The Politics Thread - please direct all related posts here..

[tuckerfor3]

So who's your choice for gop candidate for prez?

this guy

[HarthorneWingo]

C'mon, don't be a pussy.

Who's your candidate?

And, by the way, if I'm such a liberal ideologue, how is it that I am in agreement with the foreign policies of GOP candidates Ron Paul and Jon Huntsman?

[HarthorneWingo]

Hey Tucker, am I a misogynist for calling this lying cuunt a byatch? (Is that liberal enough for ya?)

http://www.nytimes.com/2011/07/01/nyreg ... ml?_r=1&hp

Strauss-Kahn Case Seen as in Jeopardy
By JIM DWYER, WILLIAM K. RASHBAUM and JOHN ELIGON
Published: June 30, 2011

The sexual assault case against Dominique Strauss-Kahn is on the verge of collapse as investigators have uncovered major holes in the credibility of the housekeeper who charged that he attacked her in his Manhattan hotel suite in May, according to two well-placed law enforcement officials.

Although forensic tests found unambiguous evidence of a sexual encounter between Mr. Strauss-Kahn, a French politician, and the woman, prosecutors now do not believe much of what the accuser has told them about the circumstances or about herself.

Since her initial allegation on May 14, the accuser has repeatedly lied, one of the law enforcement officials said.

Senior prosecutors met with lawyers for Mr. Strauss-Kahn on Thursday and provided details about their findings, and the parties are discussing whether to dismiss the felony charges. Among the discoveries, one of the officials said, are issues involving the asylum application of the 32-year-old housekeeper, who is Guinean, and possible links to people involved in criminal activities, including drug dealing and money laundering.

-more-

[HarthorneWingo]

China opens world's largest sea-bridge. Pretty amazing. The article also has video.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/06/3 ... 87721.html

WINGO OP-ED

Just great. I mean, why would WE want to do that? Especially when we have so many of our own bridges which are in such disrepair? I'm sure the private sector will take care of all this if we just cut more taxes and "let the private sector do what it does best." Right?

After ten years of tax cuts, look at all the good the private sector is doing!!!!! And this is but one of the many fine examples of why republicans are stupid byatches (that was for Tucker ).

[mugzi]

Hey Tucker, am I a misogynist for calling this lying cuunt a byatch? (Is that liberal enough for ya?)

http://www.nytimes.com/2011/07/01/nyreg ... ml?_r=1&hp

Strauss-Kahn Case Seen as in Jeopardy
By JIM DWYER, WILLIAM K. RASHBAUM and JOHN ELIGON
Published: June 30, 2011

The sexual assault case against Dominique Strauss-Kahn is on the verge of collapse as investigators have uncovered major holes in the credibility of the housekeeper who charged that he attacked her in his Manhattan hotel suite in May, according to two well-placed law enforcement officials.

Although forensic tests found unambiguous evidence of a sexual encounter between Mr. Strauss-Kahn, a French politician, and the woman, prosecutors now do not believe much of what the accuser has told them about the circumstances or about herself.

Since her initial allegation on May 14, the accuser has repeatedly lied, one of the law enforcement officials said.

Senior prosecutors met with lawyers for Mr. Strauss-Kahn on Thursday and provided details about their findings, and the parties are discussing whether to dismiss the felony charges. Among the discoveries, one of the officials said, are issues involving the asylum application of the 32-year-old housekeeper, who is Guinean, and possible links to people involved in criminal activities, including drug dealing and money laundering.

-more-

Aah this reminds me of my sleazy socialist thread which got under so many of you commies skin. I had a feeling this was going to go away, either becuase of this guy's connections or the credibility of the accuser- who btw is a west african muslim who according to this Daily Beast excerpt may have criminal connections...

So, according to this source, more detectives were assigned to look at the accuser’s possible criminal associations. Strauss-Kahn had hired TD International, an international investigating and troubleshooting firm with extensive CIA connections, to dig into the accuser’s background and connections. But the NYPD appears to have turned up the most damaging information first.

As The Daily Beast’s John Solomon confirmed earlier this morning, there were inconsistencies in the accuser’s asylum application when she came to the United States, unusual financial transactions into her personal accounts, and she had contacts with an incarcerated drug suspect. The day after she allegedly suffered the Strauss-Kahn assault, she was recorded talking to the suspect in jail about the possibility of getting money by proceeding with the charges against Strauss-Kahn. According to The New York Times, which first reported the concerns of prosecutors Thursday night, the woman had five different phones and had received as much as $100,000 into her accounts in the last two years from the man in prison and others, although those were not thought to be linked in any way to the DSK case.

[mugzi]

China opens world's largest sea-bridge. Pretty amazing. The article also has video.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/06/3 ... 87721.html

WINGO OP-ED

Just great. I mean, why would WE want to do that? Especially when we have so many of our own bridges which are in such disrepair? I'm sure the private sector will take care of all this if we just cut more taxes and "let the private sector do what it does best." Right?

After ten years of tax cuts, look at all the good the private sector is doing!!!!! And this is but one of the many fine examples of why republicans are stupid byatches (that was for Tucker ).

First of all, I dont think we should outsource anything to China, especially the construction of a bridge. The Chinese are notorious for making shoddy merchandise. F them they are snakes.

Secondly, your own hypocrisy is evident to everyone but yourself Wingo. Why havent liberal companies like GE paid any taxes on 6 billion in profit?? Oh because the CEO is a butt buddy of your man perhaps? GM will never repay what they owe, never. All Ive seen from this administration is crony capitalism mixed with socialist experimentation.

And do you dumocrats really think that taxing the ish out of the wealth earners in this country is going to solve our deficit? News flash, you could seize all the wealth of the top 1% in this country and it would pay down about 450-500 billion of the deficit, tops.

So seizing wealth from the wealth and job producers is not the answer, coming to the table and making hard choices regarding cuts is the answer.

But your kind will never do that for fear of losing the droves of people whose votes you buy with entitlements.

Theres yo booyah sucka!

Mugz out.

[tuckerfor3]

After ten years of tax cuts, look at all the good the private sector is doing!!!!! And this is but one of the many fine examples of why republicans are stupid byatches (that was for Tucker ).

You're not remotely as cute as you think you are. Just do everyone a favor and never again complain about the incivility of modern-day politics, cause you're a hypocrite par excellence when it comes to such a notion. Now zip your fly, your Ed Schultz is showing.

[MF Doom]

What is with the back and forth arguments?

In the end everyone wants the same thing, a better America.

[tuckerfor3]

What is with the back and forth arguments?

It's the Politics Thread, what do you expect?

[mugzi]

The problem is theres no such thing as a better America as people like Wingo see it. True Conservatives stand for limited govt, low taxes, an end to entitlements and fiscal responsibility.

His party stands for larger govt, higher taxes and entitlements galore to pander to a base to draw votes. They are deplorable in thought, action and deed. They are to be resisted at every turn for they see govt as a solution and not the problem. And rest assured in 2011, govt is not the solution.

Im not saying the GOP has the answers, mainly because they have been infested by RINOS and to me now are just Democrat lites.

I can tell you how to create a better America very quickly, but no one in Washington has the balls to implement the plan and make hard choices.

1. End ALL FOREIGN AID. We literally give billions away per year, some of it to nations that aren't even our true allies {Pakistan for example}

2. REPEAL OBAMACARE ASAP. This is a bureaucratic nightmare and isnt going to curb costs at all. It was a blatant unconstitutional power grab.

3. END THE WARS. Yes thats right, end them. Im not an isolationist, but Im also a pragmatist and Afghanistan is a bottomless pit, we weakened the Taliban, and if the govt there cant maintain order thats their problem. Iraq I agreed with when we entered the war although the real target should have been Iran cause they are the shadiest nation in that region, but the time has come to leave, this country is far more stable now than Afghanistan. Libya we have no business being involved in. There is no imminent or perceived threat from a 3rd rate power like Libya. And dropping bombs on a nation without boots on the ground is still a war, no matter what lies the democrats try to spin it as.

4. END THE TRADE IMBALANCE WITH CHINA. China is very cunning and shady. They keep their currency artificially low to create a trade surplus with us, they produce shoddy merchandise often with carcinogenic materials that like suckers we buy up because "they're cheaper" -WALMART
Someone needs to get tough with them and say in plain terms "Either revalue your currency so we dont run a 250 billion dollar annual trade deficit with you or we will impose a 35% tariff on all of your goods effective immediately." Dont like it? Too bad, we'll rebuild our manufacturing base here in the U.S. which we should have never given up in the 1st place.

5. END THE ECONOMIC UNCERTAINTY PURPOSELY CREATED BY THIS PRESIDENT
Capital gains taxes lowered, corporate taxes lowered and incentivize American companies to keep jobs in America through tax benefits. But there should be specific quotas of jobs for specific amounts of tax savings and if these are not met then penalties should and would ensue. Companies have to realize that they have to live up to their end of the deal.


These are just a few thoughts that I typed in 5 minutes theres many more things that can be done, but wont because the whole system is broken. These slimeballs are 2 sides of the same coin, democan, republicat at this point Im just sick of the whole charade.

Now I have a dinner date to get ready for with a fine 23 yr old whose patriotic in all the right places, so have fun fellas, and happy 4th of July to all.

[ewingxmanstarks]

Nice to see conservative thoughts in this commie sleeper cell some choose to call realgm.

[Nutty Nats Fan]

ROFL! Realgm, a commie sleeper cell. I'm away from the thread for a bit and seems it has gone off the deep end, if people actually believe that.

They are to be resisted at every turn for they see govt as a solution and not the problem. And rest assured in 2011, govt is not the solution.

Don't have a ton of time, but I did want to comment on this GOP fallacy. Just because the GOP leadership has shown they can't run this country, doesn't mean Government can't be a solution. The private sector has shown they prefer to focus on the bottom line and making wall street happy, get some competent people running this country and things would be a whole lot better. Unfortunately, no one is willing to make the tough decisions, because they will be vilified by people who don't actually care about this country.

Too many people believe a lot of the BS they get from both sides. Although the GOP seems to be in overdrive with the BS since Obama was elected (same happened with Clinton). And that is why the government can't be the solution right now, the GOP's only stated goal is obstructing Obama from trying to improve the country. They want to keep things bad, blame him, and get their "own guy" back in charge. They don't want to work with him, just get power back for themselves.

Country would almost be better off without two parties. The current system is too much of playing sides, not the country as a whole. And I'm sorry to the GOP lackeys here, but your party is not a party of this country. Just a party of themselves. When Bush was "selected" the Dems in the congress and senate worked with him (didn't even stop him from running up huge debts), when Obama is elected, the GOP declares to get him voted out. Big difference there.

Not to say Obama and the Dems or prefect either. They need to grow some balls and stop ruining this country in trying to compromise with the GOP. Obamacare, as the GOP and its lackeys like to call it, isn't even the bill Obama wanted to pass. His would have been much better, instead he ruined it to appease the GOP. Guy needs to take a page from Bush and do what he feels is best, and make it happen. At least then, unlike Bush, we'd be having stuff get done that will improve the country.

/end rant.. got a bit longer winded than I planned.

[tigerbull]

I am for Ron Paul because he wants to legalize drugs.

I want to legalize drugs because it will greatly benefit this country, and making them illegal is just as misguided as alcohol prohibition (which contributed greatly to organized crime.)

Here's one of the better articles summarizing why drugs should be legal (from the American Journal of Economics and Sociology)

http://findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_m ... _65348069/

[tuckerfor3]

ROFL! Realgm, a commie sleeper cell. I'm away from the thread for a bit and seems it has gone off the deep end, if people actually believe that.

They are to be resisted at every turn for they see govt as a solution and not the problem. And rest assured in 2011, govt is not the solution.

Don't have a ton of time, but I did want to comment on this GOP fallacy. Just because the GOP leadership has shown they can't run this country, doesn't mean Government can't be a solution. The private sector has shown they prefer to focus on the bottom line and making wall street happy, get some competent people running this country and things would be a whole lot better. Unfortunately, no one is willing to make the tough decisions, because they will be vilified by people who don't actually care about this country.

Too many people believe a lot of the BS they get from both sides. Although the GOP seems to be in overdrive with the BS since Obama was elected (same happened with Clinton). And that is why the government can't be the solution right now, the GOP's only stated goal is obstructing Obama from trying to improve the country. They want to keep things bad, blame him, and get their "own guy" back in charge. They don't want to work with him, just get power back for themselves.

Country would almost be better off without two parties. The current system is too much of playing sides, not the country as a whole. And I'm sorry to the GOP lackeys here, but your party is not a party of this country. Just a party of themselves. When Bush was "selected" the Dems in the congress and senate worked with him (didn't even stop him from running up huge debts), when Obama is elected, the GOP declares to get him voted out. Big difference there.

Not to say Obama and the Dems or prefect either. They need to grow some balls and stop ruining this country in trying to compromise with the GOP. Obamacare, as the GOP and its lackeys like to call it, isn't even the bill Obama wanted to pass. His would have been much better, instead he ruined it to appease the GOP. Guy needs to take a page from Bush and do what he feels is best, and make it happen. At least then, unlike Bush, we'd be having stuff get done that will improve the country.

/end rant.. got a bit longer winded than I planned.

Thanks for all the laughs. Both parties are a cruel joke and have been a disaster for this country, especially as of late. That's called reality. Enjoy your delusional DNC hero-worship.

[mugzi]

Global warrrrrrrrrrrrrming.


The UN's Climate of Desperation
David Rothbard
This article was co-authored by Craig Rucker

As the UN wrapped up its recent climate conference in Bonn, Germany, talks organizer Christiana Figueres proclaimed that climate change is the “the most important negotiation the world has ever faced.” Faced with real problems – financial meltdowns, unemployment, war and genuine human suffering – the world no longer agrees.

It’s a good thing human productivity doesn’t threaten the global thermostat the way the UN would have us believe. If it were, we’d be cooked. Countries rich and poor are backing away from commitments they made years ago during rosier economic times, before the public became aware of Climategate, renewable energy costs and genuine debate.

The Kyoto Protocol, the only binding international agreement signed since the global warming scare began, expires after 2012. Canada, Russia and Japan have publicly declared they will not renew; China and the United States never signed it; and the US has made it plain it is not about to. And poor countries are becoming less enamored about signing on, as they realize hard economic times mean there will be little climate “mitigation” and “restitution” money coming their way from (formerly) rich countries.

Even die-hard warmists increasingly recognize that bureaucratic solutions hatched at these conferences are rife with waste, fraud and abuse. They may enrich a few, at the expense of everyone else, especially the poor. But they are powerless to control Earth’s climate.

In March, German investigators reported that 850 million Euros disappeared, when shady companies swarmed into carbon trading, emissions and energy businesses. Criminal enterprises raked in tens of millions, fended off regulators with delaying tactics, and then announced bankruptcy or vanished. An Italian sting operation resulted in arrests of wind farm developers who billed the country for subsidies, but never produced a kilowatt of electricity.

London’s liberal Guardian newspaper was aghast to learn that the World Bank’s Biocarbon Fund had arranged to pay European “entrepreneurs” $1 million to establish a system under which 60,000 Kenyans would restrict themselves to farming under rigidly controlled, inefficient, “sustainable” techniques. For that they will receive $1.4 million over 20 years.

That’s right, the beneficent World Bank will enrich more Europeans, so that 60,000 Kenyans can receive $23.83 apiece annually for 20 years of drudgery, poverty and misery: a princely $1.19 a year!

Even the European Union finally understands how little energy deprivation and bureaucratic dictates affect the climate. “It is not enough for the EU to simply sign up for another commitment period,” EU climate representative Jurgen Lefevere admitted. “We only represent 11% of global emissions.”

Burning fossil fuels contributes only a fraction of total annual atmospheric carbon dioxide buildup, and the EU contributes just 11% of that. The EU’s commitment to slashing CO2 emissions by 20% invites corruption, has no control over Chinese or Indian emissions, and has no effect on the climate.

The biggest divide evident in Bonn was between the USA and large emerging economies. Even Obama administration officials who are thoroughly committed to manmade global warming catastrophe claims finally recognize the fraud problem. In Bonn the US insisted that all countries subject their emission reduction claims to verification.

However, China will accept only an agreement that lacks verification – and thereby guarantees the right to cheat. Meanwhile, the Chinese are happy to be “the world’s leader” in manufacturing wind turbines – 95% which they gladly sell to guilt-ridden western countries, while they build a new coal-fired power plant every week.

China and other nations support the notion that prosperous countries owe the world restitution for the “sin” of engaging in the Industrial Revolution and becoming prosperous. We can only hope some nation’s representative will have the courage to remind China and its fellow climate travelers that the West never forced them to spend fifty years mired in Communism, bureaucracy and stagnation.

While it is encouraging that the global warming camp no longer has things entirely its own way, celebration would be premature. For all the gnashing of teeth and complaining about corporate influence we hear from global warming bureaucrats and campaigners, the truth is that today the warmists are the establishment.

Billions are being redistributed to researchers, developing nations, carbon speculators, alternative energy investors and other carbon profiteers – who would like to turn billions into trillions. Pity the poor carbon traders whose markets expire with Kyoto. Not all have their villa in the sun yet.

But rest assured, they will do whatever is necessary to get their villas. Big Warming will not surrender its hold on Western taxpayers without a fight.

The warmist camp plans to retake the initiative at the December UN conference in Durban, South Africa. It intends to turn back the clock to the time when the media would attribute any weather or nature event to global warming, without question or critical examination. Al Gore’s recent Rolling Stone diatribe essentially calls on the media to censure climate disaster skeptics and adopt a one-sided manmade warming narrative.

The New York Times may go along, but the huge and growing alternative media will not. This week’s Washington, DC Heartland Institute international conference of climate alarm skeptics dramatically reinforced the lack of evidence for manmade Armageddon, and the disastrous consequences for poor and industrialized nations alike of staying the current UN course.

Many believe the last-minute appearance by dozens of world leaders crippled the Copenhagen climate conference. But with the big names absent from Cancun and now Bonn, the UN wants them back.

Ms. Figueres capped the Bonn conference with a call for “high-level political attention.” If she succeeds, just imagine the mischief a gathering of Heads of State, foreign ministers, bureaucrats, researchers, green campaigners and carbon profiteers can do at an African beach resort.

Then imagine how nearly impossible it will be to repair the harm they inflict. Action must be taken now to avert such a result.

[HarthorneWingo]

David Rothbard and Craig Tucker? Who the hell are they? (Can't you EVER cite ANY reliable sources?)

Anyway, getting back to the sanctity of "marriage" .... Ok, maybe it's not as sexy as "I Married A Monkey" but it's pretty close.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/06/3 ... s-headline

Gorilla Adopted By Childless Couple In France (VIDEO)

The Huffington Post First Posted: 06/30/11 11:13 AM ET Updated: 06/30/11 11:36 AM ET

Pierre and Elianne Thivillon don’t have any children. But they do have a 265-pound gorilla. The couple, both zookeepers, took in Digit 13 years ago, when her biological mother refused to breastfeed. They already had experience working with gorillas, but acknowledge that it’s not an easy job.

New Zealand’s News 3 reports that the couple compares raising Digit to raising a child, in terms of the impact on their social life. There are no more nights out to the movies or restaurants, but they don’t seem to mind.

BBC News reports that during the day, Digit spends her time at the Saint Martin la Plaine Zoo in France. In the evenings, she returns home to her adopted parents, where she enjoys sleeping in their bed.

According to New Zealand’s News 3, the couple also once cared for Digit’s brother, Ginko, but he became aggressive and they had to return him to the zoo. "Life was very difficult a few days after Ginko left. We got used to seeing him everyday. He slept near us, we had breakfast together, we had a good time together and it was a real pleasure. It was very hard to see him go," Pierre told the news organization.

But Digit’s relationship to the couple appears to be quite loving, and video captures Digit hugging Pierre and even planting a kiss on him. As Pierre says, “It’s going very well. We have a 13-year-old relationship with Digit, so obviously we’ve created a very strong bond with each other.”

Although Digit’s story is a unique situation, keeping wild animals in human households can be frowned upon. 17-year-old Felicia Frisco sleeps with a Bengal tiger in her bed, and questions were raised over whether or not the animal should be kept in captivity. Unfortunately though, a handler explained, "There's nowhere for a tiger to live in the wild anymore."

As for gorillas, many are endangered or threatened. For example, mountain gorillas in Central Africa are threatened by the Human Metapneumovirus which causes deadly respiratory diseases in humans and can be passed on to mountain gorillas.

[HarthorneWingo]

The problem is theres no such thing as a better America as people like Wingo see it. True Conservatives stand for limited govt, low taxes, an end to entitlements and fiscal responsibility.

His party stands for larger govt, higher taxes and entitlements galore to pander to a base to draw votes. They are deplorable in thought, action and deed. They are to be resisted at every turn for they see govt as a solution and not the problem. And rest assured in 2011, govt is not the solution.

Im not saying the GOP has the answers, mainly because they have been infested by RINOS and to me now are just Democrat lites.

I can tell you how to create a better America very quickly, but no one in Washington has the balls to implement the plan and make hard choices.

Mugzi, your using GOP buzz words to make a point. "Larger gov't;" "higher taxes;" "entitlements;" Why not use facts instead?

In the 1950s-80s - when America was The no.1 economically innovative country in the world, our government was subsidizing all that research and technology. That's why we are no longer the no. 1 "innovator" in the world. Also, there are certain aspects of the our culture which should not be subject to the profit motive. Health care is one of them. Law enforcement and prison administration is another.

You say that your party "is not perfect" (well yeah, duh), but even after the destruction that "your party" did during the 8 years of George W. Bush and Dick Cheney, you want to revert back to those very same policies. They don't work.

You republicans have gotten so crazy that republicans like Ike, Nixon, Reagan and George HW could never win a primary in this climate. They'd be way too moderate.

[HarthorneWingo]

I guess the economy is doing much better than we were led to believe. I'm sure it'll all "trickle down" to middle class Americans.

http://www.nytimes.com/2011/07/03/busin ... ay.html?hp

We Knew They Got Raises. But This?
By PRADNYA JOSHI
Published: July 2, 2011
The New York Times

IT turns out that the good times are even better than we thought for American chief executives.

Among the executives who registered huge gains in the value of their company stock and options in 2010 were Warren E. Buffett, the chief executive of Berkshire Hathaway, top, Lawrence J. Ellison of Oracle, center, and Jeffrey P. Bezos of Amazon.com. Together, the three men's holdings climbed by more than $13 billion for the year.

A preliminary examination of executive pay in 2010, based on data available as of April 1, found that the paychecks for top American executives were growing again, after shrinking during the 2008-9 recession.

But that study, conducted for The New York Times by Equilar, an executive compensation data firm based in Redwood City, Calif., was just an early snapshot, and there were even more riches to come. Some big companies had not yet disclosed their executive compensation.

So Sunday Business asked Equilar to run the numbers again.

Brace yourself.

The final figures show that the median pay for top executives at 200 big companies last year was $10.8 million. That works out to a 23 percent gain from 2009. The earlier study had put the median pay at a none-too-shabby $9.6 million, up 12 percent.

Total C.E.O. pay hasn’t quite returned to its heady, prerecession levels — but it certainly seems headed there. Despite the soft economy, weak home prices and persistently high unemployment, some top executives are already making more than they were before the economy soured.

Pay skyrocketed last year because many companies brought back cash bonuses, says Aaron Boyd, head of research at Equilar. Cash bonuses, as opposed to those awarded in stock options, jumped by an astounding 38 percent, the final numbers show.

Granted, many American corporations did well last year. Profits were up substantially. As a result, many companies are sharing the wealth, at least with their executives. “We’re seeing a lot of that reflected in the pay,” Mr. Boyd says.

-more-

[mugzi]

The problem is theres no such thing as a better America as people like Wingo see it. True Conservatives stand for limited govt, low taxes, an end to entitlements and fiscal responsibility.

His party stands for larger govt, higher taxes and entitlements galore to pander to a base to draw votes. They are deplorable in thought, action and deed. They are to be resisted at every turn for they see govt as a solution and not the problem. And rest assured in 2011, govt is not the solution.

Im not saying the GOP has the answers, mainly because they have been infested by RINOS and to me now are just Democrat lites.

I can tell you how to create a better America very quickly, but no one in Washington has the balls to implement the plan and make hard choices.

Mugzi, your using GOP buzz words to make a point. "Larger gov't;" "higher taxes;" "entitlements;" Why not use facts instead?

In the 1950s-80s - when America was The no.1 economically innovative country in the world, our government was subsidizing all that research and technology. That's why we are no longer the no. 1 "innovator" in the world. Also, there are certain aspects of the our culture which should not be subject to the profit motive. Health care is one of them. Law enforcement and prison administration is another.

You say that your party "is not perfect" (well yeah, duh), but even after the destruction that "your party" did during the 8 years of George W. Bush and Dick Cheney, you want to revert back to those very same policies. They don't work.

You republicans have gotten so crazy that republicans like Ike, Nixon, Reagan and George HW could never win a primary in this climate. They'd be way too moderate.

All your missing is the drive the car in the ditch analogy Barack.

You can obfuscate all you want but here are the facts. Unemployement was in the mid 5's on avg through 2000-2008, your boy has done nothing positive to stimulate growth. In fact he's (Please Use More Appropriate Word) growth, but thats what democrats do, (Please Use More Appropriate Word) growth.

And where did the economy collapse from? Mortgages, Slick Willy strongarming HUD to push subprime loans that bankrupted 1000s of banks and (Please Use More Appropriate Word) this economy.

(Please Use More Appropriate Word).

Happy 4th.

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kjEAqrFmAXM[/youtube]

[richardhutnik]

Ok, one more pop in here, to point out the uselessness of even bother doing discussions in this political thread.

The way people work, PARTICULARLY partisan folk, who are loyal to an nth degree to a party or ideology is that they, when faced with difficult situations, will end racing towards ANY story that makes sense out of things, anchors their view of reality, and enables them to pass blame to others, rather than see the flaws in the system. This can go to Al Gore with climate change, to Neocons and their view on foreign policy (any day now, America will be invaded by Mooslems), to those who buy into Zeitgeist, to GOP loyalists who are insistent that Bush was God's gift to earth and did NO wrong (everything is Clinton or Obama's fault), to any sort of conspiracy theorist. A real bad offender here is Harold Camping who ruined a large number of lives, but hides behind whatever excuse he made, and still presses on with the messages, acting exactly like Jehovah Witnesses did about the return of Christ. To these people, they don't even remember history the same way, or agree to the basic facts of the matter today, or even the possible range of future outcomes. It is like a dozen forms of mental illness that makes it IMPOSSIBLE for there to even be any form of discussion here.

In light of all this, how can anyone have any form of discussions with anyone that is relevant? All it is, is a duel of church choirs who can see if they can outshout the other side, as if that is how they win. And in such, they believe they are more full of winning that Charlie Sheen. I will say, such individuals are full of something.

- Rich