Melo Thread #????? - Update PG 58 - 4-way scenarios explored (In Georgia?)

[moocow007]

Melo was always an old school lead scorer, a finisher, but he couldn't be the team's alpha personality and lead the team to a title, or even a deep playoff run. Now he would be fortunate to go to a team like Houston or Cleveland to compete for a title because there are true alphas on those teams and he can settle into the old gunner role to pour it in. He would do well in that capacity even turning a series or something like that.

But I thought he was LeBron James? That's why so many guys hate him so much, no?

But yes, you are correct. It's amazing though why people can't seem to grasp it.

Just like Bernard King couldn't pull a LeBron, why Dominique couldn't pull a LeBron, Pete Maravich couldn't, Clyde Drexler couldn't, George Gervin couldn't, etc...etc... They simply did not have the all around games to be able to lead sub par casts to anything serious. And you can probably argue that Carmelo isn't even on par with those guys (as I'm sure the unreasonable folk will immediately say).

Expectations were always unrealistic.

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[VirginiaKnickFan]

"
NYK < Melo, C. Lee
NYK > J. Lin, M. Harkless, POR '19 1st rnd, HOU '21 1st rnd

HOU < R. Anderson, E. Gordon, Z. Qi
HOU > Melo, C. Lee

POR < A. Crabbe, M. Leonard, M. Harkless, '19 1st rnd
POR > R. Anderson, E. Gordon, Q. Acy

BKN < J. Lin, Q. Acy
BKN > A. Crabbe, M. Leonard, Z. Qi, HOU '19 1st rnd, HOU future 2nd
"

Who says no?


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[moocow007]

"
NYK < Melo, C. Lee
NYK > J. Lin, M. Harkless, POR '19 1st rnd, HOU '21 1st rnd

HOU < R. Anderson, E. Gordon, Z. Qi
HOU > Melo, C. Lee

POR < A. Crabbe, M. Leonard, M. Harkless, '19 1st rnd
POR > R. Anderson, E. Gordon, Q. Acy

BKN < J. Lin, Q. Acy
BKN > A. Crabbe, M. Leonard, Z. Qi, HOU '19 1st rnd, HOU future 2nd
"

Who says no?


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Can't see the Nets doing this. At this point they can probably just sign KCP to the same deal Crabbe has (maybe even cheaper now that most of the suckers have spent their cap space and KCP may not have a market). I'm not sure that Zhu Qi and a bottom of the barrel 1st and 2nd is worth the drastic gap between Lin and Meyers Leonard (who is really a liability with his suckitude and big contract). The Nets are looking for youth and they are looking to acquire assets but it's good youth they are looking for (so Meyers Leonard doesn't qualify) and the assets are projected to be marginalizing at best. Lin has a good deal of value especially for them f rt of a lot of angles. He's productive, he's cheap and he's brings his own fans (still) into an otherwise barren arena.



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[NotPhilJackson]

"
NYK < Melo, C. Lee
NYK > J. Lin, M. Harkless, POR '19 1st rnd, HOU '21 1st rnd

HOU < R. Anderson, E. Gordon, Z. Qi
HOU > Melo, C. Lee

POR < A. Crabbe, M. Leonard, M. Harkless, '19 1st rnd
POR > R. Anderson, E. Gordon, Q. Acy

BKN < J. Lin, Q. Acy
BKN > A. Crabbe, M. Leonard, Z. Qi, HOU '19 1st rnd, HOU future 2nd
"

Who says no?


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Lol! But why is HOU saying no? They are in WIN-NOW mode & are receiving major upgrades on better contracts. They gotta pony up if they want this deal to go down!

[Dr. Detfink]

I mean, why do the Rockets have to deal for Melo now? They are coming off a tremendous season. They added the best point guard in the market. Morey, a shady GM who likes prostate massagers almost as much as playing ping pong with little Asian boys, knows how to get the assets to make any deal happen. He's notorious for giving the Knicks a dirty sanchez a number of times: Maurice Taylor, Marcus Camby. So why not try again after Steve Mills pulled an Isiah and Mismanaged the cap?

Ultimately this is going to lead to Melo starting the season as a Knicks and more problems as Hardaway Jr, Melo, and KP will struggle with ball distribution (this happens without an experienced PG) and make Mills more desperate...

My worry, the Knicks tend to panic and sell off their assets prematurely.

[seren]

Melo was always an old school lead scorer, a finisher, but he couldn't be the team's alpha personality and lead the team to a title, or even a deep playoff run. Now he would be fortunate to go to a team like Houston or Cleveland to compete for a title because there are true alphas on those teams and he can settle into the old gunner role to pour it in. He would do well in that capacity even turning a series or something like that.

But I thought he was LeBron James? That's why so many guys hate him so much, no?

But yes, you are correct. It's amazing though why people can't seem to grasp it.

Just like Bernard King couldn't pull a LeBron, why Dominique couldn't pull a LeBron, Pete Maravich couldn't, Clyde Drexler couldn't, George Gervin couldn't, etc...etc... They simply did not have the all around games to be able to lead sub par casts to anything serious. And you can probably argue that Carmelo isn't even on par with those guys (as I'm sure the unreasonable folk will immediately say).

Expectations were always unrealistic.

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I don't really "hate" Melo but I always had concerns about him. It is not fan expectations that are the problem when it comes to Melo. It is the front office. If you don't believe Melo is at Lebron level, why dedicate so many resources to get him? Why accept all his demands from coach changes and personnel moves? We could have had some sustainable success similar to Atlanta or Melo era Denver level if we simply did not give in Melo's demands and instead force him to follow orders.

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[DOT]

[HEZI]

Melo was always an old school lead scorer, a finisher, but he couldn't be the team's alpha personality and lead the team to a title, or even a deep playoff run. Now he would be fortunate to go to a team like Houston or Cleveland to compete for a title because there are true alphas on those teams and he can settle into the old gunner role to pour it in. He would do well in that capacity even turning a series or something like that.

But I thought he was LeBron James? That's why so many guys hate him so much, no?

But yes, you are correct. It's amazing though why people can't seem to grasp it.

Just like Bernard King couldn't pull a LeBron, why Dominique couldn't pull a LeBron, Pete Maravich couldn't, Clyde Drexler couldn't, George Gervin couldn't, etc...etc... They simply did not have the all around games to be able to lead sub par casts to anything serious. And you can probably argue that Carmelo isn't even on par with those guys (as I'm sure the unreasonable folk will immediately say).

Expectations were always unrealistic.

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He doesn't have to be Lebron for the Knicks to make the playoffs. They won 31 games last year. The freakin Detroit Pistons won 37 games and who do they have? The Orlando Magic won 29 games and just look at that team. If he is as good as some people think, there is no excuse for not making the playoffs in the weak East, even as a 7th or 8th seed. The Knicks weren't even close. Everybody knows he's not Lebron James but his value is not even Kevin Love right now, which says all you need to know.

[moocow007]

Melo was always an old school lead scorer, a finisher, but he couldn't be the team's alpha personality and lead the team to a title, or even a deep playoff run. Now he would be fortunate to go to a team like Houston or Cleveland to compete for a title because there are true alphas on those teams and he can settle into the old gunner role to pour it in. He would do well in that capacity even turning a series or something like that.

But I thought he was LeBron James? That's why so many guys hate him so much, no?

But yes, you are correct. It's amazing though why people can't seem to grasp it.

Just like Bernard King couldn't pull a LeBron, why Dominique couldn't pull a LeBron, Pete Maravich couldn't, Clyde Drexler couldn't, George Gervin couldn't, etc...etc... They simply did not have the all around games to be able to lead sub par casts to anything serious. And you can probably argue that Carmelo isn't even on par with those guys (as I'm sure the unreasonable folk will immediately say).

Expectations were always unrealistic.

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I don't really "hate" Melo but I always had concerns about him. It is not fan expectations that are the problem when it comes to Melo. It is the front office. If you don't believe Melo is at Lebron level, why dedicate so many resources to get him? Why accept all his demands from coach changes and personnel moves? We could have had some sustainable success similar to Atlanta or Melo era Denver level if we simply did not give in Melo's demands and instead force him to follow orders.

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That's why I've said all along the angst is directed at the wrong party. The Knicks front office (and Dolan) should be receiving the bulk of the angst. Anthony is what he is, is what he's always been. If Anthony was the GM then absolutely I'd be ripping him to shreds. But he's not. He didn't trade for himself. He didn't put crap around him. If folks believe that a guy like Anthony can actually convince the front office to trade for him then...again...the problem is the front office...not Anthony. Same way that silly Hardaway contract, the Alan Houston contract, etc, etc...we're neither Hardaway nor Houston faults and they shouldn't be blamed for it.

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[Kampuchea]

players in the NBA generally dont rag on other people's contracts


Except when its a "minority" dude who stole everyone's thunder.

Yes, I always felt there was some racist undertones to what was going on with Lin. I cringed when they used to do that racist bow after he made a good play, and happy when the backlash forced them to stop doing it.

They kept it up by not wanting him to get the contract, which was no doubt influenced by race as well.

I suspect they are not even aware of it, it is just something they did without realizing what their underlying subconscious motives were.

[Knox]

But I thought he was LeBron James? That's why so many guys hate him so much, no?

But yes, you are correct. It's amazing though why people can't seem to grasp it.

Just like Bernard King couldn't pull a LeBron, why Dominique couldn't pull a LeBron, Pete Maravich couldn't, Clyde Drexler couldn't, George Gervin couldn't, etc...etc... They simply did not have the all around games to be able to lead sub par casts to anything serious. And you can probably argue that Carmelo isn't even on par with those guys (as I'm sure the unreasonable folk will immediately say).

Expectations were always unrealistic.

Sent from my SM-T377T using RealGM mobile app

I don't really "hate" Melo but I always had concerns about him. It is not fan expectations that are the problem when it comes to Melo. It is the front office. If you don't believe Melo is at Lebron level, why dedicate so many resources to get him? Why accept all his demands from coach changes and personnel moves? We could have had some sustainable success similar to Atlanta or Melo era Denver level if we simply did not give in Melo's demands and instead force him to follow orders.

Sent from my XT1575 using RealGM mobile app

That's why I've said all along the angst is directed at the wrong party. The Knicks front office (and Dolan) should be receiving the bulk of the angst. Anthony is what he is, is what he's always been. If Anthony was the GM then absolutely I'd be ripping him to shreds. But he's not. He didn't trade for himself. He didn't put crap around him. If folks believe that a guy like Anthony can actually convince the front office to trade for him then...again...the problem is the front office...not Anthony. Same way that silly Hardaway contract, the Alan Houston contract, etc, etc...we're neither Hardaway nor Houston faults and they shouldn't be blamed for it.

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Nobody wants to come and play for Dolan .... I honestly believe this Melo thing will have a terrible fallout. Truth is the Knicks dropped the ball picking him up. They dropped the ball even more by not having a game plan to put talent around him to succeed. We can't even get a real GM to come to the roster. I think this is a new low for the Knicks . I have been through all of the lows so maybe I am just negative when it comes to the Knicks these days. I feel we have to right everything within the next to years in order to keep Porzingis. I have a feeling he will walk

[god shammgod]

i had this thread poppin last night and you all ruined it. it's stale as hell now. you don't deserve me.

[NotPhilJackson]

"
NYK < Melo, C. Lee
NYK > J. Lin, M. Harkless, POR '19 1st rnd, HOU '21 1st rnd

HOU < R. Anderson, E. Gordon, Z. Qi
HOU > Melo, C. Lee

POR < A. Crabbe, M. Leonard, M. Harkless, '19 1st rnd
POR > R. Anderson, E. Gordon, Q. Acy

BKN < J. Lin, Q. Acy
BKN > A. Crabbe, M. Leonard, Z. Qi, HOU '19 1st rnd, HOU future 2nd
"

Who says no?


Sent from my iPhone using RealGM Forums

Can't see the Nets doing this. At this point they can probably just sign KCP to the same deal Crabbe has (maybe even cheaper now that most of the suckers have spent their cap space and KCP may not have a market). I'm not sure that Zhu Qi and a bottom of the barrel 1st and 2nd is worth the drastic gap between Lin and Meyers Leonard (who is really a liability with his suckitude and big contract). The Nets are looking for youth and they are looking to acquire assets but it's good youth they are looking for (so Meyers Leonard doesn't qualify) and the assets are projected to be marginalizing at best. Lin has a good deal of value especially for them f rt of a lot of angles. He's productive, he's cheap and he's brings his own fans (still) into an otherwise barren arena.



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Good point. Just think Qi, 1st and 2nd is worth the contracts. Especially considering they were going for Crabbe anyway & they dont need a starting PG in Lin now that they have Russ. Bottom of the barrel first is still a first. I see Houston's hesitation here more than anything because Morey is a prick and doesn't want to conduct fair trades. Melo & Lee are worth 2 1st round picks at the very least, HOU gotta stop being a bunch of hoes and pull the trigger.

[Huey Freeman]

It wouldn't be the worst thing in the world if Anthony came back.... just opted out of his contract next summer.

I agree with one caveat...keep Melo if we can get his friend Rondo here. I would think that a PG like DRose was not what Melo wanted AT ALL (he would never say it though). Melo doesn't need a PG that isn't "heady" (I'm trying to be pc here).

If the Knicks can somehow get Rondo and he is guiding/talking/grooming Frank during the game; KP get increased touches and ups his scoring a little; then keeping Melo for one last season isn't that bad. I just cannot see Melo NOT opting-out after next season under any circumstances. Mills just has to be responsible and not entertain any notion of giving in to accepting Andersen under any circumstances AND we absolutely need a pick.

Management has already made it clear that they are not looking to "tank", so there's no reason why we shouldn't hold our ground in any trade negotiations - and not simply take back the junk that Cleveland or Houston are offering.

As long as Mills has a backbone and conviction, we will be fine.
IMHO...ultimately Houston needs this deal more than NYK. Even with CP3, they are not beating GSW.
I see Houston, as currently constructed, will not increase their win total next season. OKC got better; Minny got better; and SAS is SAS. Not that those will be better than HOU but they closed the gap. HOU is going to get desperate if they don't win out of the gate.

[Wolfgang630]

Some peeps ready for Linsanity 2.0.

[newyorker4ever]

Why does Houston want Melo so much? His uptempo days may be over.

I know he didn't have a good playoffs but Anderson was still capable of destroying us lol.

because he's one of the most effective and clutch catch and shoot players in the league and he's got a post game and ISO game that can be relied on

he's almost never had real playmakers. In denver he had a couple and they won. often.
in Houston he would have

This.

'Melo can still be devastating as the 2nd/3rd option on a good team. In Houston, he would be motivated to show everyone he's still a top NBA talent (which he is). They will convince him to play mostly PF and he will thrive in that role because most of the guys defending him will be just a step too slow to be able to contest him consistently well.

You all will see. Whenever 'Melo had a legit PG finding him in rhythm. 'Melo needs to mix up his offense to be most effective. A few isos, a few open three's on the break, and a few pick and pop quick hits. Then he gets the occasional offensive put-back and dive to the hole. When motivated and feasting, 'Melo will rebound and defend better, especially at the 4 spot.

Since the year we had Kidd and won 54 games, 'Melo has been underachieving and hasn't been motivated. He's got 2-3 very good years left in Houston, barring injury. You all will see.

We won't regret trading him because we're on diverging paths, but we will realize, once again, how terrible our front office has been since 'Melo has arrived in maximizing his talents.

Enough with the "you all will see" when most of us agree with what you're saying but we just don't see the fit for him with us anymore is all. Everyone knows and has always said Melo is always better when he has a legit PG so no secret there. Everyone knows Melo's best position these days are PF and he'll be a step faster then most PF's in the league. I'm not sure everyone thinks he can still be a really good player for another 3 years but i definitely do and think we'll see the best Melo we've seen in a while if he can get to a legit team that he's the 3rd option on. He's also gonna wanna throw a big F U at anyone in New York that's been doubting him so he's gonna by a much more energized Melo for that reason and whoever gets him will instantly become a much better team. Shyt we'll probably even see a much more improved Melo on defense as well.

[moocow007]

I mean, why do the Rockets have to deal for Melo now? They are coming off a tremendous season. They added the best point guard in the market. Morey, a shady GM who likes prostate massagers almost as much as playing ping pong with little Asian boys, knows how to get the assets to make any deal happen. He's notorious for giving the Knicks a dirty sanchez a number of times: Maurice Taylor, Marcus Camby. So why not try again after Steve Mills pulled an Isiah and Mismanaged the cap?

Ultimately this is going to lead to Melo starting the season as a Knicks and more problems as Hardaway Jr, Melo, and KP will struggle with ball distribution (this happens without an experienced PG) and make Mills more desperate...

My worry, the Knicks tend to panic and sell off their assets prematurely.

Yeah. I mentioned something similar. In a battle of wits between Morey and Mills it could get ugly for the Knicks. I would not be surprised if Morey has something up his sleeve.

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[Huey Freeman]

.....he's gonna by a much more energized Melo for that reason and whoever gets him will instantly become a much better team. Shyt we'll probably even see a much more improved Melo on defense as well.

Oh, this WILL definitely happen.

[SARGO127]

Lee to Minny for Aldrich, Payne, OKC 1st
Melo to Hou in a 3 team deal w Harkles, a pick and expirings back

[Juco24]

I think he should stay. houston is lowballin us af, pretty sure about that. If melo wants to go badly I wouldn't accept less than 2 unprotected firsts in addition to the horrible anderson contract or a first + harkless if it's the three team deal with POR.
if the offer is worse, why the hell should we trade him?
how about getting harkless to pair with melo?

Lee, Kuz, O'Quinn for Harkless, Davis' expiring (maybe a second round pick has to be added from one side, dunno which one)

then we could offer Rondo the room exception of 4.3 million for 2 years.(he could make more, but maybe we could sell him that)

Rondo/Frank
Baker/THJ (using timmy as the sixth man here, more touches and better fit)
Harkless/Thomas
Melo/Willy
KP/Willy

boy that would be a playoff squad with a young nucleus, future cap space and all future first round picks going forward.. would be my dream scenario. main rotation with 3 veterans and 6 young guns.

BUT: I know this is most definitely not going to happen and melo will leave. makes me sad AF. but if we HAVE TO move him. it better be a really good deal.

My dream scenario...