2011 NBA Draft Discussion Thread (Lottery Tonight!)

[TrueWarrior]

This pencil neck Kahn probably will take Irving if they get the no.1 pick...smdh.

Why wouldn't he? They have no PG.

The dude drafted Rubio and Flynn then signed Sessions and then signed Ridnour and now he's going to draft Irving. What is he going to keep drafting and signing point guards every year for the rest of his tenure. If he can't evaluate the position good enough he shouldn't have a freaking job to beging with. He should stick with Ridnour and draft a SG.

Thats dumb. Its like saying the Bulls shoulda drafted Beasley instead of Rose because they already had Hinrich. Or the Clippers not picking Blake because they had Zach. Or the Wizards not picking Wall because they had Gilbert. And so on. Nah you draft the BPA. This isnt the NFL where you can draft more for need and fill in some holes.

My philosophy is always go BPA, but if for instance you need a PG and there is a PG and SF on the board who you have rated the same, you go with the PG obviously. In the Wolves' case Irving not only fills a need, but hed be the BPA too. No brainer IMO. There are no SGs worth taking top 10 except maybe Burks anyway.

The only guy I could see challenging Irving for the #1 pick is Derrick Williams, and he plays the same position as Love. Going back to my philosophy the Wolves should clearly go with the PG Irving even if they have Williams rated on the same level because of Love. If they had Williams ranked higher then by all means go with Williams though. However you then cant play Love and Williams together unless Williams is out of position as a 3 or you go small ball. Not worth it IMO because Love is their cornerstone. Williams is good, but not good enough for all that trouble to take over Irving. Barnes is likely staying in school.

Its like in our case this year. Yes we have needs at C, SG, and PG but this team just needs TALENT no matter what position. We need a bench. Flat out. Id try to stay away from combo guards though unless they are clear uprgades (like Kemba or Knight) because I think Toney can handle that spot for us. One should always lean A LITTLE bit towards a player who fits, but if the talent disparity is too big you dont go for the player who fits over the more talented player. If anything you have a better asset to use in a trade, or you could now trade others on your team to improve that way.

Damn I just rambled a lot.

[ibraheim718]

What's dumb is taking the 2 point guards back to back in o9.... A GM should have a vision. So basically what you are saying is if when the wolves are on the clock in the next five drafts and a PG is the BPA they should draft him? Right.... to me that's dumb. Drafting BPA is not the best way to build a team a clear and concise vision is the way too build a team. And on a sidenote Derrick Williams will be a much better pro than Love....mark it. So in essence if the Wolves get the number one pick and they draft Irving they are admitting they whiffed on the Rubio pick and what was he picked fifth? That's a fireable offense in my book.

[ibraheim718]

You know what TW why in the **** can't you just say you disagree instead of sounding like a five year old kid by saying "that's dumb"???? Is it so damn hard to treat people with some damn respect around here?

[ibraheim718]

Another thing your comparison of Griffin replacing Randolph or Wall replacing Gilbert are nothing like Irving replacing a 19 yo kid that you've been telling your fans and the whole country was going to play for your franchise.... How in the hell are those scenarios even remotely similar?

[TrueWarrior]

What's dumb is taking the 2 point guards back to back in o9.... A GM should have a vision. So basically what you are saying is if when the wolves are on the clock in the next five drafts and a PG is the BPA they should draft him? Right.... to me that's dumb. Drafting BPA is not the best way to build a team a clear and concise vision is the way too build a team. And on a sidenote Derrick Williams will be a much better pro than Love....mark it. So in essence if the Wolves get the number one pick and they draft Irving they are admitting they whiffed on the Rubio pick and what was he picked fifth? That's a fireable offense in my book.

A young rebuilding team should always go BPA yes. Because going by your logic the Bulls should have drafted Beasley over Rose.

I said if Kahn feels Williams is the BPA then by all means they should pick him. However that most likely means they have to trade Love if Williams ends up being better. Its a risk because Love just pulled in a 20/15 season, so how much better are we talkin here? You say them picking Irving admits to whiffing on Rubio, but what does picking Williams say about Love? Did they whiff on him too? Id say Love has been the only bright spot of that team, and it would be silly to trade him away.

What happened in the past has nothing to do with the team now. Rubio has supposedly hes been ass cheeks in Europe. Youd have to believe that Irving would finally sure up their PG spot for good, and thats something you dont pass up the way the league is these days instead of banking on Rubio to figure things out. Most scouts and GMs prob have Irving as the top prospect so its not like Kahn is reaching there. I mean you want to pass on him because of Rubio and Ridnour? You then say youd draft a SG... what SG? Doesnt seem like youve been following the draft much.

I guess we just disagree. No biggie. I would go Irving and pair him up with Love though. Thats a very good foundation right there along with Beasley, Wesley, Randolph, Darko, Flynn, Rubio, and Webster. The Wolves have some assets even if they suck. They have options. I dont understand the hate Kahn gets. Hes done decently well collecting some young high risk/high reward talents which is what they needed. Sooner or later they're going to have to start winning obviously and their assets will either need to start producing or be used in a trade, but for now hes been solid. Yes he screwed up the 09 draft it seems. Flynn was flying up draft boards at the time and Rubio's hype was crazy though. It happens. We picked Jordan Hill didnt we?

[ibraheim718]

What's dumb is taking the 2 point guards back to back in o9.... A GM should have a vision. So basically what you are saying is if when the wolves are on the clock in the next five drafts and a PG is the BPA they should draft him? Right.... to me that's dumb. Drafting BPA is not the best way to build a team a clear and concise vision is the way too build a team. And on a sidenote Derrick Williams will be a much better pro than Love....mark it. So in essence if the Wolves get the number one pick and they draft Irving they are admitting they whiffed on the Rubio pick and what was he picked fifth? That's a fireable offense in my book.

A young rebuilding team should always go BPA yes. Because going by your logic the Bulls should have drafted Beasley over Rose.

I said if Kahn feels Williams is the BPA then by all means they should pick him. However that most likely means they have to trade Love if Williams ends up being better. Its a risk because Love just pulled in a 20/15 season, so how much better are we talkin here? You say them picking Irving admits to whiffing on Rubio, but what does picking Williams say about Love? Did they whiff on him too? Id say Love has been the only bright spot of that team, and it would be silly to trade him away.

What happened in the past has nothing to do with the team now. Rubio has supposedly hes been ass cheeks in Europe. Youd have to believe that Irving would finally sure up their PG spot for good, and thats something you dont pass up the way the league is these days instead of banking on Rubio to figure things out. Most scouts and GMs prob have Irving as the top prospect so its not like Kahn is reaching there. I mean you want to pass on him because of Rubio and Ridnour? You then say youd draft a SG... what SG? Doesnt seem like youve been following the draft much.

I guess we just disagree. No biggie. I would go Irving and pair him up with Love though. Thats a very good foundation right there along with Beasley, Wesley, Randolph, Darko, Flynn, Rubio, and Webster. The Wolves have some assets even if they suck. They have options. I dont understand the hate Kahn gets. Hes done decently well collecting some young high risk/high reward talents which is what they needed. Sooner or later they're going to have to start winning obviously and their assets will either need to start producing or be used in a trade, but for now hes been solid. Yes he screwed up the 09 draft it seems. Flynn was flying up draft boards at the time and Rubio's hype was crazy though. It happens. We picked Jordan Hill didnt we?

You can come on here and ramble on about whatever you want but regardless or not what I said Kahn gets the Number 1 pick and takes irving he'll look like he doesn't have a clue in which direction he is taking the franchise unless he trades Rubio who's stock has seemingly dropped and who he has been telling the fans and media he was going to deliver.... it'll look like a failure.

[ibraheim718]

FYI NBA draft.net has Minny taking Williams with the number 1 pick...

[ibraheim718]

Re: #3 pick: scenarios not involving self-immolation

New postby [RCG] on Wed Apr 13, 2011 7:35 am
I'd say move down, either with our 1st + Flynn for Clevelands second draft pick and top-5 protected next year or the same package and Utah's two firsts. Either way pick up someone like Biyombo and Burks with Utah's two firsts.

Another possibilty is packaging Flynn and Memphis' pick to move up.

[RCG]

^^^^^this from the wolves board. ANd Burks is a 2 guard.... just had to post this because this cat is trying to clown me. KAhn needs to get creative here if he can't deliver Rubio. IF he can't trade down and draft a 2 guard (Alec Burks) then he takes williams to add depth since he can play the 3 and the 4.Or at least save face and trade the rights to rubio.

[Marty McFly]

if the wolves land the first pick, this draft is gonna make kahn's head explode.

[Knicksfan20]

Pointguards and Centers have the most trade vaue in the NBA. People call Kahn stupid, but he could easily get a top 10 pick for Flynn or Rubio still. Or trade them in a package for a player. I see nothing wrong with stacking up on Point Guards. THey are easilly traded and have the highest value.

He shoudl definatly draft Kyrie because Derrick Williams plays the same position as Keving Love and have no need for a PF. There is no other player that is worth the number 1 overall pick other then Derrick Williams or possibly Kanter but he is a stretch.

Kahn has put together a young team with potential and upside. Its a mess right now, but he can put something together. T wolves are in much better position then we were a few years ago.

[Manhattan Project]

Wolves land the first overall pick, they select Irving without hesitation.

[RutgersBJJ]

Pointguards and Centers have the most trade vaue in the NBA. People call Kahn stupid, but he could easily get a top 10 pick for Flynn or Rubio still. Or trade them in a package for a player. I see nothing wrong with stacking up on Point Guards. THey are easilly traded and have the highest value.

He shoudl definatly draft Kyrie because Derrick Williams plays the same position as Keving Love and have no need for a PF. There is no other player that is worth the number 1 overall pick other then Derrick Williams or possibly Kanter but he is a stretch.

Kahn has put together a young team with potential and upside. Its a mess right now, but he can put something together. T wolves are in much better position then we were a few years ago.

How are they in a better position than a few years ago? Who has Kahn added during his tenure as GM that is a starting quality player? Beasley? One of the most inefficient scorers in the league? He's a bench player. Love was there before Kahn got there and Kahn was against the Love for Mayo trade, he wanted to keep Mayo.

Kahn is the worst GM in the league, and he is arguably one of the worst of all-time. We're going into like year 3 or 4 of his rebuild and he has added ZERO starting quality players. He has turned 3 top 6 picks into 0 stars, 0 starting quality players, 0 role players, 2 absolute scrubs, and 1 enigma who may never even play for them.

They definitely aren't in a better position than a few years ago, because a few years ago they were still picking in the top 5 and under any other GM they probably would have added a player who didn't suck. Wes Johnson is garbage, Flynn is trash, and Rubio has regressed in Europe and still can't shoot.

You can add Irving to that team and they still won't win 30 games next year. Kahn is getting fired this year or the next.

If Kahn could get a top 10 pick for Flynn (which is laughable), then why is Flynn still on the roster when he was on the trade-block during the deadline?

[hobojoe2131]

Kahn isn't getting a top 10 pick for Rubio or Flynn. Let's be real here.

[Mecca]

Pointguards and Centers have the most trade vaue in the NBA. People call Kahn stupid, but he could easily get a top 10 pick for Flynn or Rubio still. Or trade them in a package for a player. I see nothing wrong with stacking up on Point Guards. THey are easilly traded and have the highest value.

He shoudl definatly draft Kyrie because Derrick Williams plays the same position as Keving Love and have no need for a PF. There is no other player that is worth the number 1 overall pick other then Derrick Williams or possibly Kanter but he is a stretch.

Kahn has put together a young team with potential and upside. Its a mess right now, but he can put something together. T wolves are in much better position then we were a few years ago.

If Rubio was a guarantee to come in, yes he can get a top 10, but Flynn? I doubt he can get a lotto pick.

[moocow007]

Pointguards and Centers have the most trade vaue in the NBA. People call Kahn stupid, but he could easily get a top 10 pick for Flynn or Rubio still. Or trade them in a package for a player. I see nothing wrong with stacking up on Point Guards. THey are easilly traded and have the highest value.

Rubio maybe. Flynn not likely at all. Flynn's pretty much been exposed as a erratic short shooting guard and not a dynamic PG. He's really not any more value than Toney Douglas right now. And if Flynn can get a top 10 pick the Knicks should be looking to move Douglas for one as well.

He shoudl definatly draft Kyrie because Derrick Williams plays the same position as Keving Love and have no need for a PF. There is no other player that is worth the number 1 overall pick other then Derrick Williams or possibly Kanter but he is a stretch.

Derrick Williams is more of a SF in the NBA and you probably could argue that Beasley would block him or he'd have to contend for minutes with Beasley (since Williams is generally considered the most NBA ready player in the draft).

Kahn has put together a young team with potential and upside. Its a mess right now, but he can put something together. T wolves are in much better position then we were a few years ago.

He should think about trading either the pick or Rubio's rights along with maybe Beasley or Love and make a REAL franchise changing/advancing move. The Wolves have a lot of talent but they really don't have any direction nor any true franchise guy that, if one was a fan, would feel confident can lead them to greatness.

[ibraheim718]

He should think about trading either the pick or Rubio's rights along with maybe Beasley or Love and make a REAL franchise changing/advancing move. The Wolves have a lot of talent but they really don't have any direction nor any true franchise guy that, if one was a fan, would feel confident can lead them to greatness.

This is what I'm saying.... If they get the number 1 pick and feels he can't pass on Irving.... trade the pick and let the fans and media know he made something out of nothing (even though he will still catch PR hell) and move on with Irving. My point is if he picks Irving at #1 he's going to look like a fool running a team with no real direction. He should've gotten a verbal guarantee from rubio prior to the draft that he would play in minny (even though the Rubio family hinted that the kid didn't want to play there). I think ultimately the Rubio pick buries Kahn. He probably has ownership thinking he can deliver the kid. He should convince ownership Irving is a once in a decade talent they can't pass on (when we all know he isn't) and that Rubio is a great asset and they can break even trading him (when we all know they can't).

[Knicksfan20]

How exactly has Kahn not put together a young team with potential?

Michael Beasley: Played some pretty good ball this year being the only real scorer on the team. People here are calling him an inefficient scorer, yet he averaged good shooting % across the board. Former #2 overall pick and has good potential and was gotten for pennys on the dollar.

Kevin Love: One of the best young players in the league. Double Double machine.

Wayne Ellington: Sophmore player with upside. Good athletic defender who can shoot the 3 with ease.

Johnny Flynn: So him getting injured and not living up to his hype is Kahn's fault? If i remember right, alot of fans here wanted Flynn pretty badly. Flynn has had injury woes, give him the offseason and some more time before labling him a bust please.

Wesley Johnson: Kid is going to be a beast, loved him @ syracuse. He is a rookie, give him a year or two as well. He has a lot of potential. Not so amazing rookie year...but HE IS A ROOKIE. And a no brainer pick @ the timberwolves position last season.

Anthony Randolph: They got him for free pretty much. We all know his potential, and we seen what he can do in soem games this season. Is he going to be an allstar? Who knows, but the potential is still there.

Nikola Pekovic: I dont know too much about him, but is a solid prospect. 7 footer from overseas.

Anthony Toliver: Good young player, hasnt had much of an impact with the Wolves but he has played pretty well with Golden state. Good shooter, good rebounder. Another young prospect.

Ricky Rubio: "The next nash" Although he hasnt played a single NBA game yet, he still has a ton of value based on his name/age alone. Going to be a solid player when its all said in done. Even if he doesnt come to Minny, he can be traded for value.

There is a lot of youth on that team. They dont have a star yet, but they are young and have some potential players there. They have the best chance @ #1 and will draft Kyrie with that pick, or they will pick Kanter with the #2 pick. That team is in a better position then a lot of teams in the league. You cant expect them to be great in 1 or 2 years. Its a project over there. Its up to the Players to work hard and improve and as a team they will improve. They are one of the youngest teams in the league.

[BLACKFEET 2010]

I think it's pretty safe to sat Brandon Knight and Kemba will be gone by the time we pick. Jimmer will not be able to defend an NBA position. So I'd pass. Justin Harper is really growing on me. He'll likely be available where we pick. Ok. Now let's say we buy a late first like...Chicago's 28th.
Trade Walker to Sacto for pick 32. So that's...

#17 Justin Harper F
#28 ?
#32 ?

At #28, we select C/F Greg Smith outta Fresno St.
He's a big body that can outmuscle guys in the paint; relentless motor and good kid from all reports. We don't have a body type like his on our roster. He's young and has a pretty big upside. He's big and agile and can finish over the top of defenders in the paint. He isn't a speedster and not a lock down post defender but he's a load on the block and shows a willingness to improve.

At #32, we select G Darius Morris outta Michigan.
6'4" point guard. Crafty; while not overly explosive can get into the lane and make plays for teammates or himself. Is a good distributor but not a classic pg. Great instincts but does tend to try to do to much off the dribble. Streaky, generally not a good shooter. Probably one of the most improved players in the nation this past season. Has a high upside and should improve as his role in the league will be different than it was in college. If he works on his shot he can be an impact player at the next level. Big and skilled enough to man either guard position. Is a good defender as well.

Send cash and Andy Rautins to the Bucks for their #40.
With #40, we select G/F Jimmy Butler out of Marquette.
Not gonna wow you in any one area but is a heady, all-around guy in the Landry Fields mode. Hits the glass and defends a lot of positions. He's a young and transitioning from being a post player to a wing.
Totally has the look of an NBA player. Those Marquette guys usually wind up as decent pros. If he refines his shot, he will have a lengthy and productive pro career.

Ok. Then trade Ronny, cash and a future 2nd rounder to Houston for (shadidup) G/F Terrence Williams.

IN:
#17 F Justin Harper
#28 C/F Greg Smith
#32 G Darius Morris
#40 F/G Jimmy Butler
Terrence Williams

OUT:
Bill Walker
Ronny Turiaf
Shawne Williams (likely has priced himself out of our range--but I'd love to keep him)
Anthony Carter (maybe re-sign him to the minimum when it all shakes out)
Derrick Brown (he's shown to be an athlete, nothing more)
Roger Mason Jr.
Andy Rautins
Jared Jeffries
Renaldo Balkman (waive/buyout)

Sign a vet shooter on a one year deal. (Sasha Vujacic). Sign either Joey Dorsey or Ryan Hollins, preferably the latter.

Invite to camp; C/F Jeff Foote, F/C Sam Muldrow, G/F DJ Kennedy (if healed---I know it's unlikely but I root for the kid), G Dwight Hardy, F Matt Howard, F Chris Wright, G Jacob Pullen, G Lacedarius Dunn, F/G Shan Foster.

I could see Jacob Pullen getting a contract.

Shelden Williams/Ryan Hollins/Jerome Jordan/Greg Smith
Amare Stoudemire/Justin Harper
Carmelo Anthony/Jimmy Butler
Landry Fields/Terrence Williams/Sasha Vujacic/Jacob Pullen
Chauncey Billups/Toney Douglas/Darius Morris

Wait for Chris Paul. I'm back on that.
Go Knicks.

[captain subtext]

Harrison Barnes will return to school too.

http://tarheelblue.cstv.com/sports/m-ba ... 11aaa.html

Wow! Just Wow! Brutal year to have a lottery pick.

[moocow007]

How exactly has Kahn not put together a young team with potential?

Talent and potential are not always the same. Absolutely, the Wolves have a lot of talented young players. But do they really have potential as a team to develop into something special? Not so sure about that. As of right now they have no one on that team that I would say can really be a franchise level player for a top team. Beasley is talented and has always been talented but he's not the guy that's going to lead them to the promised land. Kevin Love is absolutely a machine but he's not a lead guy either (basically the Wolves version of David Lee...even if he is more skilled than Lee). The rest of the guys? Talented but not anyone that is really going to get most people warm and fuzzy. What they have is assets (young talent, capspace, etc) that other teams might covet and that, if Kahn does his job right, can get them that player who may be able to take them up the ladder. Can these guys? Possibly, but I wouldn't bet my house on it.

Michael Beasley: Played some pretty good ball this year being the only real scorer on the team. People here are calling him an inefficient scorer, yet he averaged good shooting % across the board. Former #2 overall pick and has good potential and was gotten for pennys on the dollar.

Talented but does anyone think that Beasley is going to evolve into anything for a serious team?

Kevin Love: One of the best young players in the league. Double Double machine.

Oh he's a machine on the boards and he can pass, but he doesn't defend nor can he carry the load scoring wise. He is a more talented David Lee but a superstar in the making? I don't think so. It's odd that when Lee was putting up all those numbers on bad Knick teams people were calling his numbers fake and saying it was padded...so why wouldn't at least some of that criticism carry over for Love? Does Love fall in love (pardon the pun) with the board so much so that he sacrifices defending his man to do it (like David Lee was accused of and often did)? Again, Love a greater talent than Lee skill wise but still...

Wayne Ellington: Sophmore player with upside. Good athletic defender who can shoot the 3 with ease.

Ellington is nothing special.

Johnny Flynn: So him getting injured and not living up to his hype is Kahn's fault? If i remember right, alot of fans here wanted Flynn pretty badly. Flynn has had injury woes, give him the offseason and some more time before labling him a bust please.

Wasn't the injury. Flynn's never been a real PG. Not even at Syracuse where his game was always more of a shoot first pass second style. What he is is a talented 6th man that can come in, up the tempo and score IF he's put into that role and accepts it. Super quick and have to love his fiery style of play but he was drafted too high especially considering who he already had drafted and signed. And yes, absolutely, I was saying that Flynn isn't a starting NBA PG (a Nate Robinson type 6th man with more self control is what I said he was) even before the draft when so many people on this board was clamoring for and hoping for him to be the Knicks starting PG for the next decade.

Wesley Johnson: Kid is going to be a beast, loved him @ syracuse. He is a rookie, give him a year or two as well. He has a lot of potential. Not so amazing rookie year...but HE IS A ROOKIE. And a no brainer pick @ the timberwolves position last season.

Sure he has potential and talent just like the rest of the Wolves roster but do they have the makings of a team that can get them beyond perpetual mediocrity? Not so sure about that.

p
Anthony Randolph: They got him for free pretty much. We all know his potential, and we seen what he can do in soem games this season. Is he going to be an allstar? Who knows, but the potential is still there.

And yet what is his position? Love isn't a C he's a PF. Beasley is a PF/SF combo forward. Wesley Johnson is a SF. Anthony Randolph is not likely to get any more room to become what he might become on that team. It's one thing to amass talent (Kahn's managed that) but he needs to do something with it in order for the Wolves to be taken seriously.

Nikola Pekovic: I dont know too much about him, but is a solid prospect. 7 footer from overseas.

He's a 6'10" stocky euro C that plays with toughness but that really isn't particularly quick nor skilled.

Anthony Toliver: Good young player, hasnt had much of an impact with the Wolves but he has played pretty well with Golden state. Good shooter, good rebounder. Another young prospect.

Toliver really isn't a prospect of any worth...at 27 years old he's a journeyman in the making.

Ricky Rubio: "The next nash" Although he hasnt played a single NBA game yet, he still has a ton of value based on his name/age alone. Going to be a solid player when its all said in done. Even if he doesnt come to Minny, he can be traded for value.

They (Kahn) needs to be realistic about Rubio. Whether Rubio does or doesn't want to play in Minny, who knows...but I'm assuming Kahn deep down knows. If the answer is "no, do not want" then what on earth is he holding onto him for? Deal him and move on ESPECIALLY if they land the 1st overall pick and take Irving. Rubio isn't a SG (as he's shown), drafting Irving to be a SG is stupid. So unless the plan is to have Rubio be the backup PG (you don't draft a backup PG with the 5th pick nor does it matter how "talented" your backup PG is...it's a waste is what it would be). If the answer is "yes, do want" then why on earth would you draft Irving if they had the 1st overall? BPA? Again if this was fantasy league or if you're just playing a game of collecting players then fine but the goal, last I checked, was to win. So if they do get 1, and plan on drafting Irving, Rubio needs to be on the next boat out of town so that whatever he can get back can actually make this team better (TEAM being the captive word).

There is a lot of youth on that team. They dont have a star yet, but they are young and have some potential players there. They have the best chance @ #1 and will draft Kyrie with that pick, or they will pick Kanter with the #2 pick. That team is in a better position then a lot of teams in the league. You cant expect them to be great in 1 or 2 years. Its a project over there. Its up to the Players to work hard and improve and as a team they will improve. They are one of the youngest teams in the league.

As far as players "working hard to improve". Beasley and Randolph (two of their more talented high upside guys) have never known to be "hard working". Love is a machine but may be flawed one dimensional machine. Drafting Irving is fine but Kahn needs to make some deals to kick start that franchise.