Cavs/Knicks/OKC in 3 Way Trade Talks (JR+SHUMP TRADED TO CLE)

Jay10 · Post #1441 » by **Jay10** » Tue Jan 6, 2015 4:21 pm

mpharris36 wrote:[tweet]https://twitter.com/JonKnicksFan/status/552485682024046593[/tweet]

interesting

Similar to what the 76ers are doing by taking on contracts for draft picks.

ORANGEandBLUE · Post #1442 » by **ORANGEandBLUE** » Tue Jan 6, 2015 4:21 pm

Deeeez Knicks wrote:
it just seems like people are against Phil. They complain about Phil's plan without even knowing what it is

I'm all for pessimism when it comes to this team. But when people are citing espn magazine as evidence of what Phil's plan is, I just have to call BS.

Post #1443 » by **Capn'O** » Tue Jan 6, 2015 4:22 pm

ORANGEandBLUE wrote:It's just straight up confirmation bias. Posters who've been pushing the anti-tank train for years grasped at whatever evidence they could find that Phil was endorsing their approach to building a team. Nevermind the fact that he is literally the biggest manipulator and BS'er in the history of sports.

The guy is a master troll. Hell, he's probably R-Dawg.

Post #1444 » by **mpharris36** » Tue Jan 6, 2015 4:22 pm

Deeeez Knicks wrote:
it just seems like people are against Phil. They complain about Phil's plan without even knowing what it is

because he said one thing that every other GM says before the season...

R-DAWG · Post #1445 » by **R-DAWG** » Tue Jan 6, 2015 4:23 pm

NoLayupRule wrote:One thing I think we are seeing here is Phil believing in himself quite a bit

he seems fairly certain he can build a real squad if given the opportunity

and he's given himself that opportunity it seems

we have Pablo, Jose, Melo and Early on the roster next season only.

If Pablo moves on and retires, as one suspects he will, and accepts a buyout or we can spread his remaining salary then thats a significant few min more

If we are able to move Jose then we have almost nothing on the books

we might be looking at basically a reboot but with one of the top 5 players already on board {ok, to hell with all you who want to argue that point}

now the pressure is where it should be
on Phil

He should have a top 10 pick, perhaps top 5 or top 3
30-40 mil in cap space
Multiple top tier free agents and the lure of NYC

Get it done Phil

Ill suffer this year if you can make it worth while

Pablo should be very easy to move for a non guaranteed or trade exception. Solid back on the rotation player on a very reasonable deal.

Calderon, not so much.

ORANGEandBLUE · Post #1446 » by **ORANGEandBLUE** » Tue Jan 6, 2015 4:23 pm

R-DAWG wrote:
ORANGEandBLUE wrote:It's just straight up confirmation bias. Posters who've been pushing the anti-tank train for years grasped at whatever evidence they could find that Phil was endorsing their approach to building a team. Nevermind the fact that he is literally the biggest manipulator and BS'er in the history of sports.

I love the tank, just want more 1st rd picks

So does Phil... look at the Tyson trade. He got us Larkin and Early. He gets it. But there's no reason to think Shump could have netted us a first. This is a classic case of Knick fans overrating our assets.

god shammgod · Post #1447 » by **god shammgod** » Tue Jan 6, 2015 4:24 pm

i'm pretty sure only 500k of pablo's deal is guaranteed next year

R-DAWG · Post #1448 » by **R-DAWG** » Tue Jan 6, 2015 4:24 pm

Jay10 wrote:
mpharris36 wrote:[tweet]https://twitter.com/JonKnicksFan/status/552485682024046593[/tweet]

interesting

Similar to what the 76ers are doing by taking on contracts for draft picks.

The real question is weather or not Steve Mills is smart enough or a good enough negotiator to get it done. This isn't on Phil. Mills is the business man. I had more faith in John Idzik than I do in Mills

ORANGEandBLUE · Post #1449 » by **ORANGEandBLUE** » Tue Jan 6, 2015 4:24 pm

And look, even if he did want to compete, isn't Melo's early season knee injury kind of a game-changer in that respect? I mean I certainly see people using that as an excuse for the mediocre season Melo is having. But apparently it's not an excuse for Phil if it turns out that the injury caused him to adjust his plans for this season.

Post #1450 » by **Deeeez Knicks** » Tue Jan 6, 2015 4:25 pm

ORANGEandBLUE wrote:
R-DAWG wrote:
ORANGEandBLUE wrote:It's just straight up confirmation bias. Posters who've been pushing the anti-tank train for years grasped at whatever evidence they could find that Phil was endorsing their approach to building a team. Nevermind the fact that he is literally the biggest manipulator and BS'er in the history of sports.

I love the tank, just want more 1st rd picks

So does Phil... look at the Tyson trade. He got us Larkin and Early. He gets it. But there's no reason to think Shump could have netted us a first. This is a classic case of Knick fans overrating our assets.

And we got Thanasis in the Tyson trade. Thats 3 young players.

ORANGEandBLUE · Post #1451 » by **ORANGEandBLUE** » Tue Jan 6, 2015 4:25 pm

mpharris36 wrote:
Deeeez Knicks wrote:
it just seems like people are against Phil. They complain about Phil's plan without even knowing what it is

because he said one thing that every other GM says before the season...

Don't forget ESPN magazine!

R-DAWG · Post #1452 » by **R-DAWG** » Tue Jan 6, 2015 4:26 pm

ORANGEandBLUE wrote:
R-DAWG wrote:
ORANGEandBLUE wrote:It's just straight up confirmation bias. Posters who've been pushing the anti-tank train for years grasped at whatever evidence they could find that Phil was endorsing their approach to building a team. Nevermind the fact that he is literally the biggest manipulator and BS'er in the history of sports.

I love the tank, just want more 1st rd picks

So does Phil... look at the Tyson trade. He got us Larkin and Early. He gets it. But there's no reason to think Shump could have netted us a first. This is a classic case of Knick fans overrating our assets.

Larkin and Early are not equivalent to a 1st. Larkin won't even be here next year. He's essentially an expiring deal.

If he wanted picks he would have waited for the offseason to play out before moving Tyson and waited until Shumpert got hurt before moving him.

R-DAWG · Post #1453 » by **R-DAWG** » Tue Jan 6, 2015 4:27 pm

Deeeez Knicks wrote:
ORANGEandBLUE wrote:
R-DAWG wrote:
I love the tank, just want more 1st rd picks

So does Phil... look at the Tyson trade. He got us Larkin and Early. He gets it. But there's no reason to think Shump could have netted us a first. This is a classic case of Knick fans overrating our assets.

And we got Thanasis in the Tyson trade. Thats 3 young players.

We could have got Thanasis for cash, just like Brooklyn did with the 2nd rd picks they bought

"Keep getting them checks Minnestoa" - Bill Simmons

Come to think of it, we could have given up a future 2nd for the 35th pick in the draft like Memphis did.

We could have gotten the value we got for Tyson without giving up Tyson

Post #1454 » by **mpharris36** » Tue Jan 6, 2015 4:27 pm

god shammgod wrote:i'm pretty sure only 500k of pablo's deal is guaranteed next year

I wouldn't mind keeping him. He is a good guy to have around. And if we are purging the entire roster we will need some backups that we depend on.

There aren't as many guards at that price point that I would feel comfortable giving 15 minutes a night.

if someone wants to give us a pick for him or something then I would consider but I wouldn't just dump him like we did with JR.

Fat Kat · Post #1455 » by **Fat Kat** » Tue Jan 6, 2015 4:28 pm

Sports Illustrated gave us an A- for this trade.

ORANGEandBLUE · Post #1456 » by **ORANGEandBLUE** » Tue Jan 6, 2015 4:28 pm

R-DAWG wrote:
Larkin and Early are not equivalent to a 1st. Larkin won't even be here next year. He's essentially an expiring deal.

If he wanted picks he would have waited for the offseason to play out before moving Tyson and waited until Shumpert got hurt before moving him.

Larkin is a recent first rounder who was NOT an expiring when the trade was made. Yet another salary cap detail that Phil-bashers need to fudge in order to support their argument.

As for Shump, c'mon.... your problem is that he didn't foresee exactly when his injury would occur?

E86 · Post #1457 » by **E86** » Tue Jan 6, 2015 4:29 pm

Fairly sure we traded Tyson so quickly because him and Melo didn't get along and we wanted to resign Melo. It was probably the best package at the time.

prophet_of_rage · Post #1458 » by **prophet_of_rage** » Tue Jan 6, 2015 4:29 pm

ORANGEandBLUE wrote:It's just straight up confirmation bias. Posters who've been pushing the anti-tank train for years grasped at whatever evidence they could find that Phil was endorsing their approach to building a team. Nevermind the fact that he is literally the biggest manipulator and BS'er in the history of sports.

Exactly he is. And that's why I say "straight hoodwinked" and if that much is true then none of know his plan and can only judge his actions which seem to put everything into the "get some good free agents" which was Walsh's plan.

bigfnjoe96 · Post #1459 » by **bigfnjoe96** » Tue Jan 6, 2015 4:30 pm

Pablo contract is partially guaranteed for next year I believe. Also can someone explained to me the 6M and 2.5M exceptions we got also in the deal?

Post #1460 » by **Capn'O** » Tue Jan 6, 2015 4:30 pm

Deeeez Knicks wrote:
ORANGEandBLUE wrote:
R-DAWG wrote:
I love the tank, just want more 1st rd picks

So does Phil... look at the Tyson trade. He got us Larkin and Early. He gets it. But there's no reason to think Shump could have netted us a first. This is a classic case of Knick fans overrating our assets.

And we got Thanasis in the Tyson trade. Thats 3 young players.

And then they traded Ellington for Acy. That's 4.