Towns or Okafor or Mudiay or Russel?

[Meat]

This is how I see it:

Pick # 1 will go to Minnesota
Pick # 2 will go to either the Lakers or Sixers
Pick # 3 will go to the Knicks

Please don't hex this lottery. We're getting the number 1 pick. Silver is gonna pull a Stern and get us that pick.

But we're the Knicks, we're always jinxed.

the knicks's bad luck have been their own doing, the last time they were in contention for #1, they got number one

[Sark]

Okafor has the post game that players pay Hakeem $100k to try to learn. He's gonna be an absolute beast at the next level.

Whatever defensive deficiencies he has (not as great as people make it out to be), can and should be overlooked. He can learn to be a better defender. If Boozer can be turned into a solid defender under Thibs, then Okafor can improve his defense too.

This is where Boozer plays his best defense...

In the time it took you to find that gif you could've actually looked up his stats and seen he had a sub 100 drtg under Thibs. While he wasn't great, he was more than adequate.

[ctorres]

Is there a 5th guy or are Towns, Okafor, Mudiay, and Russel the only four that matter in the upcoming draft?

[JBreezeNY]

Okafor has the post game that players pay Hakeem $100k to try to learn. He's gonna be an absolute beast at the next level.

Whatever defensive deficiencies he has (not as great as people make it out to be), can and should be overlooked. He can learn to be a better defender. If Boozer can be turned into a solid defender under Thibs, then Okafor can improve his defense too.

This is where Boozer plays his best defense...

In the time it took you to find that gif you could've actually looked up his stats and seen he had a sub 100 drtg under Thibs. While he wasn't great, he was more than adequate.

This is real life?

His DRTG was once a 93 at one point during the 2011-2012 season, DRTG isn't factoring individual success. If your team is solid defensively then you will have a good DRTG. Boozer was at best mediocre defensively, stats aren't going to tell you that.

Boozer solid defensively

Boozer more than adequate defensively

Funniest thing I've read all day.

The Bulls kept him on the bench during 4th quarters for god's sake.

[Thugger HBC]

Okafor has the post game that players pay Hakeem $100k to try to learn. He's gonna be an absolute beast at the next level.

Whatever defensive deficiencies he has (not as great as people make it out to be), can and should be overlooked. He can learn to be a better defender. If Boozer can be turned into a solid defender under Thibs, then Okafor can improve his defense too.

This is where Boozer plays his best defense...

In the time it took you to find that gif you could've actually looked up his stats and seen he had a sub 100 drtg under Thibs. While he wasn't great, he was more than adequate.

Nah, he really wasnt, which is why he spent so much time on the bench. boozer is good at defensive rebounding though.

[JBreezeNY]

This is where Boozer plays his best defense...

In the time it took you to find that gif you could've actually looked up his stats and seen he had a sub 100 drtg under Thibs. While he wasn't great, he was more than adequate.

Nah, he really wasnt, which is why he spent so much time on the bench. boozer is good at defensive rebounding though.

Hence the high DRTG....

[god shammgod]

thibbs used to bench boozer at the end of games because of his defense. he was horrible. that really has nothing to do with okafor though. some guys can improve and some guys can't. if you could figure that kind of thing out now this would be a lot easier but you can't.

[JBreezeNY]

thibbs used to bench boozer at the end of games because of his defense. he was horrible. that really has nothing to do with okafor though. some guys can improve and some guys can't. if you could figure that kind of thing out now this would be a lot easier but you can't.

Pretty much.

Okafor's defensive awareness honestly is Amar'e level & I'm not even joking.

However his help defense could possibly be improved.

I don't see his PnR defense improving at all but his man to man defense is good.

[god shammgod]

things don't JUST happen though. they take time. he won't be a good defender right away. that's for sure.

if you take him you got to plan on him sucking on defense for the first couple of years and build your team with that in mind.

[malik959]

I honestly don't see the rush in getting an immediate impact player. If we can get an all star 3-5 years from now from this draft...I believe we succeed. Let's plan for future success beyond Melo's prime. (Yea Melo's prime would be wasted, but thats how it is right now)

Not wasting Melo's prime will be addressed through FA. What we can do with our pick if given choices is to get a prospect that is best for the long-term while at the same time hopefully fits perfectly with Melo both offensively and defensively. I believe Karl-Anthony Towns is that guy.

Thumbs up to both of you. In fact Ill take it a step further. Thats how we should approach free agency as well. I never felt we needed to rebuild by trading Melo for a slew of picks and choosing to suck over the next five years. On the other hand thoughI don't think we gotta go out and sign all these so called " win now" players who minimize our flexibility or have a short window. I think fans don't wanna see us become what the Nets are now where we go all in with a total disregard for the future.

And to those fans their antithesis is the total rebuild, complete with 76r level draft picks, sixer level trades, sixer level perpetual tanking. If when Isaiah said you cant rebuild in NY he meant that, then I agree with him. But heres my alternative. You marry both worlds. You grab this awesome draft pick this year, which will be the case no matter what path we choose. We have our draft pick folks and not just any pick. A top 4 pick cornerstone type of player. So essentially we just rebuilt right there if. You wanna get technical.

In terms of free agency, I think the Knicks should focus on young players who have shown something now. I wanna get guys who will help Melo now yet still be here as Melo fades and our 2015 draft breaks out. To put things in perspective, people always complain that Melo is 30 with bad knees and a big contract right. That contract is for another 4yrs? Let me give you a run down of some free agents and what theyll look like in 4 yrs

Butler would be 29
Jordan would be 30
Middleton would be 28
Monroe would be 29

And our draft pick would be just 22 yrs old at that point. A young fully developed star with a team of veterans around him. Guess what folks. Melo be damned, itll be Okofor/Towns/Mudaiy/Russells team at that point. And all the while that player would've developed on a winning team for the last four years. Lets get one thing straight. Carmelos been bashed, kicked while down, everything you can imagine and before it was about him always getting to the playoffs but not advancing. Now that hes not in the playoffs fans are even doubting his ability to lead a playoff team. If we get even mediocre talent Melo will lead us to the playoffs. We just dont even have mediocre talent is all. And everybody is so focused on not being a treadmill team during Melos time here that they arent seeing the true picture.

The true picture is what you call a treadmill team around Melo, I call on the job training for our rookie, our young free agents. Playoff training that after 4 years, even if we never make the finals will set our rookie up to be a great player. And you never know, even those young players may develop into good players. I think fans take a snapshot of talent and assume that what we get on day one is what we get on day three. For ex. Even in these " trade the first for Cousins" threads people look at Cousins like a photo and assume that at 24 hes a finished product, or that Monroe is a finished product, or that even Butler is a finished product. Last year Butler was Monroes age and was putting up Shumpert level numbers essentially. This year hes a max candidate. So my point is Melo may never win in 2015 yet maybe in 2017 he does. Maybe everyones fear comes true than Melo sees a decline but at the same time thats happening a guy you thought was a complimentary piece starts emerging as a primary option. Maybe Melo himself starts to identify this and I know this is blasphemy but maybe he himself starts taking a step back similar to how Pierce did later in his career.

But none of this is imaginable in the typical Championship or Rebuild model. Even playoff teams go through a progression. Last year Atlanta was a treadmill team, this year they are legitimate contenders. They never tore it down to the bone to get to this point. The Mavs have been a treadmill team for a decade straight. Somewhere in the middle they won a title.

Stop allowing the media, crazy fans and our own fears of **** Isiah teams to make us feel like getting to the playoffs every year has a negative connotation. Should the knicks have gotten further so far in the Melo era? Of course but stop and think for a second. We made the playoffs the first three years Melo was here, in the third year we had the second best year in the nba. Next year we like idiots pick up Bargnani and watch everyone get injured and guess what? We miss the playoffs. This is year is more of a reaction to last year than yet another year with good talent and failing. We are losing this year BY DESIGN. But because its championship or bust we never actually took the time to sit back and enjoy it.

Many reference the 90's with a level of pride in hindsight. We all wish the Melo era was like that era. Guess what? We didn't win a title then either and funny thing in the moment we treated that team like bums too. Only later when we missed the playoffs for a decade did we appreciate those years. Well in this era we're doing the same thing. Melo is a bum, he's horrible blah blah blah. Melo wasn't on this team from 2000 to 2010 folks. He got here and delivered what he could. I still have faith that you put a decent team around him you can win....BUT the whole point of my post is even if it never happens we can at least say hey, we spent the last four years contending and developing young players who might end up winning us our title after both Melo and the triangle are history. Thats the type of team I wanna build.

I read this with a Samuel L. Jackson voice, didn't end so well:

[DickGrayson]

things don't JUST happen though. they take time. he won't be a good defender right away. that's for sure.

if you take him you got to plan on him sucking on defense for the first couple of years and build your team with that in mind.

The thing with Okafor it seems like the way he plays defense is innate. He just lacks the soul to be nasty on defense and show a mean streak. I may even call Okafor "soft". Eddy Curry soft on defense.

However, Okafor is a good rebounder, passer and the best post player we've seen in a long time. Theres no question Okafor will be all star caliber because his game too advanced for his age.

His body language and energy on the court seems lifeless on defense. I understand Duke can't afford Okafor to foul out of games, but I'd like to see Okafor be more physical on defense and use that mammoth 6"11 270lbs 7"6 wingspan body.

[Worst_to_First]

thibbs used to bench boozer at the end of games because of his defense. he was horrible. that really has nothing to do with okafor though. some guys can improve and some guys can't. if you could figure that kind of thing out now this would be a lot easier but you can't.

Pretty much.

Okafor's defensive awareness honestly is Amar'e level & I'm not even joking.

However his help defense could possibly be improved.

I don't see his PnR defense improving at all but his man to man defense is good.

In my humble opinion…..

KAT’s chances of improving his offensive repertoire >>>>> OK4’s chances of improving his defensive awareness

[sasso]

Is there a 5th guy or are Towns, Okafor, Mudiay, and Russel the only four that matter in the upcoming draft?

Willie Cauley Stein is my 5th pick in the unlikely event we end up lower than 4th. He will be a great, versatile defensive big man in the NBA. He's also a great complement to a defensively inept center like Greg Monroe if we happened to sign Monroe this offseason.

[RHODEY]

Big night of exciting games tonight. TWolves playing at home verse the Hornets. 76ers at the Lakers. Twolves need to sack up and win a gawdamn game. Interesting game in LA as the 76ers own the Lakers pick if it falls out of the top 5. Its doubly beneficial for the sixers to lose the game.

If some other team wins the lottery, I hope its the 76ers. With Noel and Embid, they should pick one of the guards. I'd like the Knicks to have the choice of Towns or Okafor with their pick.

Really interesting point. Would Philly pass on Okafor or Towns? Would they try to trade down if the got #1? Lets assume they would pick a guard. ... That would mean chances of us having a choice between Town or Okafor are even stronger. Could one of you mathematicians out there calculate that possibility.? Assume that Philly has the 3rd most ping pong balls and we have the most ...

[JBreezeNY]

thibbs used to bench boozer at the end of games because of his defense. he was horrible. that really has nothing to do with okafor though. some guys can improve and some guys can't. if you could figure that kind of thing out now this would be a lot easier but you can't.

Pretty much.

Okafor's defensive awareness honestly is Amar'e level & I'm not even joking.

However his help defense could possibly be improved.

I don't see his PnR defense improving at all but his man to man defense is good.

In my humble opinion…..

KAT’s chances of improving his offensive repertoire >>>>> OK4’s chances of improving his defensive awareness

I completely & 100% agree.

Improving on offense is much easier than improving on defense. Anybody can put a ball in a hoop but not everybody has the ability or the IQ to learn how to become a better defender.

I wish him all the best of luck because if he does become our pick, he becomes our starting center which means he becomes our first & last line of defense and if he's our first & last line of defense that means we damn sure will need him to be not just a adequate defender but a good one. Not average, not above average but good.

We're not talking about a PG, a SG or a SF on defense here. Those positions can afford to be a little meh defensively because they're not guarding the rim. However if your PF & C are bad defensively in the post or has a lot of lapses defensively then you're fu*ked. I really, really want Okafor to be good.

[darkjedi4z]

I thought we're automatically in the top 4 picks if we have the worst record?

[ibraheim718]

Pretty much.

Okafor's defensive awareness honestly is Amar'e level & I'm not even joking.

However his help defense could possibly be improved.

I don't see his PnR defense improving at all but his man to man defense is good.

In my humble opinion…..

KAT’s chances of improving his offensive repertoire >>>>> OK4’s chances of improving his defensive awareness

I completely & 100% agree.

Improving on offense is much easier than improving on defense. Anybody can put a ball in a hoop but not everybody has the ability or the IQ to learn how to become a better defender.

I wish him all the best of luck because if he does become our pick, he becomes our starting center which means he becomes our first & last line of defense and if he's our first & last line of defense that means we damn sure will need him to be not just a adequate defender but a good one. Not average, not above average but good.

We're not talking about a PG, a SG or a SF on defense here. Those positions can afford to be a little meh defensively because they're not guarding the rim. However if your PF & C are bad defensively in the post or has a lot of lapses defensively then you're fu*ked. I really, really want Okafor to be good.

The pg is a teams first line of defense.

[ibraheim718]

I think the oakfor kid is getting a little bit of a bad wrap on the defensive end. He is very good at sticking to his assignment and making it difficult on him. One on one I think he is pretty good and shows flashes of being great.

But the weakness is he rarely sees the game outside of his man. He wont leave his man to protect the rim. He rarely seems to check over his shoulder to see if the rim needs help being protected. He just dont have the weak side help rim protection instinct.

On the flip side of that though is his size. He seems good at sticking his man but he is usually 5 inches taller and 50 pounds heavier than his man too. Maybe thats why I have seen some flashes on the defensive end. Just because he is so much bigger.

From what I have seen I definitely wouldnt give him a D grade on the defensive end. Maybe help defense is a D. I would say his man to man is a B+. Every game I have seen him in so far he has blocked a shot. And I dont recall seeing any kinda battle between he and his man. He dominates the matchup.

So you like him a little more now Kane?

And I agree about the help D needing the most work. I think he gets the verticality aspect of big man defending and I think he's a pretty good man to man post defender.

[isiah_thomas]

I thought we're automatically in the top 4 picks if we have the worst record?

Yea worst rec = top 4 pick

[camillepd]

Is there a 5th guy or are Towns, Okafor, Mudiay, and Russel the only four that matter in the upcoming draft?

Willie Cauley Stein is my 5th pick in the unlikely event we end up lower than 4th. He will be a great, versatile defensive big man in the NBA. He's also a great complement to a defensively inept center like Greg Monroe if we happened to sign Monroe this offseason.

Greg Monroe is a PF not a Center.