Felton traded to Knicks; Not matching Lin? (part 2)

[EchelonNYK]

I'm out of here for a few hours. Stay up Knicks fans.

[[GR]]

I dont understand how some posters are ok with this, and still have a great outlook on next season. Crushing the East? Really? How so? What are we doing that improves our position from last year? How many games did we win against the heat in the playoffs again?

?

Kidd, Felton > Bibby, Baron, Douglas
Camby, Thomas > Jorts, Jeffries


Regardless of the Lin situation, the Knicks improved.

I don't think the comparison is that clear cut. the distinction between the second comparison is minute, and you left out lin in the first comparison. dont know if that was by design.

I'm assuming Lin isn't back in this discussion. Felton and Kidd, are still miles better than what we had.


And the second part is a very big difference. Jeffires was not a good on ball defender versus big men, he couldn't protect the rim, nor was he a good rebounder. Camby is better all around.

[Knicks80_20]

So what really have the Knicks done this offseason? They're bringing back the same team that got destroyed by the Heat, that was 7 games under .500 before Lin took over. Like Kidd, Camby, and Felton added to that roster is going to be good enough to make it a championship contender, especially with Shump out for months? Lin was their only chance and they're giving it away. They're giving it away.

The Heat have added assets, the Nets have added assets, and the Lakers now have a top 5 PG, a top 2 SG, and either the best or second best center in the league depending on how the Howard trade talks go.

Meanwhile, we've acquired a 40 year point guard, a near 40 year old backup center, and literally the fattest guard in the league who's been absolute s*** the past two season.

All you Lin bashers are smug now, but if you're really celebrating this move, you really have question whether you have animosities against Lin that run deeper than what you're letting on.

[Falstaffxx]

So what really have the Knicks done this offseason? They're bringing back the same team that got destroyed by the Heat, that was 7 games under .500 before Lin took over. Like Kidd, Camby, and Felton added to that roster is going to be good enough to make it a championship contender, especially with Shump out for months? Lin was their only chance and they're giving it away. They're giving it away.

WOW

Isn't that what what some of us said in the Kidd thread (minus that Lin nonsense).

Bringing Kidd to back up Lin has a whole different flavor than bringing him in to backup Felton.

[Fury]

So let me get this straight, we're going to depend on a player who is always out of shape and a 40 year old guy? Oh man.

We're matching.

[ORANGEandBLUE]

[

There's a very good chance Shumpert will be a better player than Lin during the course of a 3 year contract. Neither of them deserve a ridiculous contract. Maybe in a few years, but not right now.

If we lose Shump, it'll be because other teams are willing to pay him more than us. I don't see how you can call a player's market price ridiculous.

[Mr_Perfect]

So what really have the Knicks done this offseason? They're bringing back the same team that got destroyed by the Heat, that was 7 games under .500 before Lin took over. Like Kidd, Camby, and Felton added to that roster is going to be good enough to make it a championship contender, especially with Shump out for months? Lin was their only chance and they're giving it away. They're giving it away.

Even though your username is awful, I agree with this post.

[Falstaffxx]

So what really have the Knicks done this offseason? They're bringing back the same team that got destroyed by the Heat, that was 7 games under .500 before Lin took over. Like Kidd, Camby, and Felton added to that roster is going to be good enough to make it a championship contender, especially with Shump out for months? Lin was their only chance and they're giving it away. They're giving it away.

The Heat have added assets, the Nets have added assets, and the Lakers now have a top 5 PG, a top 2 SG, and either the best or second best center in the league depending on how the Howard trade talks go.

Meanwhile, we've acquired a 40 year point guard, a near 40 year old backup center, and literally the fattest guard in the league who's been absolute s*** the past two season.

All you Lin bashers are smug now, but if you're really celebrating this move, you really have question whether you have animosities against Lin that run deeper than what you're letting on.

Yup.

[Never Wrong]

I will be highly upset if we dont sign lin..but u have to think we will just for the fact that the Nets are moving to Brooklynn...and we are going to need fan support and Lin brings that....Every body needs to realize we needed a shooting guard and Felton and Kidd could play the 2.I make rather have to passers in the backcourt to make our front court as dominate as it should of been last year...Just picture to players in the back court that p/r with Amare and Tyson.I think its just what this team needs.

TBH, it's the perfect storm for BK. There has never been another option before. So during the dark ages of Isiah (and Layden as well really), there were no other real options. This will be the spark BK needs to take off. And it isn't even just the Lin thing (though it's most probably the breaking point for anyone that will jump ship). Many have soured on this organization for quite some time. I think this might push them over the edge.

[CoolKids]

Smh. You Melo fans are celebrating the departure of Lin as if both you and Melo have gained something from it. You haven't, and you know it. I'm a Melo fan too, but I fail to see how this is going to help us at all. But go ahead. Be smug.

who is celebrating anything?

[CoolKids]

So what really have the Knicks done this offseason? They're bringing back the same team that got destroyed by the Heat, that was 7 games under .500 before Lin took over. Like Kidd, Camby, and Felton added to that roster is going to be good enough to make it a championship contender, especially with Shump out for months? Lin was their only chance and they're giving it away. They're giving it away.

Yes. The Knicks brought in some decent backups. That's all they've done. And they've lost Lin, Fields, Jeffries, and Harrelson. We haven't gotten better. And with Shumpert out for over half the year...yeah, this isn't looking good at all.

[Falstaffxx]

I will be highly upset if we dont sign lin..but u have to think we will just for the fact that the Nets are moving to Brooklynn...and we are going to need fan support and Lin brings that....Every body needs to realize we needed a shooting guard and Felton and Kidd could play the 2.I make rather have to passers in the backcourt to make our front court as dominate as it should of been last year...Just picture to players in the back court that p/r with Amare and Tyson.I think its just what this team needs.

TBH, it's the perfect storm for BK. There has never been another option before. So during the dark ages of Isiah (and Layden as well really), there were no other real options. This will be the spark BK needs to take off. And it isn't even just the Lin thing (though it's most probably the breaking point for anyone that will jump ship). Many have soured on this organization for quite some time. I think this might push them over the edge.

Oh yeah, "picturing Felton and Kidd" as our back-court definitely makes me forget about Lin.

[king billing]

If Lin turns into a all -star (which he almost did last season) i'm going to think long and hard about if want to continue watching the NBA..not just the Knicks, but the entire league.

Lin will be an all-star but I do not know if his play will be at an all-star level......We will see.

He will be voted into the all star game (you can cast a ballot from China) but he won't be at an all-star level

[boomann21]

Ok I made it. I know I'm late, but WHAT THE HELL IS HAPPENING? Are we trying to field a Knick reunion? Why Raymond Felton? Is he best friends with Stoudemire now?

I'm so confused. Not about the Knicks getting Lin back becaue I know that's happenig wiihtout a shadow of a doubt. But why Raymond Felton? I have no faith in his game and don't want him apart of the Bench Mob. I wanted Delonte West or Ronnie Brewer. The last person I wanted to replace the all worldly Baron Davis was Raymond Felton. I boo this move.

Well except the part where we got Kurt Thomas. I think I'll go watch my tapes of the 1999 eastern confernece finals tonight.

[BrOnXKing1]

So let me get this straight, we're going to depend on a player who is always out of shape and a 40 year old guy? Oh man.

We're matching.

We're not matching....Every insider is saying its over, Knicks are not matching!

[SelbyCobra]

the total money shelled out will even out to be 8/mil a year on average, though, which is the point. he could very well be worth that; a borderline all-star pg certainly would, and i'd say there's at least a 30-40% chance of that kind of upside.

If you're going to talk "total money shelled out" then the actual number for the contract could be as high as 3 years, $40+ million with the luxury tax, which is the point.

On average that's $13+ million per year.

You not that good at logic huh?
Every single player contributes to the luxury tax.

Redo your math.

No need. We're talking about a decision about the last tack on here, like Armando Galarraga losing his perfect game on a blown call on what would have been the final out of the game. If it had happened in the 7th, then it's a much more difficult argument, but when it's pretty much the last one on the heap and the debate is whether or not to match it, it's not a stretch to consider the play or contract in isolation.

[Falstaffxx]

Yes that's hilarious, but bringing in Kidd/Felton/Camby are game changers.

[ORANGEandBLUE]

Smh. You Melo fans are celebrating the departure of Lin as if both you and Melo have gained something from it. You haven't, and you know it. I'm a Melo fan too, but I fail to see how this is going to help us at all. But go ahead. Be smug.

who is celebrating anything?

Some people are just saying it's ridiculous how much people are overreacting. That's fine.

Others are literally saying they support the decision to not match Lin. That is just indefensible. Even if you care about the team's finances, it doesn't make sense to want Lin out. Financially the right move would have been letting Novak walk.

[CoolKids]

So what really have the Knicks done this offseason? They're bringing back the same team that got destroyed by the Heat, that was 7 games under .500 before Lin took over. Like Kidd, Camby, and Felton added to that roster is going to be good enough to make it a championship contender, especially with Shump out for months? Lin was their only chance and they're giving it away. They're giving it away.

The Heat have added assets, the Nets have added assets, and the Lakers now have a top 5 PG, a top 2 SG, and either the best or second best center in the league depending on how the Howard trade talks go.

Meanwhile, we've acquired a 40 year point guard, a near 40 year old backup center, and literally the fattest guard in the league who's been absolute s*** the past two season.

All you Lin bashers are smug now, but if you're really celebrating this move, you really have question whether you have animosities against Lin that run deeper than what you're letting on.

The heat added an ancient sg and a 32 year old who plays like a 60 year old. Lewis has nothing left in the tank. THe nets added 3 of the worst contracts in the league (johnson wallace blowpez) I would hardly consider those assets.

[stevieg987]

People are saying he only played 25 games but his 25 games were overall exceptional. Knicks fans realize that. That's why the message board is blowing up here and houston fans are somewhat lukewarm about him coming. We know what kind of player he is and they will find out.

Really, is this really about money or did Lin's camp do something to Dolan to piss him off. I am hoping that Dolan will come to his senses by Tuesday.

A Cav's fan on draft night:

Are YOU KIDDING ME? We drafted KYRIE IRVING? NOOOO. The guy played like 5 games in college. And now he's got a 25 million dollar contract! What!?!

Enough with this "he only played 25 games bull"-- he's signing for 25 million, not 100 million. This is a league where Jeff Green-- a player who is both mediocre and just missed an entire season because of a heart condition--gets rewarded with a 40 million dollar contract.

Lin is getting paid solid starter money, and has the potential to become a top tier starter, it's really not a ridiculous contract at all. If anything 8 a year is pretty solid. Look at it from this perspective, we get him underpaid the first two years, and then we potentially overpay for the last year. But we also ensure we have the player for the duration of his NBA career.

I'm not even kidding, I think Lin's contract would be the best one we'd hand out this off-season. Because, personally, I'm not a fan of trading away assets to sign corpses to three year deals. Or negative-sum players to deals (JR). Or overpay one trick ponies (Novak). I think deals that actually have upside are the way to go when you're filling the holes of a team that's won only one playoff game in a decade. But hey, maybe that's just me.