Official Rap/Hip Hop Thread IV

[Brooklyn_Yards]

As I've gotten older I've stopped discriminating against what I think is or isn't hip-hop. I don't think Future and Kevin Gates are the best rappers but they definitely tell good stories IMO.

[IllmaticHandler]

Im officially on suicide watch.... Drake is profiling on this dude. If he says nothing after this, then my hunch is correct, somebody told him he cant make a come back. If I was Drake i would just call the next one " three peat". SMH. This might be one of the biggest L's ever.

[j4remi]

Im officially on suicide watch.... Drake is profiling on this dude. If he says nothing after this, then my hunch is correct, somebody told him he cant make a come back. If I was Drake i would just call the next one " three peat". SMH. This might be one of the biggest L's ever.

Yeah, back to back is official, some nice shots thrown on that one and it still feels fairly light considering the length and speed that it dropped in.

[Knicksfan1992]

Im officially on suicide watch.... Drake is profiling on this dude. If he says nothing after this, then my hunch is correct, somebody told him he cant make a come back. If I was Drake i would just call the next one " three peat". SMH. This might be one of the biggest L's ever.

C'Mon just admit Drake can be nice with the mic and that Meek might be a little shook.

[Fat Kat]

[tweet]https://twitter.com/homegrownphilly/status/626366373690757120[/tweet]

[IllmaticHandler]

Im officially on suicide watch.... Drake is profiling on this dude. If he says nothing after this, then my hunch is correct, somebody told him he cant make a come back. If I was Drake i would just call the next one " three peat". SMH. This might be one of the biggest L's ever.

C'Mon just admit Drake can be nice with the mic and that Meek might be a little shook.

Nah I refuse to think Meek is shook. He actually looks worst by not responding. The fans could at least respect, if he came back and Drake still was nicer. But to fully side step Drake and say nothing, especially considering what Meek represents, is a bigger L, than if Drake beat him lyrically. Im just Glad Meek not from NYC at this point SMH.

[j4remi]

While everyone's listing top lists no particular order but tiered by my preferences.

KRS-One
Rakim
Biggie
Nas
Mos-Def

Pac
Em
Andre
Reggie Noble
Big Pun

LL Cool J
Ice Cube
Black Thought
Pharoah Monch
Jay-Z

J. Cole and Kendrick have potential to crack this list but I'm giving them an incomplete. I actually think Joey Bada$$ with the right push and growth can also become a standout lyricist too.

Just an additional thought, I made the top 15 just now off the top of my head but scanning the lists every emcee on the list has at least one classic to their name. They could all be argued for having some type of cultural impact on hip hop, expanding its reach somewhat. The top five is separated by their influence on their peers, with Mos-Def being my obvious reach but he's that dude so whatever.

[IllmaticHandler]

Phife Dog > Q tip.....

[E-Balla]

Calling his artistry legendary means he's legendary as a rapper. Even you aren't agreeing with that. His persona is legendary. Pac did have a great connection with his fans but it was established with what he did outside of the booth and when discussing rap careers I'm not taking Pac's interview ability into account at all.

It's not his persona, it's his storytelling. He was a polarizing figure yes, but tracks like Brenda's Got A Baby, Dear Mama and Keep Your Head Up are complete outliers for most successful music in that period. He had the versatility to make radio hits, thinking pieces and tell stories all at top notch levels. Lyrically, you could ask for more of the obvious wordplay ish I guess...but this is high level penmanship here

"I will never understand this society
First they try to murder me, then they lie to me
Product of a dying breed, all my homies trying weed
Now the little baby's crazed raised off Hennessey

Tell me will my enemies flee when they see me
Believe me even thugs gotta learn to take it easy, listen
Through the intermissions search your heart for a plan
And we turnin' Bad Boys to grown men, it's on again"

The interior multis make a fairly simplistic scheme stronger. None of the bars is forced, it's conversational in spite of being littered with assonance and structured rhymes. He's making a powerful statement. Strictly on the lyrics tip, you could definitely argue emcees above him but he's legendary as a RAPPER. He was lacing poems into music during the gangsta rap era, you could use his music to teach poetry or sociology, it can supplement history lessons and be excavated for literary devices.

All this, and I typically put Pac outside of my top five...but damn if I don't think it's a slight on him to say his rapping wasn't legendary, it absolutely was.

So why Pac over let's say Ice Cube who talked about many of the same issues before Pac? I'm not saying Pac isn't great but I don't see how he's top 25 album for album when All Eyez On Me and Me Against The World are the only classics I can say he had. Yeah Pac had a lot of great singles and his Greatest of CD is great but shouldn't artists be graded project for project?

[Greenie]

Im officially on suicide watch.... Drake is profiling on this dude. If he says nothing after this, then my hunch is correct, somebody told him he cant make a come back. If I was Drake i would just call the next one " three peat". SMH. This might be one of the biggest L's ever.

C'Mon just admit Drake can be nice with the mic and that Meek might be a little shook.

Nah I refuse to think Meek is shook. He actually looks worst by not responding. The fans could at least respect, if he came back and Drake still was nicer. But to fully side step Drake and say nothing, especially considering what Meek represents, is a bigger L, than if Drake beat him lyrically. Im just Glad Meek not from NYC at this point SMH.

Funny thing is he started this.
Meek is a a bitch. Literally. He'll just stomp his feet on twitter or some sh*t.

[Fat Kat]

Phife Dog > Q tip.....

Dinco D > Busta

Vinny > Treach

[j4remi]

So why Pac over let's say Ice Cube who talked about many of the same issues before Pac? I'm not saying Pac isn't great but I don't see how he's top 25 album for album when All Eyez On Me and Me Against The World are the only classics I can say he had. Yeah Pac had a lot of great singles and his Greatest of CD is great but shouldn't artists be graded project for project?

Simply put, his best of album would be arguably the best one in hip hop. Cube spoke on the issues but did his voice and message resonate the way that Pac's did? I'd argue it didn't in spite of the quality from his NWA days through Lethal Injection was arguably the best of that early 90's period.

[E-Balla]

Im officially on suicide watch.... Drake is profiling on this dude. If he says nothing after this, then my hunch is correct, somebody told him he cant make a come back. If I was Drake i would just call the next one " three peat". SMH. This might be one of the biggest L's ever.

Or he found out Nicki gave it up and he realizes he has no chance at winning? IDK man Drake got them stopped at the boarder and threw shots all over. Meek Millz should change his first name to Lton right now. He's competing with Yung Berg and Lyga right now when SB can kill you with those weak bars.

All over Drake supposedly not tweeting your album even though the official OVO account did. He should've lost his fans after that Wale BS last time.

Phife Dog > Q tip.....

The Renaissance, Amplified, Kamaal/The Abstract >>>> anything Phife made as a solo artist and most rapper's solo careers and it isn't even his best work.

[E-Balla]

So why Pac over let's say Ice Cube who talked about many of the same issues before Pac? I'm not saying Pac isn't great but I don't see how he's top 25 album for album when All Eyez On Me and Me Against The World are the only classics I can say he had. Yeah Pac had a lot of great singles and his Greatest of CD is great but shouldn't artists be graded project for project?

Simply put, his best of album would be arguably the best one in hip hop. Cube spoke on the issues but did his voice and message resonate the way that Pac's did? I'd argue it didn't in spite of the quality from his NWA days through Lethal Injection was arguably the best of that early 90's period.

Well here we are getting into what I was saying. Pac's greatness is based less on how good his albums are and more on the impact he had. I'm just saying there's a ton of artists who's albums I visit way more than Pac's. Actually I have all of Pac's albums other than 2Pacalypse Now including a few from after his death and I never find myself listening to it while I find myself throwing on Amerikkka's Most Wanted, The Predator, and Death Certificate all the time. And I grew up on all of these guys so it's not like I would have any bias but I just find Cube's music way better (actually I would've put him in my top 15 if I didn't forget about him somehow) and I can say the same about at least 10 different rappers that got started or peaked in that era.

[E-Balla]

Wait OVO signed AR-AB yesterday? Meek needs to give up completely. Publicly apologize before Drake releases the third diss featuring AB.

[emo]

Charged Up wasn't ****.

But that 'Back To Back'.. I wanna see what Meek for has this. The fact that this shyt has made interested in this nonsense says enough.

[j4remi]

So why Pac over let's say Ice Cube who talked about many of the same issues before Pac? I'm not saying Pac isn't great but I don't see how he's top 25 album for album when All Eyez On Me and Me Against The World are the only classics I can say he had. Yeah Pac had a lot of great singles and his Greatest of CD is great but shouldn't artists be graded project for project?

Simply put, his best of album would be arguably the best one in hip hop. Cube spoke on the issues but did his voice and message resonate the way that Pac's did? I'd argue it didn't in spite of the quality from his NWA days through Lethal Injection was arguably the best of that early 90's period.

Well here we are getting into what I was saying. Pac's greatness is based less on how good his albums are and more on the impact he had. I'm just saying there's a ton of artists who's albums I visit way more than Pac's. Actually I have all of Pac's albums other than 2Pacalypse Now including a few from after his death and I never find myself listening to it while I find myself throwing on Amerikkka's Most Wanted, The Predator, and Death Certificate all the time. And I grew up on all of these guys so it's not like I would have any bias but I just find Cube's music way better (actually I would've put him in my top 15 if I didn't forget about him somehow) and I can say the same about at least 10 different rappers that got started or peaked in that era.

Put it this way, if I put my ipod on shuffle and have Cube's discography as an option or Pac's...I'll end up with Pac more often than Cube's. If I compartmentalize then early Cube wins, but if we're talking about the WHOLE BODY of work, Pac wins and he beats damn near everybody when you do that. If you limit it to an album by album basis then Cube has an edge but even that could be debated since Pac was making fire up to his death while Cube was already transitioning out.

As for his impact over his albums...his albums are responsible for his impact, they shouldn't be separated. The impact his music had is a direct reflection of his rapping and writing ability.

[E-Balla]

Simply put, his best of album would be arguably the best one in hip hop. Cube spoke on the issues but did his voice and message resonate the way that Pac's did? I'd argue it didn't in spite of the quality from his NWA days through Lethal Injection was arguably the best of that early 90's period.

Well here we are getting into what I was saying. Pac's greatness is based less on how good his albums are and more on the impact he had. I'm just saying there's a ton of artists who's albums I visit way more than Pac's. Actually I have all of Pac's albums other than 2Pacalypse Now including a few from after his death and I never find myself listening to it while I find myself throwing on Amerikkka's Most Wanted, The Predator, and Death Certificate all the time. And I grew up on all of these guys so it's not like I would have any bias but I just find Cube's music way better (actually I would've put him in my top 15 if I didn't forget about him somehow) and I can say the same about at least 10 different rappers that got started or peaked in that era.

Put it this way, if I put my ipod on shuffle and have Cube's discography as an option or Pac's...I'll end up with Pac more often than Cube's. If I compartmentalize then early Cube wins, but if we're talking about the WHOLE BODY of work, Pac wins and he beats damn near everybody when you do that. If you limit it to an album by album basis then Cube has an edge but even that could be debated since Pac was making fire up to his death while Cube was already transitioning out.

As for his impact over his albums...his albums are responsible for his impact, they shouldn't be separated. The impact his music had is a direct reflection of his rapping and writing ability.

I can respect that. Personally when it comes to music I just count total great songs. For example I don't take off from LL for what he did in the 2000s, Hov for BPIII and MCHG, and I don't take off from Lupe for everything after Enemy of the State and before T&Y. I can get if you do but the way I feel about it is that with music you can literally just listen to the albums you love and not the rest.

[j4remi]

I can respect that. Personally when it comes to music I just count total great songs. For example I don't take off from LL for what he did in the 2000s, Hov for BPIII and MCHG, and I don't take off from Lupe for everything after Enemy of the State and before T&Y. I can get if you do but the way I feel about it is that with music you can literally just listen to the albums you love and not the rest.

Yeah, I get that approach completely, almost every classic album is a cohesive piece with themes, motifs and progressions. The best of the best sometimes NEED to be listened to whole in order to get the full impacts (Be is my holy example of this but more contemporary I'd point out Dark Twisted Fantasy and GKMC, for a bit older Illmatic and Reasonable Doubt). That said though, I like to look at an emcee's body of work like I'm reading the notebook they wrote their songs in. So I think putting together the best of's for an emcee is a necessary addition to the comparisons (how much you put on each variable is totally up to you).

Edit: And I totally dock emcees for poor performance but not by much. Jay's lazy ass lyricism post Black Album (mostly not all of his work since) has totally dropped him a tier for my top 15.

[SwaggedOut30]

Anybody enjoying this rap battle? Back to back is a nice little diss track. I also enjoyed Charged Up.