PG: Knicks-Thunder

[mpharris36]

I’ve said it before, I’ll say it again. I don’t like any lineup with Randle at C. We just lose all rim protection and revert back to being the Knicks of the past 20 years. We need Mitch or another rim protector (Noel or acquire one) in at all times. We are not a good enough shooting team to make up for giving up points with a wide open paint.

FACTS

[HEZI]

So we can't shoot and we know we can't shoot so logically Payton should look to pass more

Logic

RJ shot 21 times so he got the ball plenty to shoot. Are we complaining because Bullock didn't shoot enough?

[HarthorneWingo]

We took these clowns for granted.

[Chanel Bomber]

The Knicks will never be a good team as long as our front office(s) can't evaluate talent or put a roster together with pieces that fit.

These problems have been endemic in recent Knicks history, and I haven't seen anything from Leon Rose that tells me he's the one who will solve those issues. At all.

This is a treadmill team, with very little upside.

[BBALLER4FR]

RJ sure didn’t shoot 58% at the rim tonight

Guess who else is shooting 58% at the rim this year though, Julius Deion Randle

I’m talking about tonight though. RJ was just flat out horrible. Layups, jumpers and tunnel vision. You really can’t blame Randle for that.

Randle was no gem. He got early fouls, kept complaining about dumb $hit to the refs, got a tech, had 0 points in the 1st half, played garbage D, had yet again one of the most bone headed lazy turnovers styling as a PG and only got points late in the game when the damage was already done. He's a talented post player, he'll win you some games but he'll inexplicably be a major contribution to some of the losses and the MVP talk should really cease.

[NoDopeOnSundays]

I’m talking about tonight though. RJ was just flat out horrible. Layups, jumpers and tunnel vision. You really can’t blame Randle for that.

Yes I can, Randle has the ball entirely too much, he's now 4th in the league in touches per game

This really is no different than Westbrook at this point, he gets his numbers and the team is just bad on offense. We're one of the slowest teams in the league, one of the worst offensive teams in the league, near the bottom in APG.....So, keep giving it to him?

RJ missing layups, jump shots and having tunnel vision isn’t a Randle problem. It’s funny when RJ plays well you aren’t saying anything about Randle but once RJ plays like schit it’s Randle’s fault again

Payton had one assist tonight. When he’s your starting point guard of course our APG is gonna be low. He never looks to pass.

My dislike for Randles game is always there, and I don't know where this ultimately going with him, like are we going to resign him? When RJ has a good game I'm content, but when he struggles it's almost always the same thing and part of that is the fact he's not a good shooter, being asked to shoot too often. To me, the Randle / Mitch frontcourt needs to be broken up, and we don't have the personnel to replace Mitch with a floor spacing C, so Randle makes the most sense. I don't care if it's Knox or Obi, start one of them at PF to space for everyone else.

Payton is awful, but Randle is the hidden danger to me, and I will only like his game if he's coming off the bench at this point.

[RHODEY]

So we can't shoot and we know we can't shoot so logically Payton should look to pass more

Logic

RJ shot 21 times so he got the ball plenty to shoot. Are we complaining because Bullock didn't shoot enough?

Just because he shot 21 times doesn't mean he's getting the ball in the best positions to shoot...and Im not making excuses for him but the PG situation for us is atrocious.


You really can't judge our young guys , namely Mitch and RJ until we get a real floor general PG in here. Kudos to Wingo... Hali would have been nice. That said I think well get our guy eventually.

[BBALLER4FR]

I cant stand watching Elf, he's in Duhon territory for me...both of em have times where they can contribute but overall just gtfo

duhon actually passed the ball to his teammates.

You win.

[3toheadmelo]

Yes I can, Randle has the ball entirely too much, he's now 4th in the league in touches per game

This really is no different than Westbrook at this point, he gets his numbers and the team is just bad on offense. We're one of the slowest teams in the league, one of the worst offensive teams in the league, near the bottom in APG.....So, keep giving it to him?

RJ missing layups, jump shots and having tunnel vision isn’t a Randle problem. It’s funny when RJ plays well you aren’t saying anything about Randle but once RJ plays like schit it’s Randle’s fault again

Payton had one assist tonight. When he’s your starting point guard of course our APG is gonna be low. He never looks to pass.

My dislike for Randles game is always there, and I don't know where this ultimately going with him, like are we going to resign him? When RJ has a good game I'm content, but when he struggles it's almost always the same thing and part of that is the fact he's not a good shooter, being asked to shoot too often. To me, the Randle / Mitch frontcourt needs to be broken up, and we don't have the roster to replace Mitch with a floor spacing C, so Randle makes the most sense.

Payton is awful, but Randle is the hidden danger to me, and I will only like his game if he's coming off the bench at this point.

You’re acting like RJ was planted in a corner tonight and jacked up 10 3’s. He had 21 shot attempts with many of them from the rim and some mid range shots. That’s on him for sucking.
Our front court is fine. Not the main problem at all. If we had better guards our offense would look better. It’s not rocket science lol.

[mpharris36]

I cant stand watching Elf, he's in Duhon territory for me...both of em have times where they can contribute but overall just gtfo

duhon actually passed the ball to his teammates.

[NoDopeOnSundays]

RJ missing layups, jump shots and having tunnel vision isn’t a Randle problem. It’s funny when RJ plays well you aren’t saying anything about Randle but once RJ plays like schit it’s Randle’s fault again

Payton had one assist tonight. When he’s your starting point guard of course our APG is gonna be low. He never looks to pass.

My dislike for Randles game is always there, and I don't know where this ultimately going with him, like are we going to resign him? When RJ has a good game I'm content, but when he struggles it's almost always the same thing and part of that is the fact he's not a good shooter, being asked to shoot too often. To me, the Randle / Mitch frontcourt needs to be broken up, and we don't have the roster to replace Mitch with a floor spacing C, so Randle makes the most sense.

Payton is awful, but Randle is the hidden danger to me, and I will only like his game if he's coming off the bench at this point.

You’re acting like RJ was planted in a corner tonight and jacked up 10 3’s. He had 21 shot attempts with many of them from the rim and some mid range shots. That’s on him for sucking.
Our front court is fine. Not the main problem at all. If we had better guards our offense would look better. It’s not rocket science lol.

I want to see RJ in more of a creator role with better spacing, just cause he shot 21 times doesn't mean they are good shots, he and Payton took 9 threes when they shouldn't, but because Randle is essentially our PG everyone who shares the floor with him outside of Mitch has to shoot. He can't even run PnR with Mitch either, which is another terrible aspect of him having the ball so much, and I'm not the biggest Mitch fan.

I mean seriously, he touches the ball more than Luka, how is this a good thing? If we had better guards you'd be annoyed that Randle isn't getting the ball, the dude played with Holiday and AD, and they still sucked

[HEZI]

So we can't shoot and we know we can't shoot so logically Payton should look to pass more

Logic

RJ shot 21 times so he got the ball plenty to shoot. Are we complaining because Bullock didn't shoot enough?

Just because he shot 21 times doesn't mean he's getting the ball in the best positions to shoot...and Im not making excuses for him but the PG situation for us is atrocious.


You really can judge our young guys , namely Mitch and RJ until we get I real floor general PG in here. Kudos to Wingo... Hali would have been nice. That said I think well get our guy eventually.

RJ can't shoot and that's his issue. Doesn't help that there is no stretch bigs to pull the opponent help defenders out the paint so he can exploit mismatches. But even with that being the case, he's gotta be better. At the very least he's gotta be able to consistently knock down the mid range and he gets those opportunities plenty of times.

[K_ick_God]

When your Twitter login doesn’t work but your nuclear codes still do.

[Deeeez Knicks]

Knicks were clearly better with Mitch on the floor.

Problem was not Mitch couldnt shoot. Its that nobody could shoot. Off nights shooting for basically everyone and some regression to the mean. We were coming in hot and got a dose of reality. We are gonna lose some games and that is ok.

[3toheadmelo]

My dislike for Randles game is always there, and I don't know where this ultimately going with him, like are we going to resign him? When RJ has a good game I'm content, but when he struggles it's almost always the same thing and part of that is the fact he's not a good shooter, being asked to shoot too often. To me, the Randle / Mitch frontcourt needs to be broken up, and we don't have the roster to replace Mitch with a floor spacing C, so Randle makes the most sense.

Payton is awful, but Randle is the hidden danger to me, and I will only like his game if he's coming off the bench at this point.

You’re acting like RJ was planted in a corner tonight and jacked up 10 3’s. He had 21 shot attempts with many of them from the rim and some mid range shots. That’s on him for sucking.
Our front court is fine. Not the main problem at all. If we had better guards our offense would look better. It’s not rocket science lol.

I want to see RJ in more of a creator role with better spacing, just cause he shot 21 times doesn't mean they are good shots, he and Payton took 9 threes when they shouldn't, but because Randle is essentially our PG everyone who shares the floor with him outside of Mitch has to shoot. He can't even run PnR with Mitch either, which is another terrible aspect of him having the ball so much, and I'm not the biggest Mitch fan.

I mean seriously, he touches the ball more than Luka, how is this a good thing? If we had better guards you'd be annoyed that Randle isn't getting the ball, the dude played with Holiday and AD, and they still sucked

Randle was out for quite a while in this game so RJ had plenty of opportunities to create. Guess what, he still sucked nothing changed. He took the same shots he always takes when Randle is on the floor. Dude gets tunnel vision when he gets in the paint also, which has always been a problem since he was in Duke. Maybe he should keep his head up and look for open players. Him and Payton played very selfish tonight.
Sorry bro but the hate with Randle for you is way overboard. I’m calling it a night. You can have the last say or whatever lol

[3toheadmelo]

RJ shot 57% from the FT line tonight. Blame Randle though lol

[NoDopeOnSundays]

You’re acting like RJ was planted in a corner tonight and jacked up 10 3’s. He had 21 shot attempts with many of them from the rim and some mid range shots. That’s on him for sucking.
Our front court is fine. Not the main problem at all. If we had better guards our offense would look better. It’s not rocket science lol.

I want to see RJ in more of a creator role with better spacing, just cause he shot 21 times doesn't mean they are good shots, he and Payton took 9 threes when they shouldn't, but because Randle is essentially our PG everyone who shares the floor with him outside of Mitch has to shoot. He can't even run PnR with Mitch either, which is another terrible aspect of him having the ball so much, and I'm not the biggest Mitch fan.

I mean seriously, he touches the ball more than Luka, how is this a good thing? If we had better guards you'd be annoyed that Randle isn't getting the ball, the dude played with Holiday and AD, and they still sucked

Randle was out for quite a while in this game so RJ had plenty of opportunities to create. Guess what, he still sucked nothing changed. He took the same shots he always takes when Randle is on the floor. Dude gets tunnel vision when he gets in the paint also, which has always been a problem since he was in Duke. Maybe he should keep his head up and look for open players. Him and Payton played very selfish tonight.
Sorry bro but the hate with Randle for you is way overboard. I’m calling it a night. You can have the last say or whatever lol

RJ being thrust into a role of create for a few minutes isn't the same as them practicing it and it being the gameplan moving forward. Randle moving to the bench is best for business, this is all that really needs to be said, just think of all the superstar players that are after his name, and the fact this is probably going to go up too Goodnight Melo.

[KnicksChamps]

When your Twitter login doesn’t work but your nuclear codes still do.

Hopefully his nuke login is more complicated than his "maga2020!" twitter password

[Worst_to_First]

Randle dominating the ball, and making slashers become shooters is part of why our offense sucks and you know it deep down inside.

Nah you bugging. RJ has been slashing to the rim and he can’t hit **** at the rim. Same for Payton. Missing layups and jumpers. Just awful

RJ is shooting 58% at the rim.

Randle will always get his numbers, it's just the nature of dominating the ball.

Julius and Mitch have been playing well but this frontcourt duo combination is going to get violated in the playoffs.

It is not the sexy take now but we eventually are going to have to sell high on one of them.

[Chanel Bomber]

Yes I can, Randle has the ball entirely too much, he's now 4th in the league in touches per game

This really is no different than Westbrook at this point, he gets his numbers and the team is just bad on offense. We're one of the slowest teams in the league, one of the worst offensive teams in the league, near the bottom in APG.....So, keep giving it to him?

RJ missing layups, jump shots and having tunnel vision isn’t a Randle problem. It’s funny when RJ plays well you aren’t saying anything about Randle but once RJ plays like schit it’s Randle’s fault again

Payton had one assist tonight. When he’s your starting point guard of course our APG is gonna be low. He never looks to pass.

My dislike for Randles game is always there, and I don't know where this ultimately going with him, like are we going to resign him? When RJ has a good game I'm content, but when he struggles it's almost always the same thing and part of that is the fact he's not a good shooter, being asked to shoot too often. To me, the Randle / Mitch frontcourt needs to be broken up, and we don't have the personnel to replace Mitch with a floor spacing C, so Randle makes the most sense. I don't care if it's Knox or Obi, start one of them at PF to space for everyone else.

Payton is awful, but Randle is the hidden danger to me, and I will only like his game if he's coming off the bench at this point.

I appreciate the critical thinking behind this take, especially with this new sense of optimism surrounding the Knicks.

Randle is a tough player to evaluate because (not unlike other players on this roster) he can only be a featured player. He can't be a role player, because he's neither a good 3-point shooter nor a good defender (despite some improvement this season).

So is he good enough offensively to be one of the go-to options on a winning team? Or is he really more of a 6th man who can get you buckets and have the offense run through him off the bench?

Much like RJ, Obi and Payton, he's a difficult player to build around.

He's made significant progress under Thibs playing within the flow of the offense and making quicker decisions, but his game is still very slow and methodical. it's not exactly conducive to running a smooth, free-flowing offense.

I'd keep him for now because of his contract but I'd be very careful before giving him an extension and I would seriously listen to offers. I would definitely say trade him now if I had more confidence in the Leon Rose's ability to evaluate talent and to target the right players. My skepticism about our front office is the only thing giving me second thoughts.