OT: Breaking News, ABC Cancels Roseanne!

[Clyde_Style]

As an Aussie, watching from afar, you guys voted for what you've ended up with? Is everybody washing there hands of the fact this guy was voted in? He was pretty clear on what he stood for, his past history is littered with examples of what sort of person he his, which is a pretty clear precursor for what his leadership would look like.

American has always had a very strong tradition of anti-intellectualism. This was never a particularly enlightened nation.

While you may still have the same ghosts as America in terms of your treatment of the indigenous population, Australia has evolved in ways America never has. We may both be nations founded by convicts and refugees, but your cultural strain of violence probably gets channeled into football hooliganism at worst whereas we've been seeding violence here from day one.

You banned guns. I can go outside and pick one off my gun tree for breakfast.

We're still dealing with 150 year old attitudes held by whites who have zero compassion for the fact that we stole tens of millions of Africans to be our slaves.

You've got your share of bigoted white crackers in Oz, but they don't hold the reins.

I'm embarrassed by my country.

Thank you for your thoughts, i'm trying to understand what's happening, it makes no sense to me.

I've been mad as hell and not taking it well for two long years. This is either the end of our civilization or a turning point that corrects deeply entrenched corruptions

The Trump world view is to lie about EVERYTHING, so when they say drain the swamp you can bet your life on it there isn't an honest bone in their bodies

Either our society exercises its rights granted to them as citizens of a democracy and throws these people out and hits the reset button or we'll get confirmation soon whether or the majority of Americans really is composed of a mix of bigots, facists or passive idiots or actual adults who respect the rule of law and who value their constitutional freedoms.

The irony is America is supposed to be the Land of the Free, but the MAGA trend is all about surrendering your freedoms to a big brother capitalist state with zero morals.

The Trump administration literally lost 1,500 children who were separated from their parents by their immigrant hit squads. 1,500 hundred kids LOST! WTF? Some of those kids are dead now or in child prostitution rings, but they are not accounted for. How does that even happen? These are seriously evil people we're dealing with here

[Dave DaButcher]

As an Aussie, watching from afar, you guys voted for what you've ended up with? Is everybody washing there hands of the fact this guy was voted in? He was pretty clear on what he stood for, his past history is littered with examples of what sort of person he his, which is a pretty clear precursor for what his leadership would look like.

No. He has a base that support what he does no matter what. I don't have the keystrokes to go into the variety of reasons why, but there are zillion articles on it. Basically a mixture of years of republican propaganda, dysfunctional government, populism, and good old fashioned racism. As Clyde alludes to, a lot of people also stake out pre-baked ideological positions and as crazy as it sounds, as the right of the USA has moved further right, a lot of otherwise seemingly "ok" people have adopted some weird tendencies. I mean, besides the truly honestly racist. And then there is a sizable chunk of the electorate that hated him in the primary and still do. I'm not sure what the size of the % of the country that was "on the fence" or "undecided". I can't imagine there's a large independent block waiting to make up their mind. I'd like to think he's lost some conservative support along the way, but it feels like very little. I'd assume that'll change if/when he's perp walked out of the white house with his sons, daughter and son in law.

Looks like Aussies have dealt with some unpopular guys too, though I'd guess how the PM is selected isn't exactly the same:
https://www.smh.com.au/politics/federal/the-three-australian-pms-who-were-even-more-unpopular-than-donald-trump-20180111-h0grlp.html

Good diagnosis. I would add that, despite all of the trends and reasons you note,Trump’s victory was also a consequence of the fact that too many millennials failed to show up to the polls (or threw their votes away on the Green candidate), having been persuaded that Hillary was nearly as bad.

Trump’s ascension is further the ultimate manifestation of a celebrity-obsessed culture, where experience and knowledge are viewed as negative attributes.

Trump is unfortunately not a phenomenon unique to the U.S. We are seeing manifestations of him in Brexit,Le Pen, and other nativist know-nothing movements across the globe. The danger.this represents to liberty both here and abroad is obvious.

Lastly, I would suggest that we get the leaders we deserve. Hence, Trump together with the Quislings in Congress sadly say more about us than him.

Still, we have faced greater challenges in the past, and I remain hopeful that we will awaken from our current national nightmare stronger on the other side of it. Then again, that kind of naive hopefulness has kept me a suffering Knicks fan for lo these many years...

[aq_ua]

Interesting how we're brainwashed, but when asked if you think it is ok to call black people monkeys we got no answer.

This is typical conduct for latent racism which is thriving under Trump whereby somebody tries to shame you for responding to racism, but they have no rationale for why the racist behavior itself is acceptable.

This constant attempt to shame people for being SJW is part of the playbook for normalizing institutionalized racism.

MEMO: And it is NOT working

People are fighting back, speaking up and saying NO how about we shame you back for trying to silence us for speaking up about overt bigotry?

Free speech is a bitch man, because it cuts both ways and when snowflakes try to shame you into silence, just throw it back in their faces because they don't have a Plan B. They just go silent, because they've got nothing to say unless they actually want to admit they think black people are monkeys. Which they won't do.

I don’t think people intentionally mean to do it (or at least reveal their true feelings) but its maaad weird how people are quick to defend bigotry, like we are jumping the gun for getting offended. What makes it worse is that you don’t see the same type of indignation for the bigotry itself.

The incredible lack of subtlety around free speech runs though much of this. It betrays intellectual laziness. It was on full display in the NFL thread.

I'm sure some people actually think Roseanne's tweets have some equivalency to kneeling and I don't even care any more to explain WTF they are not remotely similar.

This is the hot take era and once people form an opinion (or more likely adopt a pre-baked one), they don't revise them. They just repeat themselves even if you meticulously explain why their take on something puts them squarely in the wheelhouse of MAGA ideologies.

Some people can't handle being dissected by guys like me and they shut down instead of sucking up it and re-examining their assumptions. And I don't care, because if they are too lazy to think things through or they are snowflaking from being exposed then their intentional or unintentional, direct or indirect, support of fascist, racist BS means they're playing with a MAGA deck of cards even if their self-image is not racist or facist.

I do think we are also living in a schizoid age where people can play ball with their "black friends" and then go online and be a MAGA sympathizer. That's actually a form of psychosis that may be active in millions or tens of millions of people now. They may be functional humans in the conventional sense, but they are split in their social nature between the virtual and life on the streets.

I feel at least part of this post is directed at me so I will address is directly.

If anyone were to draw a parallel between kneeling and tweeting racist commentary, it's that private enterprises are meant to protect themselves from negative public perception and that they will do what they think is necessary to achieve said protection. That's sort of where the parallel ends.

In any case, the internet and the anonymity it provides has always been the bastion of the coward. However, the more media exposure racist attitudes get, the more empowered people feel to express their racist sentiment. The unfortunate part is, Trump hasn't created racists and bigots, they've always existed and continue to exist. He's just helped give them a voice.

There is a silver lining, though. Often times, a minority can seem like a very large number given a massive absolute population to begin with. 1% of the American population would still be over 3 million people. While you hypothesized "half" of the population as bigots, it takes a lot of energy and vitriol to spew hate. I doubt in reality that high a percentage of people have that sort of angst in them.

[HarthorneWingo]

ABC is a joke. You pull one of your most popular shows because they don't follow your social bias? God forbid someone has a different view than the brainwashed masses. Silence them immediately!!!! I don't even watch the show but this is wrong.

Social bias?

brainwashed masses?

Since when is it ok for any TV/comedy star to call African Americans "apes"? That's not a "social bias." That's being intolerant of blatant racism and hatred of black folk. Fck Roseanne and her damn show. I hope she ruined her career.

[Clyde_Style]

I don’t think people intentionally mean to do it (or at least reveal their true feelings) but its maaad weird how people are quick to defend bigotry, like we are jumping the gun for getting offended. What makes it worse is that you don’t see the same type of indignation for the bigotry itself.

The incredible lack of subtlety around free speech runs though much of this. It betrays intellectual laziness. It was on full display in the NFL thread.

I'm sure some people actually think Roseanne's tweets have some equivalency to kneeling and I don't even care any more to explain WTF they are not remotely similar.

This is the hot take era and once people form an opinion (or more likely adopt a pre-baked one), they don't revise them. They just repeat themselves even if you meticulously explain why their take on something puts them squarely in the wheelhouse of MAGA ideologies.

Some people can't handle being dissected by guys like me and they shut down instead of sucking up it and re-examining their assumptions. And I don't care, because if they are too lazy to think things through or they are snowflaking from being exposed then their intentional or unintentional, direct or indirect, support of fascist, racist BS means they're playing with a MAGA deck of cards even if their self-image is not racist or facist.

I do think we are also living in a schizoid age where people can play ball with their "black friends" and then go online and be a MAGA sympathizer. That's actually a form of psychosis that may be active in millions or tens of millions of people now. They may be functional humans in the conventional sense, but they are split in their social nature between the virtual and life on the streets.

I feel at least part of this post is directed at me so I will address is directly.

If anyone were to draw a parallel between kneeling and tweeting racist commentary, it's that private enterprises are meant to protect themselves from negative public perception and that they will do what they think is necessary to achieve said protection. That's sort of where the parallel ends.

In any case, the internet and the anonymity it provides has always been the bastion of the coward. However, the more media exposure racist attitudes get, the more empowered people feel to express their racist sentiment. The unfortunate part is, Trump hasn't created racists and bigots, they've always existed and continue to exist. He's just helped give them a voice.

There is a silver lining, though. Often times, a minority can seem like a very large number given a massive absolute population to begin with. 1% of the American population would still be over 3 million people. While you hypothesized "half" of the population as bigots, it takes a lot of energy and vitriol to spew hate. I doubt in reality that high a percentage of people have that sort of angst in them.

Actually, I did not have you in mind, but I put it to bed with you anyway AFAIK as I recall I was literally going to bed and said it's a wrap.

Yes, the web empowers cowards, no doubt.

Yes, the bigots have always been there.

But when you empower publicly you probably do breed new young uns who think its safe to be a **** who can engage in racist mob behavior when there is a pack of them together. So the encouragement breeds entitlement to act out and that rubs off on the kids in their custody.

It's more than 3M man. Don't kid yourself. We're deal with tens of millions of outright ass holes and tens of millions of more who passively support their behavior.

The magnification factor is real as you're saying and that was exploited by the evil genius of Putin's social media propaganda machine.
When you have a Black Lives account on FB with hundreds of thousands of followers run by Russian operative spreading lies targeted to land on white accounts, whatever latent seeds of racism exist in people get watered by forces they are not sophisticated enough to perceive as purely manipulative in nature.

I see it. You see it. TBH, even now most people don't. It is too easy to brainwash people and Putin succeeded beyond his wildest dreams because America's lazy intellectual traits were the perfect storm for evil technologists to exploit. People who never said anything overtly racist in their lives ended up hating Black Lives and it wasn't even Black Lives they were hating, but an impostor. That's sick and very true and people are still asleep about being taken for a ride.

As far as how many are online spewing, your numbers are probably close to reality. A few million is a lot of hate when combined with the bots and fake ads and false messaging on forums. There can be tens of millions who have vaguely defined forms of racism, but a few million chit posters can ruin a whole culture, I agree.

[Jeff Van Gully]

It has everything to do with being a Trump supporter, because she showed that when given a platform that requires at least a bit of emotional discipline and intellectual integrity you are not going to get that from a cosmic pizza, george soros hustling Trump supporting fool

And because the most rabid Trump supporters are just as brainwashed with toxic BS and lies, she was a test case for the normalization of Trump support at the highest rung of the entertainment media complex and the experiment failed with a giant thudding crash

So, no, it is not a singular incident that merely shows she is mentally ill and deranged. It is an indictment of the practice of giving a public bullhorn to Trump supporters who spread lies and have zero capacity for engaging in fact-based debates.

Roseanne is THE BASE and that Trump base has repeatedly been exposed as having a rotten racist heart at its core. This just a stake right into the heart of that kind of evil BS

And typical of racist MAGA types is the self-defense that they are not racist. Well, ask Wanda Sykes how that works, because you can be fine one day with your co-worker and then have to deal with these racist hatreds that are bubbling underneath the next. I'm sure Roseanne will try to defend her racism somehow. Or perhaps she'll say I'm sorry I was being racist. And that won't really change the core problem is that having a bad day at the office doesn't make you tweet that people are from the planet of the apes.

She's got issues that have everything to do with the same issues that all die hard Trump supporters have. If they don't say a black person is a monkey, they are perfectly OK with it being said. She has no filters and you don't let her become a spokesperson for the crap sentiments of the Trump base she wedded herself to. If she wants to self-destruct, let her do it on her own dime. You don't subsidize Trump spokespeople like that if you are a respectable media platform and that is exactly what she was

there are trump supporters everywhere. they don't all say things like this. roseanne's action got her show canceled, not her support of trump.

i live and work among trump supporters all the time. they're not my cup of tea. we don't hang or anything, but they also don't say things like what roseanne did in public. any who do would suffer the consequences.

as has been pointed out, there are trump supporters bankrolling abc right now. progressive-ass abc with the black female network president and mad shonda rimes shows keeping the lights on. they're not tweeting racist things though.

You're being very compartmentalized about this. That trait is what allows good people to tacitly accept insidious support of toxic lies until it is too late to fight back. Like I said, those people you work with that you are tolerating because you probably don't have a choice as it is your livelihood are perfectly OK with the monkey talk whether they say it themselves or not.

This nation is full of closet racists and Trump is so obscenely racist that supporting him now can no longer be compartmentalized as liking some things without being a racist. You are what you eat and your beliefs are what you support.

If Trump were not a fascist and a racist then there'd be some grey areas left to allow for people to support someone they don't fully abide by, but this administration has scorched the earth of the body politic and forced people to take sides.

Saying Roseanne's statements got her fired is true. Saying it has nothing to do with being a MAGA POS person is completely false. They are inextricably entwined and compartmentalizing the truth does not explain this one bit.

i agree 100%. i'm a black man. i took a HARD line and went in on all my white friends. challenged them that they had the luxury to roll with racism as a secondary or tertiary issue when i have no such luxury. no one took me up on that olive branch and i drew lines.

i make no excuses for any trump supporter. my only point is that roseanne's support of trump is not what got her canned... not that it should or should not have been. if she said that and voted for obama twice she'd be just as cooked.

[Clyde_Style]

there are trump supporters everywhere. they don't all say things like this. roseanne's action got her show canceled, not her support of trump.

i live and work among trump supporters all the time. they're not my cup of tea. we don't hang or anything, but they also don't say things like what roseanne did in public. any who do would suffer the consequences.

as has been pointed out, there are trump supporters bankrolling abc right now. progressive-ass abc with the black female network president and mad shonda rimes shows keeping the lights on. they're not tweeting racist things though.

You're being very compartmentalized about this. That trait is what allows good people to tacitly accept insidious support of toxic lies until it is too late to fight back. Like I said, those people you work with that you are tolerating because you probably don't have a choice as it is your livelihood are perfectly OK with the monkey talk whether they say it themselves or not.

This nation is full of closet racists and Trump is so obscenely racist that supporting him now can no longer be compartmentalized as liking some things without being a racist. You are what you eat and your beliefs are what you support.

If Trump were not a fascist and a racist then there'd be some grey areas left to allow for people to support someone they don't fully abide by, but this administration has scorched the earth of the body politic and forced people to take sides.

Saying Roseanne's statements got her fired is true. Saying it has nothing to do with being a MAGA POS person is completely false. They are inextricably entwined and compartmentalizing the truth does not explain this one bit.

i agree 100%. i'm a black man. i took a HARD line and went in on all my white friends. challenged them that they had the luxury to roll with racism as a secondary or tertiary issue when i have no such luxury. no one took me up on that olive branch and i drew lines.

i make no excuses for any trump supporter. my only point is that roseanne's support of trump is not what got her canned... not that it should or should not have been. if she said that and voted for obama twice she'd be just as cooked.

Understood.

Glad you took a stand. It is kind of terrible experience to have to go through I'm sure, but in your case you felt it was necessary.

I don't see any middle ground any longer. MAGA world depends on people being "normal" which = non-confrontational. That allows the disease to infect and spread.

You get it

[Clyde_Style]

Polk, at least man up and answer people.

Do you think it is OK for her to call African-Americans monkeys?

If you can't answer that, then you have no business showing up and calling people brainwashed.

When I say someone is brainwashed I use specific examples of how that brainwashing occurs. Can you?

[Jeff Van Gully]

Social bias?

brainwashed masses?

Since when is it ok for any TV/comedy star to call African Americans "apes"? That's not a "social bias." That's being intolerant of blatant racism and hatred of black folk. Fck Roseanne and her damn show. I hope she ruined her career.

Just don’t. It’s not worth wasting brain cells on those who can’t understand why calling a black woman an ape would get someone fired.

[Clyde_Style]

brainwashed masses?

Since when is it ok for any TV/comedy star to call African Americans "apes"? That's not a "social bias." That's being intolerant of blatant racism and hatred of black folk. Fck Roseanne and her damn show. I hope she ruined her career.

Just don’t. It’s not worth wasting brain cells on those who can’t understand why calling a black woman an ape would get someone fired.

In my heart, I agree, because I do feel like it is an emotional drain and you won't convince people to change unless they want to.

But I think speaking up matters these days so sometimes you have to slap people around. As far as expecting them to change it doesn't matter, but they need to be made to understood there are consequences to their actions including defending the bigots.

[Clyde_Style]

P.S. The reason we speak up now is to resist the normalization of bigotry

Everyone should speak up when something occurs that they know they can address themselves

This is how we bring the goalposts back on to the playing field where they belong

and say

THIS IS WHERE THE CENTER OF THE FIELD TRULY LIES

[Oscirus]

Read on Twitter

?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw&ref_url=http%3A%2F%2Fvariety.com%2F%3Fp%3D1202824991

that should be interesting.

[RHODEY]

Read on Twitter

?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw&ref_url=http%3A%2F%2Fvariety.com%2F%3Fp%3D1202824991

that should be interesting.

I have as much interest in watching that as I had watching Kramer "apologize" for telling me what he really thinks of people who look like me.

[Anotha Knicks fan]

Wanted to post, but I don't think there's anything I can add that either Wingy or Clyde hasn't already succinctly dressed down. Thanks.

Just disgusting. Deplorable.

As a side note, all these disgusting people being aired out... where is this all going? Feels good to see people for who they really are, but at the same time it's disgusting to see so much filth running rampant. Have things gotten worse? Just makes me feel **** inside, not necessarily for this pos, but some personalities I've looked up to for different reasons. Idk... just losing taste for it all.

[Clyde_Style]

Wanted to post, but I don't think there's anything I can add that either Wingy or Clyde hasn't already succinctly dressed down. Thanks.

Just disgusting. Deplorable.

As a side note, all these disgusting people being aired out... where is this all going? Feels good to see people for who they really are, but at the same time it's disgusting to see so much filth running rampant. Have things gotten worse? Just makes me feel **** inside, not necessarily for this pos, but some personalities I've looked up to for different reasons. Idk... just losing taste for it all.

It's tough seeing people you respected fall like this. Could go on for a while

[WajaBawl]

As a Dane, I commend you guys for speaking out like you've done in this thread. I can only imagine how frustrating it must be to watch your country fall apart like it has done these past years. Although despicable, this has been very interesting to follow, and discourse like this gets lost in the Twittersphere.

Hang in there. It's good to know that there are at least some people out there who have their heads screwed on straight.

[NYKAL]

im assuming this is because she went on live tv to expose the mk ultra going on in hollywood.

Are you suggesting she was crucified for taking a heroic stand against the injustices perpetrated by deep state operatives?

i wish i can put it as eloquently as you just did clyde

+1 I've been just lurking and giving And1's because they have been saying everything I would like to say....they've just said it MUCH better

[NYKAL]

As an Aussie, watching from afar, you guys voted for what you've ended up with? Is everybody washing there hands of the fact this guy was voted in? He was pretty clear on what he stood for, his past history is littered with examples of what sort of person he his, which is a pretty clear precursor for what his leadership would look like.

unless I'm mistaken he DID NOT win the popular vote which comprises us little guy who go to the voting booths. The Electoral College gave him the W.

[F N 11]

It would be bigger news if they said they are cancelling South Park.

[Dave DaButcher]

This morning, Roseanne Barr blames her disgusting racist tweet on Ambien. To which, Sanofi, the drug’s manufacturer, responds:

Read on Twitter

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