylon Mercy · Post #41 » by **Waylon Mercy** » Sun Oct 6, 2013 2:36 am

Everybody loves Raymond! lol

Props to Bernier would have never stole those 2 points without him. He bailed out
our awful D and Reimer tonight.

SharoneWright · Post #42 » by **SharoneWright** » Sun Oct 6, 2013 5:33 am

Bankai wrote: "Funny that things are looking up for MLSE and the 2 Brians (Colangelo and Burke) are no longer even here.."

True that! And thanks for clarifying... for a second I thought you meant these guys!! :wink:

Ado05 · Post #43 » by **Ado05** » Sun Oct 6, 2013 3:57 pm

Burke wasnt a bad GM.

The team that made it last year, was his team.

whysoserious · Post #44 » by **whysoserious** » Sun Oct 6, 2013 4:22 pm

Adrian_05 wrote:Burke wasnt a bad GM.

The team that made it last year, was his team.

He made some good moves and some quality draft choices but he absolutely misjudged where this team was when he was hired and after he made the Kessel deal. He'd still have a job if he'd stuck to rebuilding right out the gate, even with the Kessel deal.

Mohanad · Post #45 » by **Mohanad** » Sun Oct 6, 2013 4:57 pm

Adrian_05 wrote:Burke wasnt a bad GM.

The team that made it last year, was his team.

You're absolutely right - he wasn't a bad GM at all. He took over a team that had a top line of Blake-Stajan-Ponikarvosky, Toskola and Joseph in net and Jiri Tlustly and Luke Schenn as their top prospects. The Leafs’ roster was bloated with players whose contracts included no-trade clauses, and barely any valuable tradeworthy players. Had a roster overhaul and brought in Kessel, Phanuef, Lupul, Gardiner, Franson, Kadri, JVR + prospects that included Rielly, Biggs, Percy, Macwilliams, etc.

He had some bone head moves with signings like Mike Komisarek and Liles (before his concussion), but ultimately it came down to board room politics that lost him his job.

Mohanad · Post #46 » by **Mohanad** » Sun Oct 6, 2013 5:08 pm

Waylon Mercy wrote:Everybody loves Raymond! lol

Props to Bernier would have never stole those 2 points without him. He bailed out
our awful D and Reimer tonight.

Waylon Mercy · Post #47 » by **Waylon Mercy** » Sun Oct 6, 2013 5:21 pm

Mohanad wrote:
Waylon Mercy wrote:Everybody loves Raymond! lol

Props to Bernier would have never stole those 2 points without him. He bailed out
our awful D and Reimer tonight.

lol that's awesome

And to those who thought I was insinuating Burke was a bad GM I wasn't. I consider him
and Nonis dual GM's. They usually follow each other where ever they go and have the same
taste in players. Wouldn't surprise me if Nonis consulted with Burke about the Clarkson, Bolland
and Bernier moves.

J Dilla · Post #48 » by **J Dilla** » Mon Oct 7, 2013 2:49 am

why do players hate Carlyle so much? just read macarthur is one of the many that have spoken out against him

Mohanad · Post #49 » by **Mohanad** » Mon Oct 7, 2013 4:23 am

“I didn’t have a relationship (with him) and not many guys do,” MacArthur told sportsnet.ca and two Ottawa-based reporters. “It’s one of those things where he runs the show there and everyone knows that and that’s the way it is.

“It’s worked for him in the past, he’s got a (Stanley) Cup from that, but at the same time there’s other ways to do things, too.”

“Some guys are good with the criticism and some guys don’t want to hear it every single shift you come off the ice,” MacArthur said. “You’re old enough to know (you) made a mistake. You don’t need to hear it every five seconds.

“It weighs differently on different people and, for me, it was some long days.”

Mac was also bitter the Leafs never contacted him in the off-season and he winded up signing 2 years 6.5 million with the Sens. I'm OK with Randy and Nonis' decision here - i'd rather have Raymond at 1 mill than Mac at 3+ mill who is very expandable.

Caryle is a proven coach with results and his style has been working in Toronto. Mac dropped in the depth charts, but Caryle's job is to make sure the team is winning, not to give players ice time that they feel they are entitled to. Clarke got out worked for his spot on the second line and doesn't seem too found to hear criticism about this game.

Not to mention Kessel, Bozak, and Lupul all re-signed long term and Kadri and Franson re-signed hoping to for long term deals with the team. Randy isn't exactly running players out of town.

Accountability has to mean for something.

Komisarek never worked out for the Leafs but he's one of the most classy players out there. He puts the blame solely on himself for not being about to able to produce under Carlyle.

Do we not want accountability? Ron Wilson played Komisarek every game he could because he was making 4.5M.

Randy Carlyle comes along and guys like Tim Connolly, Komisarek, Lombardi, Armstrong, MacArthur, Grabovski are nowhere to be seen. The result? They went from being the 5th worst team in the league to the 5th best team in the Eastern conference and improved the penalty kill from near dead last to the second best in the league. That's what Carlyle's job is

If you want your coach to be your friend - give Ron Wilson a call
If you want your coach to hold you accountable for the mistakes you make - you get a contending team

It's also ironic Bobby Ryan (Mac's teammate) credited Carlyle for making him a better player

'It wasn't a bad relationship, it just wasn't a great one. That's all it was. He's a tough coach and I still really do owe him quite a bit for becoming the player that I am and that isn't lost on me one bit'

http://www.cbc.ca/sports/hockey/nhl/sen ... -1.1859905

whysoserious · Post #50 » by **whysoserious** » Mon Oct 7, 2013 2:53 pm

Clarke is right, some guys respond to things differently. No one style fits all. To a certain extent, the best coaches know how to adapt their styles based on the personalities of different players. But there's also tons of examples of successful coaches that are like Carlyle where it's do it my or don't, but you won't play as much if you don't do it my way.

Clarke was average at best last year and was outplayed by guys behind him. Same goes for Grabo. Good to see Grabo do well but that likely just wasn't going to happen here and he was paid way too much to be a third line C. It's best to move on for both sides. I don't look at it like one side is wrong or right.

Carlyle talks about accountability and follows through. A lot of coaches talk about it and don't. That's a bad precedent to have on a team. I like our team better without both Grabo and Clarke this year so it is what it is.

LLJ · Post #51 » by **LLJ** » Mon Oct 7, 2013 6:17 pm

Generally, guys always blame the coach when their ice time diminishes. Lupul grumbled about Carlyle too when he was far down on the depth chart in Anaheim, but I haven't heard any complaints now that Lupul is, y'know, getting playing time and being productive in Toronto under Carlyle.

My guess is that Carlyle simply isn't a guy who will spend a lot of time talking to players he demotes or feels doesn't fit his system. He's not a guy who starts fights with people, but he isn't some friendly guy like Pinball Clemons who can cut players from a football team while still making them feel like they just won the lottery.

whysoserious · Post #52 » by **whysoserious** » Tue Oct 8, 2013 2:49 am

Not really liking these rumours of Gardiner being on the block. Depends on the return if we pull the trigger but I'd rather spend another year developing him before doing anything. I think they're jumping the gun assuming Rielly will replace Gardiner easily.

Mohanad · Post #53 » by **Mohanad** » Tue Oct 8, 2013 12:43 pm

I really value Gardiner and Franson on this team. Gardiner's off to a slow start but he definitely has top pairing potential.. it's been a slow start to the season as he seemed only good for 2 things, A) racing the puck out of the defensive zone, and B) attempting solo rushes.... nothing in between. You might even consider that only to be one thing. He needs to pick his spots better, and he needs to use his teammates better. If he did both of these (like he's done in the past...), he'd be on his way to being a premier offensive defenseman.

his speed is incredible but the first few games he seemed to just be interested in playing HIS game. Gain control of puck, use speed to get out of defensive zone, enter offensive zone, use speed to drive defender wide.... go behind net, lose puck, or throw puck blindly to the front of the net... Rinse, Repeat.

we've all see Caryle punish players who don't play the way he wants them to play. he's still a work in progress, but we've seen how sound gardiner can be for us (especially in the playoffs) i really hope nonis doesn't pull a bonehead move here

Lord Eder · Post #54 » by **Lord Eder** » Wed Oct 9, 2013 1:08 am

Paul Ranger is frustrating as hell. For every solid defensive play he makes, there's 1 or 2 absolute brain fart moments

ATLTimekeeper · Post #55 » by **ATLTimekeeper** » Wed Oct 9, 2013 1:46 am

They deserved that loss. The team was flat. Unimpressed with Carlyle playing Orr with 5 minutes left and still giving Kadri no burn.

TheRealistGM · Post #56 » by **TheRealistGM** » Wed Oct 9, 2013 1:51 am

ATLTimekeeper wrote:They deserved that loss. The team was flat. Unimpressed with Carlyle playing Orr with 5 minutes left and still giving Kadri no burn.

That made 0 sense to me too. Is there any upside to playing Orr there?

Mohanad · Post #57 » by **Mohanad** » Thu Oct 10, 2013 2:45 am

It’s one of the difficult things about playing for the Toronto Maple Leafs.

The news cycle often has a name or two off the roster in trade rumours, and right now it’s focused squarely on young defenceman Jake Gardiner.

He hasn’t been able to entirely avoid the talk.

“That’s part of the Leafs,” Gardiner said after practice on Wednesday. “Media’s going to speculate about things. It’s part of the business. If something happens then that’s the way it is. You just can’t worry about it.

“You always hear a little, but I try and stay out of that. I remember [Luke] Schenn a couple years ago, it seemed like he was talked about every single day. Then nothing happened for the longest time. It did end up happening, but that happens with every guy in here and you’ve just got to block it out.”

While the Gardiner rumours are coming from legitimate sources and, in my opinion, have some basis in reality, what has been overblown so far this season is the notion that the young blueliner has somehow been one of the Leafs main problems.

Gardiner has made a few notable turnovers and mistakes to be sure, but he played well in Tuesday’s loss to the Colorado Avalanche and logged more than 20 minutes in doing so.

http://hfboards.hockeysfuture.com/showt ... ?t=1513105

Not exactly shocked teams are calling for Gardiner. The only thing mentioned was that the Leafs were listening to discussions about Jake, per Elliotte Friedman. Then this rumor spread like wildfire. He'll be a RFA by seasons end, it'll be an interesting few months heading into the deadline.

Post #58 » by **YogiStewart** » Thu Oct 10, 2013 1:11 pm

Gardiner's perceived value is a 2nd round pick or maybe a B/B+ prospect.
he's a giant red flag when you look at last year's concussion debacle, him not being dressed for large chunks of the season and his spotty play this year.
at best, he'll be a 2nd line D-man. at best.

Deadpool_X · Post #59 » by **Deadpool_X** » Thu Oct 10, 2013 4:02 pm

YogiStewart wrote:Gardiner's perceived value is a 2nd round pick or maybe a B/B+ prospect.
he's a giant red flag when you look at last year's concussion debacle, him not being dressed for large chunks of the season and his spotty play this year.
at best, he'll be a 2nd line D-man. at best.

And I don't see the upside, I really don't. We have guys like franson, gunnerson, and dion who can all move the puck up the ice, why do we need so many offensive defensemen? What we really need is Fraser back in the line up. A guy who is just solid and plays his position.

ATLTimekeeper · Post #60 » by **ATLTimekeeper** » Thu Oct 10, 2013 8:58 pm

I think all this Gardiner b.s. is mostly to keep his price down going into next season's RFA year or justify a trade of a popular player. He's been as good as any Leaf D-Man so far, which is to say they've all had their moments. I don't doubt that Randy wants a tougher player, but it's not Jake's fault that they don't have enough stay-at-home defensemen. It's Randy's job to make the players he has work, not to punish players for lacking what he needs. Without Gardiner, we wouldn't have taken the Bruins to game 7.