Official MMA discussion thread pt 2: UFC 268 in MSG Usman vs Colby 2, Rose vs Zhang 2

[bringbackhoffa]

Apparently this foolishness got Diego cut before his retirement fight with Donald Cerrone. True to form, Big Mouth Kevin Holland has offered to fight at a catch weight. Says he could make 175. That'd be the ultimate irony, Cowboy goes out fighting the guy who has taken his role as "any time, any weight" back-up plan for the UFC.

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That coach is next level wackjob

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[HarthorneWingo]

So Rory McDonald is fighting tonight on the PFL

[HarthorneWingo]

Reyes and Jiri wow

[HarthorneWingo]

Jiri will fck up Jon Jones

[GONYK]

JIRI!!!!

HOLY SH*T WHAT A FINISH

Reyes was fighting for his life in there, and Jiri snatched his soul

[matchman]

That double spinning elbows are some sick moves, Jon Jones may have trouble dealing with this Czech guy.

[j4remi]

Yall know I was hyping Jiri before his first UFC fight. That's my guy! I didn't expect him to do Dom like that though, that was next level pressure and dominance.

[MelosSoreWrist]

Apparently this foolishness got Diego cut before his retirement fight with Donald Cerrone. True to form, Big Mouth Kevin Holland has offered to fight at a catch weight. Says he could make 175. That'd be the ultimate irony, Cowboy goes out fighting the guy who has taken his role as "any time, any weight" back-up plan for the UFC.

Read on Twitter

Read on Twitter

That coach is next level wackjob

Sent from my SM-G960W using RealGM mobile app

So the crashing of the fighter meeting was at fight island many months ago. Diego camp released the video after UFC cut him.

The reason for the cut, according to Iole, was because Fabia was asking for all the medical records of Diego from TUF on down before this fight with Cerrone. When Campbell called Diego to ask if he was okay to fight, Diego said he couldnt say because he was not a neurologist. So yeah, that was why he was cut and the UFC paid him his show, win and sponsor money. I cannot see another organization picking him up after that stunt.

[MelosSoreWrist]

Yeah, Jiri is a beast. And he is probably going to make me look like an idiot for the third straight time when I pick Jan against him.

Giga. Nice, respectful callout of Holloway. Kattar as the backup bout. Those are big steps up.

Oh and that Pinheiro fight. Pinheiro was handly winning the fight and herself had committed two eye rakes. Faking being KOed by that foot slap was pathetic. Pinheiro gets hit, looks at the ref, goes to brace her fall with his hands, pulls her hands back, then turns her head the opposite direction from the hit and falls, then a delayed loss of consciousness. To cap it all off, she needs to be carried out.

[HarthorneWingo]

Rumble vs Augusto on Showtime ... wow

[HarthorneWingo]

Nate Diaz has to withdraw from the Leon Edwards fight. It appears to only push the fight back one month. But poor Leon Edwards, smh.

[HarthorneWingo]

Maurice Greene smh

[HarthorneWingo]

Mr. Neal Magny!

I love this guy. Hope he can break the top 5 one day.

[HarthorneWingo]

Time for Cowboy to retire

[GEOLINK]

Time for Cowboy to retire

Man was wobbling after every shot.

[MelosSoreWrist]

Man, the UFC has to push the athletic commissions to do more to improve on MMA judging.

Chris Lee, I thought, had an all time worst scorecard when he scored 48-47 for Felder when the other two judges and the whole world scored it 50-45 RDA. Even Felder scoffed at that scorecard.

http://mmadecisions.com/decision/11525/Rafael-dos-Anjos-vs-Paul-Felder

Two weeks ago, Lee scored the first round of the Liang/Carnelossi, 10-8 Carnelossi. The other two judges scored Liang 10-9.

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I would not have objected 10-9 Carnelossi, but you cant 10-8 a round you have a hard time parsing out a back and forth action packed round where Liang actually dropped Carnelossi hard right off the bat.

Last week TJBrown beat Kamaka in a spit decision.

http://mmadecisions.com/decision/11887/T.J.-Brown-vs-Kai-Kamaka-III

29-28 one way, 30-27 the other. I thought Kamaka won the fight. But even the scorecard giving Kamaka the fight, Bryd, got it wrong. Kamaka round 1 and 2, Brown round 3.

This week. Holy moly. Park/Nchuwki.

http://mmadecisions.com/decision/11907/Jun-Yong-Park-vs-Tafon-Nchukwi

Tony Weeks scored it 28-28. That is a shocking scorecard.

All that incompetence above doesnt have that much lasting consequence. Kamaka, maybe a bit in his bank account. But when you see Reyes lying face down unconscious after the Jiri KO, you really feel bad. I felt Reyes won the Jones fight in Dallas, where they had a bunch of boxing judges screwing up MMA fights. I had Reyes rounds 1-3, Jones 4 and 5. When they announced 48-47, 48-47, 49-46, I thought, oh they must've given Reyes round 4 for the biggest punch in the fight that had Jones desperately shooting for a takedown. Bad scorecards. I thought the fight was close but it was still a clear win for Reyes. And they ripped away that generation changing money from Reyes and his family. That win wouldve given Reyes PPV points on a monster PPV rematch. He wouldve had big endorsement opportunities. Fame. Hero status from many. But now, after two KO losses, he probably plays out the rest of career as an undercard fighter, making decent money but not life altering.

UFC pressure to fix the judging

[MelosSoreWrist]

Nate Diaz has to withdraw from the Leon Edwards fight. It appears to only push the fight back one month. But poor Leon Edwards, smh.

Colby is next for Usman, I imagine, and then if Wonderboy beats Burns, he gets next shot. Wonderboy is the only welterweight top 5 who Usman hasnt beaten. So Edwards title shot is way down the line. Colby/Usman date hasnt even been set. And I dont know how much a Diaz win can help you leapfrog anyone.

So yeah. After Edwards beats Diaz, I think Masvidal/Edwards headliner would be next. FWIW, although not for the title, both are great high profile fights for him. Get him known to the general MMA public. Get him some steam.

[HarthorneWingo]

Nate Diaz has to withdraw from the Leon Edwards fight. It appears to only push the fight back one month. But poor Leon Edwards, smh.

Colby is next for Usman, I imagine, and then if Wonderboy beats Burns, he gets next shot. Wonderboy is the only welterweight top 5 who Usman hasnt beaten. So Edwards title shot is way down the line. Colby/Usman date hasnt even been set. And I dont know how much a Diaz win can help you leapfrog anyone.

So yeah. After Edwards beats Diaz, I think Masvidal/Edwards headliner would be next. FWIW, although not for the title, both are great high profile fights for him. Get him known to the general MMA public. Get him some steam.

Masvidal-Edwards already has the steam. Just replay that post-fight presser where Jorge left an interview and clocked Leon in the face. Just play that angle up.

If Wonderboy beats Burns then I’d like to see him get the shot over Colby who’s already lost to Usman.I wouldn’t mind seeing Colby vs Jorge or Burns.

[MelosSoreWrist]

Nate Diaz has to withdraw from the Leon Edwards fight. It appears to only push the fight back one month. But poor Leon Edwards, smh.

Colby is next for Usman, I imagine, and then if Wonderboy beats Burns, he gets next shot. Wonderboy is the only welterweight top 5 who Usman hasnt beaten. So Edwards title shot is way down the line. Colby/Usman date hasnt even been set. And I dont know how much a Diaz win can help you leapfrog anyone.

So yeah. After Edwards beats Diaz, I think Masvidal/Edwards headliner would be next. FWIW, although not for the title, both are great high profile fights for him. Get him known to the general MMA public. Get him some steam.

Masvidal-Edwards already has the steam. Just replay that post-fight presser where Jorge left an interview and clocked Leon in the face. Just play that angle up.

If Wonderboy beats Burns then I’d like to see him get the shot over Colby who’s already lost to Usman.I wouldn’t mind seeing Colby vs Jorge or Burns.

Usman fought in April, quick finish, no damage. Wonderboy/Burns is in July. October would be an unnecessary long wait with no guarantee that Wonderboy wins.

Have Usman/Colby headline 265 on top of Nunes/Pena (thats not PPV headline worthy) in August, and have Wonderboy/Usman set for like December.

The general mma crowd has no interest in Leon Edwards. Last time we saw him, his fight ended in no contest eye poke. Before that, a UD win over RDA which has happened to RDA so often, people cant differentiate. Before that he won a split decision against Gunnar Nelson where he was mounted and hung on for dear life waiting for the fight to end. He is a hardcore fans fighter but people beyond that do not care. Which means, other fighters dont care.

His after fight scuffle with Masvidal was a Masvidal moment. Edwards is an afterthought.

Finishing Diaz spectacularly will bring him interest that would carry him to a ESPN headlining fight with Masvidal. Then the scuffle can become relevant for him. Without a definitive Diaz win, it wont carry him to the big match.

[j4remi]

Alright fam, we've got a GOOD PPV...granted, it was about to be even better. But even with Diaz/Edwards off, we're getting a damned good card that finishes with a great title fight to crown the new LW champion. What makes this one great is that the fighters aren't just highly ranked, but they're EXCITING! That's not just true for the main and co-main but for fights down in the prelims and most of the main card. Here's some quick fights worth watching and my takes:

Charles Oliveira vs Michael Chandler: Let's start at the top with the fight to crown Khabib's replacement as king of the Lightweight Division. Neither of these guys need introductions but let's do a quick style rundown.

Michael Chandler has one-punch KO power in both hands, with great speed and elite toughness behind it. He's a good, but not great wrestler...generally uses takedowns to stall and earn points between his barrages. His strength might be his most slept on asset. He can overpower his way to takedowns and out of clinches or opponents attempts. That strength lets him typically decide where fights go. His core weaknesses are that he slows down and his power dips as fights wane, which leads to more takedowns and stalling. His striking is pretty much all hands too, which limits his range as an already shorter LW.

Charles Oliveira, DoBronx, is an elite grappler who is as aggressive from his back as he would be in full-mount. Remember Kevin Holland catching flack for a lack of urgency off his back? Oliveira will show you what that urgency looks like. Oliveira's recent evolution has been to include a ton of pressure striking from his feet. He throws a lot of good kicks to the body and legs, using his size advantage over most LW's to really press the distance. This forces fighters to close the gaps and creates openings for Oliveira's grappling. Wrestlers shoot into sprawls or guillotines; strikers rush into level changes.

And that's the curiosity here. Their strengths don't make for a chess match so much as a battle of wills. Can Chandler overpower his way into controlling the terms of the action or will Oliveira's distance control wear him down? Does Chandler's strength offset Oliveira's technique on the mats? Neither of these guys has great defensive sensibilities, meaning Oliveira can chip away but also get clipped. I'm leaning toward DoBronx, his size and grappling ought to take away Chandler's ability to stall and rest. I'm thinking the fight ends with a submission for Oliveira in the second or third. But make no mistake, Chandler could end this early like he did with Hooker. The same body punching that opened up Hooker would be intriguing as a weapon against Oliveira. For DoBronx, I'd love to see some intercepting knees and elbows.

Tony Ferguson vs Beneil Dariush: Tale of fighters going in two different directions. Dariush is on the best run of his career while Ferguson has had the worst two losses of his career back-to-back. Ferguson has always been a buzzsaw, chewing through the best fighters in the division but in the process he would take a ton of damage of his own. Dariush has always had a ton of talent but slipped up and made mistakes that cost him. Both of these guys can fight anywhere and move the fight to wherever they find an advantage. I think Ferguson would have trouble getting this one to the ground, but that Dariush could move the fight to grappling on his own and might give opportunities to Ferguson...own-goals.

The thing about this fight is...Ferguson has visibly slowed down between knee surgery and the major damage he's taken all career long. His chin isn't quite as sturdy and his athleticism is there but slipping. I take prime Tony to melt Dariush but I'll have to see that he's still got it to have faith that he can win. I'm leaning Dariush by decision. There are two notable reasons to go Ferguson though...EL Cucuy's losses came to Gaethje and Oliveira, aka absolute elites. Dariush got his best win of this recent streak over Carlos Diego Ferreira in a split-decision. That's a fighter a notch or two below who also just lost in more convincing fashion to Gregor Gillespie. Tony might look much better against fighters a level down, even at this stage. Add to that, Dariush had to weigh-in twice yesterday and took it to the wire. He had a bad weight cut and is facing a pressure guy. The pace could catch up.

Shane Burgos vs Edson Barboza: This is the one all my friends are most excited for. You can catch a clip of Michael Chandler calling Burgos his favorite fighter in the UFC. Shane has a bit of Chandler to him. He's a pressure boxer with great wrestling, but also has size that Chandler lacks. Barboza needs no introduction, his kicks are epic and his striking overwhelms most opponents (he has a highlight KO of Dariush btw). This one is similar to Chandler/Oliveira in that both fighters play to each others' advantages.

Burgos marches forward and you have to trust his chin over his defense at times. Barboza struggles mightily on his backfoot but can be a sharpshooter against opponents that let up on their defense. I'm leaning toward Shane Burgos by TKO in the second or third round, but this could be another highlight for Barboza because one slip-up is all it ever takes.

Matt Schnell vs Rogerio Bontorin: This one's cool fam. Matt Schnell is NEVER boring. He's a fast paced, aggressive fighter whether winning or losing. Bontorin meanwhile showed up, struggled with Ray Borg's scrambling style but then pieced up a very good opponent in Kai Kara-France. Schnell isn't the level of wrestler that Borg is, but he's way beyond Kara-France in a grappling situation...but good enough for someone with BJJ chops like Bontorin? We'll have to see. Expect a wild pace and an unpredictable fight. I haven't seen enough of Rogerio to really say whether he can overrun Schnell's aggressive pace. I lean Schnell for lack of evidence from Bontorin, and also because it's the quality strikers that generally catch Schnell and give him hell.

Chookagian vs Araujo: Consider this my low expectations fight. I've never been a fan of Chookagian and Araujo's been eke'ing out decisions against decent opposition but not much more. It could turn into an entertaining scrap but I expect more of a points based fight. I don't really have a pick for this one, Chookagian is probably the safer bet but Araujo only needs a takedown or two to start snagging rounds.

Best of the rest:
Mike Grundy vs Lando Vannata ought to be really entertaining. Vannata has slowed down and Grundy has massive wrestling chops. But Vannata has a really entertaining style to this day and he's a very difficult opponent...especially for someone who's more specialized.

Jacare is on his way down, but still an elite BJJ player. Muniz is in his prime and also a BJJ player. Jacare represents a huge step up in competition for Muniz which makes this interesting.

Andrea Lee vs Antonina Shevchenko is flames too. Antonina is Valentina's sister, a quality striker but developing a more rounded skillset. KGB Lee is well-rounded and aggressive. She's tough and plays the game at all levels. She'll absolutely be down to bring it to Antonina and could make things dicey by taking the fight to the ground.