WHG traded to hornets for O'Bryant and two 2nds

[Marty McFly]

So, here's an interesting dynamic as a result of this trade:

Knicks traded their own 2020 and 2021 second round picks to Philly for Willy

Hornets traded their own 2020 and 2021 second round picks to Knicks for Willy

Therefore, we need to finish with a better record than the Hornets in 2020 and 2021 for the overall trade to payoff.

no. you just have to draft someone better than willy with either of those picks or It's a massive L if willy turns into something.

[HEZI]

Doesn't matter if the Warriors are a winning team and we are not, the same principles apply. Kerr is basically talking about development of a young player, not about winning or losing games. Doesn't matter that he has All Stars in front of him, he still wants McCaw to stay hungry and earn his minutes by working harder than his All Stars and never feeling like he's owed anything. Kerr even says "I don't care where you go", so obviously he wasn't just talking about his team but he's talking about the general principles.

so you think carlisle is a bad coach? cause he said the exact opposite.

and yes it does matter what your situation is and who is in front of you. Not every situation is the same...

dallas and gsw are in different position so two really good coaches treat each situation differently...

Why are you bringing Carlisle into this? That wasn't a Carlisle quote, it was a Steve Kerr quote. You may not agree with it, that's fine, but Kerr has his way and Carlisle has his. You're only using the team record as something to support your opinion but that's just your opinion. I was talking about Steve Kerr and the man made it crystal clear that his opinion on the matter has nothing to do with good team vs. bad team or who's in what situation.

[DrCoach]

All-Rookie lottery pick Jahlil Okafor netted Trevor Booker and they had to include Stauskas and a 2nd rounder...

Thank you!!!!

And he is better and younger.

We got 2 2nd rd picks for a guy we picked with a 2nd rd.

Kanter is better

This also opens up a slot for a G-player

I think Okafor is like -24 in overall +/- rating if that means anything to anyone. He's pretty bad.

He was also the #3 pick in the draft, who couldn’t get a #1 pick

[mpharris36]

Doesn't matter if the Warriors are a winning team and we are not, the same principles apply. Kerr is basically talking about development of a young player, not about winning or losing games. Doesn't matter that he has All Stars in front of him, he still wants McCaw to stay hungry and earn his minutes by working harder than his All Stars and never feeling like he's owed anything. Kerr even says "I don't care where you go", so obviously he wasn't just talking about his team but he's talking about the general principles.

so you think carlisle is a bad coach? cause he said the exact opposite.

and yes it does matter what your situation is and who is in front of you. Not every situation is the same...

dallas and gsw are in different position so two really good coaches treat each situation differently...

Why are you bringing Carlisle into this? That wasn't a Carlisle quote, it was a Steve Kerr quote. You may not agree with it, that's fine, but Kerr has his way and Carlisle has his. You're only using the team record as something to support your opinion but that's just your opinion. I was talking about Steve Kerr and the man made it crystal clear that his opinion on the matter has nothing to do with good team vs. bad team or who's in what situation.

its the whole basis of your argument...you said it doesn't matter if the warriors are a winning team or not....I said it absolutely plays a role and two coaches widely considered at the top of there profession are treating young players totally different.

Easy for Kerr to say young players need to earn there minutes when you are a championship contender and have all-stars at every position. Carlisle is brought up because I don't care to talk about a bum coach like Horny...Carlisle is one of the best and in his situation he understands there will be struggles with young players and you have to let them play and learn through it.

so its part of my argument disagreeing with you.

[seren]

Patrick McCaw played in 48 games this year. He is averaging 15 minutes per game. I am pretty sure if Willy was averaging 15 a game playing 90 percent of the games he would have just STFU.

[Tuneman7]

People are putting way too much stock into an all rookie 1st team award. Did people forget about Landry Fields?

In my eyes the dude had a sourpuss demeanor in the limited time he did get on the floor this season rather than trying to fight his way into the rotation or show why he should be played over Kanter and KOQ. He can't hit shots more than 10 feet away from the basket and he plays 0 semblance of defense.

Whether we could've gotten more for him in a trade is a different story, maybe? The market for young unproven players who are 3rd-4th string on a lottery dwelling team isn't that great I guess?

[HEZI]

so you think carlisle is a bad coach? cause he said the exact opposite.

and yes it does matter what your situation is and who is in front of you. Not every situation is the same...

dallas and gsw are in different position so two really good coaches treat each situation differently...

Why are you bringing Carlisle into this? That wasn't a Carlisle quote, it was a Steve Kerr quote. You may not agree with it, that's fine, but Kerr has his way and Carlisle has his. You're only using the team record as something to support your opinion but that's just your opinion. I was talking about Steve Kerr and the man made it crystal clear that his opinion on the matter has nothing to do with good team vs. bad team or who's in what situation.

its the whole basis of your argument...you said it doesn't matter if the warriors are a winning team or not....I said it absolutely plays a role and two coaches widely considered at the top of there profession are treating young players totally different.

Easy for Kerr to say young players need to earn there minutes when you are a championship contender and have all-stars at every position. Carlisle is brought up because I don't care to talk about a bum coach like Horny...Carlisle is one of the best and in his situation he understands there will be struggles with young players and you have to let them play and learn through it.

so its part of my argument disagreeing with you.

But it's not even my argument, although I do agree with it, I was just reiterating what Kerr said. You disagree with it, ok I get that. Kerr coached a young team to the NBA Finals, Carlisle coached a bunch of vets. When it comes to dealing with and developing young kids, I'm going with Kerr on this one.

[Clyde Frazier]

Willie Asked to be traded.

*asked to play

[CrazyKnicks]

So instead of seeing what this guy has considering we're rebuilding and especially after KP went down, we trade him for nothing.

Perry should be fired for such an incompetent move. Signed THJ to an awful contract, refuses to rebuild, then gives away a young player with potential. And Perry was supposed to be this great GM? Look at the mess he built in Sacramento before he left... Look at what the Nets are doing, actually being smart and rebuilding properly even though their previous GM gave away their picks.

Just a typical Knicks move, this franchise never gets it.

[Besart19]

Warriors, SAS and OKC were better fits for Willy

[Phish Tank]

This just pretty much boiled down to Willy playing his cards wrong and not looking at the bigger picture.

Melo trade brought in Kanter. Yes, we can say we shouldn’t have done it, but Melo had to go and we’d have to take back a center in the trade because centers were the only bad contracts.

The end goal was to trade Kyle, not Willy. However, you actually have to play Kyle to get value.

At the same time, big men won’t get paid what Noah was given anymore. It’s why Kanter will opt in because there is no more money to spend on players like him.

So Willy has to basically force Kanter to be a DNP. Yet he wasn’t able to do that on the floor or in the weight room in the off-season....

Willy would get his playing time either next year or after the deadline if he just sat and waited it out. But no, he became impatient and complained about minutes. It’s not like he is a free agent this summer. Then the beat writers and other enablers egged him on to complain more and more.

At the same time, Kyle’s trade prospects are clearly limited right now. We had a deal with Willy. Perry/Mills are like, “yeah, we like Willy. But we have this deal on the table. And Willy’s been demanding a trade. Let’s send him away.”

So indeed we send him away. To a team that also has a backlog at center. And we replenish our 2nd round picks.

Had Willy shut up, he would still be here and probably would get his minutes.


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[FKF]

This just pretty much boiled down to Willy playing his cards wrong and not looking at the bigger picture.

Melo trade brought in Kanter. Yes, we can say we shouldn’t have done it, but Melo had to go and we’d have to take back a center in the trade because centers were the only bad contracts.

The end goal was to trade Kyle, not Willy. However, you actually have to play Kyle to get value.

At the same time, big men won’t get paid what Noah was given anymore. It’s why Kanter will opt in because there is no more money to spend on players like him.

So Willy has to basically force Kanter to be a DNP. Yet he wasn’t able to do that on the floor or in the weight room in the off-season....

Willy would get his playing time either next year or after the deadline if he just sat and waited it out. But no, he became impatient and complained about minutes. It’s not like he is a free agent this summer. Then the beat writers and other enablers egged him on to complain more and more.

At the same time, Kyle’s trade prospects are clearly limited right now. We had a deal with Willy. Perry/Mills are like, “yeah, we like Willy. But we have this deal on the table. And Willy’s been demanding a trade. Let’s send him away.”

So indeed we send him away. To a team that also has a backlog at center. And we replenish our 2nd round picks.

Had Willy shut up, he would still be here and probably would get his minutes.


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Yeah I’ve heard that argument. They played KOQ to showcase him but yet Willy is the one getting traded despite not playing. Doesn’t it tell us something ?

BS Perry/Mills like Willy. They didn’t. Willy was a Phil guy. Willy was the backup of Marc Gasol on the Spanish team, a great rebounder who could complement a KP, they had chemistry in Spain and he saw future with him. As soon as Phil was let go, Willy wasn’t really part of the organization no more. Phil would have waived Melo and played Willy. Instead we play Kanter and pay him the millions. Like it helps us moving forward, it doesn’t.

[FKF]

So instead of seeing what this guy has considering we're rebuilding and especially after KP went down, we trade him for nothing.

Perry should be fired for such an incompetent move. Signed THJ to an awful contract, refuses to rebuild, then gives away a young player with potential. And Perry was supposed to be this great GM? Look at the mess he built in Sacramento before he left... Look at what the Nets are doing, actually being smart and rebuilding properly even though their previous GM gave away their picks.

Just a typical Knicks move, this franchise never gets it.

And the worst is a part of the fan case and Knicks media suckers are now trying to rationalize this move. Again the Knicks spinning machine is rolling.

Mike Breen spread out on podcast pure franchise BS, as if Willy didn’t have much value and this trade saves the Knicks cap space. They should have PLAYED him and he was making UNDER $2m a year. And suddenly he was too expensive ? Bs.

The announcer of that show was like “I’m not saying they should have got better value, why didn’t they just play him and grow him?”. Mike had no answer other than “maybe you’re overestimating Willy”. How can we overestimate a guy who didn’t play ? He was a 2nd round pick who made it to the NBA all rookie team. He was on a cheap contract for another two years and showed the ability to produce when given minutes. We just couldn’t be happy with a guy making $2m and give him minutes. We had to acquire and play a guy making $18m.

They are also saying Willy wanted out. He didn’t. He wanted to play with KP, like he was doing in the Spanish league, but when he waited for three months on the bench with no opportunity, not even on a back to back night, he had no choice but to ask his reps for a move, which he could do as an all rookie 1st team selection.

[Jcs2380]

Amen. This applies to Willy, Frank, every young player:

Read on Twitter

What exactly is he supposed to do to earn minutes? I'm sure he was working hard in practice because I know he wants to play. Hornaceck just never gave him a chance. He definitely could of gave him more than just garbage time minutes.

A lot of players on the Knicks are playing terrible right now. How exactly are they earning their minutes but Willy isn't? I love to know how Mcdermott is earning his because he's consistently playing like trash.

[ChilledAlex]

Amen. This applies to Willy, Frank, every young player:

Read on Twitter

What exactly is he supposed to do to earn minutes? I'm sure he was working hard in practice because I know he wants to play. Hornaceck just never gave him a chance. He definitely could of gave him more than just garbage time minutes.

A lot of players on the Knicks are playing terrible right now. How exactly are they earning their minutes but Willy isn't? I love to know how Mcdermott is earning his because he's consistently playing like trash.

Hornacek is an idiot who has a grudge with KP, so since KP is untouchable Horny reigned over Willy

[Sark]

What has Lance 0/0/0 Thomas done to earn his minutes?

[MartinsLusis]

This just in:

Read on Twitter

[Jalen Bluntson]

What has Lance 0/0/0 Thomas done to earn his minutes?

Quadruple single...legendary!

He is Herb Williams nephew!

Alan Houston's cousin.

[GettinitDone]

Willy showed he has talent, but I don't care how talented you are, take any borderline all-star player, even all-star, if the coach plays him only spot minutes, it's going to hurt his confidence, rhythm, and momentum. He's going to look like he belongs in D-League. He was on All Rookie team last season, and for him to get no playing time due to his D, it made it sound like Kanter and KOQ are in the running for DPOY.

It's Jeff's ineptitude and incompetence that result in this mess. Willy should have got at least 15mpg, as one of our core players moving forward. Instead, we got 2 2nd rounders for him. It's tough enough for mid-late first rounder to be in rotation, 2 2nd rounders sound nice, but often don't mean jack unless you have RC Buford or Sam Presti drafting for you.

[FKF]

This just in:

Read on Twitter

I said the same thing

The Knicks are clueless pimps. They can't develop players, and when other teams do, they go out a give the same players more money and more work than anyone else would.